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Horse Racing questions and answers

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  • str
    SBR Posting Legend
    • 01-12-09
    • 11559

    #9206
    Originally posted by JBEX
    hey str

    considering a horse at tampa bay tomorrow coming off an exact 10 week layoff..he has two 4f works (his only ones) at a training center in exactly (to the fifth of a sec) the same time .. do you feel when this happens
    that it shows some intention in the 2nd work to hit the time on the nose or it's just one of those things..maybe include a 3 tick range either way as also being meaningful ?
    Originally posted by str
    Quick question JBEX.

    What is AWK in the comment line? Awkward? Like in an awkward start?? Any idea?
    Originally posted by JBEX
    guessing awkward..saw the head on and he bore out and was bounced around (at least how I'd describe it) quite a bit
    So with this analysis, because I will mention several things, and knowing that they are all presumptions and not fact, I will most likely be wrong but.. the overview should be at least as solid as it can be given the factors involved.

    I do wish I could share the PP's with everyone as I have things to say that might help for down the road with analysis but I cannot copy and paste them and have them come out coherently.
    That said, here we go.

    Ordinarily, with respect to the exact time in the workouts part, yeah, you might ask that they go about the same as last time and it happens to be right on it. But... This doesn't pass the smell test too me. I would bet if I could, that those works were just lip service to the entry clerk so the horse could run. Do you think that someone is paying clockers to sit at that training center to watch 1 horse work a 1/2 mile all day on a Sunday the 8th? Or that only 3 horses worked on a Friday , Nov. 29th? I find it hard to believe. I do not know 20 some years removed how the workouts at these places work today but when published works first started being required, if there were not any at a track that has clockers, the trainer simply gave times to the entry clerk to follow the entry for the DRF to print. So the old 1/2 in 50. was almost a flag. Fast forward to today, and without knowing anything, I put virtually no stock at all in those works. They don't even make sense. Who works a horse in 51 , waits 9 days until a Sunday, and works a 1/2 in 51 again? Then, they wait 16 more days to run?? Nonsense.
    But with that said, the horse has worked and I would guess, and probably decently. Has he worked enough with those shaky connections? IDK. But, he did run 46 2/5ths for a 1/2 mile on 10/8 for the half in his 3rd start and ran 45 3/5ths for a half in his second start.
    So this is his 5th start and he has his 5th rider on today. Unreal. This horse has had no chance to succeed unless it was done solely be him. I see very little if any help from anyone else. Fronts on as a firster, then blinkers since? Did he work in Blinkers?? Who knows. What a mess.

    But, with all that said, I think this horse has a legit shot in here at a solid price. If he runs back to his 2nd, or 3rd start, he should be a factor. The 4th start, seems deceiving on paper.

    2nd start he lost by 3 lengths for 4th.
    3rd start he lost by 3 1/2 lengths for 4th.
    4th start, he lost by 3 1/2 lengths for 4th.

    The one and two horse should duel early and both have faded in the past. I doubt they would have finished ahead of this horse in his other races.
    So you are obviously betting blind with all the assumptions and such but that is what you do when you bet on longshots sometimes.

    If they ran 20 horses exactly like this and in this exact situation, I truly think more than 1 of them beats this group. So, 15 or 20-1 would be a fair price IMO.
    At a nice price, I have bet on much worse than this guy. I say he is worth a swing at high odds.
    Last edited by str; 12-24-24, 10:03 AM.
    Comment
    • JBEX
      SBR Posting Legend
      • 01-02-12
      • 23081

      #9207
      Originally posted by str
      So with this analysis, because I will mention several things, and knowing that they are all presumptions and not fact, I will most likely be wrong but.. the overview should be at least as solid as it can be given the factors involved.

      I do wish I could share the PP's with everyone as I have things to say that might help for down the road with analysis but I cannot copy and paste them and have them come out coherently.
      That said, here we go.

      Ordinarily, with respect to the exact time in the workouts part, yeah, you might ask that they go about the same as last time and it happens to be right on it. But... This doesn't pass the smell test too me. I would bet if I could, that those works were just lip service to the entry clerk so the horse could run. Do you think that someone is paying clockers to sit at that training center to watch 1 horse work a 1/2 mile all day on a Sunday the 8th? Or that only 3 horses worked on a Friday , Nov. 29th? I find it hard to believe. I do not know 20 some years removed how the workouts at these places work today but when published works first started being required, if there were not any at a track that has clockers, the trainer simply gave times to the entry clerk to follow the entry for the DRF to print. So the old 1/2 in 50. was almost a flag. Fast forward to today, and without knowing anything, I put virtually no stock at all in those works. They don't even make sense. Who works a horse in 51 , waits 9 days until a Sunday, and works a 1/2 in 51 again? Then, they wait 16 more days to run?? Nonsense.
      But with that said, the horse has worked and I would guess, and probably decently. Has he worked enough with those shaky connections? IDK. But, he did run 46 2/5ths for a 1/2 mile on 10/8 for the half in his 3rd start and ran 45 3/5ths for a half in his second start.
      So this is his 5th start and he has his 5th rider on today. Unreal. This horse has had no chance to succeed unless it was done solely be him. I see very little if any help from anyone else. Fronts on as a firster, then blinkers since? Did he work in Blinkers?? Who knows. What a mess.

      But, with all that said, I think this horse has a legit shot in here at a solid price. If he runs back to his 2nd, or 3rd start, he should be a factor. The 4th start, seems deceiving on paper.

      2nd start he lost by 3 lengths for 4th.
      3rd start he lost by 3 1/2 lengths for 4th.
      4th start, he lost by 3 1/2 lengths for 4th.

      The one and two horse should duel early and both have faded in the past. I doubt they would have finished ahead of this horse in his other races.
      So you are obviously betting blind with all the assumptions and such but that is what you do when you bet on longshots sometimes.

      If they ran 20 horses exactly like this and in this exact situation, I truly think more than 1 of them beats this group. So, 15 or 20-1 would be a fair price IMO.
      At a nice price, I have bet on much worse than this guy. I say he is worth a swing at high odds.
      so basically other than he did work you wouldn't put much weight into the recorded times
      ..I do find it kind of amazing anywhere in general that horse's can work within 3 ticks of each as often as they do consecutive tries..understand track conditions can play into it also (mean fast to slow vs wet)

      as far as this horse I agree if he's got any of races 1-3 in him he would be tough in here..I don't think giving him a total pass in his last race is necessarily fair either in spite of what I said in my previous post..seems to be a fair placement if he's at his best (or close)..as you mentioned could be a duel between the 1 and 2 and I would think if he's up to it would probably stalk..TJ combo could bring a decent price ..be interesting to see if he gets some early action

      thanks str

      just so people know who we're discussing

      tampa

      R2 #8 hotline blink (8-1)
      @ 12:40





      .
      Comment
      • str
        SBR Posting Legend
        • 01-12-09
        • 11559

        #9208
        Originally posted by JBEX
        so basically other than he did work you wouldn't put much weight into the recorded times
        ..I do find it kind of amazing anywhere in general that horse's can work within 3 ticks of each as often as they do consecutive tries..understand track conditions can play into it also (mean fast to slow vs wet)

        as far as this horse I agree if he's got any of races 1-3 in him he would be tough in here..I don't think giving him a total pass in his last race is necessarily fair either in spite of what I said in my previous post..seems to be a fair placement if he's at his best (or close)..as you mentioned could be a duel between the 1 and 2 and I would think if he's up to it would probably stalk..TJ combo could bring a decent price ..be interesting to see if he gets some early action

        thanks str

        just so people know who we're discussing

        tampa

        R2 #8 hotline blink (8-1)
        @ 12:40





        .
        Basically, yes. I do not know why he would not have worked more than twice assuming he has been there for a month or so. More like every 5-7 days depending on the overall effort within that work and used as a build up to todays race. Twice in that span and with those days in between is ridiculous as it is presented.
        It makes no sense at all.

        So work, walk, gallop, gallop, gallop, work would be a more sensible training chart. Or a 4th gallop in between. And even then, do you let him pick it up through the stretch in those gallops? Sure, why not. Teach him how to run AND where to pick it up.
        Last edited by str; 12-24-24, 11:35 AM.
        Comment
        • str
          SBR Posting Legend
          • 01-12-09
          • 11559

          #9209
          Originally posted by str
          Basically, yes. I do not know why he would not have worked more than twice assuming he has been there for a month or so. More like every 5-7 days depending on the overall effort within that work and used as a build up to todays race. Twice in that span and with those days in between is ridiculous as it is presented.
          It makes no sense at all.

          So work, walk, gallop, gallop, gallop, work would be a more sensible training chart. Or a 4th gallop in between. And even then, do you let him pick it up through the stretch in those gallops? Sure, why not. Teach him how to run AND where to pick it up.
          I saw the rerun and will talk about this later.
          Comment
          • str
            SBR Posting Legend
            • 01-12-09
            • 11559

            #9210
            Merry Christmas and happy holidays to everyone.
            Comment
            • JBEX
              SBR Posting Legend
              • 01-02-12
              • 23081

              #9211
              Originally posted by str
              Merry Christmas and happy holidays to everyone.
              same to you and everyone else
              Comment
              • JBEX
                SBR Posting Legend
                • 01-02-12
                • 23081

                #9212
                Originally posted by str
                I saw the rerun and will talk about this later.
                I thought he just didn't have it so interested to hear what you think


                .
                Comment
                • Optional
                  Administrator
                  • 06-10-10
                  • 60849

                  #9213
                  Brothers new horse, In Limbo, had a second barrier trial on 23rd.

                  These are invite only barrier trials for the best new prospects btw.

                  2nd this time but the trainer says he is very happy with the run as the two colts she fought home against are among the most expensive and top prospects in the country this season.


                  The run also qualified her for the richest maiden race in the world, called the Magic Millions Debut, for 2yo first starters only.

                  It's getting exciting!!


                  <blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Juvenile Trial Watch - 240k MM purchase by Farnan takes the win, nice second trial from Hellbent filly In Limbo <a href="https://t.co/JfYnJ499IF">https://t.co/JfYnJ499IF</a> <a href="https://twitter.com/mmsnippets?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@mmsnipp ets</a> <a href="https://twitter.com/widdenstud?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@widdens tud</a> <a href="https://twitter.com/JohnOSheaRacing?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@Jo hnOSheaRacing</a> <a href="https://twitter.com/JamesBester4?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@James Bester4</a> <a href="https://t.co/WKXBdrkHo1">https://t.co/WKXBdrkHo1</a> <a href="https://t.co/lu2ZVVAEQb">pic.twitter.com/lu2ZVVAEQb</a></p>&mdash; Tara Madgwick (@breednet) <a href="https://twitter.com/breednet/status/1871036496524022108?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw" >December 23, 2024</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
                  .
                  Comment
                  • batt33
                    SBR Hall of Famer
                    • 12-23-16
                    • 5981

                    #9214
                    Originally posted by str
                    Merry Christmas and happy holidays to everyone.
                    same to you and everyone as well!
                    Comment
                    • batt33
                      SBR Hall of Famer
                      • 12-23-16
                      • 5981

                      #9215
                      Originally posted by Optional
                      Brothers new horse, In Limbo, had a second barrier trial on 23rd.

                      These are invite only barrier trials for the best new prospects btw.

                      2nd this time but the trainer says he is very happy with the run as the two colts she fought home against are among the most expensive and top prospects in the country this season.


                      The run also qualified her for the richest maiden race in the world, called the Magic Millions Debut, for 2yo first starters only.

                      It's getting exciting!!


                      <blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Juvenile Trial Watch - 240k MM purchase by Farnan takes the win, nice second trial from Hellbent filly In Limbo <a rel="nofollow" href="https://t.co/JfYnJ499IF">https://t.co/JfYnJ499IF</a> <a rel="nofollow" href="https://twitter.com/mmsnippets?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@mmsnipp ets</a> <a rel="nofollow" href="https://twitter.com/widdenstud?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@widdens tud</a> <a rel="nofollow" href="https://twitter.com/JohnOSheaRacing?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@Jo hnOSheaRacing</a> <a rel="nofollow" href="https://twitter.com/JamesBester4?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@James Bester4</a> <a rel="nofollow" href="https://t.co/WKXBdrkHo1">https://t.co/WKXBdrkHo1</a> <a rel="nofollow" href="https://t.co/lu2ZVVAEQb">pic.twitter.com/lu2ZVVAEQb</a></p>&mdash; Tara Madgwick (@breednet) <a rel="nofollow" href="https://twitter.com/breednet/status/1871036496524022108?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw" >December 23, 2024</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
                      Wow that's awesome! following!
                      Comment
                      • Louisvillekid1
                        SBR Aristocracy
                        • 10-17-07
                        • 52143

                        #9216
                        Guess I’m unbanned after all these years , hope all is well
                        Comment
                        • Optional
                          Administrator
                          • 06-10-10
                          • 60849

                          #9217
                          Originally posted by Louisvillekid1
                          Guess I’m unbanned after all these years , hope all is well
                          Merry Xmas LK.

                          Hope you have been doing well
                          .
                          Comment
                          • Louisvillekid1
                            SBR Aristocracy
                            • 10-17-07
                            • 52143

                            #9218
                            Yessir I’m blessed, life is amazing.

                            you as well my man
                            Comment
                            • Optional
                              Administrator
                              • 06-10-10
                              • 60849

                              #9219
                              Originally posted by Louisvillekid1
                              Yessir I’m blessed, life is amazing.

                              you as well my man
                              Nice mate! 2024 has been a great year for me too.
                              .
                              Comment
                              • Jellymancan
                                SBR MVP
                                • 03-09-20
                                • 3686

                                #9220
                                Originally posted by str
                                Merry Christmas and happy holidays to everyone.
                                You too str. This thread is gold.
                                Comment
                                • str
                                  SBR Posting Legend
                                  • 01-12-09
                                  • 11559

                                  #9221
                                  Originally posted by str
                                  I saw the rerun and will talk about this later.
                                  Originally posted by JBEX

                                  I thought he just didn't have it so interested to hear what you think


                                  .
                                  <br>
                                  <br>

                                  So here I come, the day after Christmas wanting to sling mud at someone. Not really, but at the same time, yeah, I guess. I will keep this somewhat restrained in regards to my comments. Just want to say that in regards to the race in question, do not hold ANY of that on the horse. That horse was willing. That horse raced and tried. But... that horse had no chance after a 1/4 mile. Nice run down the backside and just where he wanted to be. But before he even gets to the far turn, he is starting to get out. Get out means lean outside to the point that the rider has to put all his efforts on the other reign, in this case, the left reign. He could no longer ride the horse forward, he was too busy trying to keep the horse from going to the outside. That has most likely a physical problem that was compromising the horse and not a mental one. But whatever the case, his race was over after about 20 seconds. All he did was bear out the rest of the way. He never got off his left lead leg. Most likely a physical thing but either way. When a horse went around him, the rider had to pull off that outside horse. From what I could see of the type of bit, it was nothing that would have helped the rider, meaning it most likely is a new thing.
                                  Honestly, as a trainer, I would have been embarrassed if that was the effort my horse displayed. So maybe the horse is injured and we will see. But I get the feeling it was not as much that as it was complete incompetency by the connections. Maybe, in hindsight those works were correct. If that was the case, no horse should be running if it takes 9 days to recover from a 1/2 mile in 51 seconds.

                                  It is hard enough to pick winners, and yes, weaker connections have low percentages and longer odds for a reason. But in this horses case, he was not fit to run unless that problem occurred within the 1st 20 seconds of the race. If so, that goes with the betting territory. If a piece of equipment was broken during the race, or a shoe came off, something we cannot see, I totally understand. But if not, and that is the type of effort that that trainer is capable of his horses displaying, he needs to rethink his occupation.

                                  Hope that's not too harsh but I have always felt that bettors, fans, deserve at least a shot when they bet and that was a real bad look IMO.
                                  Comment
                                  • str
                                    SBR Posting Legend
                                    • 01-12-09
                                    • 11559

                                    #9222
                                    Originally posted by Optional
                                    Brothers new horse, In Limbo, had a second barrier trial on 23rd.

                                    These are invite only barrier trials for the best new prospects btw.

                                    2nd this time but the trainer says he is very happy with the run as the two colts she fought home against are among the most expensive and top prospects in the country this season.


                                    The run also qualified her for the richest maiden race in the world, called the Magic Millions Debut, for 2yo first starters only.

                                    It's getting exciting!!


                                    <blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Juvenile Trial Watch - 240k MM purchase by Farnan takes the win, nice second trial from Hellbent filly In Limbo <a rel="nofollow" href="https://t.co/JfYnJ499IF">https://t.co/JfYnJ499IF</a> <a rel="nofollow" href="https://twitter.com/mmsnippets?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@mmsnipp ets</a> <a rel="nofollow" href="https://twitter.com/widdenstud?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@widdens tud</a> <a rel="nofollow" href="https://twitter.com/JohnOSheaRacing?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@Jo hnOSheaRacing</a> <a rel="nofollow" href="https://twitter.com/JamesBester4?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@James Bester4</a> <a rel="nofollow" href="https://t.co/WKXBdrkHo1">https://t.co/WKXBdrkHo1</a> <a rel="nofollow" href="https://t.co/lu2ZVVAEQb">pic.twitter.com/lu2ZVVAEQb</a></p>&mdash; Tara Madgwick (@breednet) <a rel="nofollow" href="https://twitter.com/breednet/status/1871036496524022108?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw" >December 23, 2024</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
                                    Opti, that was a very nice run. The rider could have probably won it if necessary but that is not the point here. Cool part for me was the horse tried to come back on her own . She is a real gamer ! Love to see that.
                                    Thanks for the clip and GL with her. She looks great !
                                    Comment
                                    • str
                                      SBR Posting Legend
                                      • 01-12-09
                                      • 11559

                                      #9223
                                      Originally posted by Louisvillekid1
                                      Guess I’m unbanned after all these years , hope all is well
                                      What a nice Christmas present this is LKid !

                                      Welcome back my friend. Really nice to see you in here.
                                      I hope all is well with you .
                                      Comment
                                      • str
                                        SBR Posting Legend
                                        • 01-12-09
                                        • 11559

                                        #9224
                                        Originally posted by Jellymancan
                                        You too str. This thread is gold.
                                        Appreciate that Jelly.

                                        Nice to see you check in.
                                        Comment
                                        • Madison
                                          SBR Hall of Famer
                                          • 09-16-11
                                          • 6411

                                          #9225
                                          Originally posted by Louisvillekid1
                                          Yessir I’m blessed, life is amazing.

                                          you as well my man
                                          Welcome back!
                                          Comment
                                          • Optional
                                            Administrator
                                            • 06-10-10
                                            • 60849

                                            #9226
                                            Originally posted by str
                                            Opti, that was a very nice run. The rider could have probably won it if necessary but that is not the point here. Cool part for me was the horse tried to come back on her own . She is a real gamer ! Love to see that.
                                            Thanks for the clip and GL with her. She looks great !
                                            That's really good to hear from you. I was telling myself something similar. Even though she was being run down in both trials, I thought she looked to be comfortable both times. Hoping some more fitness and that experience will pay off.

                                            11th January we will find out.
                                            .
                                            Comment
                                            • Jellymancan
                                              SBR MVP
                                              • 03-09-20
                                              • 3686

                                              #9227
                                              Originally posted by Louisvillekid1
                                              Guess I’m unbanned after all these years , hope all is well
                                              Nice to see you back, man! Hope all has been well with you.
                                              Comment
                                              • JBEX
                                                SBR Posting Legend
                                                • 01-02-12
                                                • 23081

                                                #9228
                                                Originally posted by Louisvillekid1
                                                Guess I’m unbanned after all these years , hope all is well
                                                nice to see you back LK
                                                Comment
                                                • Madison
                                                  SBR Hall of Famer
                                                  • 09-16-11
                                                  • 6411

                                                  #9229
                                                  Young ones (JBEX)

                                                  FG R11 6:45pm For 58K this looks like a nice young group.

                                                  I flagged #9 but plenty more to look at. #2 GunRun/Tapit. #4 Curlin/Tapit.

                                                  Looks like a value race to me. As always , if you can pick it.

                                                  Love anyone's thoughts.
                                                  Comment
                                                  • Madison
                                                    SBR Hall of Famer
                                                    • 09-16-11
                                                    • 6411

                                                    #9230
                                                    Another interesting one

                                                    SA R10 Kinza. 4 starts 3W/1P. Baffert. Carpe Diam/ Qual Rd. OFF 263?? 3F

                                                    Comment
                                                    • JBEX
                                                      SBR Posting Legend
                                                      • 01-02-12
                                                      • 23081

                                                      #9231
                                                      Originally posted by str
                                                      <br>
                                                      <br>

                                                      So here I come, the day after Christmas wanting to sling mud at someone. Not really, but at the same time, yeah, I guess. I will keep this somewhat restrained in regards to my comments. Just want to say that in regards to the race in question, do not hold ANY of that on the horse. That horse was willing. That horse raced and tried. But... that horse had no chance after a 1/4 mile. Nice run down the backside and just where he wanted to be. But before he even gets to the far turn, he is starting to get out. Get out means lean outside to the point that the rider has to put all his efforts on the other reign, in this case, the left reign. He could no longer ride the horse forward, he was too busy trying to keep the horse from going to the outside. That has most likely a physical problem that was compromising the horse and not a mental one. But whatever the case, his race was over after about 20 seconds. All he did was bear out the rest of the way. He never got off his left lead leg. Most likely a physical thing but either way. When a horse went around him, the rider had to pull off that outside horse. From what I could see of the type of bit, it was nothing that would have helped the rider, meaning it most likely is a new thing.
                                                      Honestly, as a trainer, I would have been embarrassed if that was the effort my horse displayed. So maybe the horse is injured and we will see. But I get the feeling it was not as much that as it was complete incompetency by the connections. Maybe, in hindsight those works were correct. If that was the case, no horse should be running if it takes 9 days to recover from a 1/2 mile in 51 seconds.

                                                      It is hard enough to pick winners, and yes, weaker connections have low percentages and longer odds for a reason. But in this horses case, he was not fit to run unless that problem occurred within the 1st 20 seconds of the race. If so, that goes with the betting territory. If a piece of equipment was broken during the race, or a shoe came off, something we cannot see, I totally understand. But if not, and that is the type of effort that that trainer is capable of his horses displaying, he needs to rethink his occupation.

                                                      Hope that's not too harsh but I have always felt that bettors, fans, deserve at least a shot when they bet and that was a real bad look IMO.
                                                      thanks str

                                                      so you think , barring an equipment issue or injury, that there were probably signs he wasn't ready to go coming in .. generally speaking I don't downgrade for light/slow worktabs and will give extra credit for good ones..guess you definitely want to consider who the trainer is in these situations..the better ones are less likely to send out a horse who is unprepared to run but you'll pay for that with lower odds ..as you know part of betting the horses
                                                      Comment
                                                      • JBEX
                                                        SBR Posting Legend
                                                        • 01-02-12
                                                        • 23081

                                                        #9232
                                                        Originally posted by Madison
                                                        FG R11 6:45pm For 58K this looks like a nice young group.

                                                        I flagged #9 but plenty more to look at. #2 GunRun/Tapit. #4 Curlin/Tapit.

                                                        Looks like a value race to me. As always , if you can pick it.

                                                        Love anyone's thoughts.
                                                        lots of big pedigrees..my choice is #7 black dog (9-2)..class and bred to run forever..didn't get a chance at saratoga and churchill but ran fairly evenly in the sprints..think two turns,switching back to dirt and staying away from jose ortiz might get some value in spite of what the ml says
                                                        Comment
                                                        • Madison
                                                          SBR Hall of Famer
                                                          • 09-16-11
                                                          • 6411

                                                          #9233
                                                          Originally posted by JBEX
                                                          lots of big pedigrees..my choice is #7 black dog (9-2)..class and bred to run forever..didn't get a chance at saratoga and churchill but ran fairly evenly in the sprints..think two turns,switching back to dirt and staying away from jose ortiz might get some value in spite of what the ml says
                                                          May try 9/2/3478 spread, if odds dictate.
                                                          Comment
                                                          • JBEX
                                                            SBR Posting Legend
                                                            • 01-02-12
                                                            • 23081

                                                            #9234
                                                            hey str

                                                            in case you're not aware rick dutrow has a horse enter in the american oaks (g1) @ 10f on the turf..R11 @ SA #4 kathynmarissa (4-1)(7:12)..how about a horse going 9.5f two back and 10.5f last race going 10 today ..might be a first



                                                            .
                                                            Comment
                                                            • JBEX
                                                              SBR Posting Legend
                                                              • 01-02-12
                                                              • 23081

                                                              #9235
                                                              Originally posted by JBEX
                                                              hey str

                                                              in case you're not aware rick dutrow has a horse enter in the american oaks (g1) @ 10f on the turf..R11 @ SA #4 kathynmarissa (4-1)(7:12)..how about a horse going 9.5f two back and 10.5f last race going 10 today ..might be a first



                                                              .
                                                              I'll go #4 sugar fish (10-1) @ 6:40 in the race before (R10)
                                                              Last edited by JBEX; 12-26-24, 06:06 PM.
                                                              Comment
                                                              • str
                                                                SBR Posting Legend
                                                                • 01-12-09
                                                                • 11559

                                                                #9236
                                                                Originally posted by JBEX
                                                                thanks str

                                                                so you think , barring an equipment issue or injury, that there were probably signs he wasn't ready to go coming in .. generally speaking I don't downgrade for light/slow worktabs and will give extra credit for good ones..guess you definitely want to consider who the trainer is in these situations..the better ones are less likely to send out a horse who is unprepared to run but you'll pay for that with lower odds ..as you know part of betting the horses
                                                                You are correct JBEX about not downgrading slow works. You have no idea HOW that horse worked that race.

                                                                And yes, a trainer that knows what he/she is doing will not send a horse out that runs like that. And that is not to say that the horse could have hurt itself leaving the gate or down the backside but.. that is a small window of opportunity to come undone before he did after about 20 seconds. Not impossible at all, but this trainers full body of work would need to be examined before I would cut him any slack. I thought, all things being equal that the horse ran like a totally unprepared horse and that can only be on the trainer.
                                                                Comment
                                                                • str
                                                                  SBR Posting Legend
                                                                  • 01-12-09
                                                                  • 11559

                                                                  #9237
                                                                  Originally posted by JBEX
                                                                  hey str

                                                                  in case you're not aware rick dutrow has a horse enter in the american oaks (g1) @ 10f on the turf..R11 @ SA #4 kathynmarissa (4-1)(7:12)..how about a horse going 9.5f two back and 10.5f last race going 10 today ..might be a first



                                                                  .
                                                                  Originally posted by JBEX
                                                                  I'll go #4 sugar fish (10-1) @ 6:40 in the race before (R10)
                                                                  Sorry I missed this. I do appreciate the heads up that Ricky had a horse in there. He is all over the map these days.
                                                                  Comment
                                                                  • ChuckyTheGoat
                                                                    BARRELED IN @ SBR!
                                                                    • 04-04-11
                                                                    • 36871

                                                                    #9238
                                                                    Funny clip. Happy Holidays, guys:

                                                                    Where's the fuckin power box, Carol?
                                                                    Comment
                                                                    • str
                                                                      SBR Posting Legend
                                                                      • 01-12-09
                                                                      • 11559

                                                                      #9239
                                                                      Originally posted by ChuckyTheGoat
                                                                      Funny clip. Happy Holidays, guys:

                                                                      You as well Chucky.

                                                                      Every track has a few of these guys. Lol.
                                                                      Comment
                                                                      • ChuckyTheGoat
                                                                        BARRELED IN @ SBR!
                                                                        • 04-04-11
                                                                        • 36871

                                                                        #9240
                                                                        Originally posted by str
                                                                        You as well Chucky.

                                                                        Every track has a few of these guys. Lol.
                                                                        Ha-ha. Yeah, I thought it was funny. Think back to the Richard Dreyfus move LET IT RIDE.
                                                                        Where's the fuckin power box, Carol?
                                                                        Comment
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