Betfair $3.1 million slow-pay and other pro player issues (Video)

[Hareeba!]

Obviously I feel for you and I hope you will get what is owed to you, but if Betfair can proof that they've paid the processor I find it a difficult case.
Should they pay again?

With this much money at stake they should at least try and recover the money from the processor as far as I'm concerned, but legally it seems that they've done what they had to do.

Unless the processor is owned by Betfair.

Again, Betfair 'advices' me to withdraw trough moneybookers.
If moneybookers go up on tuesday I can't blame Betfair...

[Chopsticks]

A listed company like Betfair should not be able to fool around like this. They should only work with high quality payment processors and they should have foreseen this happening. If they were any good they would known about the limitations because they have a constructive dialogue between themselves and the payment processor. And as such they should have informed the player that he should perhaps use a different method - or a combination of methods - if he wants to get his money out quicker. They are not easystreetsports or some shady CR operation that has people running around with cash.

They chose to work with the payment processor and they should do whatever they can to make it right.

[vitalyo]

Again, Betfair 'advices' me to withdraw trough moneybookers.
If moneybookers go up on tuesday I can't blame Betfair...

That's the thing PSP didn't go bust and it looks like they are directly involved with BF . I could be wrong .

A listed company like Betfair should not be able to fool around like this. They should only work with high quality payment processors and they should have foreseen this happening. If they were any good they would known about the limitations because they have a constructive dialogue between themselves and the payment processor. And as such they should have informed the player that he should perhaps use a different method - or a combination of methods - if he wants to get his money out quicker. They are not easystreetsports or some shady CR operation that has people running around with cash.

They chose to work with the payment processor and they should do whatever they can to make it right.

100% agree with you . If something is up BF should of advice the player to use other services to withdraw his funds.Come on we are talking 3.1 mill you don't trust just anyone with such a large amount . Sounds like PSP is directly involved with BF , someone want's his money bad and betfair is closing their eyes . Why would they do that ?

GL.

[Hareeba!]

They chose to work with the payment processor ......

Do you know this for a fact?
There has to be more to this story that we need to know before making judgements.
I've never before heard of Betfair using "payment processors" at all.
Why Anty chose to take the route he did using a "Master Account" and PSP rather than doing what all regular customers do and simply create their own account rather than even getting into talking with Betfair executives remains a mystery.
Nobody has yet explained why there is a $20k limit and who imposes it.

[Toit]

Having thought about it again (and given the lack of extra info from SBR) there might be something dodgy with the way Betfair is dealing through this processor.

But then again, if it was a dodgy deal I think they would go out of their way to keep this off the radar...

[blackbart]

i could only wish they slow payed me 3.1 million

[Santo]

My guess, and it is only a guess, from what he has said is that there is some kind of credit arrangement at play whereby the PSP was providing the player some additional benefits.

[chance]

It is not a betfair issue once they have paid the money to the payment provider. The title of the video should not be befair slow play. Betfair does have an obligation to push the payment provider to expediate the funds transfer to it's client though.

[anty]

My guess, and it is only a guess, from what he has said is that there is some kind of credit arrangement at play whereby the PSP was providing the player some additional benefits.

There were no credit arrangements or other special benefits for me.

[Hareeba!]

There were no credit arrangements or other special benefits for me.

So why didn't you open an ordinary account like the rest of us without having to be hitched to a "Master Account" ?

Without a straight answer to that your story is clearly missing vital information and you can be seen to be taking advantage of your misfortune in order to have a shot at Betfair.

[jjgold]

If Betfair has shown legal proof they paid the money then this 3rd party should be in the thread title not Betfair

Its very misleading thread title

[anty]

So why didn't you open an ordinary account like the rest of us without having to be hitched to a "Master Account" ?

Without a straight answer to that your story is clearly missing vital information and you can be seen to be taking advantage of your misfortune in order to have a shot at Betfair.

At first I had an ordinary account. I used mostly wire transfers. Then betfair manager mr Asathridis proposed to me this master account scheme, promising quicker deposits and withdrawals. Thats all.
Now after this farce of course I again have an ordinary account using moneybookers.

[jjgold]

Anty did you bet on any suspicious matches??

What is your nationality because it does matter in this type of strange case and past history of fraud regarding certain types of people

[anty]

Anty did you bet on any suspicious matches??

What is your nationality because it does matter in this type of strange case and past history of fraud regarding certain types of people

Does my nationality really matter? And I explained already how I had won most of my money. If Arsenal -- Barcelona match is suspicious then every match is suspicious

[jjgold]

Are you Russian?

[anty]

Are you Russian?

Yes. And so what?

[Hareeba!]

At first I had an ordinary account. I used mostly wire transfers. Then betfair manager mr Asathridis proposed to me this master account scheme, promising quicker deposits and withdrawals. Thats all.
Now after this farce of course I again have an ordinary account using moneybookers.

Something about that doesn't make sense to me.
Why couldn't you have used Moneybookers from the start. How would that not have been just as quick as this master account scheme.

How does the master account scheme work ?

[jjgold]

Yes. And so what?

I would of bet that prop
I hope you get your cash

[anty]

Something about that doesn't make sense to me.
Why couldn't you have used Moneybookers from the start. How would that not have been just as quick as this master account scheme.

How does the master account scheme work ?

I wasn't aware of opportunities through moneybookers at the time and I am not sure transferring money through moneybookers was then as smooth as it is now. It was long lime ago.
What do you not understand? They are middlemen between betfair and me.

[Santo]

I did a little research into this Master Account issue after my latest post.

It seems they are set up for bookies or similar service providers. In Cyprus, a bookmaker (think a storefront) can operate a master account, and from there run a number of subaccounts. So if I walked into a shop in Paralimni, I could give the guy at the counter 100 EUR, he would put it into one of the subsidiary accounts, I could play, then go back into the betting shop to get my funds. These accounts aren't necessarily unique, it seems they can be re-used once empty. I assume there is some incentive for the shop (% losses or similar), but I haven't got that information yet.

Master accounts on a smaller scale also seem to have been given to bot operators, presumably as a way of limiting risk.

[Fragmau5]

not what I expected of betfair!

[jjgold]

I did a little research into this Master Account issue after my latest post.

It seems they are set up for bookies or similar service providers. In Cyprus, a bookmaker (think a storefront) can operate a master account, and from there run a number of subaccounts. So if I walked into a shop in Paralimni, I could give the guy at the counter 100 EUR, he would put it into one of the subsidiary accounts, I could play, then go back into the betting shop to get my funds. These accounts aren't necessarily unique, it seems they can be re-used once empty. I assume there is some incentive for the shop (% losses or similar), but I haven't got that information yet.

Master accounts on a smaller scale also seem to have been given to bot operators, presumably as a way of limiting risk.

I wonder how master accounts can be legal??
Why would a place like Betfair get involved with shady small time booking outfits even if legal in these weird Countries with weak gambling legislation??

[Santo]

The booking is itself legal, and it's within the EU, at least in the case of Cyprus. With Russia I have no idea.

[potless]

I wonder how master accounts can be legal??
Why would a place like Betfair get involved with shady small time booking outfits even if legal in these weird Countries with weak gambling legislation??

because they are greedy and increasingly incompetent. Bf already have a track record of stealing balances so it can be no surprise that agents they use are also partial to the same tactic.

[Scooter]

At first I had an ordinary account. I used mostly wire transfers. Then betfair manager mr Asathridis proposed to me this master account scheme, promising quicker deposits and withdrawals. Thats all.
Now after this farce of course I again have an ordinary account using moneybookers.

anty - How did betfair manager mr Asathridis propose that you use the master account?
Was it in writing (email), or strictly in private conversation?

Did the master account people put anything in writing mentioning their connection with Betfair?

I would think such materials would help your case if you were to pursue it legally.

[yokspot]

Its very misleading thread title

Indeed. It should be Betfair NO pay, not slow pay. No pay is what it appears to have morphed into.

What is Gibraltar?

Gibraltar is theoretically where the Betfair exchange is located. It's what it says on the BF homepage, and that's where they said they were going when they left the UK. Funny thing is, they're not listed on the Gibraltar licensee page.

[Monte]

What is this bullshit with "Betfair has done everything after sending money to the processor/provider"?
It is their responsibility that the player gets the money, not the damn processor whoever that is.
Some of you guys are fukked up in the mind...iam waiting for the day when you win big at a book, that book sends all your money to a processor, something goes wrong, you don't get the money and the book says "not our fault". LOL

[yokspot]

Gibraltar is theoretically where the Betfair exchange is located. It's what it says on the BF homepage, and that's where they said they were going when they left the UK. Funny thing is, they're not listed on the Gibraltar licensee page.

Only for the UK, though. I forgot that, just spoke to someone in the Commissioner's office who pointed it out.

For UK customers, the relative license page:

http://www.gibraltar.gov.gi/internet-gaming

Anti, what does it say at the bottom of the Betfair landing page about regulation? For me it says Gibraltar, because I'm in the UK. For you, I think it might say Malta, which is bad news. Can you check that?

[meckis]

For customers not from UK or Australia betfair is regulated by LGA Malta.

[anty]

anty - How did betfair manager mr Asathridis propose that you use the master account?
Was it in writing (email), or strictly in private conversation?

Did the master account people put anything in writing mentioning their connection with Betfair?

I would think such materials would help your case if you were to pursue it legally.

Both in writing and in private. Though now betfair officials are saying that PSP "was named only as one of the options, not specifically recommended"
Master account swindlers have an MSA contract with betfair. In recent recorded conversation mr Kacharava said to me that under MSA contract they have to pay me but "the timeframe is not stipulated".

[cjwatsonfan32]

looks like betfair is straight BS

[HeeeHAWWWW]

I'd be raising hell with the regulators. Gibraltar are relatively strict.

[kkkkk]

I'd be raising hell with the regulators. Gibraltar are relatively strict.

well, for him its not Gibraltar but will be Malta LGA, as hes from Russia. So not that much promising. But he can try.

[Hareeba!]

looks like betfair is straight BS

[Hareeba!]

What is this bullshit with "Betfair has done everything after sending money to the processor/provider"?
It is their responsibility that the player gets the money, not the damn processor whoever that is.
Some of you guys are fukked up in the mind...iam waiting for the day when you win big at a book, that book sends all your money to a processor, something goes wrong, you don't get the money and the book says "not our fault". LOL

Some people appear incapable of comprehending the legal relationship between parties to transactions carried out by an agent.