Horse Racing questions and answers

[JBEX]

it's terrific you get so much out of this thread str ..I'm sure everybody ,including myself, agrees it always has and continues to be a great learning tool to understand the game from the perspective of a trainer .. something that can also improve one's handicapping by seeing things in a different light than just speed figures trainer stats etc

I too have enjoyed following KB,DM and the progeny of AM and it wouldn't even be as close to interesting without your take on their performances .. appreciate what you do and the time you put in always

still 3 years away from kingsbarns first crop and that will certainly be interesting also

my suggestion with army mule would be do everything about him in the same thread (new one) ..this way we have one place for his entries and commentary when you feel it's worth noting something..obviously with the latter it will have some educational material also

this is up you though str and if you'd prefer the occasional reviews to be done in your thread that's ok with me .. can always switch things along the way if we want ..will start this next week in case any new ideas come to mind .. no rush to respond


sure with the pictures if you're up to it .. be cool to see some shots of mccarron and others

[Easy-Rider 66]

Maybe EZ is right. It is a Q and A thread and I would not want to discourage anyone that might have a question from asking it.
So what about posting AM's etc. that will be running in a new thread and any follow up questions regarding the race in here? I think there will be plenty. Or some variation of that ? IDK. What do you guys think ?( more on this in a minute)

That said, I really enjoy the AM, Deterministic, KB in the next couple of years, and all of them. A lot. It has me watching more video looking at replays and that seems to help people see things that occur during the race that most do not know to watch for. That is a great way to learn and with these things that have come up in the last few days especially within these replays, there are winners that will come from those and I do not want them to get lost.

Let me say that the only reason this thread has gone on as long as it has, has much more to do with you posters than with me. Without questions and fan interest it would have died a long time ago. This thread continues to allow me to share insights and opinions from race to race or question to question. And the AM's that do find problems within the race, the luxury of following them is that you can be really confident that you will get the horses best effort darn near every time. They are all so competitive. Can't take that for granted ever.
This thread has also allowed me to be more at peace with leaving the game when I did. It has allowed me to talk about things I suppressed for years and it has freed me from the anger and hurt that circumstances caused within the game. HISA being implemented has helped as well. Amazing to see some long time people all decide to quit the game at the same time. Gee, wonder why? Must be a coincidence? Nah ,I don't believe in those.
I have never been more at ease with what all took place than I am today. This simple thread has allowed that to happen. And you folks that posted in here made that happen.

I surprised an old owner of mine last week when I showed up at Laurel Park before the first race knowing he would be there. Thank you Jim McCue , the long time track photographer in Md. for setting that up.
That former owner headed a claiming partnership back around 1980 +\- that flourished for quite a while. As good an owner as I ever had and a friend as well. Hopefully he reads this as I told him about this thread when we saw each other. Some really great memories from back then that I’ll never forget. Thanks Bill !

The reunion at the track is next Sunday . I’m not sure who cares but I can get some pictures of some of those well known people and post them if you all want. I got a text from CJ and he will be there. But that is up to you posters in here. Just let me know.

Lastly, thank all of you for helping me, help you , just as you, helped me . Pretty amazing. And in this thread , nobody cares if you were a republican or democrat or your race or religion. Just people helping people. The way all this was meant to be.

what ever you and JBEX decide is good for me. Just thought the army mule stuff was taking over your thread. That sounds like a good compromise. Post army mules running in different thread and questions about a trip in your thread. all good. THX again STR

[str]

chancer mcpatrick (7-2) will be running in the bluegrass stakes tomorrow which is kentucky's final derby prep..also burnham square (9-2) I feel doesn't look bad ..little bias with both as the former we followed in this thread and the latter by liam's map who's progeny we also kept loose tabs on (because of deterministic and caldera)..also a sire future recommendation at big odds



.

I am not necessarily confident, but I am really hopeful that Chancer McPatrick will find his groove and run well today in the Bluegrass.
Sometimes closing one turn sprinters just do not want two turns and/ or more ground. I don't know if that is the case or not. Understand having to try though, so today should help answer that question. As a 2 yr. old, those moves he made were electric. Hope it continues around two turns.

[str]

OK JBEX up to STR. That way you can isolate the Army Mule info and have less clutter in the question and answer thread. But if STR rather keep the info here all good.

Maybe EZ is right. It is a Q and A thread and I would not want to discourage anyone that might have a question from asking it.
So what about posting AM's etc. that will be running in a new thread and any follow up questions regarding the race in here? I think there will be plenty. Or some variation of that ? IDK. What do you guys think ?( more on this in a minute)

That said, I really enjoy the AM, Deterministic, KB in the next couple of years, and all of them. A lot. It has me watching more video looking at replays and that seems to help people see things that occur during the race that most do not know to watch for. That is a great way to learn and with these things that have come up in the last few days especially within these replays, there are winners that will come from those and I do not want them to get lost.

Let me say that the only reason this thread has gone on as long as it has, has much more to do with you posters than with me. Without questions and fan interest it would have died a long time ago. This thread continues to allow me to share insights and opinions from race to race or question to question. And the AM's that do find problems within the race, the luxury of following them is that you can be really confident that you will get the horses best effort darn near every time. They are all so competitive. Can't take that for granted ever.
This thread has also allowed me to be more at peace with leaving the game when I did. It has allowed me to talk about things I suppressed for years and it has freed me from the anger and hurt that circumstances caused within the game. HISA being implemented has helped as well. Amazing to see some long time people all decide to quit the game at the same time. Gee, wonder why? Must be a coincidence? Nah ,I don't believe in those.
I have never been more at ease with what all took place than I am today. This simple thread has allowed that to happen. And you folks that posted in here made that happen.

I surprised an old owner of mine last week when I showed up at Laurel Park before the first race knowing he would be there. Thank you Jim McCue , the long time track photographer in Md. for setting that up.
That former owner headed a claiming partnership back around 1980 +\- that flourished for quite a while. As good an owner as I ever had and a friend as well. Hopefully he reads this as I told him about this thread when we saw each other. Some really great memories from back then that I’ll never forget. Thanks Bill !

The reunion at the track is next Sunday . I’m not sure who cares but I can get some pictures of some of those well known people and post them if you all want. I got a text from CJ and he will be there. But that is up to you posters in here. Just let me know.

Lastly, thank all of you for helping me, help you , just as you, helped me . Pretty amazing. And in this thread , nobody cares if you were a republican or democrat or your race or religion. Just people helping people. The way all this was meant to be.

[JBEX]

chancer mcpatrick (7-2) will be running in the bluegrass stakes tomorrow which is kentucky's final derby prep..also burnham square (9-2) I feel doesn't look bad ..little bias with both as the former we followed in this thread and the latter by liam's map who's progeny we also kept loose tabs on (because of deterministic and caldera)..also a sire future recommendation at big odds



.

[JBEX]

might be a little awkward for you to say str but I'm good with that if you'd rather do it that way

as you know this years 2yo's will be his 4th crop so going to be seeing more and more of them ..maybe at some point you want to stop reviewing trips because of the volume of runners he has and I totally get that ..always appreciate the extra insight you give and I think you've already established he's an extremely talented sire

[Easy-Rider 66]

might be a little awkward for you to say str but I'm good with that if you'd rather do it that way

OK JBEX up to STR. That way you can isolate the Army Mule info and have less clutter in the question and answer thread. But if STR rather keep the info here all good.

[JBEX]

Hey JBEX and STR: do you both think maybe JBEX should start an ARMY MULE PROGENY thread? It seems to me like the Racing and question thread is being overtaken by Army Mules. LOL. Just my 2 cents.

might be a little awkward for you to say str but I'm good with that if you'd rather do it that way

[JBEX]

deterministic made his 4yo debut yesterday .. allowance race scheduled for 9f on the turf went on a sloppy track instead..always have said would like to see him back on the dirt as his first two career wins were on it ..ran on the front end ,which he'd never done before,held well to finish 2nd by 1+ lengths ..sure he got something out of this so he'll probably be more fit for his next start

kee R10 if you want to watch a replay

[Easy-Rider 66]

Hey JBEX and STR: do you both think maybe JBEX should start an ARMY MULE PROGENY thread? It seems to me like the Racing and question thread is being overtaken by Army Mules. LOL. Just my 2 cents.

[JBEX]

yeah..won by 7+ and looked like she wasn't asked for much to do it ..didn't even realize going in that it was a filly ..other cool thing is it's out of a liam's map mare and wesley ward is the sole owner ..has to say something about the sire that he would buy one for himself



.

they mentioned on tvg she might be a candidate for royal ascot..army mule above avg turf and liam's map of course is sire of deterministic..remember last year when clement was interviewed about deterministic (think prior to his 3yo debut)he said he had another by liam's map who won a turf sprint stakes (or allowance ..not 100% sure) ..doesn't seem unrealistic he might give that a shot

[batt33]

yeah..won by 7+ and looked like she wasn't asked for much to do it ..didn't even realize going in that it was a filly ..other cool thing is it's out of a liam's map mare and wesley ward is the sole owner ..has to say something about the sire that The he would buy one for himself



.

Yes for sure! I agree people are starting to take notice more and more with the Army Mules,

[batt33]

I always immediately go visually to the legs , feet and body when I see all these horses. Just a habit. Nothing seemed different but a view is just a start. His demeanor was fine and he seemed calm and comfortable. Those white smudges we’re probably uptight, a poultice that is pre mixed but that can be routine for the soundest of horses.
I will watch the rerun but from what you guys said, it sounded like it made sense too me.

I would have signed a contract to have all mine look that good post race .

[JBEX]

Wow Pinky finger was impressive! Lily didn't run to bad either!

yeah..won by 7+ and looked like she wasn't asked for much to do it ..didn't even realize going in that it was a filly ..other cool thing is it's out of a liam's map mare and wesley ward is the sole owner ..has to say something about the sire that he would buy one for himself



.

[str]

Thanks STR! I would have believed DanBlacker would have said something in the video the next morning. Well I know one thing he will have some time off!

I always immediately go visually to the legs , feet and body when I see all these horses. Just a habit. Nothing seemed different but a view is just a start. His demeanor was fine and he seemed calm and comfortable. Those white smudges we’re probably uptight, a poultice that is pre mixed but that can be routine for the soundest of horses.
I will watch the rerun but from what you guys said, it sounded like it made sense too me.

I would have signed a contract to have all mine look that good post race .

[batt33]

He looks fine Batt. That is the most important thing.
Glad he ate up and seems good to go. Legs look good from afar. Still haven't seen the race but will find it asap.

Thanks STR! I would have believed DanBlacker would have said something in the video the next morning. Well I know one thing he will have some time off!

[batt33]

by army mule .. monday

keeneland

R1 (two horses)

#1 lily's army (15-1)
#8 pinky finger (7-5)

the 2yo races are beginning ..2 first time starters going 4.5f

Wow Pinky finger was impressive! Lily didn't run to bad either!

[str]

Yes agreed
Yes and off a layoff cant wait!
Thanks JBEX! there was reports the he was off... But as you saw in the video the trainer didn't mention it.

Look forward to the 2 year old races!

He looked comfortable grazing. Hard to see any subtle joint filling on a video like that . It is usually very subtle and you need to feel those legs every day or every other day at the least to have a firm grasp on the heat, filling, etc. I saw some white marks on a couple of legs in various spots that could have been remnants of poultice applied but that's probably standard procedure post race.
If he WAS off, he looked comfortable there. Doubt anything would be serious but it doesn't take much as Batt can attest to.

[str]

yes saw the same thing.... legs looked good... wondering if it could be a breathing issue....

Good eye Batt. That would be my first guess.

[str]

didn't look good with war mule..guess he was eased in the stretch and noticed when he crossed the wire his head was up and went side to side

The rider immediately became concerned actually just before the 1/4 pole ( red and white at top of the stretch). He either heard something or felt something and by then the horse was quite concerned and therefore a bit confused as well. He was never really in hand down the backside so the horse knew something was not perfect because he seemed to be focusing on whatever it was and not the race or the riders instructions. Being an Army Mule, he ran through it but it was evident that the horse was not himself even before the turn from the 1/2 mile pole ( red pole before the far turn) through the 3/8ths pole( green and white into the turn.)

Don't know if the not switching leads was a soreness problem or a breathing, bleeding internally problem that preoccupied the horses focus away from switching leads. Finally switched late in the stretch most likely when the horse was out of contention and being eased up and the horse kind of let down and let normalcy creep ,back in. Hope that makes sense.

Also, hope the horse is OK.

[str]

Just wasn't his day..... Yes Blacker has!

Straight No Chaser Post Race Update



Straight No Chaser bounced out of the G1 Golden Shaheen in good order this morning. Trainer Dan Blacker passed along the video above of him, reporting he jogged up sound and is good spirits. Straight No Chaser is currently scheduled to leave Dubai on Wednesday and we will follow up with any additional information.

https://cdnb-media.myracehorse.com/b...3917405044.mp4

He looks fine Batt. That is the most important thing.
Glad he ate up and seems good to go. Legs look good from afar. Still haven't seen the race but will find it asap.

[str]

[QUOTE=JBEX;n29865201]

it's really amazing how often these army mules have legit excuses when they run subpar..it's great to know this stuff for follow up plays and to further confirm he is producing solid runners overall even when it's not obvious to the untrained eye ..great job str


_______

on a separate note thought you might find this race interesting


carter stakes at aqu (army mules finale) ..don't really have an opinion but deep solid field

couple of interesting notes
..

ed allard shipping from laurel with a horse that's only run there in 5 career starts (won 4 of them)

linda rice has an "8yo" she claimed 4 starts back who ran a career high figure last start




.

Yes JBEX. I am not making this stuff up. And if I see one that is not trying or looking for a reason to disengage, I will point that out. So far all I have seen is hard trying, determined horses running hard. Only exception are a few that have not had the lightbulb go off yet.
In some cases, it could be the horse but for the most part, I would be looking at the trainer.

They damn near all do the same thing. Try like crazy.

[batt33]

we'll see what str thinks .. hopefully he's ok

think ovetta's hobby got a lot out of that race and is primed for a big effort 2nd off the layoff

sorry about SNC batt..sure after a few months away to recoup he'll have a nice year back at home

by army mule .. monday

keeneland

R1 (two horses)

#1 lily's army (15-1)
#8 pinky finger (7-5)

the 2yo races are beginning ..2 first time starters going 4.5f

Yes agreed
Yes and off a layoff cant wait!
Thanks JBEX! there was reports the he was off... But as you saw in the video the trainer didn't mention it.

Look forward to the 2 year old races!

[JBEX]

by army mule .. monday

keeneland

R1 (two horses)

#1 lily's army (15-1)
#8 pinky finger (7-5)

the 2yo races are beginning ..2 first time starters going 4.5f

[JBEX]

sorry about SNC batt..sure after a few months away to recoup he'll have a nice year back at home

[JBEX]

yes saw the same thing.... legs looked good... wondering if it could be a breathing issue....

we'll see what str thinks .. hopefully he's ok

think ovetta's hobby got a lot out of that race and is primed for a big effort 2nd off the layoff

[batt33]

didn't look good with war mule..guess he was eased in the stretch and noticed when he crossed the wire his head was up and went side to side

yes saw the same thing.... legs looked good... wondering if it could be a breathing issue....

[JBEX]

didn't look good with war mule..guess he was eased in the stretch and noticed when he crossed the wire his head was up and went side to side

[JBEX]

(AM SA6)OH cold on the board ..6-1 w/3 mtp

[batt33]

I have not seen this race but I don't care for the " antsy" part. I was hopeful that he had matured somewhat away from that especially after his last 2 races. But in his defense, it does not take much , especially at a different venue, to get any horse wound up pre race.

Sorry that occurred Batt. Seems it might take an event like this to beat him between the pre race nerves and the bad break.

He will be back. I think your trainer has done a super job with him and most likely will off this race as well.

Just wasn't his day..... Yes Blacker has!

Straight No Chaser Post Race Update



Straight No Chaser bounced out of the G1 Golden Shaheen in good order this morning. Trainer Dan Blacker passed along the video above of him, reporting he jogged up sound and is good spirits. Straight No Chaser is currently scheduled to leave Dubai on Wednesday and we will follow up with any additional information.

https://cdnb-media.myracehorse.com/b...3917405044.mp4

[batt33]

one more

by army mule

santa anita 6 @ 6:09

#6 ovetta's hobby (7-2)

2 race win streak but first time on downhill turf course is tough .. rispoli (journalism jock) will be aboard for first time ..should be in a good state of mind

rispoli .... is another " Toro on the turf"! Fernando Toro was a grass race specialist .. back about 30 years ago. Berrios is another good turf rider.

[batt33]

by army mule ..sunday

oak R12 @ 6:38

#9 war mule (2-1)

This horse looks solid in this race.

Very surprised if he isn't right there in here.

I'm with you STR!

[JBEX]

That first run down the hill can be tough to overcome. But I don’t put anything past the AM,s.
She has never missed the board and getting better every start. Unreal.

yes I agree and lot's of repect from ml maker imo factoring she's never been on the grass..interesting to me 2 consecutive dirt wins ,second one being on new years day and they give her more than 3 months off and switch surfaces ..resumed workouts fairly quickly since that last race also

[str]

one more

by army mule

santa anita 6 @ 6:09

#6 ovetta's hobby (7-2)

2 race win streak but first time on downhill turf course is tough .. rispoli (journalism jock) will be aboard for first time ..should be in a good state of mind

That first run down the hill can be tough to overcome. But I don’t put anything past the AM,s.
She has never missed the board and getting better every start. Unreal.

[JBEX]

by army mule ..sunday

oak R12 @ 6:38

#9 war mule (2-1)

This horse looks solid in this race.

Very surprised if he isn't right there in here.

one more

by army mule

santa anita 6 @ 6:09

#6 ovetta's hobby (7-2)

2 race win streak but first time on downhill turf course is tough .. rispoli (journalism jock) will be aboard for first time ..should be in a good state of mind