Problem with Book Youwin that doesn't apply and its own tennis rules

[fabulous]

Hi. I've got a big problem with the bookmaker Youwin that refuses to reimburse me 125 euros despite its rules say i should be reimbursed. This is my problem:
I place a bet on tennis match Bartoli / Garrigues. In fact i bet 125 euros that there would be "under 19.5 games" in the match. Bartoli retired whereas score was 6-4 6-7 0-1, so 24 games had already been played. I perfectly know that, if match had ended, my bet would necessarily have been lost, but, fortunately, the fact is there was player retirement, and Youwin's rule is very clear in case of retirement:

"Total Games Markets (including Live Betting): In the event of disqualification, retirement or change of surface mid-match, all bets will be deemed void."

So when Bartoli retired, i was sure my bet would be settled void, but it was settled lost ! I immediately contacted live chat to tell them there was an error in the settlement of my bet. They first told me my bet had been settled lost coz it was a live bet ???I explained them my bet wasn't a livebet at all, i placed it 12 hours before the start of the match (and anyway, even if it had been livebet, the rule says "including live betting", so .....But never mind..). Youwin found then another reason not to settle my bet void: they told me my bet would remain lost because it had already been determined before the retirement of the player !

I perfectly know that some books apply this rule, that is to say that bets stand when determined before the retirement. But in that case, they always precise it in their rules. And something makes me sure that this isn't the case for bets type "total games" on Youwin: For other types of bets, they precise it ! For example, for bets on number of aces, double faults...they write:

"Number of Aces / Double Faults & other related markets: In the event of a disqualification or retirement all bets will be deemed void, unless settlement of the bet has already been determined."

For those bets, they clearly precise "unless settlement of the bet has already been determined", but on the contrary they didn't add this precision for bets on "total games" whose rule is : "Total Games Markets (including Live Betting): In the event of disqualification, retirement or change of surface mid-match, all bets will be deemed void."

So i consider it's clear my bet on total games should be void, don't you agree? What's your opinion about it?

Youwin told me they understood their rule wasn't clear and proposed me a 50 euros free bet because of it ! But i don't want of their free bet, i want my bet to be settled void as the rule says it should be, and my 125 euros to be reimbursed ! So i refused their free bet because i'm sure i'm right in that case ! In my opinion, they use their rule to steal money: for players who would have bet "over 19.5 games" on that match, they would settle bets void, but for those who would have bet "under 19.5 games", they would settle bets "lost" ! That's too easy to make money that way! And since they know their rule isn't clear, why don't they change it to make it clearer adding "unless settlement of the bet has already been determined" ?

I'll immediately post a complain on forum but i would like to get your opinion about my problem please. Thanks in advance !

[FourLengthsClear]

According to their rule it should be void, period.

Most books have a different rule along the lines of "In the event of disqualification, retirement or change of surface mid-match, all bets will be deemed void, unless the outcome has already been decided."

Would be interested to know if they paid those that were on the over!

[Mikail]

Problem with offshore is they tend to enforce the rules only when it's in their favor. Otherwise.....

[Justin7]

File a complaint (click on the link below my signature). I have never heard of a book grading a tennis total non-void after a player retirement. We have very good communications with Youwin, so I hope we can resolve it quickly.

[Stumpage]

Brutal.....According to their own rules, it doesn't get clearer than this. The bet is void. How many times has some pour soul bet over 8 1/2 runs in a baseball game as an example...Score is 13-4 in the 6th, and then comes the rain. Unfortunately, even though you have an obvious win, you push on the technicality. Same thing here. It's inexcusable that they try to feed you this bullshit.....

Bottom line, regardless of the outcome, take your funds and get the hell out of this piece of shit book.....

[fabulous]

I've just done iy JUstin, I've just filled a complaint in which i made sum up of my problem with Youwin. Now i hope your "good communications" with Youwin will help me to manage to be reimbursed . I don't ask a lot, i just want the rule to be applied and respected...

[fabulous]

According to their rule it should be void, period. Most books have a different rule along the lines of "In the event of disqualification, retirement or change of surface mid-match, all bets will be deemed void, unless the outcome has already been decided." Would be interested to know if they paid those that were on the over!

I would too. I suppose i mustn't be the first one to have problem with their rule on bets type total games, so it's strange they decide to keep it unchanged and not to add the precision "unless bet has already been determined". It seems that way they can take advantage of their rule in any case.... But it would be great if customers who had had their bets "over... games" in any match could bring testimonies...

[fabulous]

How does it work exactly when one fills a complaint? I've received a transcription from my complaint but haven't been contacted by SBR , will SBR contact me before they contact Youwin? Inform me please

[Justin7]

How does it work exactly when one fills a complaint? I've received a transcription from my complaint but haven't been contacted by SBR , will SBR contact me before they contact Youwin? Inform me please

1. Player fills out a complaint.
2. SBR assigns the complaint (Bill, Lou and I handle a vast majority of them).
3. SBR rep contacts the player, and gets additional info if needed.
4. SBR rep contacts the book. If there are disputed facts, it can go back and forth between player and book many times.
5. SBR makes a recommendation (or often, the book corrects the situation on its own, once the facts are brought to light).

[fabulous]

SBR contacted Youwin but SBR and i are still waiting for news from Youwin.... Youwin may believe that if they let time pass i will give up ?! Big mistake ! As long as they don't respect the rule and reimburse me i'll continue posting messages so that people become aware of the way it works on Youwin...

[Hareeba!]

I wonder if those players who bet the overs in that match were paid or voided.

[King_Suckerman]

SBR contacted Youwin but SBR and i are still waiting for news from Youwin.... Youwin may believe that if they let time pass i will give up ?! Big mistake ! As long as they don't respect the rule and reimburse me i'll continue posting messages so that people become aware of the way it works on Youwin...

Fair enough but I'd give SBR and Youwin a few days to sort it first. Hope you get your cash.

[fabulous]

I'll be patient, but i find it unbelievable that it 's so long for such a case to be resolved by Youwin. I understand some cases may need time, but here, no ! I bet on total games in the match an rule clearly says: "Total Games Markets (including Live Betting): In the event of disqualification, retirement or change of surface mid-match, all bets will be deemed void." What don't they understand in their own rule ???

[wrongturn]

You are not the first one in such dispute situation, and it won't be the last, because the rule is totally counter-intuitive, and often the books themselves will get confused. Believe or not, there are many players who don't even realize their bets should have been refunded when books grade this incorrectly.

[fabulous]

I wonder if those players who bet the overs in that match were paid or voided.

I think i'm gonna look for Youwin customers who would have had in the past a bet type "over..." void whereas the number of games had been reached... That way that would proove Youwin tries to win on both sides... There's really something that isn't clear: Youwin perfectly knows its rule isn't clear, however, they don't modify it !!! They say a bet stand (for bets over/under) if unconditionnaly determined, so why don't they precise/add it clearly in their rule ??? It's strange, isn't it? It really seems they want to keep confusion and go on stealing customers...

[fabulous]

...

[fabulous]

This is the answer i had received from Youwin just before i contacted SBR:

"Thank you for your email.

Once we receive the complain from SBR we will deal with it accordingly and you will receive an answer according to the outcome of the case.

Best regards,

Marga "

Youwin must have received SBR complain about one week ago, and i still haven't any news ??? Could someone from SBR inform me?

[BET THE HOOK]

With any luck Justin7 will get your case and pounce all over this.

[Justin7]

I have it, and am still waiting for their explanation (or hopefully, reversal).

[fabulous]

There's one question Justin i had no answer from Youwin, so could you please ask them to answer that question:

Youwin says bets type total games stand if unconditionnaly determined before retirement. So why don't they write it in their rule???Why don't they precise it ? They know their rule as it is written at the moment doesn't correspond to what they say, so why don't they add precision "unless unconditionnaly determined" ? All that really looks as a scam...

[fabulous]

I have it, and am still waiting for their explanation (or hopefully, reversal).

Are you sure JUstin they received your message? Coz i sent them a message asking them why they didn't answer SBR and they told me this:
"Kindly note, that as I informed you in my previous email, we would happily answer all SBR queries whenever we receive them." ????
So why isn't there any answer?

What's more, they're quite humoristic, they dare tell me : " our decision was taken following the common sense of a rule from which you are trying to take advantage due to a misprint error" !!! I tried to take advantage of the rule??? Youwin is talking about a misprint error in the rule, so what are they waiting to correct that misprint error ??? They let it as it is simply coz they can so take advantage of their rule ! Youwin is a scam ! Will SBR think of downgrading them ???

[fabulous]

All my posts finally had one utility: Youwin sent me an email to inform me they had added precision in their rule to precise bets stand if unconditionnaly determined. At least that's clear now. But at the moment i placed my bet the rule was different, Youwin admits there was a misprint error (these are their words), so why should i be the one that should pay for their error ???When a book does an error, it has to take its responsabilities !

[fabulous]

Marge from Youwin is always very comic I received that email today:

"Thank you for your email.

Please note that we offered you 50 Euro as a compensation for the misprint error, which you declined. On the other hand through your emails, we can come to the conclusion, that you suspected there was an error of misprint and that you are trying to take advantage of by asking for your stake back, when you know that by only logic your bet was already lost.

As we said in our previous emails we will be delighted to give all the requested information to SBR once they contact us."

Of course i know my bet would have been lost if match had ended, but that's not the point !!!! I placed my bet with a book whose rule said bet would be void in case of retirement, is it difficult to understand ? CS from Youwin always lies, SBR contacted them and is waiting for an answer, and they dare tell me "we will be delighted to give all the requested information to SBR once they contact us."...ppfffffff, difficult to keep cool with such persons... And concerning their ******* 50 euros compensation, of course i refused it, coz i know i'm totally right in that case and should get back my 125 euros !!!

[Justin7]

fabulous,

Send me Marge's email address (in private, to my email). My current line of communication doesn't seem to be working.

[fabulous]

it's done Justin

[davidchong]

newss?

[fabulous]

No news for now ... Patience...

[fabulous]

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[fabulous]

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[fabulous]

Well, it seems that when a bookmaker has decided to rob a customer , there's nothing to do, no one can prevent it. Despite Justin's help (thank you Justin for the many times you contacted them) Youwin refuses to reimburse me. They clearly say that : "The terms and conditions have been updated to reflect what the rules state throughout our betting rules before this point in tennis "
So, if i understand, when i placed my bet, terms and conditions didn't reflect the rule ???How can one know it ??How can a bookmaker refuse to admit that's its fault and customer has to be reimbursed ??? Youwin is a band of rip-off merchants. Ok they stole me 125 euros, but i'll do everything i can to make them lose thousands or even millions of euros... I'll post very week on as many forums as i can so that people become aware Youwin are robbers and Youwin may regret they robbed me 125 euros... Thanks again for your help Justin, even if there was nothing to do with such a gang of robbers. A last question however: before that case, Youwin was graded D+, does SBR intend to maintain them D+ or downgrade them (since in your conclusion on this dispute is that Youwin robbed me) ? And by the way , won't your conclusion be displayed in Youwin section?

[Justin7]

Youwin robbed you. I cannot figure out why they took a stand over such a small amount.

[davidchong]

why you bet under 19.5 ?, what is the scenario that you can win that bet?

[Justin7]

why you bet under 19.5 ?, what is the scenario that you can win that bet?

6-4, 6-3.

[wrongturn]

Youwin robbed you. I cannot figure out why they took a stand over such a small amount.

Because Youwin think they are right in this case. I bet they also have "unless unconditionally determined" exception in their soccer rule, and they think the same exception applies to tennis.

[fabulous]

THese guys from Youwin are really comic ! They clearly stole me 125 euros (SBR confirmed it) and they dare sending me email whose title is "we love our customers" !!! In case you wouldn't have read this whole post, absolutely avoid book Youwin, they can decide whenever they want not to apply their own rule to steal you money... Really comic... "we love our customers"...