Tradesports making a move?

[Dark Horse]

This isn't too big, but it's big in the (conservative) Tradesports universe.

They are now offering free book-to-book transfers with Pinnacle. That seems to be a huge compliment from the number one book in the business. Usually books only transfer between each other if they're more or less at the same level. (Not a A+ book with a C book, in other words).

Tradesports mentions that other books will be added soon. This is a move in the right direction for an exchange where the liquidity was drying up faster than a dead lizard in the desert sun.

Interesting...

[Korchnoi]

interesting. I'm not sure what's in it for Pinny. Their partnership will produce a ton more liquidity at TS, I'm sure. I bet a lot of lines begin looking more alike at TS and Pinny and if they're always similar why would someone go to pinny when they might get filled inside on TS?

[Dark Horse]

Pinny offers infinitely more betting options. Not much overlap.

[sportsfanatic]

Pinnacle has way more depositing and withdrawing options than Tradesports so that'll probably help them. I stopped using Tradesports because they didn't add ANY new methods when Neteller left. I wish they would support Moneybookers.

[JoshW]

Very cool, lot of crossover between players.

[jjgold]

I dropped tradedsports, horrible place

[freebie]

doesn't look very appealing. looks dead to me.

[Dark Horse]

Agreed. Yet here is Pinnacle reaching out to Tradesports... Why?

[Art Vandeleigh]

I have mixed feelings about this Dark Horse. Part of me wants more liquidity at Tradesports, but sometimes......

This Friday, I wandered into the contracts for the AT&T Golf Classic. Some market maker was there trading 300 lots....or was he?

I looked at the leaderboard on the PGAtour.com site and saw that Troy Matteson was having an amazing afternoon and moved into a tie for the lead. And yet there were 244 contracts still available at 18 cents!!!

Not only had the MM left town and left all his contracts there without the odds changing, no one else had even bothered to come in and look around. I was like a kid in a candy store and no one was minding the store!!!

I gobbled up all the Matteson's, Villegas was still selling at 27 cents, shorted Cink...incredible!!!

Yes, there's something to be said for liquidity and lots of action...but sometimes, having morons as MMs and no interest by other exchange members can be very profitable indeed!!!

[jjgold]

Tradesports is washed up, no volume.

[Korchnoi]

I have mixed feelings about this Dark Horse. Part of me wants more liquidity at Tradesports, but sometimes......

This Friday, I wandered into the contracts for the AT&T Golf Classic. Some market maker was there trading 300 lots....or was he?

I looked at the leaderboard on the PGAtour.com site and saw that Troy Matteson was having an amazing afternoon and moved into a tie for the lead. And yet there were 244 contracts still available at 18 cents!!!

Not only had the MM left town and left all his contracts there without the odds changing, no one else had even bothered to come in and look around. I was like a kid in a candy store and no one was minding the store!!!

I gobbled up all the Matteson's, Villegas was still selling at 27 cents, shorted Cink...incredible!!!

Yes, there's something to be said for liquidity and lots of action...but sometimes, having morons as MMs and no interest by other exchange members can be very profitable indeed!!!

that's nuts. very nice. at least when you find this good stuff on tradesports the book doesn't cancel your bets and toss you out!

[Art Vandeleigh]

Thanks Korchnoi, yeah it really was nuts - and true!

But what JJ said about golf in another thread was true, it's totally dead if Tiger's not playing. When Tiger, maybe Phil and Vijay also, are playing, there's plenty of action at Tradesports. Tiger's line can move a lot depending on if he hit a shot in the fairway, the light rough, the thick rough, behind a tree... and of course all the other players lines are moving as well depending on what happens to Tiger, it lights up like a Christmas tree. But when those guys aren't playing....man you can hear a pin drop there.

[Art Vandeleigh]

Well I'm not too knowledgeable in the ways of the offshore world, but I sent Pinny an e-mail asking about this, and got the following reply, I assume it's standard within the industry.

FYI


"Dear Sir,

Please be advised that we do indeed have a transfer agreement with Tradesports currently.


Pinnacle Sports offers Account to Account transfers as a free service. However, please be advised that clients who choose to send or receive funds using ATAs are no longer eligible for free deposits and withdrawals as listed in our FAQ section.

Instead, all deposits and withdrawals will incur the fee paid by Pinnacle Sports to accept the deposit. In addition, the client will not be reimbursed for deposit fees normally reimbursed by Pinnacle Sports. Withdrawals by check or wire will incur a $25 USD, or equivalent charge and each NETELLER, Moneybooker, INSTADEBIT, myCitadel or WebMoney withdrawal incurs a $15 fee.

Please email our Customer Service at csd@pinnaclesports.com if you wish to change your account status to accept transfers with other Pinnacle Sports' accounts or Sports Books.

Regards,

Customer Service Department
Pinnacle Sports"

[Dark Horse]

Art, you were lucky. When contracts are left out by mistake (reflected in the price), the other side can bring that up with TS and be reimbursed if they want to pay a minimum fee (I think it's $200).

[jjgold]

Tradesports had more volume a couple of years ago and now basically done, hard to get money there for Americans therefore they have no shot.

[Dark Horse]

Did you play there? Just asking because you asked a while back how to enter offers at Matchbook.

[Art Vandeleigh]

Thanks for the info Dark Horse, I figure they have some mechanism in place to protect the MMs if something goes way wrong.

But what are you going to do? Believe it or not, I am an honest person. If I saw you drop a 20 dollar bill, I'd let you know about it. But if I see a 20 dollar bill lying on the side of the road I'm not going to start asking people if this belongs to them, you know? If someone is leaving contracts to be traded in a public environment they are his/her reponsibility. Those contracts don't have his or her name on them and they are up for grabs. I'm sure as heck not going to tell live help at Tradesports (which don't answer anyway) that some MM has messed up, and I don't think it's my responsibility to do so.

This particular golf situation didn't involve too much money (relatively speaking) but I saw a situation at Intrade a couple of weeks ago that could have been a nightmare for the MM.

It looked like there's a different MM for Dow Jones daily close and the hourly Dow at Intrade. Before the market opened, the hourly MM was showing the market futures to be about +35 and his contracts were reflecting that price (every hour!). The closing Dow MM was showing about -35 on the Dow (which was the correct futures price). The difference in price was huge needless to say. Only about 1000 contracts were traded in the hourlies as best I could tell, so I figure the hourly MM probably lost around 3 or 4k, but was probably exposed to high 5 figures $$$, maybe 6 figure $$$ losses if Intrade was being traded actively at that time of day.

Market makers beware and stay alert.

[sportsfanatic]

Well I'm not too knowledgeable in the ways of the offshore world, but I sent Pinny an e-mail asking about this, and got the following reply, I assume it's standard within the industry.

FYI


"Dear Sir,

Please be advised that we do indeed have a transfer agreement with Tradesports currently.


Pinnacle Sports offers Account to Account transfers as a free service. However, please be advised that clients who choose to send or receive funds using ATAs are no longer eligible for free deposits and withdrawals as listed in our FAQ section.

Instead, all deposits and withdrawals will incur the fee paid by Pinnacle Sports to accept the deposit. In addition, the client will not be reimbursed for deposit fees normally reimbursed by Pinnacle Sports. Withdrawals by check or wire will incur a $25 USD, or equivalent charge and each NETELLER, Moneybooker, INSTADEBIT, myCitadel or WebMoney withdrawal incurs a $15 fee.

Please email our Customer Service at csd@pinnaclesports.com if you wish to change your account status to accept transfers with other Pinnacle Sports' accounts or Sports Books.

Regards,

Customer Service Department
Pinnacle Sports"

Well that sucks. I knew free ATAs with no drawbacks was too good to be true.