#BlackLivesMatter

[Triple_D_Bet]

Kraky, wrongs done to your ancestors in the past can't be an excuse to be obnoxious and disruptive in the present. Drawing a moral equivalence between the two is treating people differently because of things that didn't happen to them, which is pretty ridiculous...at some point everyone has an ancestor who was wronged, so does everyone get to be a jackass, or should we just hold people accountable for their actions? As we've discussed elsewhere, it's just reverse racism at that point, no different from the fools in this thread referring to race as if it was the cause of any problem.

Not surprised that Bernie would mention the movement heavily later...his ideas might be just wishful thinking with no basis in reality, but he's not dumb, and wouldn't expect him to miss an opportunity to get more passionate people on board, misguided as they are too. Seems safe to say that you can't solve poverty by giving them everything or we'd have done it long ago, but most politicians want to try, and they'll usually find a lot of support among people whose votes are governed by optimism instead of logic and reality.

[The Kraken]

The difference is that the wrongs never stopped. Its not just about their ancestors, they're still wronged today. Todays black youth still face racial inequality, still have a harder time getting a job, are arrested and charged for equivolent crimes at higher rates than whites, have a more difficult time getting into colleges etc... Its pure and simple ongoing racism. Their parents faced the same oppression and racism, as did theirs and so on. That changes everything.

Of course, they're responsible for their actions. But we need to understand that the reason we are where we are is because the racism never stopped. The oppression never stopped.

It still exists today.

[The Kraken]

That was great. Agreed with 95% of it. It's almost like that woman was paid to take a dive on this debate.

That dumb fukking broad

Just listen to her, he picked a weak target. Unteal

[Ted Sheckler]

The difference is that the wrongs never stopped. Its not just about their ancestors, they're still wronged today. Todays black youth still face racial inequality, still have a harder time getting a job, are arrested and charged for equivolent crimes at higher rates than whites, have a more difficult time getting into colleges etc... Its pure and simple ongoing racism. Their parents faced the same oppression and racism, as did theirs and so on. That changes everything.

Of course, they're responsible for their actions. But we need to understand that the reason we are where we are is because the racism never stopped. The oppression never stopped.

It still exists today.

Wrongs? Ohh, you mean nobody explained that having 6 children by 4 different men isn't the best way to get money and stop the cycle of stereotypes against blacks?

Nobody is wronging them, except the parents of the kids not sticking around/caring about them.

[The Kraken]

But ya see Teddy, all the stats disagree with you on them not being wronged.

I listed just a few of the things above and could list at least a dozen more showing that instituional racism is undeniable, whether you see it or not, whether you believe it or not.

You can have your opinion Ted but you can't have your own facts.

[downsouth]

But ya see Teddy, all the stats disagree with you on them not being wronged.

I listed just a few of the things above and could list at least a dozen more showing that instituional racism is undeniable, whether you see it or not, whether you believe it or not.

You can have your opinion Ted but you can't have your own facts.

So its a combination of them being wronged and continually making poor choices or is it that they make poor choices because they were wronged?

[brooks85]

But ya see Teddy, all the stats disagree with you on them not being wronged.

I listed just a few of the things above and could list at least a dozen more showing that instituional racism is undeniable, whether you see it or not, whether you believe it or not.

You can have your opinion Ted but you can't have your own facts.

unless its climate change then kraken can make up all kinds of stuff. I mean, regurgitate all kinds of made up staff.

[Triple_D_Bet]

The difference is that the wrongs never stopped. Its not just about their ancestors, they're still wronged today. Todays black youth still face racial inequality, still have a harder time getting a job, are arrested and charged for equivolent crimes at higher rates than whites, have a more difficult time getting into colleges etc... Its pure and simple ongoing racism. Their parents faced the same oppression and racism, as did theirs and so on. That changes everything.

Of course, they're responsible for their actions. But we need to understand that the reason we are where we are is because the racism never stopped. The oppression never stopped.

It still exists today.

Some people don't like me and don't care to be around me, or employ me, or think highly of me; does that mean I'm being wronged and I get to use that as an excuse to act terribly (and probably not coincidentally turning people's opinions into facts)? Some people don't like other people; doesn't mean you owe them anything because someone else dislikes them, for valid or invalid reasons.

Trying to apply equal racism just perpetuates the problem. It's a little like going out and shooting white people to try to balance out the disparity in racial statistics for violent deaths....multiple wrongs don't make a right, they just make more wrong.

Wrongs? Ohh, you mean nobody explained that having 6 children by 4 different men isn't the best way to get money and stop the cycle of stereotypes against blacks?

Nobody is wronging them, except the parents of the kids not sticking around/caring about them.

So its a combination of them being wronged and continually making poor choices or is it that they make poor choices because they were wronged?

These fellas get it

[The Kraken]

You're white, therefore it doesn't apply equally. You have white privilege, as do I and every other white person in America. If someone doesn't like you therefore they don't hire you, it's not due to racial inequality.

See, as white people, we've always been the ones in control, in power, we set the rules. Therefore, it is different when someone doesn't like you compared to someone racially discriminating against a black person and neither of you getting the job.

Let me ask you two questions, mainly because I respect what you have to say and I'm interested in your opinions

1.) do you believe in white privilege?
2.) do you believe in reverse racism?

[The Kraken]

unless its climate change then kraken can make up all kinds of stuff. I mean, regurgitate all kinds of made up staff.

Don't we all just regurgitate stuff? As far as I'm aware, no one here has authored a study on climate change. We all just regurgitate other peoples work.

Funny that you consider yourself smarter than all the scientists that have put in the work, obtained pHd's and poured through the data.

But you know what's "made up", because you read it Drudgereport

[mpaschal34]

my newphew was applying for some special project at MIT this summer....was told, sorry, you are a white male, therefore you are not eligible.

[Triple_D_Bet]

You're white, therefore it doesn't apply equally. You have white privilege, as do I and every other white person in America. If someone doesn't like you therefore they don't hire you, it's not due to racial inequality.

See, as white people, we've always been the ones in control, in power, we set the rules. Therefore, it is different when someone doesn't like you compared to someone racially discriminating against a black person and neither of you getting the job.

Let me ask you two questions, mainly because I respect what you have to say and I'm interested in your opinions

1.) do you believe in white privilege?
2.) do you believe in reverse racism?

Do some small number of people think poorly of different races, and people of those races have lesser amounts of "opportunity" as a result? Indubitably...but they seem vastly outmatched by situations where people make bad choices and the consequences are ascribed to racism instead of the bad choices. And here's the thing: people have the right to their opinion, and to act on their opinion by associating or not associating with whoever they choose. If they choose not to associate with people, the people excluded aren't owed a damn thing; you don't have a right to force everyone to associate with you, whether it's hanging out, paying you money to do something, buying something from you, or whatever. People have the right to be racist, sexist or whatever, as dumb as it is...forcing them to act against their beliefs is a violation of their rights and doesn't end the behavior.

1) No, white privilege doesn't exist; people don't succeed primarily because they're white....with the numerous examples of non_successful white people, seems like a pretty big hole in the theory of white privilege.

2) No, racism is wrong regardless of which race is being discriminated against. Stop racism by stop treating people differently based on race.

[Triple_D_Bet]

my newphew was applying for some special project at MIT this summer....was told, sorry, you are a white male, therefore you are not eligible.

Would a reasonable person experiencing this be less likely to resent the racist policy, or should we expect that the "minority privilege" would incite people to resent the minorities? Where does it end?

[Mr KLC]

What is the end game? What has to finally happen so all of these whiners shut the hell up, and stop blaming other people for their insecurities and inadequacies? There is a difference between suppression and just plain whining. Suppression was very evident in the 1960's, but all of this today pretty much fits the latter. Charles Swindoll believed that life is 10% what happens to us and 90% how we react to it. The people running this group are so determined to find a blue eyed, white deviled boogeyman that they are blinded by the fact that the boogeymen causing these problems live in their own neighborhoods. They're shooting sperm into females, and then disappearing instead of being a man and taking care of their responsibilities. Women get rewarded for wearing out the mattress with these guys by getting subsidized for fertilization. It's happened generation after generation for decades now, and people are actually surprised that these people are continually in trouble? It's not the cops. It's that boogeyman making another boogeybaby that will take the mantle and continue this cycle a decade and a half later.

[The Kraken]

My favorite form of white privilege

When minorities have been deprived equal opportunity and then finally get that opportunity, whites feel as if they have had something taken away.

Ex. Affirmative action... instead of realizing that the inequality gap is simply closing, many white people feel as if blacks are being given spots in colleges unfairly as if they're taking our spots... I'm sure the black kid that got in to USC is so glad his great-great grandmother got raped most likely dozens of times so one day, he'd be able to go to USC

Whites are still accepted to colleges all over the US at a disproportionately high rate

One privilege of being white

So anyone with a degree, next time you think you've done it all on your own, mever got any help, remember this, you're white, you've had help. You've enjoyed privileges that minorities don't.

Just be aware, no need to go off and get a jeri-curl or anything, just be aware. That's as good a start as any

[The Kraken]

my newphew was applying for some special project at MIT this summer....was told, sorry, you are a white male, therefore you are not eligible.

So you believe your nephew should be eligible for all projects at MIT? You don't believe there are some projects that maybe white people shouldn't be a part of? Because that would be segregation and discrimination and hypocritical

Like black history month, right? Why do blacks get a "black history month" but whites don't? I'll tell you why, because we have White History Year.

Think of the black people only clubs in colleges, should white people be allowed to join? Should white people be allowed to have a "white persons club"? Hint, they already do, it's called the college.

There is an expectation that white people have access to every club, every space, every thing.

Trip D, I disagree vehemently with you on both points and am honestly a bit shocked you deny white privilege. Racism = prejudice + power, still believe in "reverse racism"? I look foward to the dialogue with ya

Audios until tonight boys

[mikewlgm]

[ByeShea]

2.) do you believe in reverse racism?

I guess I do because I cried and punched a wall when I saw this picture...

[Mr KLC]

I don't have trouble with black clubs, history months, etc etc. You can't have all of these things though and then yell "equality for everyone". Races keep this crap going when they purposely separate themselves like this. If equality is so damn important, why go out of your way to promote your skin color? It's supposed to be the character and content of the man, right? How can I see that if you feel that you have to keep reminding me what's outside instead of inside?

[hugh_jorgan]

Whites are still accepted to colleges all over the US at a disproportionately high rate

One privilege of being white

Actually, that's less due to the privilege of being white and more a result of more whites having HS diploma's.

Now the obvious argument to my point would be "but it is white privilege that causes more whites to have HS diploma's"

And my answer to that would be that more whites graduate from HS because there is more emphasis placed on education within white household.

The obvious argument to that point would be "but it is white privilege which causes this"

And my answer to that would be that there is more emphasis on education in white households mainly because the family is intact and there are proper priorities taught from a young age.

The obvious argument to that point would be "but it is white privilege which causes this"

Now, I could keep this back and forth going for pages and pages, until I was talking about slave owners in the pre-Lincoln days, but I will stop here as I've already lost 60% of the people who started reading it.

IMO, the root cause of the african american people to have not raised themselves above the difficult hand that they have surely been dealt, lies in the family unit. As a country we need to spend less on affirmative action, less on welfare, and all other gov't subsidies, and use that money to somehow get into the inner cities and teach the people on the merits of a two parent household. Teach about the importance of education, morality, trustworthiness, non-violent reactions to perceived injustices. We need to educate that it is not cool to join a gang, nor do you get your man card by going to prison. It is not ok to have a baby at 14 years old, and subsequently have 8 more kids. We need to educate that everyone is ACCOUNTABLE FOR THEIR OWN ACTIONS TODAY, regardless of yesterdays injustices. The current system of "evening up the tables" is simply not working. It is time for a change, and that change starts with the re-wiring of a thought process from a very early age.

Again, this is just my opinion.

[blackHIPPY]

Do some small number of people think poorly of different races, and people of those races have lesser amounts of "opportunity" as a result? Indubitably...but they seem vastly outmatched by situations where people make bad choices and the consequences are ascribed to racism instead of the bad choices. And here's the thing: people have the right to their opinion, and to act on their opinion by associating or not associating with whoever they choose. If they choose not to associate with people, the people excluded aren't owed a damn thing; you don't have a right to force everyone to associate with you, whether it's hanging out, paying you money to do something, buying something from you, or whatever. People have the right to be racist, sexist or whatever, as dumb as it is...forcing them to act against their beliefs is a violation of their rights and doesn't end the behavior.

1) No, white privilege doesn't exist; people don't succeed primarily because they're white....with the numerous examples of non_successful white people, seems like a pretty big hole in the theory of white privilege.

2) No, racism is wrong regardless of which race is being discriminated against. Stop racism by stop treating people differently based on race.

Kraky, wrongs done to your ancestors in the past can't be an excuse to be obnoxious and disruptive in the present. Drawing a moral equivalence between the two is treating people differently because of things that didn't happen to them, which is pretty ridiculous...at some point everyone has an ancestor who was wronged, so does everyone get to be a jackass, or should we just hold people accountable for their actions? As we've discussed elsewhere, it's just reverse racism at that point, no different from the fools in this thread referring to race as if it was the cause of any problem.

Not surprised that Bernie would mention the movement heavily later...his ideas might be just wishful thinking with no basis in reality, but he's not dumb, and wouldn't expect him to miss an opportunity to get more passionate people on board, misguided as they are too. Seems safe to say that you can't solve poverty by giving them everything or we'd have done it long ago, but most politicians want to try, and they'll usually find a lot of support among people whose votes are governed by optimism instead of logic and reality.

yikes

[blackHIPPY]

most of you have obviously never been around black ppl

and to say white privilege doesnt exist

[blackHIPPY]

a white felon has the same chance of getting a job as a black man w no record

but white privilege doesnt exist

[Kermit]

My favorite form of white privilege

When minorities have been deprived equal opportunity and then finally get that opportunity, whites feel as if they have had something taken away.

Ex. Affirmative action... instead of realizing that the inequality gap is simply closing, many white people feel as if blacks are being given spots in colleges unfairly as if they're taking our spots... I'm sure the black kid that got in to USC is so glad his great-great grandmother got raped most likely dozens of times so one day, he'd be able to go to USC

Whites are still accepted to colleges all over the US at a disproportionately high rate

One privilege of being white

So anyone with a degree, next time you think you've done it all on your own, mever got any help, remember this, you're white, you've had help. You've enjoyed privileges that minorities don't.

I live in a small town. I graduated in 1992 in a class of 218 kids. There were far more white kids in my senior class than there were black kids(Probably around a 160-40 ratio) yet more black kids didn't graduate than white kids. Now in high school we all had the same benefits as each other and no one had any more privilege than anyone else. So why did more black kids fail?

[Ted Sheckler]

a white felon has the same chance of getting a job as a black man w no record

but white privilege doesnt exist

I thought that was debunked on mythbusters?

[blackHIPPY]

I live in a small town. I graduated in 1992 in a class of 218 kids. There were far more white kids in my senior class than there were black kids(Probably around a 160-40 ratio) yet more black kids didn't graduate than white kids. Now in high school we all had the same benefits as each other and no one had any more privilege than anyone else. So why did more black kids fail?

[Kermit]

a white felon has the same chance of getting a job as a black man w no record

but white privilege doesnt exist

Do you have type of stats to back this claim up?

[blackHIPPY]

I thought that was debunked on mythbusters?

[Kermit]

No legit answer from you huh?

[Covy]

I don't see Arabs/Asians/Spanish people complaining

they're working harder and getting ahead, but I guess that's just a dumb fukking idea...they're better off bitching and moaning

it starts with the family structure

[blackHIPPY]

Do you have type of stats to back this claim up?

sure...

http://ac360.blogs.cnn.com/2008/08/09/study-black-man-and-white-felon-same-chances-for-hire/

[blackHIPPY]

Do you have type of stats to back this claim up?

what year did your school desegregate?

[Ted Sheckler]

I live in a small town. I graduated in 1992 in a class of 218 kids. There were far more white kids in my senior class than there were black kids(Probably around a 160-40 ratio) yet more black kids didn't graduate than white kids. Now in high school we all had the same benefits as each other and no one had any more privilege than anyone else. So why did more black kids fail?

That's like saying why is there 200Mil whites and 40Mil blacks, yet blacks are charged with more murders per year? It's because the racist cops nab every black man that's shoots the other backs, but lets all those nice white folk go and just give them a slap on the wrist. At least I think that's it. Racist cops. In your case, I think it's racist teachers. I'm sure kraken knows.

[hugh_jorgan]

most of you have obviously never been around black ppl

and to say white privilege doesnt exist

Hippy, I believe that white privilege does exist.
And I've spent more than enough time in the inner cities than I care to admit.
Anyway, the question remains, what to do about it?
The current programs have been abject failures.
It's easy to sit there and laugh at the racism displayed on this site, which is all you are doing, which helps no one.
How do we, as a country, fix the racial problems?

[Ted Sheckler]

Good to see someone can take a joke.