Originally posted by polskboy
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Check your PM inbox. Sent you a suggestion.
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I was affected by the same decision at Bookmaker. My Mederos bet was graded as a loss, not a draw. I reached out to live chat and another contact, and they are sticking by their grading. They referenced Rule 1 for Mixed Martial Arts:Originally posted by Optional- The result at the end of the contest is final. This includes any recounts of the judges’ scorecards. Any subsequent changes made by governing bodies do not count for betting purposes.
From what I understand, the judges scorecards weren't changed. The error was deemed a "misread scorecard" by the commission. I'd be welcome to any suggestions you may have. Thanks.Comment -
This 10000% should be changed.Comment -
Thank you for the fuller explanation.Originally posted by 9XL
If Bookmaker rules say the first announced result is final, then I think there would be a lot more uproar if they changed to paying out on a draw for grading later.
It sounds like they graded this correctly from your description.
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Now Opti is saying they are correct in what they graded. If they announced a winner by mistake but it was really a draw then it should be graded as a draw. Now I'm not following.Comment -
I'm not sure this is the correct interpretation. The result at the end of the contest was a draw. There was no recount and the scorecards were not changed. The scorecards were misread.Originally posted by Optional
The scorecards always showed 28-28, 28-28, 29-27 = majority draw. They were not changed. For some unkown reason they were read as 29-27, 29-27, 28-28 = Padilla the winner.
Besides Bookmaker, is there any other sportsbook that did not grade this as a draw? (Not counting Kalshi as they cannot reverse the decision after the Contracts expire.)Comment -
Bear with me, as I did not see this and could not find a video of the decision part of the fight.Originally posted by 9XL
I'm not sure this is the correct interpretation. The result at the end of the contest was a draw. There was no recount and the scorecards were not changed. The scorecards were misread.
The scorecards always showed 28-28, 28-28, 29-27 = majority draw. They were not changed. For some unkown reason they were read as 29-27, 29-27, 28-28 = Padilla the winner.
Besides Bookmaker, is there any other sportsbook that did not grade this as a draw? (Not counting Kalshi as they cannot reverse the decision after the Contracts expire.)
Is it correct that Padilla was announced as official and hand raised in the ring?
Is it correct that around an hour later that official decision was changed?
If so, you definitely have no argument and Bookmaker definitely graded correctly.
Let me know if I am missing some aspect.
You've mentioned the score cards were not changed. I do not think that is a relevant matter at all. They pay on the first official decision regardless of the reason it is changed later. Much like the Kalshi situation you mentioned they do it so they can grade fast and not need to open a pandoras box of customers having rebet that money before a decision change is made. Not to cheat customers.
Also, another poster pointed this out "two weeks ago same thing happened and they marked Marcin Tybura fight as a loss", presumably to suggest Bookmaker graded differently in that situation.
That also does not appear to be the case. It appears Bookmaker graded that exactly the same way as they graded this.
That's just my opinion based on what you guys have told me and a little googling. If I missed something I apologize but for now I can't agree that the draw must be paid out..Comment -
You are correct, Padilla was announced as winner and his hand was raised in the ring. The correction took place a little less than 30 minutes later from what I can tell.
If by "The result at the end of the contest is final" means Buffer's announcement and subsequent hand raise, it is unfortunate that he can say the wrong score and/or fighter's name and that announcement stands and cannot be corrected.
I said I was "not sure" that you have the correct interpretation. You may be right and Bookmaker correctly graded per their rules. Bookmaker is not out to cheat customers. I have been playing with them for 20+ years and will continue to do so as they are one of the best books out there.
Grading mistakes happen and those can be corrected hours or even days after the fact when it is brought to their attention. I am curious if any other sportsbook (not counting Kalshi) kept Padilla as the winner.
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Bookmakers don't actually grade based on reality. They grade based on the market terms. Which can be tough to accept in situations like this.Originally posted by 9XL
The situation comes up quite often in soccer games, where books will state they grade based on official stats. Official stats can often get the number of corners wrong for example. It doesn't matter if a video review proves it they will only change the grading if the official league site changes it. (which we have managed to get done a few times)
Another way to think about it is if they did change this grading, how strong would the argument of those then penalized be based on these rules? Very strong I think.
Anyway, sorry to not see it how would you have preferred..Comment -
They have a rule that basically says we pay out on the announced official result in the ring and don't recognize any changes later.Originally posted by 2Sweeet
Someone asked how many other books have a similar rule. I don't bet much MMA but I would guess plenty grade this way.
I do bet a lot of NASCAR and the majority of books grade motor racing similarly. They pay on the finishing order at the podium ceremony even if the driver is later disqualified.
BM really did get this one correct.
In the old days they may have done a goodwill payout to both bet sides in a weird situation like this one, but there is no requirement for them to..Comment -
Plenty of books? I can't find another book that didn't grade it as a draw. Pinny, BetOnline, Bet365, 4Casters, Fanatics, Circa, etc...all corrected to a draw. I would love to hear of another sportsbook that kept it as a Padilla win.
I don't see how your soccer analogy applies to this case. The official stats aren't wrong and didn't change.
It is your interpretation that "The result at the end of the contest is final" = "we pay out on the announced official result in the ring". My argument is that the final result at the end of the contest was a draw and didn't change. The announcer misread the results. You are arguing the other side. That's fair.
Anyway, thanks for the feedback and good luck to you.Comment -
If any of these apart from Circa did reverse the grading, it was likely they just paid both sides as a goodwill measure.Originally posted by 9XL
I didnt check BOL as I need a login.
Bet365 says "Subsequent appeals/amendments… will not affect settlement" <-- but they regularly pay both sides in this situation.
Betfanatics "All wagers are settled based on the official result at the conclusion of the event. Any subsequent changes, protests, or appeals will not affect the settlement of wagers."
Pinnacle "In the event of a disqualification or amended result, bets will be settled on the result at the time of the podium presentation."
Draftkings say Official result stands unless amended within 1 hour.
Circa same as DK but it says changes will be recognized up until 3am after the event.
BetMGM "Official result at the conclusion of the event will stand… protests or changes do not affect wagers."
Caesars "Results are based on official decision… any subsequent changes… do not affect wagers."
Fanduel "Bets are settled on the official result at the time of settlement… subsequent changes do not count.".Comment -
I had to go look up the house rules for myself. Everything below is from their current website or app. All of the sportsbooks below would grade and pay out the Draw as the winner. Not out of goodwill, but based off of following their rules. It's possible some of the "human error" language was added after this weekend's fiasco.
Bet365 Sports Rules: MMA: Bet Settlement and Appeals/Amendments:
Subsequent appeals/amendments do not affect settlement (unless the amendment was made due to human error when announcing the result).
BetFanatics: General MMA Rules- All bets will be settled on the official result announced at the end of the fight. Subsequent appeals/amendments do not affect settlement. If an announcer is found to have misread or announced scores incorrectly then this will be acknowledged and events will be resettled accordingly.
Pinnacle: Your qoute about podium presentation is from their sport specific Cycling rules.
General Rule #4. The result of a fixture will be the final determination by the fixture’s governing body on the date of the fixture’s completion. Pinnacle does not recognise protested or overturned decisions
The result was not protested nor overturned.
BetOnline: similar to Pinnacle.
All Sporting Events will be settled in accordance with our wagering rules on the day they are completed. Any subsequent change in the result of an event due to any form of protest will not be considered for settlement.
"Settled on the day" gives Pinny and Betonline the latitude to correct initial grading errors.
Draftkings: The result was amended within 1 hour.
Circa: The result was amended before 3am.
Caesars: UFC/MMA Fights
Event results will be graded/re-graded based on the official result at ringside. An Event result may be revised or altered after initial presentation by the ring announcer. Event results are not official for wagering purposes until verified by officials at the Event venue. The overturning of a fight decision by an official or unofficial sanctioning body, based on appeal, suspension, lawsuit, drug testing result, or any other fighter sanction, will not be recognized for wagering purposes.
FanDuel:
Mixed Martial Arts- General
- Unless otherwise stated below, bets will be settled on the official result announced in the octagon. Subsequent appeals/amendments do not affect settlement (unless the amendment was made due to human error when announcing the result)
BetMGM: MMA Wagers
Mixed Martial Arts Wagers
Mixed Martial Arts wagers are accepted in the following manner:
Results will be graded on the basis of the official result at ringside as communicated by the official announcer. Any subsequent change to the official outcome of the fight for any reason will not be recognized for wagering purposes (unless the amendment was made due to human error when announcing the result)Comment -
Bookmaker is the worst book in terms of management and customer support - no question.
betonline mgmt eventually met me in the middle. It took hours and persistent outreach, but they made things right.
bookmaker in the other had just cold shoulder me after depositing $500k and banned me for laying into CS. Micky Flynn and the mgmt team is the worst and I would never trust them with your business. DM me with questionsComment -
Headsup anyone got a kyc reply from bookmarker lately? It's been 3months still no update on my endComment -
Sad this is still going on present day. Nobody should be signing up for bookmaker until the book learns to value their players again, and develop a KYC team that has half a brain. It's likely ran by some egotistical work from home costa rican making $20 an hour. thinking he's made it. Hilarious that their phone line is still down for employees to stay "safe". Covid was 5 years ago, come out from hiding.Originally posted by Diskills
As a betting man, I'd wager maybe 5% of their company could graduate high school, and they handle millions of dollars a year, crazy! Or more like scary
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