Why is team USA with Lebron and Curry only -700 to win at the Olympics?

[IBetYou]

But why are the nicking players from the 3rd world if they're invincible? OK, Embiid more American than Carlick is Sudanese, but he's not American... FEAR.

[Eddy Munny]

But why are the nicking players from the 3rd world if they're invincible? OK, Embiid more American than Carlick is Sudanese, but he's not American... FEAR.

Embiid sucks. His skill set is redundant on this team. Don't act like he's doing USA a favor, they're doing him a favor by letting him chase gold. Bam and AD are clearly the two best bigs on the roster.

[biggie12]

lets go canada ship the cookies to daddy one time

[ChuckyTheGoat]

I understand why Alcaraz isn't -300 in the tennis They only play best of 3. Things could get random

But with these rosters, Canada could be a real problem, but still it's a -10-11 spread in the finals? Or maybe -15? Sure they're older now but they play every 4th day? They could do this until their 45 each, man

Explain this price to me please

Mobil, how do you rate Team USA right now? South Sudan lost by 1 in the Exhib game, 17 today.

[asiagambler]

Embiid sucks. His skill set is redundant on this team. Don't act like he's doing USA a favor, they're doing him a favor by letting him chase gold. Bam and AD are clearly the two best bigs on the roster.

But they didn't know he'd suck this badly

He's right, it is fear. They wanted to make sure he wasn't on France first of all

So it's the same reason they kept an injured Durant on the roster while kicking out Leonard and choosing Derrick White for fit instead of about 20+ other more established stars

They know they need to do everything they can to win it, it's not enough to just pick their top 12 players with no concern for fit and no gameplan and just show up and win

I'm sure Hill or whoever's picking the players doesn't want to be known as the first guy responsible for USA failing to win Olympic gold when sending their top players because it's for sure happening sooner than later

[MOBIL19]

Mobil, how do you rate Team USA right now? South Sudan lost by 1 in the Exhib game, 17 today.

It's not 'just 17 today'.

It's 26-14, 29-22 and champagne for coaching staff at the halftime.

Rating hasn't changed, as the team hasn't been challenged yet. And I doubt it will

[MOBIL19]

lets go canada ship the cookies to daddy one time

Canada will do well to stay within 17 in the final game of the tournament.

Daddy bet them to win silver, right?

[MOBIL19]

But why are the nicking players from the 3rd world if they're invincible? OK, Embiid more American than Carlick is Sudanese, but he's not American... FEAR.

That's the way sports work. Players want to get paid and play in the best leagues. Oftentimes, it leads players to change nationalities. Many Americans, men and women, play for European national teams because over there, national basketball federations impose rules making it hard for ballclubs to field teams that are mainly foreign by passport, kind of like salary cap in the NFL here.

[ChuckyTheGoat]

It's not 'just 17 today'.

It's 26-14, 29-22 and champagne for coaching staff at the halftime.

Rating hasn't changed, as the team hasn't been challenged yet. And I doubt it will

Probably true. They built a comfortable halftime margin and did coast in the 2h.

Will see how the bracket shakes out. I don't think they're invincible.

[Eddy Munny]

But they didn't know he'd suck this badly

He's right, it is fear. They wanted to make sure he wasn't on France first of all

So it's the same reason they kept an injured Durant on the roster while kicking out Leonard and choosing Derrick White for fit instead of about 20+ other more established stars

They know they need to do everything they can to win it, it's not enough to just pick their top 12 players with no concern for fit and no gameplan and just show up and win

I'm sure Hill or whoever's picking the players doesn't want to be known as the first guy responsible for USA failing to win Olympic gold when sending their top players because it's for sure happening sooner than later

Since when is strategy and foreplanning a symptom of fear? What kind of nonsense is that?

Of course the United States angled for the best players and ones they felt would complement one another because that's what you're supposed to do. Is calling a timeout and drawing up a play also a sign of "fear?"

I mean no shit they're going to opt for Durant if he's available because he's still one of the best in the world and the early returns bear that out. Are they supposed to apologize for trying? Players win games, not uniforms.

And for your information, the United States already failed to secure gold in the Olympics with NBA players 20 years ago and a handful of times in the FIBA's. It's already been established that they can't afford to simply mail it in. That ship has long sailed, you're not exactly breaking news, there chief.

[asiagambler]

Since when is strategy and foreplanning a symptom of fear? What kind of nonsense is that?

Of course the United States angled for the best players and ones they felt would complement one another because that's what you're supposed to do. Is calling a timeout and drawing up a play also a sign of "fear?"

I mean no shit they're going to opt for Durant if he's available because he's still one of the best in the world and the early returns bear that out. Are they supposed to apologize for trying? Players win games, not uniforms.

And for your information, the United States already failed to secure gold in the Olympics with NBA players 20 years ago and a handful of times in the FIBA's. It's already been established that they can't afford to simply mail it in. That ship has long sailed, you're not exactly breaking news, there chief.

Well no it is breaking news when you consider the rhetoric of this entire thread

And yes of course those are all fear if you're the USA

I clearly said when they brought their TOP PLAYERS. 2004 roster was a joke. Are you seriously calling those guys the top players at that time ????

Same with FIBA WC. They rarely took that seriously but the times they did, they cruised. So I completely disagree that it has been established that they can't afford to mail it in WITH THEIR TOP PLAYERS. Well actually, maybe it was established in Tokyo where they lost to France. That's another discussion but it definitely wasn't established 20 years ago

[Eddy Munny]

Well no it is breaking news when you consider the rhetoric of this entire thread

And yes of course those are all fear if you're the USA

I clearly said when they brought their TOP PLAYERS. 2004 roster was a joke. Are you seriously calling those guys the top players at that time ????

Same with FIBA WC. They rarely took that seriously but the times they did, they cruised. So I completely disagree that it has been established that they can't afford to mail it in WITH THEIR TOP PLAYERS. Well actually, maybe it was established in Tokyo where they lost to France. That's another discussion but it definitely wasn't established 20 years ago

Well your definition of fear is absurd. Literally every coach/organization in the history of competitive sports is riddled with fear if that's the case and therefore the point is moot.

The 2004 roster was what it was because top players declined. It's not like the committee was nonchalant and "fearless" and felt they could just roll the ball out. Their objective has always been to assemble the best team, whether or not that actually materializes is a whole nother story.

[asiagambler]

Well your definition of fear is absurd. Literally every coach/organization in the history of competitive sports is burdened with fear if that's the case and therefore the point is moot.

The 2004 roster was what it was because top players declined. It's not like the committee was nonchalant and "fearless" and felt they could just roll the ball out. Their objective has always been to assemble the best team, whether or not that actually materializes is a whole nother story.

Exactly. Which is why it's nothing to do with what I said. That roster had just ONE All-NBA player or All-Star from the year before (or something like that). There are definitely some recognizable names (even a young LeBron ) but they were rookies or very early in their career

And you think that's absurd? How about this: The 92 Dream Team didn't call a single timeout during the entire tournament, even when they trailed to Croatia (26-24?) in the gold medal match (only time in the entire Olympics they trailed I believe). When Daly was asked about if it was a consideration, he said 'NO' and something along the lines of not wanting to show any FEAR

[asiagambler]

Looking back at that 2020 roster, it's actually not that great. Definitely missing a few of the top top guys. Jerami Grant?? Zach Lavine??? Some are just LOL (Javale McGee ?????)

So can probably even throw that out of the discussion and losing 1 game in the group stages was probably a fair result

[IBetYou]

Looking back at that 2020 roster, it's actually not that great. Definitely missing a few of the top top guys. Jerami Grant?? Zach Lavine??? Some are just LOL (Javale McGee ?????)

So can probably even throw that out of the discussion and losing 1 game in the group stages was probably a fair result

You mean the '21 roster. '20 was the covid year... That was a strong roster. Holiday & Booker were starters just like this year. Lillard in place of Curry and Bam at centre (no Cameroon help) and Durant - their best FIBA player - at the 4. James & Curry weren't there, but it's not like other teams don't have key absences.

There's also the absence of the top teams in some cases because qualification from Europe is more difficult than from Americas; Serbia weren't in the '21 Olympics.

[IBetYou]

Interesting that Popovich was the coach of the '21 team and he didn't start Tatum..... he's not regarded by top American coaches as being in the same class as James & Durant, even now -ostensibly being closer to his prime.

Edit: I mean he started Holiday at SF over Tatum. Think about that when people talk about the Celtics as a 2-star team.

[Eddy Munny]

Exactly. Which is why it's nothing to do with what I said. That roster had just ONE All-NBA player or All-Star from the year before (or something like that). There are definitely some recognizable names (even a young LeBron ) but they were rookies or very early in their career

And you think that's absurd? How about this: The 92 Dream Team didn't call a single timeout during the entire tournament, even when they trailed to Croatia (26-24?) in the gold medal match (only time in the entire Olympics they trailed I believe). When Daly was asked about if it was a consideration, he said 'NO' and something along the lines of not wanting to show any FEAR

I'm still not quite sure what you're going round and round about.

That because the USA has to try its best, it must be fearful? That's an argument a 12 year old would have.

What team doesn't put forth its best effort? This isn't the Harlem Globetrotters versus the Generals.

Like we've already acknowledged time and time again that the world has closed the gap. Bringing up the '92 Dream Team is a pointless argument, the global hoops scene was in its infancy at the time. You might as well bring up the Wright Brothers and tell us air travel is an inconvenience.

All you're really saying is that it's understood that if the United States pussyfoots around in effort and/or personnel, that they can and will be beat in this day and age. No kidding. That's how competitive sports work. Nick Saban wanted the best players on his team and built the best coaching staff as well, therefore, by your kindergarten definition, he was one of the most scared head coaches in college football. Just fear and dread from head to toe.

[JIBBBY]

Dream team 2.0. This team is gonna sweep with blowouts to win the GOLD. This team came together and playing hard, even on the defensive end now. Good luck with all that.

[SomeDayinBuffalo]

Dream team 2.0. This team is gonna sweep with blowouts to win the GOLD. This team came together and playing hard, even on the defensive end now. Good luck with all that.

With Puerto Rico not the same time around. The starters will get plenty of rest this game.

[asiagambler]

I'm still not quite sure what you're going round and round about.

That because the USA has to try its best, it must be fearful? That's an argument a 12 year old would have.

What team doesn't put forth its best effort? This isn't the Harlem Globetrotters versus the Generals.

Like we've already acknowledged time and time again that the world has closed the gap. Bringing up the '92 Dream Team is a pointless argument, the global hoops scene was in its infancy at the time. You might as well bring up the Wright Brothers and tell us air travel is an inconvenience.

All you're really saying is that it's understood that if the United States pussyfoots around in effort and/or personnel, that they can and will be beat in this day and age. No kidding. That's how competitive sports work. Nick Saban wanted the best players on his team and built the best coaching staff as well, therefore, by your kindergarten definition, he was one of the most scared head coaches in college football. Just fear and dread from head to toe.

No you are the one going round and round. You brought up 2004 when USA didn't send their top players after I clearly said I'm talking about when USA brings their top players. That's the argument a 12 year old makes. You brought up FIBA WC as if that somehow makes your point stronger when USA cares even less about those

We clearly have NOT acknowledged the world has closed the gap if you look at the posts here at SBR. This isn't the only thread I saw with this same sentiment

You're angry because you're seemingly a Lebron fanboy so you're getting very defensive and emotional because a few of us are poking fun at how hard USA is try-harding at this

The tongue in cheek comment about timeouts clearly went over your head. You've fallen off quite a bit here

[asiagambler]

You mean the '21 roster. '20 was the covid year... That was a strong roster. Holiday & Booker were starters just like this year. Lillard in place of Curry and Bam at centre (no Cameroon help) and Durant - their best FIBA player - at the 4. James & Curry weren't there, but it's not like other teams don't have key absences.

There's also the absence of the top teams in some cases because qualification from Europe is more difficult than from Americas; Serbia weren't in the '21 Olympics.

Yea it was strong. USA lucky they have Durant and how willing he's been to play in the Olympics time and time again. Most guys are happy to win just once then pass the baton. How patriotic of him !!

[Eddy Munny]

No you are the one going round and round. You brought up 2004 when USA didn't send their top players after I clearly said I'm talking about when USA brings their top players. That's the argument a 12 year old makes. You brought up FIBA WC as if that somehow makes your point stronger when USA cares even less about those

We clearly have NOT acknowledged the world has closed the gap if you look at the posts here at SBR. This isn't the only thread I saw with this same sentiment

You're angry because you're seemingly a Lebron fanboy so you're getting very defensive and emotional because a few of us are poking fun at how hard USA is try-harding at this

The tongue in cheek comment about timeouts clearly went over your head. You've fallen off quite a bit here

Are you sure we're having the same conversation? Nothing I've directed at you is even remotely controversial or anything I would regard as a "hot take." My points about the 2004 Olympics and the FIBA World Championships are relevant because it illustrates the fact that we are very liable to falter on the global stage if we put forth less than 100%.

In other words, yes, the USA has to TRY at basketball. Anyone with any sense about them knows this and has for awhile. There's precedent for what happens when we don't. I don't care what a couple of rogue posters on SBR say, it's common knowledge that the world can compete now.

What I find bizarre is that you hold this position that the USA trying is somehow uncool, desperate, or pathetic. You keep reiterating this point and I'm just scratching my head. Show me an organization competing at the highest level, in any sport, that doesn't try, and I'll show you a team with an empty trophy case.

Fire is hot. Water is wet. The USA has to try to capture gold. What am I missing here?

I give you the benefit of the doubt because normally you're a good poster, but you lost me on this one.

[asiagambler]

Are you sure we're having the same conversation? Nothing I've directed at you is even remotely controversial or anything I would regard as a "hot take." My points about the 2004 Olympics and the FIBA World Championships are relevant because it illustrates the fact that we are very liable to falter on the global stage if we put forth less than 100%.

In other words, yes, the USA has to TRY at basketball. Anyone with any sense about them knows this and has for awhile. There's precedent for what happens when we don't. I don't care what a couple of rogue posters on SBR say, it's common knowledge that the world can compete now.

What I find bizarre is that you hold this position that the USA trying is somehow uncool, desperate, or pathetic. You keep reiterating this point and I'm just scratching my head. Show me an organization competing at the highest level, in any sport, that doesn't try, and I'll show you a team with an empty trophy case.

Fire is hot. Water is wet. The USA has to try to capture gold. What am I missing here?

I give you the benefit of the doubt because normally you're a good poster, but you lost me on this one.

2004 and FIBA have zero relevance to what I said because I said I'm only talking about when USA sends their best players. It's that simple. You keep bringing it up is going round and round

The whole try/try-hard/fear dialogue has quite obviously gone way over your head. It's really not that deep

You should probably stop giving me the benefit of the doubt because you keep making yourself look like a fool lol

[Eddy Munny]

2004 and FIBA have zero relevance to what I said because I said I'm only talking about when USA sends their best players. It's that simple. You keep bringing it up is going round and round

The whole try/try-hard/fear dialogue has quite obviously gone way over your head. It's really not that deep

You should probably stop giving me the benefit of the doubt because you keep making yourself look like a fool lol

I'm okay with looking like a fool as long as it's in another fool's mind. Yes, I'm looking at you.

The 2004 Olympics and FIBA's are relevant because they serve as precedent for less than optimal results when the USA doesn't "try" henceforth why they are "trying" now. Do you understand? Read the actual words I'm saying instead of glossing over them and salivating at your chance to reply.

[asiagambler]

I'm okay with looking like a fool as long as it's in another fool's mind. Yes, I'm looking at you.

The 2004 Olympics and FIBA's are relevant because they serve as precedent for less than optimal results when the USA doesn't "try" henceforth why they are "trying" now. Do you understand? Read the actual words I'm saying instead of glossing over them and salivating at your chance to reply.

No I don't understand. You should block me or something so you don't have to keep replying the same thing to me over and over again

[Eddy Munny]

No I don't understand. You should block me or something so you don't have to keep replying the same thing to me over and over again

Well if you say that the 2004 roster was a joke, and I equate the 2004 roster to not trying, then we're essentially in agreement... see? It's really not that hard. Then I took our agreed upon supposition and used it as the foundation for my argument of why the committee, players, coaches etc. understand that "trying" is a necessary ingredient to winning gold nowadays. What was the case 30, 40, 50 years ago is not the case today, both in sports and otherwise.

[Eddy Munny]

Yeah that got you to pipe down real quick, didn't it shooter...

If you hadn't been all puffed up and eager to argue, you'd have seen the forest for the trees straight away.

[asiagambler]

Yeah that got you to pipe down real quick, didn't it shooter...

If you hadn't been all puffed up and eager to argue, you'd have seen the forest for the trees straight away.

Well you finally stopped coming off like an angry teenage girl and replied in a civil manner so I just let it go

But I guess you were too ashamed to leave it at that so by all means carry on with your boring arguments

[Eddy Munny]

Well you finally stopped coming off like an angry teenage girl and replied in a civil manner so I just let it go

But I guess you were too ashamed to leave it at that so by all means carry on with your boring arguments

All my replies were civil. You were just butthurt over the fact that I compared your attitude to that of a 12-year-old online edgelord for scorning "trying" from a country in a sport they're supposed to dominate in their sleep I guess.

You also argued like your life depended on it over a minor detail on which I actually agreed with you on. Again, pretty juvenile. If that doesn't warrant the 12yo remark then I'll give you 13, tops.

[asiagambler]

All my replies were civil. You were just butthurt over the fact that I compared your attitude to that of a 12-year-old online edgelord for scorning "trying" from a country in a sport they're supposed to dominate in their sleep I guess.

You also argued like your life depended on it over a minor detail on which I actually agreed with you on. Again, pretty juvenile. If that doesn't warrant the 12yo remark then I'll give you 13, tops.

No no no, your replies weren't civil. It's you that was "butthurt" because I offended your sensibilities about trying. And here you are many posts later droning on continuing to argue like your life depends on it about something so trivial. You're literally projecting all your deficiencies onto me

You even gave yourself a little pat on the back reassuring yourself that you got me to pipe down

[Eddy Munny]

No no no, your replies weren't civil. It's you that was "butthurt" because I offended your sensibilities about trying. And here you are many posts later droning on continuing to argue like your life depends on it about something so trivial. You're literally projecting all your deficiencies onto me

You even gave yourself a little pat on the back reassuring yourself that you got me to pipe down

Well you did pipe down, only after I highlighted the fact that I agreed with you. The sad thing is I always had been agreeing with you on that particular point but you were on such a warpath that it kept going over your head.

So you called that post "civil" only because it finally dawned on you that you were arguing with ghosts.

[Eddy Munny]

Furthermore, you never even bothered to answer my question because you knew that any attempt to do so would paint you into a very uncomfortable corner.

And so I ask again, show me an organization in any sport at any competitive level that isn't full of fear. To be clear, we're using your definition of "fear" which apparently no one else in the functioning neuro-typical world recognizes.

[asiagambler]

Well you did pipe down, only after I highlighted the fact that I agreed with you. The sad thing is I always had been agreeing with you on that particular point but you were on such a warpath that it kept going over your head.

So you called that post "civil" only because it finally dawned on you that you were arguing with ghosts.

But why are you even still arguing at that point ???

LOL I called that post civil because it was civil and I had no interest in continuing to ridicule you

You got triggered by some people (ok mostly me) poking a little fun at USA basketball for some reason and almost had a complete meltdown. Like I said, you fell off !!

[asiagambler]

Furthermore, you never even bothered to answer my question because you knew that any attempt to do so would paint you into a very uncomfortable corner.

And so I ask again, show me an organization in any sport at any competitive level that isn't full of fear. To be clear, we're using your definition of "fear" which apparently no one else in the functioning neuro-typical world recognizes.

Do you even read your posts ?

"Uncomfortable corner??" Straight comedy

[Eddy Munny]

But why are you even still arguing at that point ???

LOL I called that post civil because it was civil and I had no interest in continuing to ridicule you

You got triggered by some people (ok mostly me) poking a little fun at USA basketball for some reason and almost had a complete meltdown. Like I said, you fell off !!

That would be a great point except for the fact that none of it is true. Meltdown? Nope, try again.

You're not fooling anyone trying to play it off as a joke. You were clearly serious and attributed it to some SBR posters in various threads (whom you haven't named and probably never will) who allegedly made hyperbolic claims on behalf of USA hoops, and your criticism of USA's efforts as "try-hard" and "fear based" was in direct response to those people.

See you've been blowing so much hot air you can't even recall the plot at this point.

I think that deserves a laughing emoji. Here it comes...