Derrick Rose vs Lebron: More Talented?

[SBR Lou]

This thread would have been legitimate a couple of years ago when the points brought up in the original post were actually valid and relevant (poor outside shooting, poor FT shooting, lack of "clutch-ness", etc.). However, unless you havn't watched any NBA basketball for the last 2 seasons this isn't really a question. Lebron is by far and away the best player in the NBA. Don't get me wrong, Kobe is a better "scorer" and DWade is very good. Derrick Rose is a ****ing phenomenal point guard and is one of the best in the league. But when a guy is not even the best player at his position (possibly not even in the top 3), I don't see how you can ask if he's more talented than the best player in the league.

I'd rather CP3, Deron, or Parker @ point guard. Ask me that same question in 2 years and it becomes much more difficult.

Excellent post, and I agree that of course Rose is not going to be heralded as the PG right now when he's not currently the best in the game. I just think his basketball skills are much more worthy of discussion+hype than a "Lebron James".

Lebron is just a figurehead, overrated, a Sportscenter machine and thus the average basketball fan thinks he's a living legend. Give me Kobe any day, and I do think Rose potentially develops into an across the board better player than Lebron.

[WileOut]

Eric Gordon as fast as Rose??? As fast to what -- the buffet table?

Gordon is a better 3-point shooter for sure, but he is decidedly not fast. There is not even a comparison to be made on that point. Are you Eric Gordon's agent? I think Gordon can be a very good scorer for many years, though I don't think he'll be a great overall player and he is not fast or quick.

Look I'm not going to keep arguing with you. I'm saying that not only is Gordon quicker, he is stronger in taking the ball to the basket. They both are about the same speed wise and I'm telling you nobody in the NBA is faster from baseline to baseline than Eric Gordon. Derrick Rose is just as fast. Gordon is quicker.

There are 3 types of speeds. Acceleration, quickness, and straight away top speed. Gordon and Rose accelerate and have the top speed in the NBA. Gordon is quicker than Rose from side to side. Gordon is stronger than Rose too. These are things I and the scouts around me observed with our own eyes. They said they had never seen 2 guys that fast on the same high school team.

Eric Gordon averaged 18 points a game as a rookie in 34 minutes a game. He is only 6-3. It is very hard to average 18 points a game playing the 2 position at 6-3 unless you have supernatural speed, quickness, and athletic ability. He has this. Gordon has unheard of speed.

[yisman]

Lebron is just a figurehead, overrated

Lou, your posts are getting worse and worse.

Your argument for Rose made no sense at all and was not factual. Now you've dropped that and you've moved on to bashing LeBron as "just a figurehead".

Unreal.

LeBron is ridiculously talented. Forget the fans and "Sportscenter". Look at what other players and teams think.


Even LeBron's biggest hater would have to agree he's a top 5 player in the game today.

Why do you ignore the facts? Look at LeBron's statistics. Look at his supporting cast. Look at how much better Cleveland is with him.

[WileOut]

As for the original question, Rose is one of the 2 fastest players in the NBA. That says a lot. That means he has an obvious advantage over everyone covering him. He is probably a tad bit faster than James, but that is expected because James is taller. I'd pay money to see them race though just for the hell of it. Rose has to fix his shooting. He needs to develop a mid range and 3 point game, then he will be unstoppable. Gordon already has the whole package. He's faster than everyone on the floor and he can nail 3's and mid range shots.

James will proabably go down as the greatest of all time when its all over with. I hear Brooklyn is going to get a team and I hear they will be going after James with big money. Being in a big media place they will build a franchise that will be unbeatable led by James and probably another big name player like a Dwight Howard. Can you imagine those 2 guys playing together? But first things first, James can add the first chapter to his legend by winning the NBA championship. They looked really bad last time they made it against the Spurs 2 years ago. Mo Williams makes all the difference though. He is unstoppable at times himself.

[waco66]

Think about this one before saying Lebron immediately..

1) Derrick has a better first step, Deron Williams of Utah said he believes Rose is the fastest player in the NBA right now.

2) Derrick can actually hit a free throw, and is a better shooter all around.

3) Derrick has shown all the signs of being the same team facilitator and "make guys better" type of player that Lebron does, and this will only improve with time.

He may never touch Lebron's hype, but he may prove to be the best PG in the league in a couple of seasons..

Lebron James = CAREER 27, 7 and 7 player! Also averages MORE steals than mr "Im faster than James' Rose. Better 3 point shooter? Lebron James in his rookie year averaged better than Rose. Their FT's are almost the same. Defense...uh James wins that aswell.


This thread is pure comedy. The thread starter needs to take his pills.

[Ralphie1412]

wow some of you should be banned. Just shows the squares that hang out here that literally dont know a thing about sports......eric gordon? The kid who hardly held it down in the BIG TEN? Please

[SBR Lou]

Chicago needs to open up and start letting Rose create some action, they're using him too conservatively tonight and need to go to him in the 2nd half.

[SBR Lou]

Refs predictably slapped Rose with 2 souls to begin the game to keep Boston in it.

Rose 3/5 for 6pts

[IGotDi$]

Why the hell did I even waste my time reading this . Le Bron no question

[jjgold]

Anyone thinking Rose is better should not even be posting on this board, what an embarrassing statement.

[raydog]

really tough to compare the 2 because of size and age difference. both are unreal talents. rose will be an all-star maybe as soon as next year and he will be one probably every year of his remaining career. lebrons physical stature makes him a monster. he will always get more points and get more hype. hell, who wouldnt want him if they were starting a team??? he would definitely get more votes than rose if you had to pick one of them. but if you want to talk pure pound for pound talent.... he is over the hill now but hands down, no questions asked, the pound for pound most talented basketball player in the nba since jordan retired is Allen Iverson.

[SBR Lou]

Anyone thinking Rose is better should not even be posting on this board, what an embarrassing statement.

Right now obviously you cannot compare body of works, but the question was is he more 'talented', not is he a better NBA player. Lebron crushes him career wise as Rose is a rookie and they're in different situations, but Rose isn't as far behind basketball IQ or talent wise as some think.

[RonPaul2008]

Derek Rose is a great player, but you have to be joking to compare him to Lebron. Lebron is clearly the best player since MJ.

[daggerkobe]

Crazyl doesn't know much about sports or gambling but he does know how to create threads that get the most replies.

[jjgold]

There are plenty of guys like Rose, Oliver Miller of Phila is much much better , I can name like 10 guys that are better point guards. He could not even shine Rondo's shoes, Williams of Utah, Parker, ectg , ect.

[daggerkobe]

Oliver Miller?

[Tsoprano]

Lebron by a mile

Lou makes this thread after a couple good games he has seen from Derrick, unreal.

[Cheme82]

There are plenty of guys like Rose, Oliver Miller of Phila is much much better , I can name like 10 guys that are better point guards. He could not even shine Rondo's shoes, Williams of Utah, Parker, ectg , ect.

Go ahead, name them.

Rose, Williams, and Paul will be the top 3 PG's in a year or two. Nash, Parker, and Kidd are on their way out.

Another kid to watch is JJ Barea from Dallas, although he probably will never be on that level.

[yisman]

really tough to compare the 2 because of size and age difference. both are unreal talents. rose will be an all-star maybe as soon as next year and he will be one probably every year of his remaining career. lebrons physical stature makes him a monster. he will always get more points and get more hype. hell, who wouldnt want him if they were starting a team??? he would definitely get more votes than rose if you had to pick one of them. but if you want to talk pure pound for pound talent.... he is over the hill now but hands down, no questions asked, the pound for pound most talented basketball player in the nba since jordan retired is Allen Iverson.

I hope this is a joke. That's even more asinine than comparing Rose to LeBron.

unless you're taking "pound for pound" literally and saying that AI has more talent per pound because he's light.

Not a very helpful thing for your team. "We have better value because our players are almost as good and they're lighter!"

Oliver Miller could be the worst "pound for pound" since Thomas Hamilton.

[yisman]

Oliver Miller?

He means Andre Miller, although Andre Miller was never as good as Rose is now.

[Madetowin]

guys give up Lebron is the man

[Vincepcion]

LOL!!!

Is this really up for debate?

LeBron will go down as one of the best to ever play and took generally a bunch of scrubs to the finals. Rose is gonna be a great player, but he won't even be the best PG in the league. CP3 has that spot and is on pace to become the best PG of all time.

[5 star bomb]

Right now obviously you cannot compare body of works, but the question was is he more 'talented', not is he a better NBA player. Lebron crushes him career wise as Rose is a rookie and they're in different situations, but Rose isn't as far behind basketball IQ or talent wise as some think.

CrazyL I understand the message you are trying to get across... Roe is definitely a true Superstar and will be a force in the NBA. Their is no debating that on my end... BUT Lebron is literally a top 5 ALL TIME NBA player imo... He is only 24 years old and will win at least 3 titles. I could pretty much guarentee that he will. He IS that good... Rose is awesome but Lebron is Lebron, almost like MJ was MJ. He is close to that level

[Vincepcion]

Another kid to watch is JJ Barea from Dallas, although he probably will never be on that level.

JJ Barea will be nothing more than what he is now. A small, spot up shooter who brings scoring off the bench.

[flyingillini]

Unreal

[Mac4Lyfe]

Rose did in one game what Lebron does EVERY night... This post is stupid.

[jsmithj88]

iverson isnt the best "pound for pound" talent since MJ
wat the hell is that supposed to mean anyway?
chris paul is the same size and im dam sure he can score 30 a night if he wanted to.

[NBA Hero]

rose hasnt proven ANYTHING.

[raydog]

iverson isnt the best "pound for pound" talent since MJ
wat the hell is that supposed to mean anyway?
chris paul is the same size and im dam sure he can score 30 a night if he wanted to.

AI wasnt blessed with the big bodies and long limbs that kobe and lebron have. chris paul is very very good but not quite in AI's league when he was in his prime...not yet anyways. AI had to do it all with pure fukking talent and skill and always against someone bigger than him. his body wasnt a weapon like the taller players. speed and pure abililty to do what guys 7 inches taller than him are doing, make him the best talent since jordan. you kids didnt get to watch him enough in his prime to understand i guess. much harder to score 30 a night playing man to man than that half man half zone shit they play now. if you gave AI a body like kobes or lebrons, he would be thrown into the "best player ever" talk. remember the topic is talent. just my opinions of course. im a little guy so i got that little mans disease too and gotta take up for the little ones

[Vincepcion]

AI wasnt blessed with the big bodies and long limbs that kobe and lebron have. chris paul is very very good but not quite in AI's league when he was in his prime...not yet anyways. AI had to do it all with pure fukking talent and skill and always against someone bigger than him. his body wasnt a weapon like the taller players. speed and pure abililty to do what guys 7 inches taller than him are doing, make him the best talent since jordan. you kids didnt get to watch him enough in his prime to understand i guess. much harder to score 30 a night playing man to man than that half man half zone shit they play now. if you gave AI a body like kobes or lebrons, he would be thrown into the "best player ever" talk. remember the topic is talent. just my opinions of course. im a little guy so i got that little mans disease too and gotta take up for the little ones

Stop acting like scoring is everything.

First off, AI and CP3 are about the same size.
Second of all, you do realize that CP3 is putting up the best overall PG numbers since Magic and is on pace to be the best PG in NBA HISTORY? He could possibly be better than the guy who most NBA-heads would rank as #2 or #3 all time. And he's still super young and gonna get better.

I guarantee if you take the quote "AI is the best talent since Jordan" to any true basketball forum they would laugh at you. I just want to close my post by saying I'm aware of how good he was and how he obliterated NBA defenses. I was the biggest AI guy when he put the crossover on Jordan, to when he averaged seasons of 30+ PPG, to last year in Denver when he put up absurd numbers as well. But CP3 deserves a ton of credit and AI is not the best basketball player since Jordan. Just my opinion, good luck with your plays.

[raydog]

go back and look at AIs stats his first 4 years vs. cp3s besides a few more assists, iverson was much better. the 1 main thing you must remember about how good AI was and why his first 4 years are much better than cp3s....those were the years when AI had to play against man to man defense and it was always someone bigger than him and the best defenders on a team against him. cp3 has always played in the zone defense allowing him more assists and more open shots. not saying the kid isnt fukking awesome, im just saying that AI putting up better numbers against tougher defense, sets him apart from the kids playing today.

those starting 4 years are all you can really judge by cus thats how long cp3 has been in the league. its really not even close when you look at the circumstances. good luck with your plays too vinny. good discussion

[Vincepcion]

AI was definitely very very good and at one point was arguably the most feared offensive force in the NBA. I remember him dismantling my Raptors in the 2001 EC 2nd round, the furthest we have ever gone in the playoffs. Anyway I respect your opinion, I just have to disagree. He was a volume shooter (one year he averaged almost 30 shots per game, LOL!!!) and his percentages are VERY poor. He's a HOF'er no doubt, but I think that the league has seen better talent since Jordan. Again, good discussion.

[jsmithj88]

AI is just a scorer who happens to be small and quick.
i wouldnt call jordan a natural talent, he worked hard to be great
iverson shot a poor percentage to get his 30 points in his heydays.
i gotta compare iverson to marbury, they both are scorers pretending to be a point guard.

[jjgold]

rose hasnt proven ANYTHING.

Exactly, he is a nice player right now, that is all. Not even close to a great player, Gordon right now is 5x the player compared to Rose

[Vincepcion]

i gotta compare iverson to marbury, they both are scorers pretending to be a point guard.

LOL @ Iverson pretending to be a PG. You do realize that he's spent much of his career as a SG, right? Which is where he belongs.