Rangers trade Ian Kinsler for Prince Fielder

[manny24]

expensive handjob

[Vinnie Paz]

Isn't sherzer free after next season??

[pavyracer]

Wow he is going to balloon to 350 lbs with all the greasy unhealthy fried Texas "food".

[No coincidences]

Great move by dombrowski

Dump the fat fukk and his over inflated contract to the lowly texan rangers

Cabrera back to 1st

Brilliant!!

Texas

You'll be posting the same shit when the Pistons trade Cancer Smith in a few years like you were against him all along. You were sucking Prince's kneecaps not too long ago.

Have you ever had an original thought before, or do you just roll on to whichever bandwagon you can get to quickest you fvcking tub of lard?

[No coincidences]

I am pretty skeptical of this. The truth is, Fielder is still a better player than Kinsler. If you accept that premise, the Tigers got rid of the better player, took in the weaker one, and is paying the majority of the salary? Sure, IK is a better defender, but his defense is nothing spectacular either and Fielder played the one position on the diamond where you could be a defensive liability and still be okay. So In other words, the offense differential that is lost by obtaining Kinsler will have to be made up somewhere else. But where? One possibility is that the pitching is going to have to be even better than it was last year....highly unlikely given that it was historically good. Cabrera? Maybe if he is not hurt. But now, he does not have Fielder protecting him in the lineup. I don't see how this is such a great move personally. At best a lateral move.

Tigers needed to free up money to either try and re-sign Max or fix the holes in both their lineup and their bullpen -- of which there are plenty. Fielder ain't getting any younger or better. Kinsler brings much-needed speed to the table for a team that has none, and he has nice pop for a middle infielder. While power hitting corner infielders are a dime a dozen, guys who produce like Kinsler at his position aren't.

Now with all of that being said, everything depends on how much Kinsler plays. We all know he has the track record of a china doll. I'm pretty sure that '11 and '12 were the only seasons he didn't spend time on the DL. Prince, meanwhile, plays every day no matter what. So the success/failure of this trade for either team will likely hinge on Fielder's future production (shaky) vs. Kinsler's ability to stay in the lineup (shaky). Also, a lot depends on what DD does with the extra cash. I love Max, but I'm still not sure he's worth what he's going to be asking for.

[No coincidences]

Let me add this, too -- the Tigers now must find protection for Miggy in the lineup. He's alone on an island right now. I'm assuming Kinsler would lead off or hit second, which means Jackson likely gets moved down in the order.

They could hit Martinez cleanup I suppose, but is that a championship-level lineup if you're relying on V-Mart in the 4 spot?

I would anticipate something like this as of today:

1) Kinsler, 2B
2) Jackson, CF
3) Cabrera, 1B
4) Martinez, DH
5) Hunter, RF
6) Castellanos, 3B
7) Avilla, C
*8) Dirks or Peralta, LF
9) Iglesias, SS

I'm sure more moves are coming. This is probably part of a much bigger and more elaborate Dombrowski plan.

I'm assuming the upgrade comes in LF, or maybe they go after Ellsbury and move Jackson to left. Then you could go:

1) Ellsbury
2) Kinsler
3) Cabrera
4) Martinez
5) Hunter
6) Castellanos
7) Avilla
8) Jackson
9) Iglesias

Either that, or find someone with power to play left, bat fourth, and move everyone down a spot in order #1.

[Deuce]

Coiner, Peralta gone. Iglesias is Tigers SS. Keep hearing a move for Beltran. Kinsler will bat lead off. As of today I see...

Kinsler
Hunter
Miggy
Vmart
Jackson
Avila
Castellanos
Dirks
Iglesias

[billysink]

Guys I just can't see handing Castellanos more than 350 at bats right off the hop. If that is their plan they better put him in the 3 hole.

And they better not put Jackson anywhere near Avila. Fukkin whiff kings.

[No coincidences]

Coiner, Peralta gone. Iglesias is Tigers SS. Keep hearing a move for Beltran. Kinsler will bat lead off. As of today I see...

Kinsler
Hunter
Miggy
Vmart
Jackson
Avila
Castellanos
Dirks
Iglesias

I just threw Dirks/Peralta in there because that's who played left last year. That's why there is an asterisk.

I'd take Beltran, but I'm still not sure V-Mart is enough protection for Miggy and you wouldn't hit Beltran clean-up. Just not sure who this mystery LF would be if that's what DD is thinking. Don't see much on the free-agent market that would fit that role.

I'm not a fan of Castellanos personally. I know it's early, but his mechanics look flawed at the plate and there's a reason he's been playing OF (not just because Miggy was at third). Dude wouldn't be much of an upgrade defensively at third over Cabrera, which obviously isn't saying much. Not sure this kid's ready to be an everyday third baseman. Tigers must see something in him for as many bullets as he's dodged as trade bait, though.

[Deuce]

I just threw Dirks/Peralta in there because that's who played left last year. That's why there is an asterisk.

I'd take Beltran, but I'm still not sure V-Mart is enough protection for Miggy and you wouldn't hit Beltran clean-up. Just not sure who this mystery LF would be if that's what DD is thinking. Don't see much on the free-agent market that would fit that role.

I'm not a fan of Castellanos personally. I know it's early, but his mechanics look flawed at the plate and there's a reason he's been playing OF (not just because Miggy was at third). Dude wouldn't be much of an upgrade defensively at third over Cabrera, which obviously isn't saying much. Not sure this kid's ready to be an everyday third baseman. Tigers must see something in him for as many bullets as he's dodged as trade bait, though.

I mean of course Nick isn't an upgrade but I agree Dave has something else. Last year was do or die. Right now they are throwing dirt of the coffin. I don't see a huge deal like Jacoby though just because you have to sign max and Miguel.

[No coincidences]

Guys I just can't see handing Castellanos more than 350 at bats right off the hop. If that is their plan they better put him in the 3 hole.

Exactly.

As I said, I don't think he's ready to be an every day major leaguer. I would've traded him a long time ago when his minor league stock was sky high, but that's just me.

And they better not put Jackson anywhere near Avila. Fukkin whiff kings.

Jackson was pretty good his rookie year. Then the league adjusted and he stunk. Then he adjusted and got good again. Then the league re-adjusted and he stunk again. Let's hope he re-re-adjusts this year. LOL.

[No coincidences]

I mean of course Nick isn't an upgrade but I agree Dave has something else. Last year was do or die. Right now they are throwing dirt of the coffin. I don't see a huge deal like Jacoby though just because you have to sign max and Miguel.

I like Ellsbury, but he's not worth what he's asking for and he makes Kinsler look like an iron man.

Whatever it is, DD knows the time is now. Cabrera and Verlander aren't getting any younger. This isn't part of a long-term plot to win. This is a plan to win immediately in 2014. I know that much.

[No coincidences]

BTW, were there any legs to the rumored deal that had Porcello, Castellanos and others going to the Bravos for Kimbrel last year? Or was that all just hearsay?

[billysink]

Exactly.

As I said, I don't think he's ready to be an every day major leaguer. I would've traded him a long time ago when his minor league stock was sky high, but that's just me.

Jackson was pretty good his rookie year. Then the league adjusted and he stunk. Then he adjusted and got good again. Then the league re-adjusted and he stunk again. Let's hope he re-re-adjusts this year. LOL.

Would love to see Infante one more year.

[No coincidences]

Would love to see Infante one more year.

Where would you play him? Third?

It's going to be interesting to see if the organization deems Castellanos "ready" to play every day for a World Series contender.

[Deuce]

BTW, were there any legs to the rumored deal that had Porcello, Castellanos and others going to the Bravos for Kimbrel last year? Or was that all just hearsay?

I'd like to add Choo to the OF personally, but I think he's going to be in pinstripes.

I had heard that too. It was when reportedly they were shopping Max, as well. I'm fine with moving Rick to be honest. It's already stated Smyly is in the rotation so that puts Rick in the pen. I'd be much more confident than Dirks in LF but don't know what you do with him. As of right now there isn't a playing signed to 2015 besides Cabrera and Verlander.

[No coincidences]

Maybe send Porcello and friends to the Blue Jays for Bautista?

1) Kinsler, 2B
2) Infante, 3B
3) Cabrera, 1B
4) Bautista, LF
5) V-Mart, DH
6) Hunter, RF
7) Avilla, C
8) Jackson, CF
9) Iglesias, SS

With Castellanos in the minors would be ideal in my book -- except for the lack of lefties (which is why I mentioned Choo).

[billysink]

please don't send Choo here the guy was an automatic out last year against lefties. Absolutely useless. Batted .215 and slugged .267.

[No coincidences]

please don't send Choo here the guy was an automatic out last year against lefties. Absolutely useless. Batted .215 and slugged .267.

Who would you go after in left?

BTW, Kurkjian is saying Miggy might stay at third and the Tigers go after a first baseman like Morneau. Interesting.

[ZetaPsi808]

Deal includes Tigers paying a large portion of prince's $.

only 30 million of the remaining 168 million in princes contract

[stevenash]

@Buddy

Prince is not better than Kinsler, not even close.

Big gap in offense WAR, and that's before we start talking Kinsler's defensive WAR, which is first page, right under Longoria.


@Opie
I did not realize Andrus defensive WAR was that good. Wow

[opie1988]

@Opie
I did not realize Andrus defensive WAR was that good. Wow

Again, who knows how this will turn out? Right now, both clubs feel like they filled big holes, so thats a good thing.

From my fanatical fan perspective, I'm very happy with this trade.
I'll take an infield of Fielder, Profar, Andrus, and Beltre against anyone, everyday of the week.

[SamDiamond]

Again, who knows how this will turn out? Right now, both clubs feel like they filled big holes, so thats a good thing.

From my fanatical fan perspective, I'm very happy with this trade.
I'll take an infield of Fielder, Profar, Andrus, and Beltre against anyone, everyday of the week.

Op....take the Coke-stained Ron Washington goggles off for a second....

If you weren't a Rangers fan you wouldn't be this optimistic.....

You knee deep in homershit.

This was a salary dump by the Tigers, and the Rangers were nice enough to take Fielder for them.

Fielder was a mess, with the best hitter in baseball hitting in front of him. Now, simply because he changes area codes, he's going to be lights out?

[no1here]

Horrible PR move by the Tigers. Fielder best known player here by far! Every non sport nut knew and loved him. He made everybody here aware of the Tigers. He sold more jerseys by far. He was known by all!! He made the Tigers nobody else!

It was done for the money not to get better player as they didn't. Makes no sense to bring the weight to Texas and the fans will hate him. Niether Kinsler or Fielder will play much next year. One hurt and one suffering. I hate Fielder being gone and could bring an uproar here.

[KiDBaZkiT]

Beautiful move by both teams. Baseball is beautiful. Already can't wait for Spring. Prince is horrible in the playoffs and couldn't pick up any slack from Cabreras injury. Kinsler will prob be rejuvenated in a new setting.

[SamDiamond]

Horrible PR move by the Tigers. Fielder best known player here by far! Every non sport nut knew and loved him. He made everybody here aware of the Tigers. He sold more jerseys by far. He was known by all!! He made the Tigers nobody else!

It was done for the money not to get better player as they didn't. Makes no sense to bring the weight to Texas and the fans will hate him. Niether Kinsler or Fielder will play much next year. One hurt and one suffering. I hate Fielder being gone and could bring an uproar here.

Ummmm. Huh?

You know that "other" guy--- you know, the best hitter in baseball---- Miggy?

Yeah, I think he may trump Fielder by 328,399 light years in popularity.

[Wilfred]

Ummmm. Huh?

You know that "other" guy--- you know, the best hitter in baseball---- Miggy?

Yeah, I think he may trump Fielder by 328,399 light years in popularity.

Not really as much as you would think here. People like him but even during the "who's your tiger" campaign every year more people picked Verlander and Prince. The language barrier throws people off from picking him as their favorite I think. Hell, I see way more people walking around with Verlander and Prince shirts over Cabrera around town and at the games.

[billysink]

Not really as much as you would think here. People like him but even during the "who's your tiger" campaign every year more people picked Verlander and Prince. The language barrier throws people off from picking him as their favorite I think. Hell, I see way more people walking around with Verlander and Prince shirts over Cabrera around town and at the games.

Very true.Tons of Fielder jerseys at the games.

[InTheDrink]

robbie cano calling the moving trucks to head to arlington

[gryfyn1]

taken in a vacuum this is a win for Detroit over Texas at first glance, with Detroit basically gaining long term payroll flexibility while fixing its infield defense (which directly cost them at least one game in the playoffs).

But the truth is Texas did better than most people seem to think.

Firstly, Kinsler was going to have to be traded, he was refusing to move off of second base and Profar really needed to be put into the lineup full time and getting much in return for him was going to be tough sledding without texas paying a chunk of his salary.

Secondly, the short term salary difference isn't major, only about 6.5m per year over the next 4, Texas does take a chance paying Fielder 49m from 2018-2020.

Thirdly, Fielder's decline is over stated, Yes last year was a down year and there is a chance it is a sudden evaporation of skills, but assuming that is a fools errand, people thought Davis Ortiz's career was over four years ago. But fielder was the mostly the same guy in his first year in Det as he was in Milwaukee.

From 2007-2011 fielder posted a line of 288/399/553 w 40HR/ 700PA in 2012 311/412/528 w/30 HR in 690PA, he traded HRs for average, but it was mostly park factors that contributed to that. In Milw he posted a 151 OPS+, 147 wRC+ and 401 wOBA, in 2012 he posted a 151 OPS+, 153 wRC+ and 398 wOBA.

The HRs? well over the last 4 years Milw has HR factor of 1.30 and Det a HR factor of .99, so 25% decline in HR seems abit much, but not overly so. the total is supported by his flyball distance which was 300 in his year in Milw and drop only 4 feet in 2012.

[No coincidences]

Horrible PR move by the Tigers. Fielder best known player here by far! Every non sport nut knew and loved him. He made everybody here aware of the Tigers. He sold more jerseys by far. He was known by all!! He made the Tigers nobody else!

It was done for the money not to get better player as they didn't. Makes no sense to bring the weight to Texas and the fans will hate him. Niether Kinsler or Fielder will play much next year. One hurt and one suffering. I hate Fielder being gone and could bring an uproar here.

What are you talking about? He was basically the universal scapegoat for Detroit's playoff failures. Most Tiger fans are saying good riddance this morning. I'm not one of them mind you, but that's the general sentiment.

[Big Bear]

Miguel Cabrerra may start getting walked as much as Barry Bonds used to.

Tigers probably still make the playoffs though.

The AL central will be the worst division in baseball next season.

[LT Profits]

And Cardinals are interested in trying to get either Profar or Andrus.

[No coincidences]

And Cardinals are interested in trying to get either Profar or Andrus.

Why would Texas trade either one of those cats now that Kinsler's out of the picture?

[MiDNiTe]

great move by tigers looks like they will have a chance to keep max, max over prince any fing day