Betfair $3.1 million slow-pay and other pro player issues (Video)

[chance]

Why a lot of comments about betfair was deleted?

I would also like to know why posts were deleted?

I thought this was a free and fair discussion forum.

[anty]

I still don't understand what a masters-account is...
Why didnt u use moneybookers?

Now after this fiasco of course I use moneybookers. But at the time I didn't feel like it is needed, I thought that I was fully protected just by the name "betfair" and nothing can happen. How stupid I was
Btw, its late here in Russia, I am going to sleep a bit. I ll answer the questions and also may be give some of my thoughts about this tomorrow.

[spider]

Also some additional details. I never avoided Premium Charges, I paid some 600000 USD in Premium Charges. I won 90% of my money betting on English Premier League and FA Cup, La Liga matches involving Real and Barca and Champions League matches. So I don't think you can accuse of betting on fixed matches

just so everyone can understand this ,

*** from the 3 million owed to you, how much of this is yours, that you deposited

*** you paid 600,000 on premium charges?

*** you played all these super favorites (Real, Barca, etc.) at what prices ? 1.03 to 1.15 ?

the math doesn't add up!

[PVO]

...I won 90% of my money betting on English Premier League and FA Cup, La Liga matches involving Real and Barca and Champions League matches. So I don't think you can accuse of betting on fixed matches

they are searching hard for how information did leak i guess

[anty]

just so everyone can understand this ,

*** from the 3 million owed to you, how much of this is yours, that you deposited

*** you paid 600,000 on premium charges?

*** you played all these super favorites (Real, Barca, etc.) at what prices ? 1.03 to 1.15 ?

the math doesn't add up!

1. Does it really matter? I deposited a lot less.
2.Yes
3.I usually lay superfavourites, not back them

[spider]

1. Does it really matter? I deposited a lot less.
2.Yes
3.I usually lay superfavourites, not back them

if you're laying the superfavorites, then you are not winning enough to cover the premium charges and to make a profit on top.

why would you let your balance to grow like that and not withdraw earlier?


like i said before--- the math does not add up.

[spider]

1. Does it really matter? I deposited a lot less.
2.Yes
3.I usually lay superfavourites, not back them

you must have deposited at least 1.5 to 2 million in order to get back 3. how did you deposit it? why don't you go in person to collect your money back plus your profit!

your story does not add up!!

[anty]

if you're laying the superfavorites, then you are not winning enough to cover the premium charges and to make a profit on top.

why would you let your balance to grow like that and not withdraw earlier?


like i said before--- the math does not add up.

1. How did you come to this conclusion?
2. My balance grew very quickly in January and February, had the greatest 2 months in my betting life.

[anty]

you must have deposited at least 1.5 to 2 million in order to get back 3.

Why??? In theory you can win millions even from 10 USD deposit. And in practice too, though it takes time...

[Hareeba!]

you must have deposited at least 1.5 to 2 million in order to get back 3. how did you deposit it? why don't you go in person to collect your money back plus your profit!

your story does not add up!!

I don't see why this isn't possible and why you say it doesn't add up.
There's plenty to this case we don't understand.

But really none of this is relevant so far as the regular Betfair customer is concerned and this thread shouldn't scare anybody off using them.

Anty had some peculiar arrangement with Betfair that none of us understand and aren't going to get involved in.

[anty]

But really none of this is relevant so far as the regular Betfair customer is concerned and this thread shouldn't scare anybody off using them.

Anty had some peculiar arrangement with Betfair that none of us understand and aren't going to get involved in.

Its not a peculiar arrangement, lots of players in Russia had this arrangement. But its true that for ex British customers are much more protected, those kind of problems will never bother them.
On the other hand, this case shows that you can't trust betfair. Today this farce, tomorrow may be something else...

[Hareeba!]

Its not a peculiar arrangement, lots of players in Russia had this arrangement. But its true that for ex British customers are much more protected, those kind of problems will never bother them.
On the other hand, this case shows that you can't trust betfair. Today this farce, tomorrow may be something else...

Until I see something like this happen to a regular customer my trust in Betfair will remain very strong.

None of us really understand the details of your arrangement with Betfair, if indeed it was directly with Betfair. This "Master Account" thing sounds like an agency deal with PSP as the responsible party and the one who had the arrangement with Betfair and your contract was with PSP and they are the ones who have stiffed you after Betfair paid them the $3M+.

[Monte]

How anyone can defend these crooks is beyond me.
Sure there are people who need them (or think they do), but how you could "trust" them is ridiculous.
Any exchange that never puts their own money at risk but charges premium fees, is close to being a bunch of asshole criminals.
That's how it is, despite Hareeba and some others defending them again of course.

[chance]

Can someone post the new betfair premium rules. What is this 60% rule.

Anty has been caught up in this complicated structure. Their premium charges are hugely complex. They out smarted themselves with the casino promo.

It sounds to me like they need to keep things simple for a while.

Arty you need to get on a plane to schedule a face to face meeting at betfair head office.

[Hareeba!]

How anyone can defend these crooks is beyond me.
Sure there are people who need them (or think they do), but how you could "trust" them is ridiculous.
Any exchange that never puts their own money at risk but charges premium fees, is close to being a bunch of asshole criminals.
That's how it is, despite Hareeba and some others defending them again of course.

I've never defended the premium charge.

All I've had to say about it is a) it applies to a very small minority of players but it has been used to unnecessarily scare off players who would never see it applied to them, and b) there have been any number of inaccurate posts about how it works which I've responded to in an attempt to correct them

As for Anty's case, I am questioning the details of the arrangement. I don't understand it. Do you?

To me the reference to "Master Account" sounds suspiciously like it is an agency type arrangement. If Anty's contract was in effect with PSP rather than Betfair directly, then where is Betfair at fault if they have paid the withdrawal to PSP as per the contract conditions? Does Betfair have any interest or control over the activity of PSP?

[Hareeba!]

Can someone post the new betfair premium rules. What is this 60% rule.

Your best shot is to go to the Betfair site and read up on it. Bit too involved to post it all here.

[anty]

As for Anty's case, I am questioning the details of the arrangement. I don't understand it. Do you?

To me the reference to "Master Account" sounds suspiciously like it is an agency type arrangement. If Anty's contract was in effect with PSP rather than Betfair directly, then where is Betfair at fault if they have paid the withdrawal to PSP as per the contract conditions? Does Betfair have any interest or control over the activity of PSP?

Betfair advised me to use and trust PSP, betfair managers together with PSP made promises about full payment that were not fulfilled and betfair not at fault? PSP have a contract with betfair under which they (PSP) should fully pay me in reasonable time. But for some reason betfair is very lenient with those swindlers.

[Hareeba!]

Betfair advised me to use and trust PSP, betfair managers together with PSP made promises about full payment that were not fulfilled and betfair not at fault? PSP have a contract with betfair under which they (PSP) should fully pay me in reasonable time. But for some reason betfair is very lenient with those swindlers.

I can't say for sure that Betfair is or isn't at fault unless I know the details of the contract and the nature of the relationship between Betfair and PSP.

But what I am saying is that this is certainly not the arrangement for regular Betfair customers and that therefore they oughtn't to be concerned for the welfare of their funds.

[gliblet]

Part of the reason for a lot of the issues is that Betfair has a monopoly on exchange betting. Yes their share price has been dropping but that is because it was overvalued to begin with. They can't grow much but there just doesn't seem to be enough incentive for their users to move to Betdaq or Smarkets.

[Ace_of_Spades]

I really dislike seeing these videos about Betfair. Especially since i play at Betfair and there is no other exchange remotely close to what Betfair can offer.

Anyone know what kind of balance you have to have to have that premium charge to be implemented in to your account?

[chance]

You can have a $5 balance and win $5 and stiill be charged the premium charge. It is not about the size of your balance but whether you account has paid 20% of it's profit to betfair.

[Santo]

There are minimums at play too. Your $5 example isn't true. I think the allowance is 1000 GBP / currency equivalent. So for the first 1000 after your total fees paid fall below 20% you won't be charged, and if you get it back above 20% you won't be charged.

anty: Is there a contract in existence between you and Betfair, or written proof of them advising you to use the MA, or was it just a conversation where they said (for example) you'll get paid easier if you use a MA?

[cyberinvestor]

If you bet at Pinnacle and want a $500,000 wire Pinnacle does it in one shot.

Is Betfair not the same? I was not aware Betfair had payout limits or is this just limited to this case? Anyone have a larger withdrawal from Betfair over $50,000 or $100,000 and not paid in one shot?

Last question is many people have said "you could always go there and get your money". Does Betfair pay cash or large check if you go to their office? Justin7 made that statement which was echoed by others but I didn't quite understand what it meant.

Sorry for all the questions but the Betfair website isn't too good with the answers. Thanks in advance to anyone who can respond!

[shaunovery]

Good video as always justin

[Ace_of_Spades]

If you bet at Pinnacle and want a $500,000 wire Pinnacle does it in one shot.

Is Betfair not the same? I was not aware Betfair had payout limits or is this just limited to this case? Anyone have a larger withdrawal from Betfair over $50,000 or $100,000 and not paid in one shot?

Last question is many people have said "you could always go there and get your money". Does Betfair pay cash or large check if you go to their office? Justin7 made that statement which was echoed by others but I didn't quite understand what it meant.

Sorry for all the questions but the Betfair website isn't too good with the answers. Thanks in advance to anyone who can respond!

Maybe a phone call would be your best option. Thats what i'd do if i wanted answers.

[Foosball Champ]

The only thing that surprises me is that the Chinese or Russians haven't hacked betfair and stole all their money.

[Hareeba!]

If you bet at Pinnacle and want a $500,000 wire Pinnacle does it in one shot.

Is Betfair not the same? I was not aware Betfair had payout limits or is this just limited to this case? Anyone have a larger withdrawal from Betfair over $50,000 or $100,000 and not paid in one shot?

Last question is many people have said "you could always go there and get your money". Does Betfair pay cash or large check if you go to their office? Justin7 made that statement which was echoed by others but I didn't quite understand what it meant.

Sorry for all the questions but the Betfair website isn't too good with the answers. Thanks in advance to anyone who can respond!

I'm not certain about what their daily limits might be but I've withdrawn $20k in one hit a few times with no issue.

But the problem with this case is that Anty isn't a regular Betfair customer. He has something I've never heard of before which sounds like an agency agreement. From Justin's video it seems as though Betfair have paid out but to his 'agent' not directly to Anty and that's where the problem appears to be.

[durito]

just ******* stop

[jackkkk2009]

Didn't realize BF can let you withdraw that much at a time. Although they slow pay you on that large amount, the most important thing is they don't stiff players. I hope 5dimes can purchase BF & MB, then bring them back to USA..

[spider]

Why??? In theory you can win millions even from 10 USD deposit. And in practice too, though it takes time...

lets see , you bet $10 to win $3 now you have 13.
you bet 13 to win 7 now you have 20, etc. etc.

in no time you will have $3.1 million (like in 3.1 million years).
nice theory you have.

[Hareeba!]

lets see , you bet $10 to win $3 now you have 13.
you bet 13 to win 7 now you have 20, etc. etc.

in no time you will have $3.1 million (like in 3.1 million years).
nice theory you have.

actually it would take only 32 successive winning all up bets at 1.50 to get over 3.1M

[spider]

actually it would take only 32 successive winning all up bets at 1.50 to get over 3.1M

which will never happen when you are laying the superfavorites as he said that he was playing.

[the sink]

He is laying the favorites not backing them...
laying real madrid at home = playing X2

[blix177]

Man seem like all books are in slow pay mode, there really doesn't seem like any good books left. 5 years ago, good books were a dime a dozen.

[Extra Innings]

Good Report Justin