OT: And the case for atheism gets stronger every day...

[moneyline]

Robyn, I answered your ?'s. I'm wondering why you would choose to "be bad" when you know, if there is a God, you are going to "pay dearly" for your actions?

[guitarjosh]

A person that leaves a positive mark on others.

Define positive.

[Robyn]

moneyline, I do not "know" that there is a God. All I was saying that if there is, we's gonna be in some trouble!

[Shark79]

Define positive.

define :dick:

[moneyline]

Robyn, you know there might be a God. It is not so far-fetched to believe that a greater power created earth and the universe around it, but yet you feel comfortable flaunting your bad behavior. I guess I understand when children do that, knowing their parents might get mad at them if they get caught, but adults doing the same thing is a bit confusing.

[Arnold]

Those who decide to ignore God will suffer a fate that lasts quite a bit longer ...

What is God anyway? It's not your Bible and church. It's not that "someone" you imagine when you pray. God is what good you do for others. It doesn't matter how many times a day you pray or go to church. What matters is how you treat people, regardless of your religious beliefs.

Sad, when they had the free will at their disposal and could've just joyfully accepted the gift offered to them.

How do you like that gift from Santa? Accept it.

Oh, and Arnold, when you say you have no beliefs, that is saying you do have a belief. You choose to believe in nothing. Sounds rather empty, doesn't it?

Choosing and believing is 2 different things. I don't have a belief if I don't believe in God. There is no such thing as "believing in void". Your argument is simply absurd. I need reasons to believe in something. I see no reason to believe in the God of the Bible.

Of course you have no beliefs. What a pussy. You attack people and dont have the courage to make a stance. I just said this.

I'm a pussy for having no beliefs? Well, then you're a retard for having no brain.

And I like Swede, but why she is following you is beyond me. You are.....nothing.

Before she said that, you were OK with me. Now you're trying to pick a fight. Don't be a fool, you already lost.

So, Arnold, now you are taking 15-20 minutes instead of 7, to answer the thread? Right? You are a joke and dont have the balls to take a position. You just want to ridicule everyone who does. Sorry, Robin, I knew the way this guy was. And I like Swede, very good poster and person, but why would she back this guy?

Wow. Ask God for some patience and reasoning. I don't take a position for the sake of whatever. I take a position when I see basis for that position. Again, get a life.

Define positive.

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/positive

Get to the point if you have one.

[Panic]

What is God anyway? It's not your Bible and church. It's not that "someone" you imagine when you pray. God is what good you do for others. It doesn't matter how many times a day you pray or go to church. What matters is how you treat people, regardless of your religious beliefs.



How do you like that gift from Santa? Accept it.



Choosing and believing is 2 different things. I don't have a belief if I don't believe in God. There is no such thing as "believing in void". Your argument is simply absurd. I need reasons to believe in something. I see no reason to believe in the God of the Bible.



I'm a pussy for having no beliefs? Well, then you're a retard for having no brain.



Before she said that, you were OK with me. Now you're trying to pick a fight. Don't be a fool, you already lost.



Wow. Ask God for some patience and reasoning. I don't take a position for the sake of whatever. I take a position when I see basis for that position. Again, get a life.

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/positive

Get to the point if you have one.

LOL. Nice comeback after an hour. Typical response from a "person" with no conviction and courage. Way to go, Arnold.

[moneyline]

Arnold, your belief is that no greater power exists. I don't see why you are embarrassed by your belief system.

(actually, I do ...)

[Arnold]

LOL. Nice comeback after an hour. Typical response from a "person" with no conviction and courage. Way to go, Arnold.

Forgive me your highness for it being 5:30PM when I'm off work, and not getting to you faster. Once again, please have mercy on me.

PS. Flush yourself, turd.

[Arnold]

Arnold, your belief is that no greater power exists. I don't see why you are embarrassed by your belief system.

(actually, I do ...)

I never said that no higher power exists. Why don't you read more carefully?

[moneyline]

Oh, I'm sorry Arnold. Since you keep comparing God to Santa Claus, I just made the assumption you believe He didn't exist. I didn't realize you believe in Santa and, therefore, God.

Good for you, my friend. May your stocking always be full.

(how will you feel when you pass away and find that God does exist and He's not too pleased with your lack of faith?)

[Panic]

Forgive me your highness for it being 5:30PM when I'm off work, and not getting to you faster. Once again, please have mercy on me.

PS. Flush yourself, turd.

Last time I respond to you, kid. You are the man. Anyone who uses the word "turd" is scary. I apologize.

[Arnold]

Oh, I'm sorry Arnold. Since you keep comparing God to Santa Claus, I just made the assumption you believe He didn't exist. I didn't realize you believe in Santa and, therefore, God.

Read again. I never said that I believe that God exists, or that I believe that he doesn't exist. Santa was brought up as an analogy to your God. He sounds silly to you the same way, as your God sounds silly to me. Hope you'll finally get it.

(how will you feel when you pass away and find that God does exist and He's not too pleased with your lack of faith?)

How will you feel when you pass away and find that God is not too pleased with your faith just for the sake of fear of hell?

To answer your question, I think God won't care about my faith. He's not human. He doesn't need my faith, worship or feet licking. He's above that.

[moneyline]

Arnold -- you believe in nothing. Except maybe yourself. And that makes you one of the most egocentric people on the face of this earth.

God doesn't need your worship. He wants it. He's made that clear, through His word and His sacrifice to us of His Son. Ignore these things at your peril.

Surely a man of your intellect understands that with every decision you make (or refuse to make in your case), there is a consequence. Just because you refuse to choose doesn't make you immune from the consequence that will result ...

(you are the ostrich that puts his head in the sand when he sees a lion, thinking he will be safe ... I refuse to choose anything, therefore I am not accountable ... really, Arnold, I did expect better than that)

[Arnold]

Arnold -- you believe in nothing.
Except maybe yourself.

For sure, I believe in myself, as in having an optimistic set of mind. You can't achieve anything if you don't think you can.

And that makes you one of the most egocentric people on the face of this earth.

Believing in myself doesn't hurt anyone. In contrary, it helps them.

God doesn't need your worship. He wants it. He's made that clear, through His word and His sacrifice to us of His Son. Ignore these things at your peril.

Then God is no better than a human king, that wants everyone's recognition and worship, or else he decapitates you.

Surely a man of your intellect understands that with every decision you make (or refuse to make in your case), there is a consequence. Just because you refuse to choose doesn't make you immune from the consequence that will result ...

I don't refuse to choose. It's impossible to refuse to believe if you believe in something. I just don't see any basis for believing in either of the two. Do you always have an opinion on something?

(you are the ostrich that puts his head in the sand when he sees a lion, thinking he will be safe ... I refuse to choose anything, therefore I am not accountable ... really, Arnold, I did expect better than that)

You're a Christian, so I'm not expecting you to understand what I'm saying.

[guitarjosh]

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/positive

Get to the point if you have one.

Good, bad, positive evil, is all a point of view. These debates are pointless because most people who have different views on the Bible also have different views of good and bad.

[Arnold]

Good, bad, positive evil, is all a point of view. These debates are pointless because most people who have different views on the Bible also have different views of good and bad.

Do you know what's good for you? Then I hope I make you feel good, whatever that is for you.

[thezbar]

Your life is but a blink of an eye. That you believe this is all there is without having the faith to believe in more is quite depressing. But God will not give up on you until your dying breath -- always time for you to open your heart to Him.

Doubting Thomas of Biblical fame. Your attitude mimics his.

Interest thread. There was a situation during this lifetime in which I was falling downwords towards an possible injury or death do to the errors of others and lack of caution on my part. During that fall I had my life "flash before my eyes". I'll never forget that moment. And it was in the blink of an eye that I saw my life as it flashed.
It makes me think that time as we percieve it isn't necessarily how time really is. Therefore I kind of think there more out there than we realise.
It took two months to heal and years for the physical marking to dissappear from that fall.

[Dazzez]

As H.L. Mencken opined, "God is the immemorial refuge of the incompetent, the helpless, the miserable. They find not only sanctuary in His arms, but also a kind of superiority, soothing to their macerated egos: He will set them above their betters.”

moneyline, we're all atheists ... all of us. Even you. Some of us just believe in fewer gods than others. When you figure out why exactly you reject Vishnu, Zeus, Odin, Marduk, Shamash, Sin, Tiamat, Allah, Ishtar, An, Enlil, Enki, Ceridwin, Ganesh, Brahma, Quetzalcoatl, Jah Rastafari, Baha, Ahura Mazda, and the Flying Spaghetti Monster, you'll have figured out exactly why we reject your foolish and narrow conception of your own personal savior.

I'll tell you something. Nowhere is so complete and utter an inability to reason and think critically considered so positive and compelling a character trait outside the world's religions.

[Robyn]

Robyn, you know there might be a God. It is not so far-fetched to believe that a greater power created earth and the universe around it, but yet you feel comfortable flaunting your bad behavior. I guess I understand when children do that, knowing their parents might get mad at them if they get caught, but adults doing the same thing is a bit confusing.

I am doing nothing more dreadful than about 85% of the Christians in this world. I am just not choosing to follow the word of the Bible. That is my sin. Bad behavior? I really don't behave badly, unless you call making fun of American Idol via my article bad behavior. Or maybe indulging in some gambling here and there. I don't need another human being pointing a finger at me in attempt to make me feel guilty for any of my behaviors. And that is exactly what Religion does. Point fingers.

I do not know anything but what is right before my eyes. My keyboard, my monitor, my stuffed vulture named Carrion. These are the things I see.

[moneyline]

Funny thing is God puts me above nobody. All I have done is accepted Him -- no great accomplishment, but yet one that others choose to ignore or to deny. Only when it comes to believing in a Creator is it thought to be foolish to make a choice. In sports, picking a team is preferable to choosing all of them. In your life, settling down with one woman is considered to be much more mature and fulfilling than picking all of them.

Only in one's moral belief system is choosing one deity to put your faith into considered a failing or a weakness of sorts.

With regards to Mencken, he is a mortal like the rest of us. Since God created Mencken, l will follow God before him any day of the week ...

And Robyn, you say you know nothing, save what you can see. But you have faith in so many things you cannot. You can't (or don't) see the inner workings of an airplane you get on to fly somewhere, but you have faith it has been inspected, passed and will take you where you want to go.

Can a person be created from nothing? And if they were created from something, what created the something that created them? It all takes faith. Just depends on where you place yours.

[swede96]

Arnold, you know very little of Christianity if you believe I need to do good things to go to heaven, as if there was a scoresheet. The Bible says you can't earn heaven, but can get there through accepting God's sacrifice for us, His Son Jesus. It is a gift. It cannot be earned. But it has to be accepted -- like any gift does!

Oh, and what Swede said.

So you can be an asshole and still go to heaven just because you accepted the lord and dipped your head in water? Okie dokie. Well, Moneyline, is nasty, mean spirited people like you are going to be in heaven, I think I'll take my chances in hell.

[swede96]

Instead of criticizing people for making their beliefs known, how about you let us know your beliefs? All I've seen you do is attack people, but have no position yourself. But be happy, you got a "follower" in Swede with you. Lets hear it.

Funny that you would say WE are the ones attacking.

First off, I follow no one. Now, as for my beliefs:

I believe that there is some force out there that sometimes guides us in life. For example: One day my mother and I got into a fight. I went over to my Dad's to cool off and talk to him about it, but he was on his way out to the store so I turned around and headed home. In the mean time, my mother had a medical emergency. I pulled up to a bunch of EMTs trying to figure out how to get in my house to save her. Had I not come back with my keys that very moment, she would be dead today. I don't think that is just a coincidence. I believe that something told my Dad to go to the store right then so that I would go home to save my Mom. I do not know what this force is. It could be the God Christians worship, fate, destiny, karma...hell, it could be Odin for all I know. But I do know that I must be doing something right because someone was looking out for me and my family that day.

I believe that if I live my life as a good person and put positive energy out into the world, it will come back to me. I try to respect all living creatures initially. Of course, it becomes very clear who does and does not deserve respect after some time.

I put my faith into myself. If there is a God and he is in all of us, then in a way, I am putting faith in Him. I do not thank God when things go well in my life, but I also do not blame Him when things get rough. I do not pray to Him to fix my problems. I do it myself or with the help of my family and friends.

I could sit here all day and list off stories of times I was narrowly saved from hardship, or was kept from helping others avoid it. I believe this is all part of some plan, but I just don't know who or what is pulling the strings. However, as I said, I must be doing something right, because I have two great jobs, great friends, an awesome family and the best man on the planet.

[swede96]

Of course you have no beliefs. What a pussy. You attack people and dont have the courage to make a stance. I just said this. And I like Swede, but why she is following you is beyond me. You are.....nothing.

Again, I am not following. I agree with much of what Arnold has said, but maybe "100%" wasn't quite accurate. I don't feel that people who belive in God are foolish, just different from myself. I have no problem with that as long as they treat me with respect.

I would also like to add that I don't see myself as someone who has chosen NOT to believe in God, just as someone who hasn't chosen TO believe. There is a difference. In my eyes, beliefs are not choices. I can't choose what to believe in anymore than I can choose who to love. Beliefs are programed into a person. Sure, things can happen that may alter them, but I haven't seen anything that makes me believe 100% that God does or doesn't exist.

[Stumpage]

I believe this world was created by someone much greater than me. All one has to do is look at the Himalayan mountains to see that ...

That's odd.....I always thought it had something to do with Plate Tectonics, but that must just be the "Going to BURN IN HELL in the afterlife" side of me.....

[swede96]

Funny thing is God puts me above nobody. All I have done is accepted Him -- no great accomplishment, but yet one that others choose to ignore or to deny. Only when it comes to believing in a Creator is it thought to be foolish to make a choice. In sports, picking a team is preferable to choosing all of them. In your life, settling down with one woman is considered to be much more mature and fulfilling than picking all of them.

That is actually a very good point, Moneyline.

Only in one's moral belief system is choosing one deity to put your faith into considered a failing or a weakness of sorts.

I don't think that for one second. I handle my problems by looking within myself instead of to God. That's just the way I am. I don't think it's a sign of weakness to look to God. In fact, I will admit that there have been times in my life that I looked inside myself and couldn't find the strength to overcome. In those times, I briefly wished that I could believe in God and turn to Him. Heck, I've even prayed once or twice. However, I just don't believe. I can't force myself to believe in him. So, in those times that I can't find the strength in myself, I turn to what I can see; my family and friends...and they have never failed me. If God is real, maybe He sent me these people for that very reason. Maybe he knows that while I have faith in all his creations, I am just not ready to accept and believe in Him.

[swede96]

That's odd.....I always thought it had something to do with Plate Tectonics, but that must just be the "Going to BURN IN HELL in the afterlife" side of me.....

I'm with Stumpy. I side with science on such things.

[Stumpage]

I'm with Stumpy. I side with science on such things.

That's good to hear, Swede.....Though the bad news of course is that I guess I'll be seeing you in the Flaming Underworld when our time here is done.....

[swede96]

That's good to hear, Swede.....Though the bad news of course is that I guess I'll be seeing you in the Flaming Underworld when our time here is done.....

I likes it hot and I have a feeling Satan throws WAY better parties. Doubt they'll be passing a bong around in heaven. Ya know?

[RageWizard]

Swede is going to hell. I should know because I was guarenteed the personnel directors job by the big man in charge down there himself in dream that I had. I know it was him because he was huge, had a deep manly voice, but was dressed like the cop from the village people. What a nighmare, luckily he was hung like a midget on Willy Wonka and the Chocolate Factory, so it didn't hurt that much when he forcably initiated me into the brotherhood of hellraisers.

[Arnold]

So you can be an asshole and still go to heaven just because you accepted the lord and dipped your head in water? Okie dokie. Well, Moneyline, is nasty, mean spirited people like you are going to be in heaven, I think I'll take my chances in hell.

I think hell won't be that bad after all. And I've seen Christians that are much worse than Moneyline. Heaven must be the real hell then.

I believe that if I live my life as a good person and put positive energy out into the world, it will come back to me.

This is true and it is a natural effect.

However, as I said, I must be doing something right, because I have two great jobs, great friends, an awesome family and the best man on the planet.

You get out of this world what you put into it. There is nothing surprising about it.

[moneyline]

Hell is living without the presence of God. Right now, whatever your belief system, God is all around you. In hell, He won't be. And if the word of God is to believed, you'll notice the difference.

Put your faith in men and you will eventually ALWAYS be let down.

Put your faith in God and you will ultimately never be.

Put your faith in science and ... well, you have a faction yelling about global warming, another yelling about global cooling and no consensus anywhere because (here's the tricky part) they are all mere mortals, flawed in every way just like everyone around them ...

And Swede, not for nothing, but everyone claims to have the best man/woman on the planet when they are dating them and then after the break-up they find another best man/woman on the planet ... and the beat goes on ...

[mathdotcom]

So the Himalayas are quite spectacular, hence there is a God. And it's the one I follow.

I see where you're coming from.

Bunch of religious tards

[mathdotcom]

Whether there is a God or not is not the question. Noone can answer that. Don't debate that point with me please. Just look at how religion causes more harm than good.

- Young kids getting married because they are horny as hell, and then divorce a couple years later because they didnt shack up first to see if they were compatible.
- Anti-gambling legislation
- Anti-gambling legislation
- Anti-gambling legislation

[moneyline]

God doesn't speak about gambling in the Bible. He does, however, speak about excessive behavior, whatever the topic. And I'm not debating anything with you. You are the one who jumped into this thread and began to debate with me.

That's fine. Just don't do it and then start whining about it. It is so very unscientific.