Betfair $3.1 million slow-pay and other pro player issues (Video)

[jesuseatsnubs]

wow that is messed up .. I recommend anyone using betfair .. just simply stop using them .. let them dig their own grave

[austin]

wow that is messed up .. I recommend anyone using betfair .. just simply stop using them .. let them dig their own grave

you mind me asking - what exchange you recommend to use instead?

[bettilimbroke999]

That much is clear. For you this is about you. But this thread is about a guy who is slow paid 3.5 million. So why on earth did you take over the thread?

There is no need to be alarmed? lol Most of the money is held by a small percentage. So if they start skimming off the top to pay the 'poor', that should probably concern anybody playing at Betfair. My take? They change rules on the fly, because they're in over their heads.

At 60% even if you bet a game at no juice you would be betting at -250. Betting a 100 to win 40

At least BF is reasonable to winners

[thom321]

I have just read this thread non-stop from the first post and I could frankly have done without the name calling and the personal attacks, since it takes away from the actual issue. However, I have never been on a sportsbetting forum where that doesn't happen so I fully expected it.

It is indeed unfortunate that we can't be sure that we have all the facts, but I think it might be unwise to assume that we don't have all the facts just because everything doesn't seem to add up. I agree that it seems strange to use a third party given the amount involved and I would not have done so myself. So Anty should (and I think he already has in some comments) get part of the blame. However, if we assume that it was indeed Betfair that suggested/recommended the use of said PSP (even if it was a rouge employee at Betfair who gets kickbacks to recommend a specific PSP, that employee still represents Betfair) they still should get most of the blame, since they have much greater resources than the individual customer to do the necessary due diligence on potential PSPs. The reason we have the FDIC in the US to protect customers from bank failures is because the average customer does not have the resources to look into the stability of the bank before depositing money with it. That way, the system can stay relatively stable since customers have faith that their money is safe.

Hareeba!, I have read all your posts in the thread and it is clear that you have definitely put some thought and effort into (most if not all of) your comments. However, even though Betfair might have fulfilled their strict legal obligation by paying the PSP, don't you think that they have a moral obligation to try to make things right for the player e.g. by paying the amount owed directly to the player and then taking action against the PSP to recover the funds not paid?

Given that the amounts involved are most likely considerable for the individual, but in the grand scheme of things rather small for a company of Betfair's size, to me it would be a great promotion and creator of goodwill if Betfair would do just that. I would think that the positive publicity (Betfair can make sure the world knows about it) from such an action by Betfair would outweigh the cost involved since I also think that Betfair has a pretty good chance of getting the money back, at least considerably better than an individual player would have.

For full disclosure, I don't have an account with Betfair and never had. However, I have experience as an investor in analyzing companies and I find quite a few actions, most recently the increased PC, by the Betfair management team very concerning and raise quite a few questions as to where Betfair is headed going forward.

Btw, Hareeba! did not ask for SBR to comment initially, Toit did. My apologies if that had already been cleared up but it was getting a bit old reading about it repeatedly in the last hour.

[jesuseatsnubs]

you mind me asking - what exchange you recommend to use instead?

as far as exchanges go .. i would say Matchbook ..

but if ur looking for a sportsbook .. Pinnacle if ur not in US .. and if in the USA then either bookmaker or betislands .. and only reason I say betislands is because they offer same day payouts .. and they seem to be good .. I can't recommend them just yet until I see how they do perhaps a year or 2 from now ..

[Santo]

At 60% even if you bet a game at no juice you would be betting at -250. Betting a 100 to win 40

At least BF is reasonable to winners

The PC isn't charged on every bet, but rather profits over a period, so this is a little misleading.

[bettilimbroke999]

The PC isn't charged on every bet, but rather profits over a period, so this is a little misleading.

Oh I see, well that's a little better I guess, though I dont play there (US) it sounds like they've got the most complicated and greedy commission structure that ever existed on earth to rape their winners, its amazing none of the pros that are getting gouged have taken any of the liquidity Justin7 keeps saying they provide to a competitor.

[kkkkk]

PC is based on what u have won over the week. im prefer to pay 20% at betfair for many reasons. However let me give you example on this PC:

If you made 20 bets at pinacle at 1.90 or -110 american and you have won 11 of 20 bets that will mean: 11x0.90 units profit - 9 units loses = 0.9 units net profit
And situation at betfair under same circumstances: 11 bets won @ 2.00/-100 and 9 lost means = 11-9 = 2 units net profit. Then comes 20% PC on 2 units = 1.60 units weekly profit. And thats more then at Pinacle.
If we make more thoughs 1.60 vs 0.9 units in long term -> if you made 20k profit on Pinnacle that will mean theoretically 35 k profit with Betfair.
So which one will you chose ?
Not to mention that not many bookmakers offer 1.90 lines, some like b365 or other european books offer 1.83 lines that make huge difference-> with betfair you will make 35k, with Pinnacle 20k, and with b365 or other it will be not more then 5k. So compare 5k with 35k!

Of corse we have to take in mind other difference between those bookmakers like liquidity or limits, voiding/accepting bets and others.

So you see now why some preffer to be charged 20% ( as i said there are also other important reasons i dont speak about) then playing at normal bookmakers. Even if you are charged 60% on 35k you will have 10k left that is more then made while playing at most European bookmakers like b365/bwin and others.

[pjesnik24]

PC is based on what u have won over the week. im prefer to pay 20% at betfair for many reasons. However let me give you example on this PC:

If you made 20 bets at pinacle at 1.90 or -110 american and you have won 11 of 20 bets that will mean: 11x0.90 units profit - 9 units loses = 0.9 units net profit
And situation at betfair under same circumstances: 11 bets won @ 2.00/-100 and 9 lost means = 11-9 = 2 units net profit. Then comes 20% PC on 2 units = 1.60 units weekly profit. And thats more then at Pinacle.
If we make more thoughs 1.60 vs 0.9 units in long term -> if you made 20k profit on Pinnacle that will mean theoretically 35 k profit with Betfair.
So which one will you chose ?
Not to mention that not many bookmakers offer 1.90 lines, some like b365 or other european books offer 1.83 lines that make huge difference-> with betfair you will make 35k, with Pinnacle 20k, and with b365 or other it will be not more then 5k. So compare 5k with 35k!

Of corse we have to take in mind other difference between those bookmakers like liquidity or limits, voiding/accepting bets and others.

So you see now why some preffer to be charged 20% ( as i said there are also other important reasons i dont speak about) then playing at normal bookmakers. Even if you are charged 60% on 35k you will have 10k left that is more then made while playing at most European bookmakers like b365/bwin and others.

one problem with this calculation is that with pinnacle, sbobet, 188bet etc you get -103 even -102 when you compare all the sites (for soccer) and at betfair you never get +100 but -100.5 at best.

[Hareeba!]

omg you are a bigger moron than i thought, just scroll back a few pages, Im not gonna play your silly little game

no matter what you say the people that read this thread are gonna realize what a racket betfair is

read: omg you didn't ask for a comment after all .. my humble apology

[Hareeba!]

Hareeba!, I have read all your posts in the thread and it is clear that you have definitely put some thought and effort into (most if not all of) your comments. However, even though Betfair might have fulfilled their strict legal obligation by paying the PSP, don't you think that they have a moral obligation to try to make things right for the player e.g. by paying the amount owed directly to the player and then taking action against the PSP to recover the funds not paid?

Yes, as I have already said, IF it can be established that there was a recommendation by Betfair (or a rogue employee) that Anty use PSP or that there is a principal/agent relationship between Betfair and PSP.

Btw, Hareeba! did not ask for SBR to comment initially, Toit did. My apologies if that had already been cleared up but it was getting a bit old reading about it repeatedly in the last hour.

Thank you Thom.
Mushroom please note.

[Scooter]

Hareeba! - "Yes, as I have already said, IF it can be established that there was a recommendation by Betfair (or a rogue employee) that Anty use PSP or that there is a principal/agent relationship between Betfair and PSP."

Anty has stated that he deposited with the PSP and played directly thru his Betfair account.
Wouldn't that clearly establish a Principal/Agent relationship?

Also, I asked him early in the thread and he has stated that he has email documentation establishing the recommendation by Betfair to use that PSP.

I think everyone reading this thread would agree with Thom321 and Hareeba! that (if the above is correct) Betfair has a moral and ethical obligation to make things right.

[SportsMushroom]

Mushroom please note.

all Im noting is you trying to defend the indefensible

everyone disagrees with you yet you keep spewing out the same nonsense in every single post you make, further proving my point that you are a not so bright annoying shill

even justin has commented that he is looking into several complaints about betfair, and you can be sure those are only the very small percentage that stumbled upon sbr, but you will keep going on about what good people your employers are, go back and read the replies in this thread, noone is buying the crap you are selling

[Hareeba!]

all Im noting is you trying to defend the indefensible

everyone disagrees with you yet you keep spewing out the same nonsense in every single post you make, further proving my point that you are a not so bright annoying shill

even justin has commented that he is looking into several complaints about betfair, and you can be sure those are only the very small percentage that stumbled upon sbr, but you will keep going on about what good people your employers are, go back and read the replies in this thread, noone is buying the crap you are selling

well you've already been proven wrong so who's selling crap ?

[SportsMushroom]

well you've already been proven wrong so who's selling crap ?

been proven wrong about what shill?

how can I be proven wrong if i have not made any claims? did you even manage to finish high school?

you are the only one that has claimed something, claiming betfair is a good book, I just remind you how full of shit you are

their policies are geared towards driving wining players away, you claiming to play there proves you are either small time or a one trick shill

[Hareeba!]

been proven wrong about what shill?

how can I be proven wrong if i have not made any claims? did you even manage to finish high school?

you are the only one that has claimed something, claiming betfair is a good book, I just remind you how full of shit you are

their policies are geared towards driving wining players away, you claiming to play there proves you are either small time or a one trick shill

You stated that I asked SBR for comment.
I asked you to prove it - you failed miserably.
Thom gave the answer proving you lied.
Now unless you have anything positive to contribute to this thread just disappear please.

[Hareeba!]

Anty has stated that he deposited with the PSP and played directly thru his Betfair account.
Wouldn't that clearly establish a Principal/Agent relationship?

Yes. Between Anty as principal and PSP as agent.

Also, I asked him early in the thread and he has stated that he has email documentation establishing the recommendation by Betfair to use that PSP..

I think we need to see what that says.

[yokspot]

Hareeba! - "Yes, as I have already said, IF it can be established that there was a recommendation by Betfair (or a rogue employee) that Anty use PSP or that there is a principal/agent relationship between Betfair and PSP."

Anty has stated that he deposited with the PSP and played directly thru his Betfair account.
Wouldn't that clearly establish a Principal/Agent relationship?

Whenever you make a deposit via a mechanism that is accepted by the merchant, its plainly a method acceptable and approved by the merchant. LMAO.

Is it even necessary to state such an asininely obvious fact? Are we really still bothering to argue such idiocy with Hareeba the shill at this point?

[AimingHigh]

Hareeba isn't a shill, just a shrewd bettor who's seen too many scammers running to SBR for sympathy from other players, who assume any complaint against a book must be a solid one. And even if you don't like his views, it's good for every community to have input from all sides.

The fact that Anty placed bets directly on Betfair doesn't tell us much; it certainly doesn't of itself suggest an agency relationship between Betfair and the PSP.

[PVO]

... well delete it

[potless]

Hareeba isn't a shill, just a shrewd bettor who's seen too many scammers running to SBR for sympathy from other players, who assume any complaint against a book must be a solid one. And even if you don't like his views, it's good for every community to have input from all sides.

The fact that Anty placed bets directly on Betfair doesn't tell us much; it certainly doesn't of itself suggest an agency relationship between Betfair and the PSP.

not too sure about the shrewd bettor bit
Sadly he seems incapable of taking on board or understanding anything negative about bf and their recent behaviour (maybe his view is coloured by using a part of the bf operation that is properly regulated) for example he's still struggling to comprehend the casino thefts despite bf settling court cases in the players favour (full balance and compensation) - oh well maybe he'll get there eventually and the penny will finally drop.

[vitalyo]

Betfair the most trusted company


On the 5th of August betfair suspended Peter Webb accounts without warning nor explanation , the designer of Bet Angel and one of the industry's most trusted people. He was kept in the dark for 5 day . According to him he had paid premium charges .

From his twitter

http://twitter.com/#!/betangel


@betangel Bet Angel


Betfair have suspended all my accounts this afternoon. I am waiting for a reply as to why.

5 Aug via web

in reply to ↑ @betangel Bet Angel


@mangomasher - The words incredibly bad publicity spring to mind.

5 Aug via web

@betangel Bet Angel


I've emailed them and asked if they can phone me or elaborate. It's only fair I should give them a chance to redeem themselves.

5 Aug via web


@betangel Bet Angel


Still not a whisper from Betfair.

5 Aug via web

@betangel Bet Angel


Somebody kindly gave me the direct number for their head of customer services. I just left him a message.



@betangel Bet Angel


Betfair still haven't told me why but have promised to get back to me by Tuesday to let me know the outcome of their 'investigation'.

5 Aug via web


@betangel Bet Angel


@mangomasher - I've asked them constantly to phone me to explain. But they said they won't let me know anything till Tuesday.


@betangel Bet Angel


I've offered to speak to whoever on the phone at Betfair and to visit their offices to offer clarity to the situation.

5 Aug via web


@betangel Bet Angel


Looking on the bright side, one less person in the market today. Unfortunately that's me!

5 Aug via web Good one



@betangel Bet Angel


I don't understand why they would suspend first and ask questions later. Surely they must know if I am in breach of terms already?

5 Aug via web

@betangel Bet Angel


@mangomasher - Betfair are refusing to let me withdraw funds. But there hasn't been much in their since 18/7


5 Aug via web


@betangel Bet Angel


Let's hope this is some horrible mis-understanding. I am happy to speak to anybody at Betfair to help clarify the issue. They have my number

5 Aug via web


@betangel Bet Angel


@bee9791 - Lets see. It's possible they may think I am doing something I am not. But it would have been nice to talk to them to clarify.

5 Aug via web





@betangel Bet Angel


@Sir_Back2lay @puntdotcom - Five days now. If they really had an issue, they must know what that issue is and can surely tell me.

9 Aug via web

Yes this is f@cked UP . If betfair can f@ck around with a fish like him imagine what they can do to you ?


@betangel Bet Angel


Got an email from Betfair this evening. But need them to clarify what they have said. Expect another delay.

9 Aug via web


@betangel Bet Angel


@puntdotcom - I have my account back but I wasn't using it much anyway at 60%+

9 Aug via web


Well we don't know the full story on why BF suspended his accounts . The fact is for 5 days they didn't even bother to tell him why !

For me serious problem would be if i had "live" bets. I don't even wanna think about it .I would lose control over my funds . Surly they wouldn't refund my trades /wagers .



Peter Webb's personal blog

http://www.betangel.com/blog_wp/

A lot of interesting read . However he doesn't talk about his suspension .I wonder why ? He also writes a articles in the Racing Post on Saturdays . On Augest 5th he wrote on his twitter "The words incredibly bad publicity spring to mind".And then he goes quiet .He could of easily damage Betfair reputation .
Somehow betfair is been able to avoid all negative publicity , it's like complains don't even exist .

Here he talks about 60% premium charge

http://www.betangel.com/blog_wp/2011/07/24/betfair-international-stakes/

Betfair to get rid off bots

http://www.betangel.com/blog_wp/2011/07/20/botfair/

Any of you wonder why BF is trying to get rid of SHARP players / Guys with a BIG MONEY that provide liquidity ??? And why betfair is trying to get rid off bots ???Good question .
I have a pretty good idea .

It's my personal opinion so take it the way it is .

Betfair Customer Services 13 Dec 16:51
From December 2007 Betfair has started employing its own software or “robots” to provide liquidity into the exchange games markets. It has been evident for some time that the activity of 3rd Party bots is essential to ensure that there is enough liquidity in the markets to provide an attractive customer proposition. For commercial reasons we have decided that rather than rely solely on 3rd party bots, Betfair will itself provide liquidity.

Our robot has no advantages over any other in price terms. That is, if anyone (whether electronically or manually) offers a better price, the Betfair robot will not try to better that price; and we are not market-making on the back of being able to see what everyone else is doing. Customers will be equally likely to be matched by a 3rd party as by the Betfair bot.

Our robots cannot cheat, they place bets through the same channel as other robots, have no access to privileged information and cannot influence the result. The architecture of the system has been passed by our regulator and approved.

In September 2008,Betfair introduced a "Premium Charge" 20% .

The 20% premium charge didn't do well to get rid of the SHARPS/BIG MONEY .
So BF now increased premium charge to 60%. Many of you said it's a suicide and it will discourage SHARPS .


Again it is my personal opinion . BF instead of been exchange is trying to act like a bookmaker . Why not . BF is reach enough ,BF robots already do and can provide the liquidity and balance the money ,on top they can swap any overlay (before you do it manually) .

It is a win win situation . Plus on top they collect 5% from the winners . This way instead of regular 5% they can do 7-7,5% ( again my estimates) .
The only competition to them SHARPS with bots . Guys with the big money who knows what they are doing .

Bots just like LIVE betting provide more turn around . More turn around, more profit a specially for an Exchange where they have ZERO liability. Example would be "black jack" the more hands are delt the more profit for the casino , but unlike an exchange casinos are always at risk (short term).
So you have ask yourself why Betfair wants to get rid off people who provide liquidity and overall turnaround .

PS . What do you do when you see rats like this running off the boat ?

GL.

[Ethan]

like anyone here has that issue.

[vitalyo]

To BF lovers and people who are not good at math .

If you are wagering on soccer sides and totals there is no need to use BF . BD all around has the same odds and liquidity is there .
If you are betting / trading with BF $20 up to $100 you should be ok .
BD , pinny and asian books are much safer place to keep your funds .
Yesterday first race from York, BF matched £852k ,betdaq £821k matched.
York today had more matched on BD than BF on the 2.30 and 4.50 and the same on the 4.15.
Betdaq is surely improving by the week.

GL.

[Scooter]

AimingHigh - "The fact that Anty placed bets directly on Betfair doesn't tell us much; it certainly doesn't of itself suggest an agency relationship between Betfair and the PSP."

Does Betfair allow peer to peer transfers?

This is the only other possibility as to how Anty could deposit with the PSP and see the money appear directly in his Betfair account.

(And even if they do allow peer to peer, wouldn't Betfair have investigated what's going on if they see huge deposits by the PSP into the PSP's Betfair account, and then the funds being transferred to Anty?

Would Betfair permit this without having a relationship with the PSP)?

[Hareeba!]

To BF lovers and people who are not good at math .

If you are wagering on soccer sides and totals there is no need to use BF . BD all around has the same odds and liquidity is there .
If you are betting / trading with BF $20 up to $100 you should be ok .
BD , pinny and asian books are much safer place to keep your funds .
Yesterday first race from York, BF matched £852k ,betdaq £821k matched.
York today had more matched on BD than BF on the 2.30 and 4.50 and the same on the 4.15.
Betdaq is surely improving by the week.

GL.

Just had a look at BD for the upcoming QF between Djokovic and Monfils - £13,934 matched and £33k on offer at 1.08 for Djokovic.
At Betfair over $1M matched and $232k on offer for Djokovic at 1.09

still a fair way to go I'd say

[Scooter]

```

[Dark Horse]

If the 3.5 million slow pay/no pay, and this won't discourage people, nothing will, vitalyo.

Some people just don't care as long as it doesn't affect them. Good post.

Betfair should be rated C or worse. Funds, at the very least, are at some risk.

Betfair the most trusted company


On the 5th of August betfair suspended Peter Webb accounts without warning nor explanation , the designer of Bet Angel and one of the industry's most trusted people. He was kept in the dark for 5 day . According to him he had paid premium charges .

From his twitter

http://twitter.com/#!/betangel


@betangel Bet Angel


Betfair have suspended all my accounts this afternoon. I am waiting for a reply as to why.

5 Aug via web

in reply to ↑ @betangel Bet Angel


@mangomasher - The words incredibly bad publicity spring to mind.

5 Aug via web

@betangel Bet Angel


I've emailed them and asked if they can phone me or elaborate. It's only fair I should give them a chance to redeem themselves.

5 Aug via web


@betangel Bet Angel


Still not a whisper from Betfair.

5 Aug via web

@betangel Bet Angel


Somebody kindly gave me the direct number for their head of customer services. I just left him a message.



@betangel Bet Angel


Betfair still haven't told me why but have promised to get back to me by Tuesday to let me know the outcome of their 'investigation'.

5 Aug via web


@betangel Bet Angel


@mangomasher - I've asked them constantly to phone me to explain. But they said they won't let me know anything till Tuesday.


@betangel Bet Angel


I've offered to speak to whoever on the phone at Betfair and to visit their offices to offer clarity to the situation.

5 Aug via web


@betangel Bet Angel


Looking on the bright side, one less person in the market today. Unfortunately that's me!

5 Aug via web Good one



@betangel Bet Angel


I don't understand why they would suspend first and ask questions later. Surely they must know if I am in breach of terms already?

5 Aug via web

@betangel Bet Angel


@mangomasher - Betfair are refusing to let me withdraw funds. But there hasn't been much in their since 18/7


5 Aug via web


@betangel Bet Angel


Let's hope this is some horrible mis-understanding. I am happy to speak to anybody at Betfair to help clarify the issue. They have my number

5 Aug via web


@betangel Bet Angel


@bee9791 - Lets see. It's possible they may think I am doing something I am not. But it would have been nice to talk to them to clarify.

5 Aug via web




@betangel Bet Angel


@Sir_Back2lay @puntdotcom - Five days now. If they really had an issue, they must know what that issue is and can surely tell me.

9 Aug via web

Yes this is f@cked UP . If betfair can f@ck around with a fish like him imagine what they can do to you ?


@betangel Bet Angel


Got an email from Betfair this evening. But need them to clarify what they have said. Expect another delay.

9 Aug via web


@betangel Bet Angel


@puntdotcom - I have my account back but I wasn't using it much anyway at 60%+

9 Aug via web


Well we don't know the full story on why BF suspended his accounts . The fact is for 5 days they didn't even bother to tell him why !

For me serious problem would be if i had "live" bets. I don't even wanna think about it .I would lose control over my funds . Surly they wouldn't refund my trades /wagers .



Peter Webb's personal blog

http://www.betangel.com/blog_wp/

A lot of interesting read . However he doesn't talk about his suspension .I wonder why ? He also writes a articles in the Racing Post on Saturdays . On Augest 5th he wrote on his twitter "The words incredibly bad publicity spring to mind".And then he goes quiet .He could of easily damage Betfair reputation .
Somehow betfair is been able to avoid all negative publicity , it's like complains don't even exist .

Here he talks about 60% premium charge

http://www.betangel.com/blog_wp/2011/07/24/betfair-international-stakes/

Betfair to get rid off bots

http://www.betangel.com/blog_wp/2011/07/20/botfair/

Any of you wonder why BF is trying to get rid of SHARP players / Guys with a BIG MONEY that provide liquidity ??? And why betfair is trying to get rid off bots ???Good question .
I have a pretty good idea .

It's my personal opinion so take it the way it is .

In September 2008,Betfair introduced a "Premium Charge" 20% .

The 20% premium charge didn't do well to get rid of the SHARPS/BIG MONEY .
So BF now increased premium charge to 60%. Many of you said it's a suicide and it will discourage SHARPS .


Again it is my personal opinion . BF instead of been exchange is trying to act like a bookmaker . Why not . BF is reach enough ,BF robots already do and can provide the liquidity and balance the money ,on top they can swap any overlay (before you do it manually) .

It is a win win situation . Plus on top they collect 5% from the winners . This way instead of regular 5% they can do 7-7,5% ( again my estimates) .
The only competition to them SHARPS with bots . Guys with the big money who knows what they are doing .

Bots just like LIVE betting provide more turn around . More turn around, more profit a specially for an Exchange where they have ZERO liability. Example would be "black jack" the more hands are delt the more profit for the casino , but unlike an exchange casinos are always at risk (short term).
So you have ask yourself why Betfair wants to get rid off people who provide liquidity and overall turnaround .

PS . What do you do when you see rats like this running off the boat ?

GL.

[anty]

Hareeba isn't a shill, just a shrewd bettor who's seen too many scammers running to SBR for sympathy from other players, who assume any complaint against a book must be a solid one. And even if you don't like his views, it's good for every community to have input from all sides.

The fact that Anty placed bets directly on Betfair doesn't tell us much; it certainly doesn't of itself suggest an agency relationship between Betfair and the PSP.

I don't know what you mean by "agency relationship". PSP signed with Betfair an MSA contract under which they have to pay me. This particular PSP (Irakli Kacharava) is also Betfair poker live organizer. And he obviously has close links with some betfair managers, its an open secret that for ex they are big friends with betfair Russian service chief mr Ulanov, often spend holidays tohether. On this video you see them together in betfair poker tournament in Yalta, Ulanov (not Kulanov as is written) is a bald guy http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6khrU1GwkAg

[Ingram$]

... well delete it

Betfair is rather reputable. So i don't know.

[anty]

Again, the most striking fact for me is that even after my emails to them and Justin's video betfair did nothing. NOTHING. I never expected them to pay instantly instead of PSP, I am not so naive. But at least I expected an investigation. Together with PSP BETFAIR MANAGEMENT promised me full payment. Milena Ivanova, betfair chief Eastern European manager, in the spring promised me full payment in 6 months time. But I never heard from her again...

[Tomahawk]

I don't get it, betfair takes away the commissions but should keep all of the rest of the money ready for transfer.

So if let's asume everybody registered at betfair cashes out then betfair needs to be able to give them the money since they only take the commissions and all other funds are availalable to players 24/7

[Scooter]

```

[bettilimbroke999]

Hard to believe that Betfair or any legit business would care so little about robbing a client of 3.1 million dollars. I have no idea why you just dont sue to get your money. If they are doing absolutely nothing (not even communicating with you) then it sounds like you need to talk to a lawyer about suing either BF or the PSP or both

[anty]

Hard to believe but its true...