based on everything ive read and heard the last 24 hrs, my best guess is that this was a murder-suicide. he felt there was nowhere to go. looks like they were both in their 50's. unbelievable.
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It is a matter of public record, but every jurisdiction handles things like this differetly. I do agree with you. This is just too big of a deal to be considered a hoax. Now the circumstances surrounding their deaths is a whole other ball game. I am not buying any theory at this point because there simply is not enough evidence to convince me one way or the other. The suicide theory has all kinds of circumstances that could be considered "odd", but certainly not impossible. We all know that we can not rule out the possibility of a "hit". Aparently this guy was in real deep, either owing money, or rating someone else out. I need more evidence to make an educated judgement, and I think anyone else who is, or was in the legal field would agree.Comment -
Booking operations are small time for feds, they aint no witness protection program for this.Comment -
Typically this is the case, but not always. He could just be a very important informant that they need to protect, but will never need him to testify, and will only use him to give info. Also, many investigations take YEARS, so they might just need to keep him safe while they build their case and wanted to fake his death instead of just having him disappear. Just disappearing would be a clear cut case of witness protection and might hinder an investigation.Originally posted by BigdaddyQH
The one thing i can say for sure is that something doesn't seem right and that usually means there is more to the story.Comment -
I agree. If it were a big deal for the Feds, they would have shut down just about every off shore book out there. The Feds use booking operations as probable cause to go after people. That is the extent of their interest in such operations. If I want you on a murder charge, but do not have enough evidence to arrest you, but I do have a case for larceny, I book you on the larceny charge and go from there. It is a common law enforcement practice.Originally posted by jjgoldComment -
As you can imagine this is a terrible time for our family. I have lost my beautiful mother and my close friend and stepfather Ken.
I just want to come on EOG to confirm the loss. Ken and my mother have passed away. They took their own lives sometime late Wednesday night or early Thursday morning with sleeping pills carbon monoxide...
I want to let all of you know that he loved EOG and the posters...it was his passion. He mention this in a note he left for me and wanted to say he was sorry for leaving you all...mostly Mo, Blondie, Ball, and Jimmy who worked so hard to keep EOG rolling. I am at his desk...crying my eyes out as I type..
They left no reason for what they did thou I have my own ideas....I am just very sad and my heart is broken...I lost my best friend of the last 40+ years and the greatest mom a fellas could have....my heart is truely broken. If there is a heaven I know my mom is there planting flowers and waiting on her family to arrive one day....Ken's family...by brother, our wives and their heartbroken grandchildren will celebrate their lives on Tuesday.
I know that there has been a lot of rumors flying around and I must admit I was worried this past week that something horrible had happened and my gut was right. I just wanted to come on and share with the folks at EOG what is the only truth in this terrible day....THE SHRINK and my mother are dead..
Thanks for all the good times EOGers...!!
And those who love to to be cruel and run them down...find a new big bad wolf..Comment -
okay, if you want to go with the no witness protection route....
we will go with...help the feds, who in return help you cover up or make up what needs to be and you move wherever it is you think you will be safest without any "protection"... the idea of them being out of the country on an island or some shit is much more believable than a double suicide...thats all im sayin...i didnt know them, so in all honesty, it doesnt matter to me. i just really dont think that woman would kill herself and leave her kids and grandkids. if shrink fukked up so bad he was gonna kill himself, she had plenty of people to live with or take care of her or whatever...didnt seem like the kind of woman to kill herselfComment -
a lot of people on different sites who know his wife personally or have met her a few times are saying they dont believe for a second that she agreed to commit suicide. if thats the case, then we have a big-time gambler who might have been a degenerate gambler who was good at capping but not at managing money (i'm just guessing based on generalizations about gamblers) who killed his wife and then killed himself just 2 to 4 days after supposedly losing 500K on the ncaa championship gm between duke and butler. this story is highly believable, is it not?Comment -
Lots of crimes go hand in hand with book making including money laundering and using the profits to fund other illegal activities.Originally posted by jjgold
And there is absolutely witness protection for bookmaking.
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what i'm asking is: other than being a pioneer in the sports gaming message boards, what makes or made this gentleman any different than 98% of gamblers who lose long term? maybe this guy just lost BIGGER than everyone else and took his life after the last huge bet because he saw no other way out. i bet (no pun intended) that gamblers commit suicide on a much higher percentage than the avg personComment -
the guy in the story is in the witness protection program yet theyre giving his name and his age, even if they're fake names and ages, why give them out? going into the witness protection means you are protected, not that you have to fake a death to stay alive. it is more believable that The Shrink staged his own death to go and hide in a remote location and avoid paying debts than he was put in WPPOriginally posted by MastaBComment -
The witness protection theory makes no sense. The Feds would not waste their time on him. He was small potatoes. Trust me on this. Has there been any more arrests? Has any big name person gone down? So far, all I hae seen is a bunch of small time wanna be's getting busted for a money laundering scam. Now if there is some earth shaking news that is about to break (being in California, I really should not use that saying), then I could see your point. But this was a nothing. It may have been a big deal to him, but that would just give more credability to the suicide theory. Did you know the man at all? From what I knew of him, and from what many others who knew him well are saying, he is not the type to just drop out of sight. He is more of the type to do something rash, if he felt that it would actually help his family in the long run.Comment -
and thats the bottom line because raydog said soOriginally posted by raydogComment -
Originally posted by BigdaddyQH
he touched more money than alot of people will in their entire lifetimeComment -
excellent questionOriginally posted by hoopster42Comment -
+1Originally posted by Grandmaster B
he touched more money than alot of people will in their entire lifetime
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I have no idea who these people are, but
after a little internet research I came up with this article:
EOG.com Founder Ken Weitzner Commits Suicide
"I just want to come on EOG to confirm the lose. Ken and my mother have passed away. They took their own lives sometime late Wednesday night or early Thursday morning with sleeping pills carbon monoxide."
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Originally posted by raydog
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JJ, can you or someone else in the know please answer this question?Originally posted by hoopster42Comment -
Connections, People and Things that he knows aboutOriginally posted by hoopster42Comment -
he is different because he touched more money than 100% of the people you knowOriginally posted by hoopster42Comment -
Shrink had more offshore contacts than anyone in the business. He was invited to Las Vegas handicapping contests. He wasn't an ordinary gambler.Comment -
was the guy a long-term betting WINNER or LOSER? can anyone vouch for his ASSETS besides the house, the car, and forumComment -
That is a crock. I know people who deal with more money in a year than he did in his lifetime. Stop your dreaming. He was small potatoes. And by the way, if you really must know who the victims are that were found by the Chesapeake Va. Police at approximately 10 am on Saturday, all yo have to do is call them. They were able to I.D. the bodies. They were told that it was a suicide by the caller, but listed "other" as a possible cause of death.Originally posted by Grandmaster B
I just love how you guys that know absolutely noting about gaming come on with all of your alleged knowledge. Grandmaster, you know absolutely about the workings of books, casinos, and the law. You have never been involved in anything that comes close to an operation. Stick to your $5.00 wagers and can the rumors that you and others love to spread. Believe what you like, but do not spew nonsense like the above mentioned post in here.Comment -
Aparently he blew his fortune. At one time, his net worth was over 2 million, which is still small potatoes when talking about big time gamblers, but big enough to get the attention of the smaller offshore books. If he did blow his fortune on gaming, and was deeply in debt, how good of a gambler was he?Originally posted by raiders72002Comment -
He was a good handicapper but a bad gambler evident by his $500,000 bet on a championship game betting the square side.Originally posted by BigdaddyQHComment -
understand this...everything you do with money over $10,000 in a single day is reported to the feds because of the patriot actOriginally posted by hoopster42
now ponder over this question...for a guy like the shrink...think of everything he could be involved in (guy founded 2 count em 2 offshore betting forums and thats just for starters)...being in the game DEEP for a long period of time...is it possible he was moving some serious coin?
its not about assets....its about how much money you move....and how much money you receive...in _____ amount of time
if it comes out officially sometime soon....its a sad story....RIP
Calvyn Ayre wont step foot on US Soil...am I comparing Calvyn to the Shrink?...nah
Shrink was living in the United States?...intersting about his last post as well
he never signed his posts "Ken" at the bottom...not that ive seen in the last 13 years (how long ive been betting offshore)...if someone tried to edit it after noticing they ****ed up it would show that the post was edited correct?...vbulletin forums always show "edited by" regardless if its a admin/mod or not...unless administrators have a option to ghost edit...ive been on alot of vbulletin forums and ive never seen it done
leaving the post intact was the only option because editing it would question the validity of shrinks now infamous "last post"
again these are just my views on the whole thing...why wouldnt a obituary be posted in the local newspaper mentioning "survived by?"
either way you slice it though they arent coming back so RIPComment -
wow you must have pull like Ice-T on law and order svu...you're privy to information the press cant getOriginally posted by BigdaddyQH
can you Call Obama on the red phone later tonight and ask him who he likes in the SF vs PITT game?
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I have enough pull and experience to recognize someone who is talking out of his hat, and that is exactly what you are doing. Like I said, just make a phone call to the Chesapeake Va. Authorities and find out for yourself. It can not be any easier than that.Originally posted by Grandmaster Bwow you must have pull like Ice-T on law and order svu...you're privy to information the press cant get
can you Call Obama on the red phone later tonight and ask him who he likes in the SF vs PITT game? Comment -
If a death certificate has been made, it is public record.Originally posted by Grandmaster Bwow you must have pull like Ice-T on law and order svu...you're privy to information the press cant get can you Call Obama on the red phone later tonight and ask him who he likes in the SF vs PITT game? Comment -
umm...just re read your postOriginally posted by BigdaddyQH
its odd to me since you're surrounded by tycoons why are you posting on SBR forum today?...taking a break from the sun in the bahamas and thought you might take the time out of your lavish lifestyle to post on a internet forum?
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Originally posted by BigdaddyQH
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we're talking about a piece of paper here that someone typed up correct?Originally posted by ClipCanComment -
You are so ignorant that you will not accpet what anyone says if it does not agree with your point of view. This has been a theme in all of your posts. As far as what I do, that is really none of your business. Suffice it to say that I have more money that you will ever see. Here is somethng else that you can not believe:
That is the obit that appeared in today's Virginia paper.
Your ignorance is overwhelming. I guess you are too chicken to make the call and find out that you are wrong, again, as usual.Comment -
is it a open casket funeral?...since you have all the informationOriginally posted by BigdaddyQHYou are so ignorant that you will not accpet what anyone says if it does not agree with your point of view. This has been a theme in all of your posts. As far as what I do, that is really none of your business. Suffice it to say that I have more money that you will ever see. Here is somethng else that you can not believe:
That is the obit that appeared in today's Virginia paper.
Your ignorance is overwhelming. I guess you are too chicken to make the call and find out that you are wrong, again, as usual.Comment
