Fellow Americans - feeling cheated by the point devaluation?

[shari91]

Like clockwork you appear. You could keep posting irrelevant drivel or actually search my posts from when the Pro program was first introduced, 7 months before I started working here. I was saying the same thing then that I am now. If you're someone who actually gambles with money, then being a Pro is a great program. For those who choose not to become a Pro for various reasons, I respect and understand their decision not to. But that's not the discussion in here. It's about whether or not SBR has stuck it to Americans by wanting to make sure that one morning we don't wake up and find this site shut down because no one bothered to check to make sure that offering sportsbook cash to Americans was legal.

[Dirty Sanchez]

Personally I enjoy the sight and the bantering back and forth....it's the reason I joined. All of the other stuff, such as being a "Pro", is an added bonus. If it all went away I would still be here....and I'm not going to riot/protest because the US is getting screwed. Lou and the gang have always been fair to me, and I with them, and in the end that's what it's all about.

[shari91]

I won't be renewing, I used Betphoenix when I turned PRO and they're no longer on the list. I only use betjam and betislands and I'm not opening another book, furthermore who knows when the GOV puts the screws to online gambling for good, I'm sure its gonna be sooner rather than later. I think its gonna be real real real soon, but that's just my opinion.

Im with you on not opening any other accounts, Bet Jam is where I signed up pro last year, and is the only book I feel safe having $ in anymore. I re-loaded at Bet Jam today, but now that I read a little closer its probably not going to cut it as a pro renewal, so if not, no pro for me anymore, and no BTP this year either. later

Guys, please take a look at the post I just made in the Newbie Forum about the Pro renewal policy. You CAN use your original book even if they no longer are an SBR sponsor ie BetPho and BetJam. Provided of course you have $200 of cash deposits in there at the time you need to renew.

http://forum.sbrforum.com/newbie-for...l#post10739617

[gamemastere]

Plus if you understand how affiliate deals work you'd realise the silliness of your statement in fine print.

Wat shari means by this comment is that even if you decide not to renew your Pro status, your account is tagged to SBR and would continue to generate income based on your playings on that account for the life of that account.

You would have to stop playing on that account and actually start playing on an untagged SBR account before SBR would lose by you not renewing Pro membership.

[POTVINSUX]

SBR reminds me of parent who always spoils the younger kids (non-US Pros) and neglects the first born kid. US Pros is what made this site what it is now and at this point they feel very disrespected.

On point

[Roadtrip635]

What if someone does not have the $200 deposited in the original sportsbook they turned Pro with, but does have the requisite $200 in another book linked to SBR (signed up for a book through an SBR link for a tourney, contest, etc)? Would the member have to deposit into the original book or would the other sportsbook balance be sufficent to renew Pro status? What if the balance in the sportsbook is wholly or partially funded be free sportsbook cash (Not Freeplays) purchased through SBR, where the $200 minimum would not be met without the inclusion of the purchased free cash?

Is there a page or link to inform members on what is needed to maintain/renew Pro status? I ask because I haven't seen a FAQ or page that covers these questions and seems it might be helpful for some. My renewal date isn't until Dec., but info that covers many of these questions may be useful especially considering how many Pros renewal date is coming up next month.

[Grandmaster B]

Wat shari means by this comment is that even if you decide not to renew your Pro status, your account is tagged to SBR and would continue to generate income based on your playings on that account for the life of that account.

You would have to stop playing on that account and actually start playing on an untagged SBR account before SBR would lose by you not renewing Pro membership.

so SBR continues to make a % off the accts even if people dont renew?

WOW

[shari91]

What if someone does not have the $200 deposited in the original sportsbook they turned Pro with, but does have the requisite $200 in another book linked to SBR (signed up for a book through an SBR link for a tourney, contest, etc)? Would the member have to deposit into the original book or would the other sportsbook balance be sufficent to renew Pro status? What if the balance in the sportsbook is wholly or partially funded be free sportsbook cash (Not Freeplays) purchased through SBR, where the $200 minimum would not be met without the inclusion of the purchased free cash? Is there a page or link to inform members on what is needed to maintain/renew Pro status? I ask because I haven't seen a FAQ or page that covers these questions and seems it might be helpful for some. My renewal date isn't until Dec., but info that covers many of these questions may be useful especially considering how many Pros renewal date is coming up next month.

The renewal policy is in the link I provided right above your post but to answer your questions:

The $200 needs to be in the book you originally signed up with in order to be grandfathered in. If not, then the requirements are the same as if you were becoming a pro for the first time ie can't use sportsbook cash/freeplays towards your $200 requirement.

[Robust]

its free.. no lawyers needed.. its fvcken free!!!!!

now any other complaints anyone has can be directed to my ass

Robust

[stogies]

if you dont like it go post your crap some where else. is there a list of the charities some place that i can give money to and become a pro?

[stogies]

so SBR continues to make a % off the accts even if people dont renew?

WOW

glad to see that little brain of yours finally kicked in. now gtfo.

[shari91]

if you dont like it go post your crap some where else. is there a list of the charities some place that i can give money to and become a pro?

They're still finalising the details on that but we'll post them once we know. Thanks for reminding me though - I should add a note about that to my post.

[Roadtrip635]

Shari- That post you made about renewals should be stickied in PT instead of in the Newbie forum.

[stogies]

They're still finalising the details on that but we'll post them once we know. Thanks for reminding me though - I should add a note about that to my post.

thank you shari91.

[shari91]

Shari- That post you made about renewals should be stickied in PT instead of in the Newbie forum.

Yeah I agree. I had made it in response to questions in the Newbie Guide thread and had debated creating a separate thread about it as renewals are starting to come up now. But usually policy threads are started by Admin so I figured I'd just direct people who ask to my post for the time being as I had received the details from Lou so I know they're correct. I'll ask him when he logs on in the morning about just grabbing that post and making a separate thread.

[Doc JS]

Shari,

I think some of the frustration by US players about the sportsbook cash is that when we've asked for an update from Lou, SBR John, etc., all we get is "nothing new. We'll let you know when we have something."

Now, while that very well may be true...if feels like we're being stone-walled. It would be nice if we could get some idea of WHEN a decision would be reached. Now, I know lawyers bill by the hour. And sometimes the wheels of progress grind slowly. But if SBR could give us an idea of, at least, approximately when an announcment will be made, it would certainly be seen as a "good faith gesture".

I'm not a lawyer, but it seems pretty obvious to me that sportsbook cash either is or isn't against US laws and SBR either is or isn't at risk for offering sportsbook cash to US memebers. I'm sure SBR has good lawyers. It's been about 45 days since the "embargo" on sportsbook cash for US players went into effect. How long does it take SBR's good lawyers to come to a decision on what appears to be a straight forward question?

Doc

[gamemastere]

Originally Posted by SBR_John
In the meantime I will ask Sam to make more gift cards available like pre paid Mastercards and such. As most know we stopped allowing points transfers in the Service Plays forum because of lawsuits from scum...errr, touts,(my apologies) whom claim players are in essence buying the picks from SBR.The points program is a very simple concept but it also can be twisted to make it look like something it is not.

From the thread "SBR Store discontinuing sportsbook rewards" you mentioned back in may about making pre paid cards available to purchase in the SBR store. Has this been considered further for US SBRPro's.

[shari91]

Yeah Doc I hear you but how is anyone supposed to know when a decision will be made? It's been 29 business days since cash was taken down for Americans. Should the lawyer say to John "Ok pal, I've never dealt with this before because this situation has never existed but I realise a few of your posters want a decision by xxx day so I'll give you my recommendation by then regardless if I've even had the time to definitively come to a conclusion?" And you're right - you're not a lawyer and neither am I so who are we to think that we know how long an issue like this would take to sort out?

I think the problem is some people are assuming this is just a matter of saying "SBR's not a bank so they're not doing anything illegal". And to those people I'd say come show me your law degree, your evidence to back up that SBR could never get into trouble for this and your guarantee that if you're mistaken and they do get shut down, you're willing to face the repercussions for giving erroneous advice. If someone does that, then I'll merrily join in with the impatience and complaining.

Here's John's latest post about this a few minutes ago:

Some items like sportsbook cash for the US guys is just out of our control. We have a top name lawyer who concluded it could violate US law. We are trying to hire different law group to start at A and work through the entire concept and give us the best options.

[venice2222]

We should just blame Obama!

[Cap dat 4ss]

Lol... john doesnt like the answer this top notched attorney gave him so he's going to hire a new attorney, albeit not as good, and then take their advice. That makes sense.

[Grandmaster B]

glad to see that little brain of yours finally kicked in. now gtfo.

aww

looks like you'll have to beg for change now in front of the am pm in your town

[Extra Innings]

Not looking good for US based players, hasn't for the last (5) years. My position is any person/company that knowingly profits (whether that be by booking or collecting affiliate fees) from an illegal enterprise is guilty...including your run of the mill advertiser. Don't need a high paid lawyer to figure that one out.

[Extra Innings]

Not looking good for US based players, hasn't for the last (5) years. My position is any person/company that knowingly profits (whether that be by booking or collecting affiliate fees) from an illegal enterprise is guilty...including your run of the mill advertiser. Don't need a high paid lawyer to figure that one out.

The American contingent have suggested that the only fair remedy for US based PRO players is 18 points daily. Have your team PM my team if this sounds like something you would like to discuss further.

[Doc JS]

Yeah Doc I hear you but how is anyone supposed to know when a decision will be made? It's been 29 business days since cash was taken down for Americans. Should the lawyer say to John "Ok pal, I've never dealt with this before because this situation has never existed but I realise a few of your posters want a decision by xxx day so I'll give you my recommendation by then regardless if I've even had the time to definitively come to a conclusion?" And you're right - you're not a lawyer and neither am I so who are we to think that we know how long an issue like this would take to sort out?

C'mon Shari...no one is asking for an answer before it's ready. And I do understand how critical it is that SBR be on the right side of this issue least we log in one day to see the SBR has been taken over/shut down. I get it. I really do.

But seriously, you guys are paying top dollar for someone who has spent a month (29 business days) studying this and the best he (or she) can come up with is it "could (might) violate US law"? And now, you guys are changing lawyers? So, in effect, you're starting all over, right?

As far how long it should take...I do think that we should at least be able to get a ballpark figure on how long. You ask the lawyer how long and he says, I've to to research this, talk to people who specialize in this type of law, talk to the US DOJ, and I should have an answer in _________________ (four to six weeks, 3 month, a year). That's all I'm saying...

Doc

[Extra Innings]

C'mon Shari...no one is asking for an answer before it's ready. And I do understand how critical it is that SBR be on the right side of this issue least we log in one day to see the SBR has been taken over/shut down. I get it. I really do.

But seriously, you guys are paying top dollar for someone who has spent a month (29 business days) studying this and the best he (or she) can come up with is it "could (might) violate US law"? And now, you guys are changing lawyers? So, in effect, you're starting all over, right?

As far how long it should take...I do think that we should at least be able to get a ballpark figure on how long. You ask the lawyer how long and he says, I've to to research this, talk to people who specialize in this type of law, talk to the US DOJ, and I should have an answer in _________________ (four to six weeks, 3 month, a year). That's all I'm saying...

Doc

Doc...create a website that directs people how to order Schedule 2's without a prescription. You could get affiliate fees for each referral. Better yet, you could give the users of your site points to get those drugs from each website you use as a referral

[SpreadSniper]

I understand "why" U.S players can no longer receive/purchase certain things through the SBR store.... although it may suck, I understand WHY it had to be done... guys are whining as if this was done on purpose.

[Doc JS]

Doc...create a website that directs people how to order Schedule 2's without a prescription. You could get affiliate fees for each referral. Better yet, you could give the users of your site points to get those drugs from each website you use as a referral

EI, My goal every day is not to do anything that puts my medical liscense at risk...

[Extra Innings]

I understand "why" U.S players can no longer receive/purchase certain things through the SBR store.... although it may suck, I understand WHY it had to be done... guys are whining as if this was done on purpose.

I think a lot of people are whining about the process being fair and transparent. When the requirement is to up 200 dollars to a specific book it is no longer a free program. A lot of the benefit derived through this site requires one to be an SBR Pro...some US based players are looking for clarity/equity (they want to know what they are getting) before pulling the trigger.

[pavyracer]

Doc,

The lawyers in CR are not like what we have here in the US. Remember it's still an undeveloped third world country at the end of the day. A US lawyer works 7 days a week. You should be happy if the CR lawyer even works 2 days a week.

[Extra Innings]

Doc,

The lawyers in CR are not like what we have here in the US. Remember it's still an undeveloped third world country at the end of the day. A US lawyer works 7 days a week. You should be happy if the CR lawyer even works 2 days a week.

Gambling in the United States (outside NV) is illegal, it's that simple. I know the nuances of the 2006 law and the point system (specifically the idea of acquiring sportsbook $$$) circumvents it knowingly. Hate to shit on everybody's parade.

[shari91]

C'mon Shari...no one is asking for an answer before it's ready. And I do understand how critical it is that SBR be on the right side of this issue least we log in one day to see the SBR has been taken over/shut down. I get it. I really do. But seriously, you guys are paying top dollar for someone who has spent a month (29 business days) studying this and the best he (or she) can come up with is it "could (might) violate US law"? And now, you guys are changing lawyers? So, in effect, you're starting all over, right? As far how long it should take...I do think that we should at least be able to get a ballpark figure on how long. You ask the lawyer how long and he says, I've to to research this, talk to people who specialize in this type of law, talk to the US DOJ, and I should have an answer in _________________ (four to six weeks, 3 month, a year). That's all I'm saying... Doc

If you really think it's possible for a ballpark figure to be given, then honestly you should ask John and see if he has an idea. The fact that he said today "we are trying to hire a different law group" leads me to believe that this group hasn't been secured yet. So I'm not sure how it's possible to give an estimation of when that group, once enlisted, will come back with a recommendation. Especially since they'll know that Mr Hotshot lawyer already said he felt there could be trouble so if they're going to give the green light they better be damn sure they're right after another lawyer said differently. Plus John said this group would be starting at square one and working through the whole concept which leads me to believe that the group will be delving deeper than what the first lawyer did. Again though, I'm just trying to interpret what I see going on. I get no more info on this situation than what any other poster receives.

Maybe the best thing to do would be to start a thread and ask your question to up the chances of him seeing it?

[Doc JS]

Doc,

The lawyers in CR are not like what we have here in the US. Remember it's still an undeveloped third world country at the end of the day. A US lawyer works 7 days a week. You should be happy if the CR lawyer even works 2 days a week.

Pavy,
I will defer to those who know a lot more about this sort of thing than I do!

[Extra Innings]

Do you realize how many millions of dollars SBR would have to spend to answer charges levied by the DOJ

[shari91]

Ideally it'd be nice if there was a tradeoff for everyone. US posters don't have sportsbook cash or free plays right now. Non US posters have never been able to access pizza and most gift cards and have to pay duty on electronic purchases yet didn't have anything extra added in the store to compensate. The fact that non US posters still have sportsbook cash is irrelevant as they've always had it. So I'm not sure how SBR would figure out how to level the playing field until/if cash comes back as the field has always been uneven.

[onetrickpony]

Ideally it'd be nice if there was a tradeoff for everyone. US posters don't have sportsbook cash or free plays right now. Non US posters have never been able to access pizza and most gift cards and have to pay duty on electronic purchases yet didn't have anything extra added in the store to compensate. The fact that non US posters still have sportsbook cash is irrelevant as they've always had it. So I'm not sure how SBR would figure out how to level the playing field until/if cash comes back as the field has always been uneven.

lower prices on all items for us