LeBron is the best basketball player ever.

[pulledclear]

FADE McDummy!!!!!!!!!!!!

[mcduggly]

FADE McDummy!!!!!!!!!!!!

Clever.

[GunShard]

[The Kraken]

lebron top 5 of all time already. So it's like even if he loses and MJ is thought of as the best ever, he's still right there in the discussion. The guy has already won.

[SparJMU]

lebron top 5 of all time already. So it's like even if he loses and MJ is thought of as the best ever, he's still right there in the discussion. The guy has already won.

Why do people have such short memories? Lebron is hands down the best player on the planet right now, unfortunately he has not been playing on this level for the last ten years. The NBA greats of the past played at their peaks for extended periods of time and won numerous titles. If Lebron can keep up his 2011 - 2013 level of play for another 5 or 6 years, he will hands down be the greatest of all time. Unfortunately he still has a long way to go to earn that.

[milwaukee mike]

bulls record with jordan 1993 57-25
bulls record without jordan 1994 55-27

so he had a pretty good team there, the 2nd time he retired they fell off a cliff because everyone abandoned ship

cavs record with lebron 2010 61-21
cavs record without lebron 2011 19-63

lebron had a pretty bad team as a surrounding cast, perhaps the frustration of knowing you're gonna lose because your teammates are pathetic was part of the reason for a couple bad playoff games

[pouyasophy]

bulls record with jordan 1993 57-25
bulls record without jordan 1994 55-27

so he had a pretty good team there, the 2nd time he retired they fell off a cliff because everyone abandoned ship

cavs record with lebron 2010 61-21
cavs record without lebron 2011 19-63

lebron had a pretty bad team as a surrounding cast, perhaps the frustration of knowing you're gonna lose because your teammates are pathetic was part of the reason for a couple bad playoff games

Cavs had their 3 best players injured for most of the year...keep pretending Lebron is better than Jordan...no matter how you slice the cake, Lebron will always have 1 less ring than Wade, which is pathetic...Lebron not even top 10 yet.

MJ is the best team sport athlete ever...not even close...Jerry Rice is the only athlete comparable to MJ in a team sport.

[Chi_archie]

bulls record with jordan 1993 57-25
bulls record without jordan 1994 55-27

so he had a pretty good team there, the 2nd time he retired they fell off a cliff because everyone abandoned ship

cavs record with lebron 2010 61-21
cavs record without lebron 2011 19-63

lebron had a pretty bad team as a surrounding cast, perhaps the frustration of knowing you're gonna lose because your teammates are pathetic was part of the reason for a couple bad playoff games

nice research

can you look up how the Bulls were before Jordan and after Jordan for a few years and the same with the Cavs/Lebron

[milwaukee mike]

^^
before jordan 27-55
first 3 years with jordan 38-44
30-52
40-42

before lebron 17-65!!!
first 3 years with lebron 35-47
42-40
50-32

so lebron inherited a team that was 10 games worse than jordan's, and yet proceeded to win 19 more games over the first 3 years

it's a fun argument/discussion as long as we keep the name calling out of it. i don't think there's a wrong opinion, other than the "jordan has more championships" argument, which would mean that robert horry is better than jordan

[k13]

I must say I've never seen Lebron do anything that made me say "wow".

He is efficient though.

[pavyracer]

bulls record with jordan 1993 57-25
bulls record without jordan 1994 55-27

so he had a pretty good team there, the 2nd time he retired they fell off a cliff because everyone abandoned ship

cavs record with lebron 2010 61-21
cavs record without lebron 2011 19-63

lebron had a pretty bad team as a surrounding cast, perhaps the frustration of knowing you're gonna lose because your teammates are pathetic was part of the reason for a couple bad playoff games

What was Heat's record the year they won the NBA championship without Lebron and just Wade?

[goldengreek]

This agruement is stupid.

Jordan.

Done

Over

[dlunc3]

he went to a superstar team and got to the finals and he didn't do shit in any of the 4th quarters of any game... was the joke of the summer. Jordan never let his team go down in the Finals. Ill give him a slight pass for the 2007 Finals as they were big dogs to the Spurs going for a 4th title in whatever amount of years....but he still got his ass SWEPT

how many finals did jordan play in before he got pippen and phil? oh yea, thats right..

[k13]

Every time Jordan lost he cried and blamed it on his teammates. Even in Washington when he sucked himself.

It was great when the Pistons used to kick his ass every time.

[riffraff24]

dumb dumb dumb

[stevenash]

nice research

can you look up how the Bulls were before Jordan and after Jordan for a few years and the same with the Cavs/Lebron

The 1978-1979 Boston Celtics (Larry Bird's last season at ISU) were 29-53
The 1979-1980 Boston Celtics (Larry Bird's rookie season with the Celtics) were 61-21 (lost in the Conference finals) and as a rookie averaged over 21 PPG, like a 6 year seasoned veteran.

Guess who won the Championship in 1980-1981 (Bird's second pro season) win valuable prizes?

Q. How many of the Larry Bird's Celtic teams went to the layoffs?
A. All of them

Not saying Bird was the greatest of all time, he was not, the greatest (imo) of all time is either Russell, Chamberlain, or Jordan

*off topic*
David Robinson is the most underrated great player of all time.

[riffraff24]

Just curious. The argument that is constantly made about how Jordan was undefeated in the Finals going 6-0.

Let's say Kobe eventually gets his 6th ring.

What's better, making it to the Finals 8 times and winning 6. Or only making it to the finals 6 times but winning all of them?

[stevenash]

What's better, making it to the Finals 8 times and winning 6. Or only making it to the finals 6 times but winning all of them?

Going six for six.
However, the difference isn't that great

[riffraff24]

Going six for six.
However, the difference isn't that great

Right. But one can also make the argument that Jordan only made it to the Finals 6 times compared to 8 (or possibly more). Also, Jordan only played 14 seasons and the last few were not at a very high level. Kobe is in his 17th season at an extremely high level. Kobe's shooting percentage sucks but he takes some of the most difficult shots I have ever seen.

My point isn't Kobe > Jordan. My point is there are plausible arguments for both sides. However it's all hypothetical being that the game is completely different comparing then to now. Called fouls, tempo, defense, evolution of human athletic ability etc. To me Kobe is not better than Jordan and Jordan was not better than Kobe. I don't know who is better and I never will.

[InTheDrink]

arent all these regular season stats great? (nevermind that when jordan had a great wing player AND a great pf they won 72 and 69 games in two years)

who is the best postseason player of all time?

without ANY question

i dont think most of these guys understand that EVERY FUKKIN POSSESSION went through jordan during the playoffs...and the game was a LOT more physical then for whatever thats worth

to my recollection lebron has had three amazing playoff games in his career....jordan did it game after game after game....8 times over 50 pts and who knows how many over 40

[stevenash]

My point isn't Kobe > Jordan. My point is there are plausible arguments for both sides. However it's all hypothetical being that the game is

Correct, it's an opinion question.
Like, who was better? Ramones or the Sex Pistols?
Arnie or Jack?
Trans Am or Camaro?

No wrong answer.

[mcduggly]

Cavs had their 3 best players injured for most of the year...keep pretending Lebron is better than Jordan...no matter how you slice the cake, Lebron will always have 1 less ring than Wade, which is pathetic...Lebron not even top 10 yet.

MJ is the best team sport athlete ever...not even close...Jerry Rice is the only athlete comparable to MJ in a team sport.

So you're saying if LeBron leaves Miami, he will never win another ring and surpass Wade? Please. And no matter how you slice the cake, Jordan will always have 5 less rings than Russell. Stupid point you were trying to make.

And have you ever heard of guys named Babe Ruth or Wayne Gretzky?

[InTheDrink]

Correct, it's an opinion question.
Like, who was better? Ramones or the Sex Pistols?
Arnie or Jack?
Trans Am or Camaro?

No wrong answer.

Jack was far better than Arnie

Poor example nasher

[riffraff24]

Correct, it's an opinion question.
Like, who was better? Ramones or the Sex Pistols?
Arnie or Jack?
Trans Am or Camaro?

No wrong answer.

Not even close bro. Ramones over the Pistols ANY DAY. Kudos on that analogy

[Goat Milk]

I must say I've never seen Lebron do anything that made me say "wow".

Maybe you should go to the league then.

[Goat Milk]

Russell played with great players as well, in an era with shit athletes (comparatively), a fast pace which led to inflated stats, and the game was just starting up which means all the rules weren't in place (i.e. was there even a 3 in the lane rule). Probably not, that's why Wilt did what he did. Wilt would never even average 25 and 15 in today's game.

Russell? Russell is the greatest defensive player ever, but he was a horrible offensive player. His points in the old days came off putbacks and because the pace was so fast, if you adjust those numbers it's as if he was averaging like 9 10 points tops. And with the 3 in the lane rule, he probably would average 5 6 points a game. You can't be the best ever unless you're GREAT on BOTH ends.

Lebron? No where near Jordan right now. Will he get there? Maybe. Let's not forget that while Lebron had a bad Cavs team, he melted down in the finals in 2011 against Dallas. Went into his shell while D Wade averaged 30 a game over 6 games to carry Miami and Lebron averaged 17 ppg and like 6 points total in the 4th quarters of all six games.

You think that would ever happen to Jordan? never. So Lebron wasn't even the best player on his team in 2011. Wade was.

[Fishhead]

Jack was far better than Arnie

Poor example nasher

Correct

[William Walters]

Lebron is currently the greatest player in the world.

Lebron is currently playing as well as anybody ever has in the history of the NBA.

Lebron is capable of going down as the greatest player ever.

Lebron still needs to climb over a list of players such as Kobe, Kareem, Wilt, Bird, Magic, Duncan, Russell, etc. to challenge Jordan as the best player of all time.

[stevenash]

Jack was far better than Arnie

Poor example nasher

Jack was better, but I think you missed my point. All good.

[infospy]

Jordan is by far better than Lebron, as a team player, clutch, and everything.

[infospy]

Lebron is always whining about something

[pavyracer]

Here is the true measuring stick. If your team is down 2 points with 15 seconds left in the game who do you want to have the ball, Michael Jordan or Lebron James?

[William Walters]

Here is the true measuring stick. If your team is down 2 points with 15 seconds left in the game who do you want to have the ball, Michael Jordan or Lebron James?

Robert Horry

[PAULYPOKER]

I GUARANTEE my winning percentage on spreads and totals is at least 10 points higher than yours. Plus you have more losing picks on this forum than anybody other than Brock and BradleySnyder.

As you wish............

[raiders72001]

so sick of these kids who never saw jordan play, say kobes the best ever and now lebron .jordan made the nba what it is.

LeBron is a better rebounder and that's it. Jordan is better in every other category offensively and defensively as well as FT shooting.