No more black quarterbacks?

[poochiecollins]

vick in the nfl has performed worse than Tim Couch do you think the browns should start Couch over their young guy Colt McCoy?

False, unless you're figuring Vick's injuries and suspensions. Running stats don't stop mattering because a player's not a running back.

[poochiecollins]

I think it's important to look past the current trend and ask the question: why are more whites playing baseball than blacks? or why are more whites quarterback than blacks? Anytime you connect race to a sport or position within a sport, I'd argue that there are underlying cultural, economic, educational, and historical biases that account for the majority of racial gaps in sports. For example, if you just look at the NBA and say Blacks are better ballplayers, you are ignoring huge factors that contribute to these trends. It's too easy to say blacks at this and whites are better at that...but the differences aren't so much ethnic based as they are societal. Just my two sense.

Factors like that blacks are taller, stronger and faster on average than whites? I used to play basketball regularly, with many different courts and crowd types; blacks are more talented basketball players. Whites usually close the gap some by playing more intelligently, which is then largely factored out when a coach is involved.

[poochiecollins]

Mobility is highly over rated as a QB skill.

How is QB mobility highly overrated if a lot of people trash it?

[poochiecollins]

Now, being Mexican, I bring up the subject of culture, because through whatever millieu of Americanization that I may have been introduced to, I can say that I find myself to always be annoyed with the culture that I was made fun of for not accepting or "being apart of" when I was a child. I've seen the shunning of education in all its forms when being called a white boy as I excelled in school. It always appeared to be a forced manner of deference in terms of being a Latino.

Could you elaborate?

[Joe_Shabadoo]

Could you elaborate?

Certainly.

Attempting to educate oneself beyond the absolute bare minimum was largely seen by the younger demographic of other hispanics in my neighborhood and school as an attempt at being a bitch-ass white boy, to put it colloquially.

[Prey]

apes run n catch em, the humans throw em

[C-Gold]

c-gold, why did you write 4 paragraphs about jason cambell. jason cambell is maybe the most garbage QB in the league right now. this is not because he's black. its because he sucks. nobody liked him or thought he was good. im a skins fan. if you are trying to make a valid point you should talk about the respectable black qbs.

I spent the better part of the last 5 years saying that. I didn't just say " Jason Campbell sucks", I broke down exactly why he sucks with excruciating detail. People disagreed with me until the bitter end. Jason was always a decent enough above average quarterback that was "unlucky" to have somebody else mess up for him... ALL EXCUSES.

You ever listen to sportstalk 980?

(Racist black) Doc Walker was in love with Campbell and still defends him. John Thompson, Brian Mitchell and plenty of others defended him. Every black caller on any radio show defended him. White Redskins fans defended him until they'd say " He's a nice guy but..." (He sucks).

There are and were respectable black QB's.
Warren Moon
Randall Cunningham
Steve Mcnair
Donovan Mcnabb
I still think a mobile running yet sub par passing Vince Young could have a decent future too.

The rest though? I still see guys like (black) Jamie Dukes saying that Tavaras Jackson should start over Favre... They said the same shit last year and Favre had one of his best years ever. What if some stupid ass white announcer said that Rex Grossman should start over Donovan Mcnabb?

Every time you watch a game with (racist black) Soloman Wilcotts calling a game you see it. He's part of the shitty crew that gets the worst teams in the NFL by the way... The Oakland Raiders, Buffalo Bills, Cleveland Browns type games. So who'se playing in these games? A lot of shitty black quarterbacks and he's ALWAYS talking about how mobile these guys are and how they ADDS something.... Ahhhh sorry Soloman... It's great and all that Senecca Wallace can pick up rushing yards, but if any personel guy tried to make him a franchise QB they'd get axed the following day.

Oh and if you want to see Racism, just watch Shannon Sharpe do highlights.

A white safety intercepts a pass and is running it back for a touchdown... "geez, it's taking forever, he's slow"

What if all the white guys doing highlights said... " Geez this Jamarcus Russel guy is dumb as shit"?

But that's the PC world we live in. If you are black and better than somebody at something it's true... If an Asian, White, Hispanic or anybody else person does something better than a black person it's not true, it's "racist". Black students are on average taller than Asian students... FACT. Asian students on average score higher than black students on standardized tests... That's not a fact... that's ra ra ra racist!

I'm not saying black people can't play QB or anything like that, it's been proven before with guys like Warren Moon. I'm just saying there is a double standard but we already knew that.

[dante1]

Why are people obsessed by this question? I can only think of one reason.

[C-Gold]

Icancount2one

The other, much bigger deal, I think, is that black QBs seem much more likely to get benched based on poor performance. TJax or VY struggle? Let's get some washed up white dude out of the attic ASAP. Sanchez or Matt Ryan struggle? It's part of the normal QB progression. The instant a black dude plays a bad game, the conversation about replacing him starts. I'm sure in the collegiate and HS level where fans have less input it goes even quicker than that.

The only physical racial differences I am aware of are in bone structure and density. The vast cultural differences and overlap in almost all skill sets mean you should deal with every individual person on a case by case basis, and I'm sure there are great black QB talents out there, but they were probably socialized into playing point guard in the NBA instead.
________________________________________ ___________


Really?Did you see Tavaras Jackson play?He had a super bowl contending team and the guy was freaking horrible.There is no freaking way he would have threw 33 TD-7 INT that Favre did last year. Not a chance in hell that he will EVER have a season that well.T-Jack would have 5 INT games and would struggle to even get 1st downs. He's freaking horrible and was replaced by arguably the best QB everand you want to say that race was a factor? How about the fact that he sucked and probably always will suck?The guy has poor fundamentals and couldn't start at QB over Matt Jones at Arkansas so he transfered to a D1AA team and didn't even light it up there. Brad Childress ( idiot) took a flier on him because he thought he could coach him up... actually the whole point of this thread and took him in round 2 when most people saw him as a 5th rounder. T-Jack is a poor poor example.

VY has been a bottom 5 passer in the league as a starter and was replaced by a QB with super bowl experience. Kerry Collins is a guy that has won in the league, been to the super bowl, and is a much better passer than VY. Isn't the main point of QB passing and not picking up rushing yards? Didn't the Titans go 13-3 under Kerry? Trust me, Jeff Fisher is NOT racist and Jeff Fisher knows what he is doing. That's another poor example.

So what are you going to say now. Jack Del Rio was racist for cutting a lazy Byron Leftwich and replacing him with a harder working black QB?

Silly argument.

[DwightShrute]

Blacks make better basketball players! wait that's racist to whites

nevermind

[icancount2one]

Icancount2one

The other, much bigger deal, I think, is that black QBs seem much more likely to get benched based on poor performance. TJax or VY struggle? Let's get some washed up white dude out of the attic ASAP. Sanchez or Matt Ryan struggle? It's part of the normal QB progression. The instant a black dude plays a bad game, the conversation about replacing him starts. I'm sure in the collegiate and HS level where fans have less input it goes even quicker than that.

The only physical racial differences I am aware of are in bone structure and density. The vast cultural differences and overlap in almost all skill sets mean you should deal with every individual person on a case by case basis, and I'm sure there are great black QB talents out there, but they were probably socialized into playing point guard in the NBA instead.
________________________________________ ___________


Really?Did you see Tavaras Jackson play?He had a super bowl contending team and the guy was freaking horrible.There is no freaking way he would have threw 33 TD-7 INT that Favre did last year. Not a chance in hell that he will EVER have a season that well.T-Jack would have 5 INT games and would struggle to even get 1st downs. He's freaking horrible and was replaced by arguably the best QB everand you want to say that race was a factor? How about the fact that he sucked and probably always will suck?The guy has poor fundamentals and couldn't start at QB over Matt Jones at Arkansas so he transfered to a D1AA team and didn't even light it up there. Brad Childress ( idiot) took a flier on him because he thought he could coach him up... actually the whole point of this thread and took him in round 2 when most people saw him as a 5th rounder. T-Jack is a poor poor example.

VY has been a bottom 5 passer in the league as a starter and was replaced by a QB with super bowl experience. Kerry Collins is a guy that has won in the league, been to the super bowl, and is a much better passer than VY. Isn't the main point of QB passing and not picking up rushing yards? Didn't the Titans go 13-3 under Kerry? Trust me, Jeff Fisher is NOT racist and Jeff Fisher knows what he is doing. That's another poor example.

So what are you going to say now. Jack Del Rio was racist for cutting a lazy Byron Leftwich and replacing him with a harder working black QB?

Silly argument.

My point about T-Jax was not regarding replacing him with Favre (which I thought was a bad move at the time, Favre is playing this year like I thought he would last year) it's about when they replaced him with Frerotte and Frerotte didn't exactly dazzle either, putting up nearly identical numbers, but the fans wanted to keep him in there. I can understand drafting a QB or giving a legend like Favre a shot (although they overpaid him), but using Frerotte when all it did was screw up continuity and hurt T-Jax's confidence was boneheaded.

Vince Young has been the QB of the Titans for deep postseason runs (I thought they should have gone deeper when the refs gave the game to the ravens). The Titans D hadn't figured out how to get by without Haynesworth, and the offense suffered from time of possession problems. VY was still too young to bench for as long as they benched him. Then the inconsistent Collins went back to his old ways, and they gave away their whole season on the old man. VY turned them around just as dramatically as Collins the year before, and if that'd been young Jake Plummer or Jeff Garcia, they would have said "there're some bumps in the road but he's our guy" and the rushing numbers would be brought up in every statline instead of disregarded.

I also haven't mentioned McNabb. I was in favor of the trade this off season, but people forget about all the great games he had, how many times he had highlight performances against Dallas, and the time he played on a broken ankle. A LOT of fans talk about McNabb, and have always talked about him, like he was JaMarcus Russell.

David Garrard and Carson Palmer have had mediocre careers and are stinking it up this year, but who hit the bench first? Which one has had his career proclaimed over by most of the NFL fanbase?

And just so you know, I'm a PSU fan (even though I don't follow college ball that closely) and rooted for Kerry when he was in, but it was no surprise when he regressed.

The bottom line is black QBs have much shorter leashes than their white counterparts.

[freelee]

c-gold, why did you write 4 paragraphs about jason cambell. jason cambell is maybe the most garbage QB in the league right now. this is not because he's black. its because he sucks. nobody liked him or thought he was good. im a skins fan. if you are trying to make a valid point you should talk about the respectable black qbs.

besides mcnabb who else is there?

[freelee]

Blacks are faster, so they should absolutely use their leg speed some. You might have noticed how VY and Vick have had oddly high winning percentages in respect to how well they throw? The ONLY problem with a running QB is that they'll get injured more. I hypothesize that this could be largely fixed with regular, timely sliding.

vick has won only one playoff game the same as Romo and vince young has never won a playoff game even tho his team is so talented they almost made the superbowl with Kerry Collins starting

[freelee]

My point about T-Jax was not regarding replacing him with Favre (which I thought was a bad move at the time, Favre is playing this year like I thought he would last year) it's about when they replaced him with Frerotte and Frerotte didn't exactly dazzle either, putting up nearly identical numbers, but the fans wanted to keep him in there. I can understand drafting a QB or giving a legend like Favre a shot (although they overpaid him), but using Frerotte when all it did was screw up continuity and hurt T-Jax's confidence was boneheaded.

Vince Young has been the QB of the Titans for deep postseason runs (I thought they should have gone deeper when the refs gave the game to the ravens). The Titans D hadn't figured out how to get by without Haynesworth, and the offense suffered from time of possession problems. VY was still too young to bench for as long as they benched him. Then the inconsistent Collins went back to his old ways, and they gave away their whole season on the old man. VY turned them around just as dramatically as Collins the year before, and if that'd been young Jake Plummer or Jeff Garcia, they would have said "there're some bumps in the road but he's our guy" and the rushing numbers would be brought up in every statline instead of disregarded.

I also haven't mentioned McNabb. I was in favor of the trade this off season, but people forget about all the great games he had, how many times he had highlight performances against Dallas, and the time he played on a broken ankle. A LOT of fans talk about McNabb, and have always talked about him, like he was JaMarcus Russell.

David Garrard and Carson Palmer have had mediocre careers and are stinking it up this year, but who hit the bench first? Which one has had his career proclaimed over by most of the NFL fanbase?

And just so you know, I'm a PSU fan (even though I don't follow college ball that closely) and rooted for Kerry when he was in, but it was no surprise when he regressed.

The bottom line is black QBs have much shorter leashes than their white counterparts.

What are you talking about Vince Young has never won a single playoff game his career in the postseason is 0-1 with a 17-6 loss in which he threw for 130 yards and ran for 12 with 0 touchdowns and 1 interception.

[poochiecollins]

vick has won only one playoff game the same as Romo and vince young has never won a playoff game even tho his team is so talented they almost made the superbowl with Kerry Collins starting

This doesn't refute what I said. Vick was known to play on mostly mediocre teams, and I knew of handicap angles on Young that showed him historically to be good as an underdog and bad as a favorite (this might have changed recently).

[pavyracer]

After watching the Oregon - UCLA game I think the black QB of Oregon is better than the white QB of UCLA.

[freelee]

After watching the Oregon - UCLA game I think the black QB of Oregon is better than the white QB of UCLA.

yeah and Steve Nash is better than smush parker what's your point?

[Robber]

vick is coming back

they dont win a lot of super bowls but they can do ok

[freelee]

vick is coming back

they dont win a lot of super bowls but they can do ok

After how well Kolb played i can't wait to see vick back as starter it should be hilarious no way can he match what the kid has been doing

[freelee]

Unbelievable troy smith is announced as the starter for the 49ers this weekend and their still the favorite bet the house on DENVER very few guarantees in the NFL but this is one of them.

[Glitch]

besides mcnabb who else is there?

we'll have josh freeman developed in a year or two.

and perhaps opportunity is a factor here. being (as jimmy the greek so sacrificially pointed out) superior athletes, maybe they get assigned to other positions more readily. maybe there is preferential treatment even on the lower levels as far as highschool and college given to "european americans" in that captain/QB position.

like because you guys wanna just talk numbers- we can also state that there are more sh*tty white quarterbacks in the league than black ones but that is also obviously because there are just way more of them. like there arent many good black ones because there are way less of them.

[Dad]

49ers are starting a black QB this weekend.

[nobs]

Wow I start a thread saying Black girls are hot and it gets moved to Private Zone in 3 minutes. This guy starts an at least somewhat racist thread and it stays in players talk.

I dont understand that, but I guess SBR has their reasons.

[freelee]

we'll have josh freeman developed in a year or two.

and perhaps opportunity is a factor here. being (as jimmy the greek so sacrificially pointed out) superior athletes, maybe they get assigned to other positions more readily. maybe there is preferential treatment even on the lower levels as far as highschool and college given to "european americans" in that captain/QB position.

like because you guys wanna just talk numbers- we can also state that there are more sh*tty white quarterbacks in the league than black ones but that is also obviously because there are just way more of them. like there arent many good black ones because there are way less of them.

you might be on to something i think this could be the same reason there aren't a lot of elite white running backs

[freelee]

49ers are starting a black QB this weekend.

I know i can't wait it should be hilarious

[freelee]

we'll have josh freeman developed in a year or two.

and perhaps opportunity is a factor here. being (as jimmy the greek so sacrificially pointed out) superior athletes, maybe they get assigned to other positions more readily. maybe there is preferential treatment even on the lower levels as far as highschool and college given to "european americans" in that captain/QB position.

like because you guys wanna just talk numbers- we can also state that there are more sh*tty white quarterbacks in the league than black ones but that is also obviously because there are just way more of them. like there arent many good black ones because there are way less of them.

i'd like you to list these good black quarterbacks because i don't think they exist

[stealthyburrito]

49ers are starting a black QB this weekend.

troy deserves his shot, hope he has some success for the 49ers.

[The Bet Master]

Troy Smith really hasn't had a shot until now. We'll see how he does.

[freelee]

Troy Smith really hasn't had a shot until now. We'll see how he does.

he started a few in baltimore for awhile and there's a reason he hasn't got another shot until now

[Joe_Shabadoo]

he started a few in baltimore for awhile and there's a reason he hasn't got another shot until now

Because of his genes, right?

[freelee]

Because of his genes, right?

I'll be honest he played better than i thought but i felt he was a little lucky especially with that throw to Delanie Walker we'll see how he does next week

[cant call it]

prolly will suck it up

[Socrates]

Your stats are wrong. Jim Plunkett is Mexican and won a Superbowl.

Time for a minor stat adjustment. Just saying. lol

[freelee]

Your stats are wrong. Jim Plunkett is Mexican and won a Superbowl.

Time for a minor stat adjustment. Just saying. lol

he had some irish and german in him which obviously was enough to get those Superbowl wins

[Robber]

the most sought after free agent in the offseason will be a black quarterback

time to let it go