CAUTION --- TONY 5 DIMES TRYING to TAKE A SHOT AT PLAYERS RIGHT NOW.

[sharpcat]

I was ignored when I posted this fact awhile ago and it will be ignored again but it is similar to Dark's situation. Right around mid-NBA season for awhile 5dimes would post a game saying they would have live betting (game would be on ESPN OR TNT) and not offer the full live game. At times you were lucky for them to even offer live betting in the 2 qtr. 2nd half? lines never came back. Or sometimes they would but only for the 3rd qtr and not the 4th. They would mix it up all the time.

So sorry for bad grammar but what does this look like to you? I posted this months ago when a player here asked for a good book for US players that had live betting. Of course my post was ignored and all said it was 5dimes for US players.

5dimes usually only does live betting during commercial breaks.

There is no requirement that a book offer full blown live betting it is an option, if you want full live betting than play with someone who offers that like SIA if you want reduced juice play with 5dimes.

[biff]

5dimes usually only does live betting during commercial breaks.

There is no requirement that a book offer full blown live betting it is an option, if you want full live betting than play with someone who offers that like SIA if you want reduced juice play with 5dimes.

OK, I assumed if you offer a game live it's full game. Not being sarcastic here, you could say I'm new to live betting as you know not many options for US players. Well Bodog... SIA is no longer taking US players, correct?

[sharpcat]

OK, I assumed if you offer a game live it's full game. Not being sarcastic here, you could say I'm new to live betting as you know not many options for US players. Well Bodog... SIA is no longer taking US players, correct?

I no longer play at SIA due to heavy limiting but it is my understanding that they are no longer accepting US players but if you had an account with them already than you are still able to play with them.

Most books who offer live betting only offer it during commercial breaks.

[biff]

I no longer play at SIA due to heavy limiting but it is my understanding that they are no longer accepting US players but if you had an account with them already than you are still able to play with them.

Most books who offer live betting only offer it during commercial breaks.

Yes, I understand that. I never had a problem with that. I understand it is not full live betting, just betting every commercial break. It's just 5dimes can not make up its mind. Take for example NHL live betting. You were only able to bet after each period up to the finals. If I recall last year before the finals you could bet at every commercial break. Now during the finals you can bet at every commercial break. I understand again it is only at commercial breaks. I just think if you are going to post a game for live betting why not the whole game?

[sharpcat]

Yes, I understand that. I never had a problem with that. I understand it is not full live betting, just betting every commercial break. It's just 5dimes can not make up its mind. Take for example NHL live betting. You were only able to bet after each period up to the finals. If I recall last year before the finals you could bet at every commercial break. Now during the finals you can bet at every commercial break. I understand again it is only at commercial breaks. I just think if you are going to post a game for live betting why not the whole game?

Try live betting at Bookmaker, it is impossible you never know when they are going to give you a line and it takes so long to place a bet on their software that by the time you get to the confirm screen the line has been taken down.

[biff]

Try live betting at Bookmaker, it is impossible you never know when they are going to give you a line and it takes so long to place a bet on their software that by the time you get to the confirm screen the line has been taken down.

That sounds frustrating. I like 5dimes, do not get me wrong. Think maybe I will just stay away from all live betting for now on.

Thanks for the information, sharpcat.

[Dr.Gonzo]

Gonzo i think what you don't understand is that 5Dimes won't take professional action, as in the limits of sharp players are cut very fast.

I know that 5d limits players. But you seem to be implying that anyone with half a brain can beat their lines. OK if I can agree with your assertion that would imply leaving without getting booted is leaving money on the table.

If someone walks away from 5D, he is often forced to do so...

He is not walking away because he was forced to. He is walking away because he wasn't offered a 2nd half line on a soccer friendly. He was also quick to condemn the players in recent casino disputes as shot takers which I disagreed with him over. So I thought it was funny he would get his panties in a bunch over a minor issue.

but maybe you don't understand that cos you are a square.

I was the first person to call bullshit on this thread. I'm not a genius but I'm not a loser either.

[nobs]

Now I'm convinced you're not being serious.

+400 on the team leading at the half is not a bad line????? Oh my.

NO. It was +400 on the Knicks To BOTH BOTH BOTH BOTH BOTH BOTH BOTH win the first half AND AND AND AND AND AND win the game.

That means the KNICKS had to be ahead at halftime AND win the GAME in REGULATION.

That means you lose if the Knicks are behind at half, or if the game is tied at half, or if the knicks lose the game or if the game goes OT.

And yes +400 is reasonable and I see +400 on double result bets like this all the time.

And the fact is that Tony just didnt notice the so called " Bad line" until halftime when the knicks of course were winning 59-57.

Now do you really want to say that Tony would have cancelled this bet if it was 57-57 0r 59-59 at half ????

You know damn good and well that bet would have been graded a LOSS if it was tied at half. GEEZ.

You told me to make sure I am at least posting the truth if I have something to say about 5 dimes. Thats was you right ? The thing about practicing what you preach comes to mind here.

I know this thread has been done to death and I am not trying to resurrect it, but I was reading through the posts and damn Shari im not trying to start shit with you but damn all Tony has to do is breath "bad line" and its amazing how quick you guys fall in line.

And if this thread never existed and Brian Davis won. Tony would have said BAD LINE and you all would be talking about how Brian Davis +23000 is an "OBVIOUS BAD LINE" since there was another A book who had him +8000.

And please dont bring the "field" argument into this to try and confuse some posters. You and I both know the Field bet doesnt have a damn thing in hell to do with 1 book having Brian Davis +8000 while another has him +23000.

Now Tony has every right to post good lines, and its also true that Tony's lines were closer to fair market than the other books. What I mean by that is Brian davis probably didnt even have 1 chance in 230 of winning so the +23000 is more fair than +8000.

But the thing is, books cant just be posting lines that break even or make them a little profit. They have to be making nice coin, to cover expenses like forum advertising, employees, bonus, fees that they cover, website costs, phone calls, and a million other things.

So its great if Tony wants to give fair odds like davis +23000 when other books offer Davis +8000 to +10000. Where the problem arises is that Tony has a history of screaming bad line like no other book ever. I have never seen or heard of a book use the bad line excuse even 10% as often as Tony does. Thats a problem when you are trying to create a competitive advantage as being a book that offers payouts double and triple the industry average on long shots.

If you are going to do that, you need to make damn well sure that you are not posting bad lines all the time. Tony does it all the time and then his attitude is pretty much F**& You and your momma when someone hits on him.

Now you kept on saying that you have never heard of a 5 dimes complaint other than the recent casino issue. Then one guy gave you 6 or 7 different examples out of the literally hundreds that exist and of course you dismissed them all with the "obvious bad line" mantra. Probably 95% of people Tony screws over never even post a thread about it. Now I know there were 2 stupid idiots who thought they should be paid on a push, not saying all of the complaints are always 100% on, but a lot of them are.

This thread went way further than I expected so im not trying to start it again, but shari you said I dont like 5 dimes so its easy for me to be against them. Youre probably right. I dont like 5 dimes/tony. Same is true for you guys though. You immediately back him, and in fact I have never found a thread where you have ever supported the complaining poster or even posted a neutral remark, so I think you could also stand to try and be a little more fair to the complaining posters instead of just immediatly screaming obvious bad line.

Knicks to Lead at half and win the game in regulation +400

is not an "obvious bad line", now it does sound like a bad line when you change the play to Knicks to win game +400 after they are already ahead at the half like you did.

Too bad that wasnt the bet. And Too bad Tony waited until halftime, when the bet could have already been a loser to declare BAD LINE.

[nobs]

After browsing this place for years to hear industry news, it finally took the most retarded thread in the history of the internet by a T-4 candidate named Nobs to actually register and make a post.

Let me explain some math to you son, the reason 5 Dimes has much longer odds to win on golfers to win tournaments than other books is because THEY ARE PRICING USING A LOWER THEORETICAL HOLD. Have you ever calculated the theoretical margins for futures odds on a golf tournament (or any multiple entry futures market)? I'm making an educated guess you haven't, don't understand the concept, and wouldn't know how to calculate it even if you wanted to. By the way, i have calculated the holds with fields as large as 150 players.

5Dimes on PGA events is not only offering prices on every golfer entered, they usually have a theoretical hold somewhere around 9%-11%. Most European books are using holds around 18%-25% and Vegas obviously are thieves by jacking 40%+ holds. Places like the greek and bodog are using 15-20%+ holds on full field golf events.

So the reason your getting 100-1 on a golfer to win, when they're 60-1 everywhere else, is because THEY ARE USING A LOWER MARGIN. And they're are actually morons on this thread complaining about that? Some of you sheep that are thinking this idiot is on to some "conspiracy" need to wake up.

I've been betting on golf for 12 years. Not that that's my profession, but I love golf action, regardless if i'm playing, or watching pro's. 5dimes is the king of golf wagering. Not only discounted futures to win on PGA events, but also more plausable pools like top 10 finish, and top 5 finish. Not to mention, the European Tour, The Champions Tour, and even tours like the Nationwide, Japan, and South Africa which NOBODY else offers (the hold is quite high on Nationwide futures though).

I have ALWAYS been paid when cashing a golfer at 5Dimes, ALWAYS. And I've hit a few 100-1 + shots that were obviously shorter odds everywhere else.(once cashed 10k on a 50-1 shot for $200.) Being that I am a student of golf markets, I also see when they make obvious mistakes, which they do quite regularly ( which is natural when your putting over 700 prices out on multiple markets on 5 different tours in a 2 day span) What do I do when i see an obvious error? I call them or e-mail them to let them know so they can change it.
If there is a price that seems very generous, but not neccesarily an error, I call or e-mail to confirm the validity before i bet it.

People who bet on golf should be rejoicing that there is a 5Dimes. Believe me when I tell you, they are the most bettor friendly markets by far. And if you understood gambling, you'd realize that even at industry low 9% theoretical holds, the book will do just fine with volume.

It just infuriates me that people with no clue of what they're talking about make worthless and slanderous threads like this.

I'm glad that there is a book that offers low juice on sports like golf, and that means we as players need to protect them when they make mistakes, and not look to exploit them. And clueless posters like Nobs should shovel their brand of uneducated trash somewhere else.

Odds this was Tony/someone from 5 dimes -50,000,000
Odds it wasnt + 49,999,999

How is that for a "Low Margin"

[Fa11en]

Do you even gamble nobs?

[nobs]

This is the whole point people have been trying to make in this thread. If a line looks too good to be true to YOU, check it at an exchange. As you see, many people don't understand what constitutes a bad line. They think because it's at +10000 at one book and a couple of the other books they check has it at +7000, it's bad. Some people aren't willing to learn how to even calculate the difference between +7000 and +10000, let alone open up one more tab in their browser and see what Betfair has it at. So to them, the line must be bad. As you see in 12pgs of this thread.

Anyway, you should start your thread and see how it goes.

LOL. One guys claims it was +6000/+10,000

Now Shari Changes it to +7000/+10,000

And she was the one claiming I am not being honest about 5 dimes ???

No, It was +8000/+23000

That is +8000 ( 1.25% ) and +23000 ( ~ 4 % ) . I had someone do that for me, I cant calcualte theoretical odds.

Well i dont want to say any more. I dont want to make a "slanderous" post against Indio err I mean Tony.

[nobs]

Do you even gamble nobs?

No. They just gave me the PRO label because of my good looks and amazing charm.

[underthe total]

Odds this was Tony/someone from 5 dimes -50,000,000 Odds it wasnt + 49,999,999 How is that for a "Low Margin"

i want its 5 dimes for the max

and i want you are dumb for starting and defending this thread for the max

5 dimes is arrogant and they are assholes, but they are not thieves

[nobs]

imo

if you know a line is bad then you should not bet

if you don't know what a bad line is and you bet it no harm no foul, but it should get canceled with the rest of them

if a bet does not get canceled before the game starts then the bets should be paid

if you consistently bet bad lines with a book they should and will ban you, if they do not the book if its in the offshore market will get hammered significantly hurting the books bottom line

a book should never confiscate funds

Tony violates the bolded part quite often and SBR backs him.

[nobs]

They are not thieves when you said your self a bet should be paid if its not cancelled before its starts.

How about waiting until the halftime score is 59-57 and then cancelling the bet after the 1st leg has already won ???

They did that and the link was posted in this thread.

[durito]

Could you be any stupider?

[underthe total]

nobs

look i am not buying the 5dimes is out to scew people, try that shit on someone else

you are waisting everyones time with this shit so move on to something else

[underthe total]

again

i am not going to go back and read to find anything that you are pointing out

give it a rest

[Fa11en]

Next time, you should just document your interaction with 5Dimes and if you bust them moving the line or doing something fishy after you confront them, then you can present your case rather than looking stupid for not knowing basic math.

[Fa11en]

No. They just gave me the PRO label because of my good looks and amazing charm.

No they gave you PRO because you paid 200$.

[nobs]

No they gave you PRO because you paid 200$.

Shit was that it? I thought they loved me.

[Fa11en]

I think that is why. Is there a way to circumvent paying the 200?

[nobs]

Next time, you should just document your interaction with 5Dimes and if you bust them moving the line or doing something fishy after you confront them, then you can present your case rather than looking stupid for not knowing basic math.

2+2 =3 ???

Shit I never liked math anyway.

I dont have any "interaction" with 5 dimes. But many people have documented theirs, like Tony telling 1 guy to die. And cussing several other customers. What a great guy and wonderful CS skills too.

You see I dont care how I look to a bunch of internet strangers who i will never meet in real life. Shit, there are people I actually know who think I am a dumb ****. What is the harm if some strangers do as well ? My only point was putting the facts out there that Tony likes to double/triple the paodds on long shots and he has a history of using the bad line excuse.

Thats a fact, some say thats fine, others wont deal with 5 dimes. Thats each persons personal choice. No hair off my back either way.

[shari91]

LOL. One guys claims it was +6000/+10,000 Now Shari Changes it to +7000/+10,000 And she was the one claiming I am not being honest about 5 dimes ??? No, It was +8000/+23000 That is +8000 ( 1.25% ) and +23000 ( ~ 4 % ) . I had someone do that for me, I cant calcualte theoretical odds. Well i dont want to say any more. I dont want to make a "slanderous" post against Indio err I mean Tony.

nobs, give it up. I was posting those numbers as an example. Notice I didn't say "this was the Betfair line"? The simple fact remains, you have no clue. You didn't know to check an exchange. You checked US facing books that post crappy dog lines. OMG - some of those books you posted are SBR sponsors!!!!! And I just said again, oooohhhhhh and John even said, that by betting dogs there, you're paying a worse price than you'd get at 5Dimes. Again - SBR SPONSORED BOOKS.

As for the Knicks bet, I was already corrected about that in this thread and after I was, it was even more OBVIOUSLY A BAD LINE. What 7pt favourite NBA team with an ML of -280 is going to pay +400 to win HT/FT???? Please show me one example. Show me one example and I will pay you 1000 pts. You won't find one - because it doesn't exist.

You say you've never seen a thread with me backing a poster?? Well now you've just proven you haven't even read these bloody 5Dimes threads. Because IF YOU HAD, you would've seen me in the 20pg golf lines thread from September '10. You know the one that you just posted in the other day? Right below a post of WVU bumping one of my posts from 9 months ago? See you guys are similar like that because he also didn't read the thread and thought by bumping my old post it would show that I didn't like 5Dimes back then and was trying to prove that my position had changed since I became a Mod.

Unfortunately, yet another person too lazy to bother to read so I'll sum it up for you: I was in there repeatedly supporting Beware5Dimes until it came out A. what the line was at Betfair for the same bet B. he had already had his case resolved by SBR before making the thread but didn't disclose that C. had not only bet the bad line once, but twice.

That's when it dawned on me that I need to educate myself before I jump on bandwagons around here. Because it turned out, the line was again OBVIOUSLY BAD.

I have also just the other day posted in a 5Dimes thread about someone's live blackjack bet being cancelled, that I'd be ticked off if it happened to me but fair enough because there's a rule posted about it. Then, someone came in and explained even further why they had the rule after a few people said it was overly cautious. That explanation validated Tony's reasoning for the rule in the first place.

Again, that would take reading a thread instead of just trying to start drama out of thin air. Your mistake is that this isn't just the Players Talk crew who will give you 5 seconds of attention and leave. You have had many experienced gamblers come in this thread - some of whom have made no secret of their feelings for Tony or SBR - try to explain to you that you were 100% wrong and give you the reasoning for it. Yet still you don't get it.

I'd tell you to actually READ THREADS next time and try to educate yourself before making a nonsense thread like this and yapping anything about me. But I know you won't so all I can say is best of luck betting your dogs at a book besides 5Dimes. Too bad you fail to see how you're only screwing yourself by doing so.

[Fa11en]

But I know you won't so all I can say is best of luck betting your dogs at a book besides 5Dimes. Too bad you fail to see how you're only screwing yourself by doing so.

That implies that he actually gambles rather than spend his time scandalmongering in forums, a far stretch.

[underthe total]

ok nobs just to not be acomplete jerk i read your thread.

betting a 42/1 at 425/1 is stupid and you should lose your money for even trying that (paul casey)

a customer that plays with his book on the regular and bets something that is off or bad is more likely to get a pass..........

but someone like your self who deposits 200 dollars and jacks it off on some shit where you are trying to be sharp and it gets canceled doesnt give you the right to come on here and bash 5 dimes.

i think you have decided that you wanted to look smart by starting this thread but problem is it back fired....

move along

[shari91]

That implies that he actually gambles rather than spend his time scandalmongering in forums, a far stretch.

Well, I'd like to believe he gambles regularly. I think he just let his rampant anti-Tonyism get away from him and he just made a mistake that I very well could've a year ago. Because ironically it was that September 5Dimes thread where I learned the importance of checking an exchange, not blindly believing I'm receiving all of the facts in the first post of a thread and of educating myself more before jumping on a bandwagon. And some of the same people in this thread were in there, patiently explaining things over and over and trying to teach some of us basic gambling 101 facts that I ashamedly admit I should've known at that point. I guess I should just consider myself lucky that I chose to listen back then.

[Fa11en]

Well played Shari, you swoop in to set him straight in your post and then display your own humility and take the high road.

[Preston09]

I've seen so many negative 5 dimes posts on these forums to help me make the decision to never reload there again.

[nobs]

Exactly Preston. Its not worth the hassle to bet Brian Davis +23000 just to stroke the ego thinking ur so smart for getting the better price. I would rather play at a book that will pay you with no BS when you do hit.

I knew posting this thread would bring about a lot of negative responses toward me from the SBR team, certain know it all posters and posters like fallen who dont even have $200. I knew that from the beginning. My point was to warn other posters, even if its only 1.

Now the SBRteam can babble all they want about betting exchanges, and entire markets, and field bets and low margins. Sure it will confuse some people who dont really know what they are saying but will nonetheless accept that as a reasonable response.

SBR knows what time it is and so do I. 5 dimes is not a betting exchange, 5 dimes is a sportsbook who has to incur all the costs that come along with that. So no I dont compare Tonys odds to a betting exchange, I compare him to other A rated sportsbooks. He should expect that since when he cried bad line on nick watney +425 ( Only after it won of course ) he proposed lowering the payout to what other books were paying. He never proposed paying triple what other books were offering. He never proposed paying what bet fair was paying.

But SBR is OK with that. I would expect nothing less, since they are Ok with Tony telling a customer to Die and all the other abuse he throws at customers routinely in the posted chat logs.

There was a time years ago that SBR said it would never accept advertising because then ity would no longer be free to have honest opinions. Maybe that was before Shari's time but I know Bill Dozer was involved in SBR at the time. In those days SBR claimed thats what set them apart from MW, RX, EOG, etc. All those books had to back their advertisers but not SBR.

Well now SBR is all those books. And its not because of me. I dont care if every person in this thread talks shit about me. But this board has been covered in 5 dimes complaints, and SBr finds a way to back tony every time. Its funny how Shari suddenly remembers every detail of every thread but tried to pass off the Knicks play as being a +400 on the Knicks ML only after the Knicks were up at the half. And she asked repeatedly for examples because she just couldnt remember any complaints about 5 dimes book, only the recent casino issue.

Its funny how SBR is so MUM not a word on the fact that Tony didnt even cancel that bet until it was 59-57 at halftime. That is fair ?????????????????????????

Dont worry, everyone has a right to play where they choose. And just as a lot of people who arent even pros are in here backing Tony then I have a right to put my opinions as well. 5 dimes rating dosent mean a thing. There is a book I played at years ago and beat the shit out of and that book paid me spot on without any BS and no trouble ever. That book was an F book for a while and now a D book.

Aces Gold was once an A book before it went under and stole so much money I couldnt even imagine.

Hollywood Sportsbook an A book where are they now ?

Camelot

Dalton wagners vwager/mvpsportsbook/BHB was a book so highly rated that the forums would rip your nuts off for even thinking of posting anything bad about them. The book went under and boy how quiet the books are.

the forums ( all of them ) have a very bad history of pumping up advertising books, then those books go under and we pay the price. Due your own due dilligence.

[durito]

You are a ******* retard.

[nobs]

Yes I am a retard.

So its OK for Tony to cancel a play at halftime and its OK for Tony to abuse players.

Lets talk about something that can be debated here. My being a retard is already a known fact.

[nobs]

This thread was nominated 55 times. It was even nominated by Ace of Spades, a guy who personally hates me.

Not to mention I am a pretty well disliked poster so I think 55 nominations speaks more to the fact that Tony is a cheating, scamming, thieving, abusive POS. Right down to his pathetic attempt to create a new user name and come into this thread posing as someone else. At least I have the balls to post what I think under NOBS I didnt create a new user name and pretend to be someone else like Tony err I mean God did.

[nobs]

posted at MW by SBR.COM




Hey red eye, I don't care, I'm not saying you are a devious shot taker like it was 1500 - 1. But if the market was 30-1 and they had 100-1 that is beyond value shopping, thats betting a line that you know is highly suspect.(at best)









Now I cant do math but 30 to 1 and 100 to 1 is 3.3X. Tony had many 3X +. Maybe SBR.COM is just a dumbfuck like me. I bet he didnt check betfair either before making that idiotic statement.

[nobs]

In the above thread ( which I linked ),

#1. a book offered 100 to 1 when the industry average on the long shot was only 30 or 35 to 1.

#2. The 100 to 1 long shot hit ( obviously or there would have never been an issue ).

#3. SBR.COM position was that this went beyond value shopping and was betting into a line known to be suspect at best.

#4. Said book decided to pay out the average of what BoDog and Pinnacles lines were. ( Those are 2 books I used, and AMAZINGLY bet fairs prices were not considered in the payout )

#5. SBR.COM's final position was THE ADJUSTED LINE PAYOUT WAS FAIR.


The book was not 5 dimes, but was offering odds at 2.8X to 3.3X what Bodog/Pinny/Olympic had. That is exactly what Tony 5 dimes did in the memorial tourney. SBR called it a highly suspect line and implyed the player was shot taking. SBR supported the adjusted much lower payout decision.

Now SBR says I am making something out of nothing in this thread.

Flip Flop much SBR.

SBR is bought by 5 dimes. Now I am done with this thread.