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  • wtf
    SBR Posting Legend
    • 08-22-08
    • 12983

    #1
    still bullish on stocks? read this
    Stocks May Be Destined to Drop Below March’s Lows: Chart of Day
    Share | Email | Print | A A A

    By David Wilson

    June 22 (Bloomberg) -- U.S. and European stocks are destined to fall below March’s lows if bear-market history is any guide, according to Jim Reid, a strategist at Deutsche Bank AG.

    Share prices tend to hit bottom “at extremely cheap levels” relative to earnings during so-called secular bear markets, Reid wrote five days ago in his first equity strategy report. Secular bears consist of multiple rallies and declines, with each slump producing lower valuations than the prior one.

    The CHART OF THE DAY shows the Standard & Poor’s 500 Index’s price-earnings ratio since 1900, based on data compiled by Yale University’s Robert Shiller and cited in Reid’s report.

    Shiller calculated the P/E ratio at 6.6 in September 1982, just before the 1980s bull market started. The gauge sank to less than six in the depths of the Great Depression and at the beginning of the 1920s. This year, it has stayed above 13.

    “History tells us that at some point in the next decade there will be much more stressed valuations than today and a once-in-a-generation buying opportunity,” wrote Reid, who previously focused on credit-market strategy.

    Even “a large rally” later this year and into 2010 may not be enough to prevent this scenario from unfolding, he added. The S&P 500 has climbed as much as 40 percent from its March 9 lows. Reid’s European benchmark, a local-currency version of the MSCI Europe Index, has risen as much as 33 percen
  • Chi_archie
    SBR Aristocracy
    • 07-22-08
    • 63183

    #2
    good info, heard/read similar prognostications from some other sources. Fake rally right now, won't last
    Comment
    • wtf
      SBR Posting Legend
      • 08-22-08
      • 12983

      #3
      i bailed out a month ago, not the peak but darn close

      will wait to get back in, another chance will beckon soon
      Comment
      • pico
        BARRELED IN @ SBR!
        • 04-05-07
        • 27321

        #4
        shiller is famous mr doom. i think market usually double bottom, but every recession is different.
        Comment
        • KingRevolver
          SBR Hall of Famer
          • 06-05-09
          • 5293

          #5
          Thanks for this.
          Comment
          • MonkeyF0cker
            SBR Posting Legend
            • 06-12-07
            • 12144

            #6
            Worthless article. A bit like saying the Twins have won on every fourth Tuesday of the month this season so bet on the Twins tomorrow!!!
            Comment
            • tacomax
              SBR Hall of Famer
              • 08-10-05
              • 9619

              #7
              Originally posted by MonkeyF0cker
              Worthless article. A bit like saying the Twins have won on every fourth Tuesday of the month this season so bet on the Twins tomorrow!!!
              Thanks. I got them at +108. Can't see that losing.
              Originally posted by pags11
              SBR would never get rid of me...ever...
              Originally posted by BuddyBear
              I'd probably most likely chose Pags to jack off too.
              Originally posted by curious
              taco is not a troll, he is a bubonic plague bacteria.
              Comment
              • andywend
                SBR MVP
                • 05-20-07
                • 4805

                #8
                What possible catalyst exists for the stock market to go up in either 2009 or 2010?

                The entire federal government is controlled by the democratic party whose platform consists of:

                1. Supporting higher corporate tax rates on big business having a NEGATIVE impact on earnings.
                2. Supporting labor unions which increases the cost of labor having a NEGATIVE impact on earnings.
                3. Supporting trial lawyers which increases ligitation against these companies having a NEGATIVE impact on earnings.

                When you combine the above with Obama's desire to socialize as much of the country as he possibly can, it spells bad times ahead for the financial markets.

                While the markets have done well over the past several months, its important to note that Obama has flooded the financial markets with TRILLIONS of dollars in federal government aid via bailouts. However, we all know this can't continue on a permanent basis and when the government trough runs dry, the market is going to go straight down.

                I don't think anyone will disagree about democrats favoring higher corporate taxes, labor unions and trial lawyers and I can't imagine even the greatest liberal spin machine coming up with a convincing argument that higher taxes, unions and trial lawyers are GOOD for business.

                Democrats are BAD FOR BUSINESS, plain and simple.
                Comment
                • tacomax
                  SBR Hall of Famer
                  • 08-10-05
                  • 9619

                  #9
                  Originally posted by andywend
                  Democrats are BAD FOR BUSINESS, plain and simple.
                  Good for share prices, though. Funny, eh?


                  Originally posted by pags11
                  SBR would never get rid of me...ever...
                  Originally posted by BuddyBear
                  I'd probably most likely chose Pags to jack off too.
                  Originally posted by curious
                  taco is not a troll, he is a bubonic plague bacteria.
                  Comment
                  • jjgold
                    SBR Aristocracy
                    • 07-20-05
                    • 388208

                    #10
                    The market is in serious trouble as is the economy

                    I would short stocks
                    Comment
                    • wtf
                      SBR Posting Legend
                      • 08-22-08
                      • 12983

                      #11
                      further to andy's note there is no real impetus for shares to rise.

                      past two bubbles; tech stocks and then property

                      what and when will be next bubble is anyones guess

                      using a sports analogy for shares is not rational, at some point fundamentals ALWAYS come into play with shares
                      Comment
                      • Dark Horse
                        SBR Posting Legend
                        • 12-14-05
                        • 13764

                        #12
                        I think the market and economy will tank, but bounce back some in the short run, starting at the end of this week.

                        Regardlessly, I'm still thinking the stock market may be a safe place to put money, at the right price. Some companies aren't going to go down, no matter how bad it gets, so then I would rather own stocks than dollars. But I'm open to be talked out of that, if anyone has some good arguments.
                        Comment
                        • MonkeyF0cker
                          SBR Posting Legend
                          • 06-12-07
                          • 12144

                          #13
                          The market goes sideways until the 3rd quarter, then fundamentals begin to come around. Historical P/E ratios are far more absurd to compare. We will never see those ratios again in our lifetime.
                          Comment
                          • themajormt
                            SBR MVP
                            • 07-30-08
                            • 3964

                            #14
                            So is this the time to be maxing out my 401k with 100% company match or am I just pissing money away?????
                            Comment
                            • forloveofthegame
                              SBR Hall of Famer
                              • 06-01-09
                              • 5288

                              #15
                              buy gold!!!
                              Comment
                              • maddogmadden86
                                SBR Wise Guy
                                • 11-08-08
                                • 898

                                #16
                                this is a traders market plain and simple options traders like myself can make money no matter what i take my trades one day at a time, buy and hold is gone and will probably never come back this is simply a traders market and the market is at the demise or traders and hedge funds
                                Comment
                                • RageWizard
                                  SBR MVP
                                  • 09-01-06
                                  • 3008

                                  #17
                                  Yes, I have been telling you that the market will drop like a crowbar for months now, and not sometime in the distant future, but before the end of the year, and not just the March lows either. My crystal ball has it at around 5000-5250.

                                  I would liek to say thank you to Tacomax for pointing out the the stock market has historically done better when a democrat is in the white house, so all you doom and gloom republicans can stop that lie.

                                  So why is the market going to tank, well it all has to do with the banks. The government has been telling the banks to fake their quarterly reports for 3 quaters now, so they can have their secondary offering of stock. Have you noticed the price of banks like J.P. Morgan and Wells Fargo haven't drop below the offering price. That is strange, and also the banks are up over 100 % since March. Try to find the last time that happened.

                                  Anyway, get the Eff out now right after the 2nd quarter window dressing that is going to be happining from now until the end of the month. We will have a rally until then, but afterwards, the market will be range bound, and eventually start dipping lower and lower, until the 4th quarter starts, then it will just tank big time. So go ahead and short the financials and don't worry about the short term pain, in November or December, you can thank me then. You can also buy mining stocks or commodities, but not right now, they are getting hit with a pullback from all of this inflation is contained bullshit. You already know that inflation is coming, so don't eff around, get some commodity stocks, but make sure not to buy the actual gold. It won't get above $1000 for long it is that plain and simple, so why buy it when it at $900 for only a 10% gain.
                                  Comment
                                  • pico
                                    BARRELED IN @ SBR!
                                    • 04-05-07
                                    • 27321

                                    #18
                                    cash is king
                                    Comment
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