blackjack insight needed....

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  • bobby heenan
    SBR MVP
    • 03-20-09
    • 4120

    #1
    blackjack insight needed....
    kind of a long question that requires some background ....here goes

    i live in RI and im about 15 mins from foxwoods...i play blackjack regularly....dont get to go as much as id like because of the gf...she comes most of the time and doesnt mind me giving her shopping money from winnings....been trying to convince her its a 2nd source of income....shes not very keen on the idea of me going regularly by myself though.....

    i always play two hands at a time...and try to make it the last two spots on the table so i can control it somewhat.....15 dollar minimum....sometimes upping my bet into the 25-50 range on gut...but mostly staying in the 15 dollar range....play perfect strategy most of the time with a few deviations...maybe doubling a few hands i normally shouldnt...but otherwise...pretty by the book

    i havent had a losing trip in the last 50 or so visits....the one losing trip i had came after a night of drinking....and i started upping my bets ridiculously after losing only a small portion of roll early....i really do look at this as an isolated incident...where i started playing different than i usually do......the smallest amount ive taken home was 165...and that was pretty recent...was actually up in the 350 range and played a few 50 dollar hands because i knew id be leaving soon and i decided to push it....most ive taken home is about 700...probably could have stayed and pushed...but i was happy with the amount and decided to walk away...most of the time im in the 165-350 range with what im taking home...i stand behind playing two hands at a time always....and having a good size bankroll to play with....and only cashing in about 1/3 of your roll when you first sit down...

    heres my question i guess...

    i know a guy that was a few years older than me in high school...hes a pitboss now...was a dealer for awhile there...used to tell me stories about dealing to antoine walker and ben affleck upstairs in the high roller area....dont see him much except at out Fantasy football draft once a year.....but he had a theory when he was still a dealer...that u could go around to every bj table in the casino and get up one hand at each...and walk away with some money.....when he mentioned it around a group of people it was quickly shot down ....but he stood by it.....i even thought it was crazy....but the more i play...i think its actually feasible....every time i play and sit at a table...im always up a hand at some point....

    eventually ill give this a try...but i usually sit down and get sucked in to just sitting there and playing....as long as you have no issue with pissing other people off by jumping in and out of tables

    im sure most will point to times when they lost 5 or so hands in a row at some point...which happens....and say this isnt possible....but with doubling and splitting....and playing two hands at time...i think its definitley possible....although ive yet to actually test it though....and then of course there is the issue of how many people are sitting at each table....obviously playing one on one with the dealer isnt desireable even if you are playing multiple hands....

    also...if you do think its possible....obviously at a place like foxwoods there is good money to be made short term...you could hit up all of the bj tables at both ends...then walk over to the mgm side and make a few bucks over there.....but eventually theyd catch on and probably put and end to it....but a place like vegas, with many options, could have u hittng up a different spot(or a couple) on a daily basis.......anyone think this is possible to grind out a good living trying to get up one hand at each bj table in a casino??
  • iceminers26
    SBR Posting Legend
    • 10-13-08
    • 15600

    #2
    just skimmed it but my advice

    dump the girlfriend
    Comment
    • Stallion
      SBR MVP
      • 03-21-10
      • 3617

      #3
      Trial and Error. Good Luck
      Comment
      • HilltopTony
        SBR Wise Guy
        • 01-09-10
        • 767

        #4
        A little long winded, but yes if you stay disciplined. I used to do it with slots in Wheeling WV before they got the table games. I would double my 20 bucks and go to another machine. I was taking home damn near 300 every time I did it.
        Comment
        • bobby heenan
          SBR MVP
          • 03-20-09
          • 4120

          #5
          thanks for the input guys

          for now im focusing on staying disciplined on what has been working for me....and just sitting down and playing.....its probably going to take a losing trip to make me test this theory out....im kind of itching to try it out...at the same time i hope i dont have to...lol
          Comment
          • bobby heenan
            SBR MVP
            • 03-20-09
            • 4120

            #6
            Originally posted by iceminers26
            just skimmed it but my advice

            dump the girlfriend
            haha...thanks ice...but shes a gem.....but she sees some of the type of people that hang around there...and the single, desperate, women that hang around too....not really our type of people
            Comment
            • ttwarrior1
              BARRELED IN @ SBR!
              • 06-23-09
              • 28460

              #7
              50 sessions and none losing , u would be up almost 100 k, i call bull
              Comment
              • LVBOUND
                SBR MVP
                • 07-25-08
                • 2658

                #8
                Always Double down!
                Comment
                • Strange Design
                  SBR Sharp
                  • 10-06-10
                  • 251

                  #9
                  It doesn't matter if you're dealt 1000 hands at 100 tables or 1000 hands at the same table; your odds of winning are the same. So even if you win 1 unit x at number of tables and are up x units, in the long run you will eventually hit a table where you lose the first hand and never get back to even. In that situation your strategy would keep you at that table indefinitely.

                  It sounds nice, but the reality is that every table has the same house advantage so jumping around from table to table changes absolutely nothing over a large sample size.
                  Comment
                  • jarvol
                    SBR Hall of Famer
                    • 09-13-10
                    • 6074

                    #10
                    Originally posted by bobby heenan
                    dont get to go as much as id like because of the gf
                    Way to be your own man....
                    Comment
                    • jarvol
                      SBR Hall of Famer
                      • 09-13-10
                      • 6074

                      #11
                      Originally posted by Strange Design
                      It doesn't matter if you're dealt 1000 hands at 100 tables or 1000 hands at the same table; your odds of winning are the same. So even if you win 1 unit x at number of tables and are up x units, in the long run you will eventually hit a table where you lose the first hand and never get back to even. In that situation your strategy would keep you at that table indefinitely.

                      It sounds nice, but the reality is that every table has the same house advantage so jumping around from table to table changes absolutely nothing over a large sample size.
                      ^^this^^
                      Comment
                      • bobby heenan
                        SBR MVP
                        • 03-20-09
                        • 4120

                        #12
                        Originally posted by ttwarrior1
                        50 sessions and none losing , u would be up almost 100 k, i call bull
                        thats fine....but ive pondered quitting my reg job...but i dont know how to present that to my family or my gfs family...i mean...i guess i could just pretend im still working and lie...but im not really down with that....not to mention i have benefits....and the fact that i dont 100 percent believe you can get by doing this long term.....i like having the guaranteed money...if i wasnt rational i probably would have already quit
                        Comment
                        • bobby heenan
                          SBR MVP
                          • 03-20-09
                          • 4120

                          #13
                          Originally posted by Strange Design
                          It doesn't matter if you're dealt 1000 hands at 100 tables or 1000 hands at the same table; your odds of winning are the same. So even if you win 1 unit x at number of tables and are up x units, in the long run you will eventually hit a table where you lose the first hand and never get back to even. In that situation your strategy would keep you at that table indefinitely.

                          It sounds nice, but the reality is that every table has the same house advantage so jumping around from table to table changes absolutely nothing over a large sample size.
                          common sense would tell you that....

                          and im not bullshitting you...i cant remember the last time ive sat down to play regularly...and havent been up at least one hand at some point.....i see what yer saying though...if you bounce from table to table...yer probably bound to hit one where you down eventually get to even or +1

                          this theory was presented years ago by this guy...hes been dealing for years there....hes a pitboss now....dunno if he still believes it could work...but hes not dummy
                          Comment
                          • Johnny 55
                            Restricted User
                            • 05-16-09
                            • 1079

                            #14
                            god damn, people are so dumb, no has ever thought of this theory, you have discovered a gold mine, take the casinos for millions with your genius strategy.

                            if you are not counting cards you will not win in the long run, simple as that, and even if you do, you have a small advantage and without a huge bankroll would only slowly grind out profits.
                            Comment
                            • Monitor-Tan
                              SBR MVP
                              • 02-20-11
                              • 4460

                              #15
                              To the person that said every table has the same house edge is NOT TRUE. If the count on the table is tremendously favaroable to the player. Player actually has the edge.. However in thi scase OP wouldn't know which table a count is really good at..
                              Comment
                              • UntilTheNDofTimE
                                SBR Hall of Famer
                                • 05-29-08
                                • 9285

                                #16
                                Originally posted by Monitor-Tan
                                To the person that said every table has the same house edge is NOT TRUE. If the count on the table is tremendously favaroable to the player. Player actually has the edge.. However in thi scase OP wouldn't know which table a count is really good at..
                                He said over a large sample size, that includes the fact that you will randomly be walking into tables with high counts and tables with very unfavorable counts. Over say 100,000 hands the fact that you might be walking into a hot/cool table is obsolete.
                                Comment
                                • RichardGeorge
                                  SBR Wise Guy
                                  • 04-18-10
                                  • 640

                                  #17
                                  What part of Rhode island...I live in woonsocket..... I'm at the woods all.the time.. I've probably seen u at the tables before.

                                  As for the plan, they will catch on very quick.... the pitbosses notice this kind of thing immediately. Good luck, but it won't be able to last very long.
                                  Comment
                                  • bobby heenan
                                    SBR MVP
                                    • 03-20-09
                                    • 4120

                                    #18
                                    Originally posted by Johnny 55
                                    god damn, people are so dumb, no has ever thought of this theory, you have discovered a gold mine, take the casinos for millions with your genius strategy.

                                    if you are not counting cards you will not win in the long run, simple as that, and even if you do, you have a small advantage and without a huge bankroll would only slowly grind out profits.
                                    ya ya i know....im waiting for the "if its possible why doesnt this guy just quit his job and do it himself"

                                    most of the people that play are dumb....u wouldnt believe the amount of people who jump onto a 10 or 15 dollar table with 100 bankroll...play one hand at a time...and get up, having lost the 100 bucks, with a disgusted look on their faces like "this game sucks".......you arent going to do shit against the house with 100 bucks playing one hand at a time....
                                    Comment
                                    • bobby heenan
                                      SBR MVP
                                      • 03-20-09
                                      • 4120

                                      #19
                                      Originally posted by RichardGeorge
                                      What part of Rhode island...I live in woonsocket..... I'm at the woods all.the time.. I've probably seen u at the tables before.

                                      As for the plan, they will catch on very quick.... the pitbosses notice this kind of thing immediately. Good luck, but it won't be able to last very long.
                                      westerly bro....

                                      and ya....at a place like that itd get shutdown after a couple of weeks or so....but it it were possible....vegas has so many spots...you could keep working this over and over probably
                                      Comment
                                      • biggie12
                                        SBR Posting Legend
                                        • 12-30-05
                                        • 13792

                                        #20
                                        bobby what kind of blackjack games are you playing that you won 50 times in a row playing basic strat.
                                        Comment
                                        • sam9ball
                                          SBR MVP
                                          • 07-01-09
                                          • 4454

                                          #21
                                          Originally posted by RichardGeorge
                                          . As for the plan, they will catch on very quick.... the pitbosses notice this kind of thing immediately. Good luck, but it won't be able to last very long.
                                          Don't think the casino will worry about a $15 player. If it were $1500 or more then yes maybe but for $15 you cant even get rated.
                                          Comment
                                          • bobby heenan
                                            SBR MVP
                                            • 03-20-09
                                            • 4120

                                            #22
                                            Originally posted by biggie12
                                            bobby what kind of blackjack games are you playing that you won 50 times in a row playing basic strat.
                                            50 is a pretty fair estimate...not an exact figure...im not keeping books on it....im playing blackjack at foxwoods....not spanish 21...just blackjack...at blackjack tables

                                            two hands at a time...at all times
                                            Comment
                                            • biggie12
                                              SBR Posting Legend
                                              • 12-30-05
                                              • 13792

                                              #23
                                              I used to count cards, 50 winnings sessions in a row, is almost impossible even with error free counting. Im amazed you can do this with basic strategy.

                                              is it a auto shuffle machine or shoe game? how many decks?
                                              Comment
                                              • bobby heenan
                                                SBR MVP
                                                • 03-20-09
                                                • 4120

                                                #24
                                                Originally posted by sam9ball
                                                Don't think the casino will worry about a $15 player. If it were $1500 or more then yes maybe but for $15 you cant even get rated.
                                                you get rated at the woods at 15 dollars a hand...keep in mind im playing two 15 dollar hands at a time...minimum

                                                but the issue there would be....going from table to table....trying to get up one hand at each table...if it were working...and they noticed the same face trying to do this on a daily basis...im sure they would have a problem with it...if u were jumping in and jumping out....u would gain their attention

                                                it would work better long term in vegas...where you have so many casinos to operate in...they probably wouldnt remember you....this is all hypothetical of course
                                                Comment
                                                • muldoon
                                                  SBR MVP
                                                  • 01-04-10
                                                  • 4397

                                                  #25
                                                  Like someone said - 50 hands at 50 tables is no different than 50 hands at one table.

                                                  Oh, except the fact that playing dive-in hit and run will get an army of angry BJ degenerates waiting for you in the parking lot.
                                                  Comment
                                                  • bobby heenan
                                                    SBR MVP
                                                    • 03-20-09
                                                    • 4120

                                                    #26
                                                    Originally posted by biggie12
                                                    I used to count cards, 50 winnings sessions in a row, is almost impossible even with error free counting. Im amazed you can do this with basic strategy.

                                                    is it a auto shuffle machine or shoe game? how many decks?
                                                    shoe game...8 decks

                                                    they just started, last week, having to hit on soft 17's.....theyd been staying on soft 17's since i can remember....since they opened i believe
                                                    Comment
                                                    • biggie12
                                                      SBR Posting Legend
                                                      • 12-30-05
                                                      • 13792

                                                      #27
                                                      there is no way you have beaten that game 50 times in a row. Im sorry i don't believe you.

                                                      And as others have already said it doesnt matter where you are playing those hands unless you are back counting which will only Slightly improve your edge.
                                                      Comment
                                                      • jjgold
                                                        SBR Aristocracy
                                                        • 07-20-05
                                                        • 388179

                                                        #28
                                                        Seems like a bull shit story

                                                        Its impossible to win all the time
                                                        Comment
                                                        • bobby heenan
                                                          SBR MVP
                                                          • 03-20-09
                                                          • 4120

                                                          #29
                                                          Originally posted by biggie12
                                                          there is no way you have beaten that game 50 times in a row. Im sorry i don't believe you.

                                                          And as others have already said it doesnt matter where you are playing those hands unless you are back counting which will only Slightly improve your edge.
                                                          thats fine...

                                                          im beating the game playing two hands at a time....just sitting down at a single table....

                                                          but my question was...do u think its possible to get up one hand on every table in the casino during a single trip...moving from table to table...and do u think that could repeated over the course, of say, 5 trips in a row
                                                          Comment
                                                          • biggie12
                                                            SBR Posting Legend
                                                            • 12-30-05
                                                            • 13792

                                                            #30
                                                            oh god kids these days seriously....
                                                            Comment
                                                            • JohnGalt2341
                                                              SBR Hall of Famer
                                                              • 12-31-09
                                                              • 9138

                                                              #31
                                                              Originally posted by ttwarrior1
                                                              50 sessions and none losing , u would be up almost 100 k, i call bull
                                                              I agree. I would bet EVERYTHING I own that there isn't a single person on the planet that has that has ever won 50 straight trips to any Casino in the history of the world no matter what game they were playing.

                                                              For bobby heenan, a bit of history about myself. I dealt BlackJack for a few years back in my early 20's. Like yourself, I thought I could beat the game and I was very close to quitting my job(BlackJack Dealer) to play professionally. When I first memorized Basic Strategy I thought I was some sort of genius. I had various different betting strategies and I thought I had the game beat. Unlike yourself, I kept detailed records of every trip that I ever made to a Casino. I almost NEVER won on more than 4 trips in a row. After a year straight of spending virtually all of my free time trying to beat the game(keep in mind I was also dealing 40 hours a week) I finally came to the conclusion that BlackJack is virtually unbeatable in the long run.

                                                              A couple of more things, becoming a Pit Boss doesn't necessarily make you a genius at BlackJack. There's a not a single Pit Boss that I ever worked with that I felt knew more about BlackJack than I did. And I've worked with 100's of different Pit Bosses. If the Pit Boss that you know REALLY believed his theory he would be applying it and not be working as a Pit Boss. Also, Counting Cards is extremely overrated. If you are LUCKY you might get a SLIGHT edge every now and then and that's if you're playing Single or Double Deck games. There are much better ways than counting cards to win at BJ but overall trying to beat BlackJack is futile.
                                                              Comment
                                                              • blackbart
                                                                SBR MVP
                                                                • 12-04-07
                                                                • 3833

                                                                #32
                                                                what is it like to be ahead in bj?
                                                                Comment
                                                                • Recurring
                                                                  SBR Sharp
                                                                  • 12-11-10
                                                                  • 343

                                                                  #33
                                                                  keep doubling until you reach 3.5 milllion dollars
                                                                  Comment
                                                                  • ChuckyTheGoat
                                                                    BARRELED IN @ SBR!
                                                                    • 04-04-11
                                                                    • 37446

                                                                    #34
                                                                    Originally posted by jjgold
                                                                    Seems like a bull shit story

                                                                    Its impossible to win all the time
                                                                    U know it, Coach. Fiction.
                                                                    Where's the fuckin power box, Carol?
                                                                    Comment
                                                                    • thezbar
                                                                      SBR Hall of Famer
                                                                      • 08-29-06
                                                                      • 6422

                                                                      #35
                                                                      Going from one table to another then leaving once you get that one unit win is called "stick and move". It is one of many ways you can use to lower the odds of getting beat up when things go bad at one table. In the 70's players could jump in on a table when the count was in their favor mid shoe. Casino's countered that by creating the "no mid shoe entry" rule.
                                                                      No one wins all the time. But a due agree with the ex bit boss who states this tactic can be a useful and effective way of clipping a casino from some extra change.
                                                                      Comment
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