Horse Racing questions and answers

[JBEX]

speaking of sloppy hasn't stopped raining for 3 days here..... the "Atmospheric river."... has been aimed right at me.... I'm pretty safe in my location.... but people near the creeks and especially near the fire scars are dealing with some issues...

so I guess areas where the fires were are more prone to flooding with less trees?
glad at least your away from bad spots

[JBEX]

cd R4 #4 gypsy dreaming (8-1) @ 2:27.. little bit of an interesting angle with liam's map being the dam's sire..don't remember seeing one of these before..he's a 2yo debuting in a mcl 50k

[Madison]

A couple of things Madison.

First off, that jockey is very tall. He is 5'10" which is quite a difference. I assume he is fine but that much height might look a bit out of place when compared to the smaller jocks. That is why it looked like he was standing straight up with a ton of horse. He did have plenty of horse and she was relaxed enough early but I understand it looked a little weird. If you watch the replay again, look at the length of the jockey's legs compared to the rider just outside of him when they go around the 1st turn. From his knee to his torso, he has several more inches of leg height.
As they went around the far turn about the 5/16's pole ( black and white pole before they hit the 1/4 pole ( red and white) at the top of the stretch, the horse kind of pulls herself out of that spot which is a little tighter than it had been. It wasn't the rider doing it, it was the horse. And as that started to happen, the rider in the two path squeezed her even more which made her back out of there. Good riding by that outside jock IMO.
Because your horse backed herself out of that spot, she was not out of gas, just claustrophobic and did have energy left to finish. This is the classic example of covering a speed horses right eye up with the outside mount. Simply put, Fearless Lady did have some fear when her right eye was covered up. She did not like it, and started thinking for herself. Never a good thing IMO.
Keep an eye out for her next start ( No pun intended.) And I would not be surprised if she runs back with blinkers ON. That would be on my mind right about now if she was mine.
Hope that makes sense . That is indeed what happened. Not the jocks fault.

Always much appreciated. I did notice how high in the saddle the jock was early. Certainly didn't understand the "pull back" far turn and then the late semi rally. Was really wondering if the pace/field was to blame?

[str]

Always much appreciated. I did notice how high in the saddle the jock was early. Certainly didn't understand the "pull back" far turn and then the late semi rally. Was really wondering if the pace/field was to blame?

IMO it was not the pace at all. Simply the horse being reluctant to run up when pinned and then the outside rider making it tight enough that the jockey had no choice but to pull out of a fast shrinking spot. If you notice, when they straighten away for home, there is no room for that inside horse anymore. That outside horse stole it from the rail horse when she became reluctant.
Hope that makes sense.

[batt33]

so I guess areas where the fires were are more prone to flooding with less trees?
glad at least your away from bad spots

Yes, Basically the fires burned so hot they slicked off the mountain sides...

[batt33]

[COLOR=rgba(77, 76, 76, 0.9)]Sweet Voyage Race Overview
[/COLOR]
Sweet Voyage makes her return to the races this coming Saturday in the opener at Del Mar. The five-furlong turf maiden special weight drew a field of seven fillies. While our initial plan was to run at the maiden claiming level, we really couldn’t have asked for a better spot if she is going to prove herself at the maiden special weight level.
Your daughter of Candy Ride has worked better of late since transitioning to the training track for her final three drills. Based on those recent works, we would expect her to show more speed than she did in her debut 11 months ago, but that still likely won’t put us on or close to the front end.
#3 Cyprus Moon appears to be the trip horse and could get a lonely lead unless she receives pressure from #6 Blissterinthesun. A pace duel between the top two contenders would certainly benefit our chances, but we still believe that in the long run, your filly will prefer two turns. We hope to see a good finish from Sweet Voyage to set her up for her next start.
About the competition (click here for the past performances):
#1 Current Affair (9/2): Improved when switching surfaces after attempting to keep up with talented MyRacehorse stablemate Seismic Beauty in her California debut. This is a quick turnaround, but Hollendorfer has been successful in the past wheeling back fast.
#2 Tahiti Iti (30/1): Has been beaten double-digit lengths in all four starts. Can’t see it here, but perhaps the switch to the sod can help.
#3 Cyprus Moon (2/1): Looks to be the biggest threat in the field and potentially lone speed. she was run down most recently by Shirreffs’s runner Ashley, who was always highly regarded. The one to catch.
#4 Sparrow (6/1): Daughter of Into Mischief makes her second start off of a long layoff. It wouldn’t be impossible for this one to jump forward, but the odds are against it.
#6 Blissterinthesun (5/2): Live runner put forward a huge effort over this surface this past summer when unintentionally taken off of the pace, but failed to follow that effort up next out, posting an even fourth when pressing the pace at Santa Anita going one furlong further. It will be interesting to see what tactics the connections use on Saturday. It’s a tough decision as they don’t want to let #3 Cyprus Moon get the lead on her own, but this one clearly has run her two best races from off of the pace.
#7 Miss Mandalay (10/1): Cuts back to a sprint after three failed routes in the U.S. Can’t blame them for making a change, but don’t see it working.

[batt33]

continuing along ....Stylishly ‘23 Hits the Track
Video is in the next post

[/COLOR]
Stylishly ‘23 has begun training on the racetrack at Wavertree. Your son of Not This Time walks through the starting gate daily before proceeding with his training assignment. Please enjoy the above video with comments from Ciaran Dunne.https://cdnb-media.myracehorse.com/blog/video/Stylishly2023NotThisTimeTrack111524_1732 297211938/MP4/Stylishly2023NotThisTimeTrack111524_1732 297211938.mp4

[batt33]

https://cdnb-media.myracehorse.com/blog/video/Stylishly2023NotThisTimeTrack111524_1732297211938/MP4/Stylishly2023NotThisTimeTrack111524_1732297211938.mp4

[batt33]

[COLOR=rgba(77, 76, 76, 0.9)]Real Savvy Farm Update[/COLOR]

Real Savvy continues to be in turnout at Wavertree Stables in Florida. Please enjoy this video of your son of Authentic with an update and comments from Ciaran Dunne.https://cdnb-media.myracehorse.com/b...2296462963.mp4

[str]

[COLOR=rgba(77, 76, 76, 0.9)]Real Savvy Farm Update[/COLOR]

Real Savvy continues to be in turnout at Wavertree Stables in Florida. Please enjoy this video of your son of Authentic with an update and comments from Ciaran Dunne.https://cdnb-media.myracehorse.com/b...2296462963.mp4

Probably very boring to most and I get that but I could watch that all day.

Thanks Batt

[str]

continuing along ....Stylishly ‘23 Hits the Track
Video is in the next post

[/COLOR]
Stylishly ‘23 has begun training on the racetrack at Wavertree. Your son of Not This Time walks through the starting gate daily before proceeding with his training assignment. Please enjoy the above video with comments from Ciaran Dunne.https://cdnb-media.myracehorse.com/blog/video/Stylishly2023NotThisTimeTrack111524_1732 297211938/MP4/Stylishly2023NotThisTimeTrack111524_1732 297211938.mp4

https://cdnb-media.myracehorse.com/b...2297211938.mp4

Place looks like horse heaven. So cool to see.

[str]

[COLOR=rgba(77, 76, 76, 0.9)]Sweet Voyage Race Overview
[/COLOR]
Sweet Voyage makes her return to the races this coming Saturday in the opener at Del Mar. The five-furlong turf maiden special weight drew a field of seven fillies. While our initial plan was to run at the maiden claiming level, we really couldn’t have asked for a better spot if she is going to prove herself at the maiden special weight level.
Your daughter of Candy Ride has worked better of late since transitioning to the training track for her final three drills. Based on those recent works, we would expect her to show more speed than she did in her debut 11 months ago, but that still likely won’t put us on or close to the front end.
#3 Cyprus Moon appears to be the trip horse and could get a lonely lead unless she receives pressure from #6 Blissterinthesun. A pace duel between the top two contenders would certainly benefit our chances, but we still believe that in the long run, your filly will prefer two turns. We hope to see a good finish from Sweet Voyage to set her up for her next start.
About the competition (click here for the past performances):
#1 Current Affair (9/2): Improved when switching surfaces after attempting to keep up with talented MyRacehorse stablemate Seismic Beauty in her California debut. This is a quick turnaround, but Hollendorfer has been successful in the past wheeling back fast.
#2 Tahiti Iti (30/1): Has been beaten double-digit lengths in all four starts. Can’t see it here, but perhaps the switch to the sod can help.
#3 Cyprus Moon (2/1): Looks to be the biggest threat in the field and potentially lone speed. she was run down most recently by Shirreffs’s runner Ashley, who was always highly regarded. The one to catch.
#4 Sparrow (6/1): Daughter of Into Mischief makes her second start off of a long layoff. It wouldn’t be impossible for this one to jump forward, but the odds are against it.
#6 Blissterinthesun (5/2): Live runner put forward a huge effort over this surface this past summer when unintentionally taken off of the pace, but failed to follow that effort up next out, posting an even fourth when pressing the pace at Santa Anita going one furlong further. It will be interesting to see what tactics the connections use on Saturday. It’s a tough decision as they don’t want to let #3 Cyprus Moon get the lead on her own, but this one clearly has run her two best races from off of the pace.
#7 Miss Mandalay (10/1): Cuts back to a sprint after three failed routes in the U.S. Can’t blame them for making a change, but don’t see it working.

Looks like she fits in here just fine. I've seen tougher MSW races before. Will be interesting to see her run through the lane and gallop out.

GL Batt.

[JBEX]

aqu R5 #7 chief "liam" (12-1) (LM)
@ 2:09


like one of yesterday's ,the dam sire is liam's map.. 2yo msw sb debuter..trainer not good with debuters but that will get you a price..possibly true he's not cranking him up
first out today either but like some of the pedigree aspects with this one (besides the obvious)



.

[Madison]

aqu R5 #7 chief "liam" (12-1) (LM)
@ 2:09


like one of yesterday's ,the dam sire is liam's map.. 2yo msw sb debuter..trainer not good with debuters but that will get you a price..possibly true he's not cranking him up
first out today either but like some of the pedigree aspects with this one (besides the obvious)



.

Likely a sloppy mess, so??

[JBEX]

(LM) in gp R5..#10 widerthanamile (3-1)..big drop to bottom level mcl and irad rides first time .. probably well meant with him aboard..looks tough

[str]

aqu R5 #7 chief "liam" (12-1) (LM)
@ 2:09


like one of yesterday's ,the dam sire is liam's map.. 2yo msw sb debuter..trainer not good with debuters but that will get you a price..possibly true he's not cranking him up
first out today either but like some of the pedigree aspects with this one (besides the obvious)



.

One quick note with this.

If a trainer is not known to crank down on a firster, that does NOT mean the horse cannot win first out. Is the horse fit enough? Usually yes. It is the time and again hard drills that separate those trainers that do crank them up from those that do not.

Just wanted to point out the difference.

[str]

Likely a sloppy mess, so??

Liking a sloppy track or not comes down to the horses trust in the surface. If they are apprehensive with the footing they will take shorter strides, thus be slower than on a fast track.
If a horse has turf breeding in it's pedigree, that typically but not automatically gives them a much better chance to be comfortable with the mud/slop and therefore have a longer reach with each stride.

Hope that makes sense.

[str]

aqu R5 #7 chief "liam" (12-1) (LM)
@ 2:09


like one of yesterday's ,the dam sire is liam's map.. 2yo msw sb debuter..trainer not good with debuters but that will get you a price..possibly true he's not cranking him up
first out today either but like some of the pedigree aspects with this one (besides the obvious)



.

Interesting race. This one is worth watching to get a gauge on. Paid 380K for a 40k stud.

The one that I saw that I think is really cool is the 2 horse. A lightly bred horse who is by a 5k sire and sold for 100,000 . And look at the name : A Million Stories. That is a GREAT name. No doubt selling for that much there were indeed a million stories flying around the sales ring on this one. The gate work at Belmont has to be respected. Such a cool name. I always appreciate a name with a meaning.

[JBEX]

Likely a sloppy mess, so??

hasn't rained in about 12 hours but still should have figured it'd be an off track ..not sunny either which might have helped a bit..definitely lowers my opinion of his chances

[JBEX]

Interesting race. This one is worth watching to get a gauge on. Paid 380K for a 40k stud.

The one that I saw that I think is really cool is the 2 horse. A lightly bred horse who is by a 5k sire and sold for 100,000 . And look at the name : A Million Stories. That is a GREAT name. No doubt selling for that much there were indeed a million stories flying around the sales ring on this one. The gate work at Belmont has to be respected. Such a cool name. I always appreciate a name with a meaning.

also violence one of the better first out sires and as you said did cost a bundle ..part of the reason I liked him

yes the 2 did cost a lot relative to the fee and the work you mentioned is impressive..
sure the name also has to do with the sire and as you said could possibly be related to talk at the auction ..work you mentioned is impressive


.

[batt33]

Looks like she fits in here just fine. I've seen tougher MSW races before. Will be interesting to see her run through the lane and gallop out.

GL Batt.

Thanks STR! and yes I enjoy posting the video's....! Just interesting to see the "other side"

[batt33]

also violence one of the better first out sires and as you said did cost a bundle ..part of the reason I liked him

yes the 2 did cost a lot relative to the fee and the work you mentioned is impressive..
sure the name also has to do with the sire and as you said could possibly be related to talk at the auction ..work you mentioned is impressive


.

following!

[Madison]

Liking a sloppy track or not comes down to the horses trust in the surface. If they are apprehensive with the footing they will take shorter strides, thus be slower than on a fast track.
If a horse has turf breeding in it's pedigree, that typically but not automatically gives them a much better chance to be comfortable with the mud/slop and therefore have a longer reach with each stride.

Hope that makes sense.

Yes, but it seems with 2/3 yr olds who have never experienced this is much different than back history on more seasoned??

[str]

Yes, but it seems with 2/3 yr olds who have never experienced this is much different than back history on more seasoned??

Oh, it is for sure. Forget back history or seasoned. Let's just talk about handle the mud or not. Or, like it or not.

If a horse likes the mud albeit a baby or a 7 year old, they trust what their feet are feeling. And if they do not trust it , those short strides will equate to a horse that is slow. It's like you or me trying to walk on what we suspect might be black ice. Smaller steps and carrying your weight higher instead of in your legs. So experience isn't really that big a deal . They either trust it or they don't.

Remember, they have all galloped in it before in all probability. Maybe worked in it but even if not working, they have felt an off track before the races come into play and they either don't mind it, or hate it. And those that do not mind it at all are the ones we say love it.
Make sense?

[batt33]

[COLOR=rgba(77, 76, 76, 0.9)]Sweet Voyage Race Recap
[/COLOR]
Sweet Voyage was fifth this afternoon at Del Mar.
All things considered—the lay-off, the fact that we were hoping to run her at the maiden claiming level, and the sharp trip—it wasn’t a bad effort.
Sweet Voyage broke alertly, but did have to work hard from there to keep pace and was really out-footed entering the turn. She continued to respond to Tiago Pereira’s energetic encouragement, and tipped out when guided into the clear for more running room. The chestnut never fully leveled off, but showed some late interest and galloped out with decent energy.
She’ll have picked up some fitness from today’s run, and we also plan to consider adding blinkers for next time. Some class relief, added ground and potentially a circuit change are all options we’ll weigh for next time, but it was good to get Sweet Voyage back to the races today.

[JBEX]

hey str

interesting army mule going on sunday at gulfstream

R6 #3 be here now (6-1)
@ 2:45

obviously very talented but laying her off this long after the blowout win at ellis park ??
win 3 back as gritty as it gets factoring distance,running style :some speculation but maybe had something to do with non effort the following race..would seem well suited to today's distance off what she's done ..hasn't missed a beat in the morning going back to late august and running off a freshening isn't a problem

maybe like daddy this one has some soundness issues ..what's your overall take on her ?

[str]

hey str

interesting army mule going on sunday at gulfstream

R6 #3 be here now (6-1)
@ 2:45

obviously very talented but laying her off this long after the blowout win at ellis park ??
win 3 back as gritty as it gets factoring distance,running style :some speculation but maybe had something to do with non effort the following race..would seem well suited to today's distance off what she's done ..hasn't missed a beat in the morning going back to late august and running off a freshening isn't a problem

maybe like daddy this one has some soundness issues ..what's your overall take on her ?

She obviously hurt herself badly after that last race. A year is serious but it looks like it is all fine now. Plenty of works and this trainer seems to have them ready 1st time off away. So what happened? IDK, but I would not consider it at this point.
As you know, these AM's all seem to run and this one is no exception. Probably fit enough. Just don't know about a year off. Typically they might need a race to get back in the flow but there is not much typical about these AM's that run their eyeballs out every time.
If you think she can beat the others without worrying about the time off, and I would not, then go for it JBEX. That's my take.

Oh, and beaten 97 lengths?? Really? That might be a 1st for me. Are we sure it wasn't just 89? WTF? Was she in a photo with the harrows? A chart callers delight there. Lol.

[JBEX]

She obviously hurt herself badly after that last race. A year is serious but it looks like it is all fine now. Plenty of works and this trainer seems to have them ready 1st time off away. So what happened? IDK, but I would not consider it at this point.
As you know, these AM's all seem to run and this one is no exception. Probably fit enough. Just don't know about a year off. Typically they might need a race to get back in the flow but there is not much typical about these AM's that run their eyeballs out every time.
If you think she can beat the others without worrying about the time off, and I would not, then go for it JBEX. That's my take.

Oh, and beaten 97 lengths?? Really? That might be a 1st for me. Are we sure it wasn't just 89? WTF? Was she in a photo with the harrows? A chart callers delight there. Lol.

thanks str

yeah I thought you would feel he's most likely physically ok but whether he's good enough is a separate issue..that mile at gulfstream really impresses me and makes me think he might be something really good..more-so than the big length short field win at elp last out..more or less just like to see a another good army mule performer vs whether she's a good bet or not

was probably about 3/16th's away when the winner crossed the wire two back ..too bad it wasn't 100+ lengths back as would've been cool to see triple digits in that spot lol



.

[str]

thanks str

yeah I thought you would feel he's most likely physically ok but whether he's good enough is a separate issue..that mile at gulfstream really impresses me and makes me think he might be something really good..more-so than the big length short field win at elp last out..more or less just like to see a another good army mule performer vs whether she's a good bet or not

was probably about 3/16th's away when the winner crossed the wire two back ..too bad it wasn't 100+ lengths back as would've been cool to see triple digits in that spot lol



.

I see no reason why we won't see a solid effort.

With that much time, the trainer wants to be sure she is ready to give that type of effort. Would be unfair IMO to send her out knowing she was short. Can she lose? sure. But I don't think too much of that will be fitness if she does.
Maybe something similar to her first race?

[batt33]

I see no reason why we won't see a solid effort.

With that much time, the trainer wants to be sure she is ready to give that type of effort. Would be unfair IMO to send her out knowing she was short. Can she lose? sure. But I don't think too much of that will be fitness if she does.
Maybe something similar to her first race?

Sure has a steady work tab! I wonder why 7F instead of 6F.... without knowing the condition book.

[JBEX]

Sure has a steady work tab! I wonder why 7F instead of 6F.... without knowing the condition book.

I think the way she handled a mile twice including being up close both times makes 7f a good choice..at both tracks 1 turn more or less (believe elp is a chute onto the turn at that distance)



.

[str]

Sure has a steady work tab! I wonder why 7F instead of 6F.... without knowing the condition book.

Yeah, I don't know. Maybe he actually preferred 7/8ths.
She might be a bigger type horse that will be more comfortable going that extra 1/8th?

[batt33]

I think the way she handled a mile twice including being up close both times makes 7f a good choice..at both tracks 1 turn more or less (believe elp is a chute onto the turn at that distance)



.

Just looking at the workout tab.... before the issue most of the works were at 5 furlongs .. this time around only 2 albeit the last one was at 5. Doesn't mean she wont run well ... just something I noticed!

[batt33]

I like the "Army Mule" horse race 3 at Pleasanton #1 Valiant son 5/2 Won his last race while rating and has been working nicely since then.

[batt33]

I like the "Army Mule" horse race 3 at Pleasanton #1 Valiant son 5/2 Won his last race while rating and has been working nicely since then.

Broke a step slow... made a nice rally to finish second.