Whats with all the BWIN.COM complaints ? SBR DO SOMETHING !
these guys are really starting to act like they are too big to answer to anyone and they can do as they please.
Not cool .
Very unstable book , BEWARE
Not cool .
Very unstable book , BEWARE
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After Bwin 2 executives were placed to jail in France for going around EU laws on gambling regulation and advertising in EU while being an offshore company, they got it: They hired hundreds of lawyers to protect them, I read articles on Google where it's even written that Bwin want to put pressure on officials who restrict their octopus from acting against the law.
They face 3 years in jail in France if found guilty and had to place multimillion $ bale bonds to be released. They need all this lawyers to protect their ass in first place.
I am also suspecting them on various fraud schemes and placed it on my blog, you can agree with it you can not, this is my opinion after I fell a victim to their fraud. They also used lawyers against me (only for demanding my winning bets returnet, 736eur, when I placed 30 sport bets, risked a lot of money to win it) to scare me off, but it had the opposite effect, I just got more engaged and active and convinced even more that my views have a merit.
Thank you for supporting me and other defrauded Bwin customers, drop by drop we will get them accountable to us, and even if we will get nothing from them (how can they pay us, if we are not licking their asses to return our money we legally won), our examples will be of help to other potential customers. They will decide for themselves if to open Bwin account or not. It's everybody's private decision.Comment -
What's SBR going to do? Send VegasDave and CrazyLou to roughen them up? It's like sending a mall cop to capture Pablo Escobar.Comment -
HAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAAH!!! That was funny Pavs
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Don't underestimate the power of the internet.
Besides all the big mafia types and other big gangsters where catched often by making small mistakes (the thiev, even if he stole a billion and nobody yet knows about it, is a thiev in nature) like stealing a Snickers in a grocery store and then cops got his fingerprints.
Or like buying stolen Patek Philippe platinum watch (retail from 70,000$) from a pawn shop in Brooklyn for 10,000$ and then being stopped at the airport and after checking watch's serial number getting arrested.
Thieves have no sizes, it's a character and a way of life.Comment -
one thief...two thievesComment -
Thank you.Originally posted by pavyracerComment -
i would expect a bit more out of you honestly.Originally posted by pavyracer
Perhaps like a downgrade from SBR , or a newsletter .
Will make players aware of what is going onComment -
I contacted H2 Gambling Capital regarding their subscriptions and reports about gambling industry, but after I received a quoute from 2000$ to 10000$ per annum, I said no, thanks. They write more about the whole industry from investment perspective, it's like investment bank and research boutique for gambling companies, not what average player like you and me needs.
I offered them to make a cheaper version of their services, kind on newsletter where they will rate a stability of a bookmakers on a monthly or quarterly basis and will distribute it for low price to players, so we can know about company's health not from their advertising on T-Shirts but from H2 Gambling Capital database. This is exactly what they do, they cover only gambling industry's private and public companies. They have all the statistics we can't get elswhere, but SBR is doing even better job on it with it's free ratings on betting companies and covers almost all of it FOR FREE.
Regarding Bwin, I can provide real reasons why they have to be downgraded Bwin to D and below (nothing to do with my complain, it's based on their balance sheet, they lost 20,000,000eur in year 2008 on about 400,000,000eur in revenues, it's alarming as not profitable company can use even cheating casino games where more players will lose than otherwise, already they are under pressure and lose money). This can be seen here on the down right. http://www.bwin.org/InvestorRelation...tienchart.aspx
I personally think they are going to lose even more in 2009-2010.
Link to H2 Gambling Capital : http://www.h2gc.com/index.phpComment -
Bwin is very much better these days than years ago. I canĀ“t understand this complaints. There are so much horrible european books around. Bwin is not one of theseComment -
I don't know about other rotten books so I can not comment. I only comment on facts: I won 736eur, was not paid for me it's enough to call Bwin a fraud. I represent myself only. I read here complaints about all kind of tricks by bwin, chip dumping, deleting of previously entered correctly details by customers and their accounts closed.
I think the problem lies with the management of Bwin and they demand from their employees to close accounts that are profitable, because Bwin itself is not profitable and must look for ways to make money. Their losses are very significant: 20 million euros only in 2008.
Madoff pyramid fell and Stanfor Financial , because the new inflows were smaller than withdrawal requests by existing customers, these making a pyramid not profitable or able to cover up.
Bwin claims to have 20 million customers (does anybody here believes it?), 2008 revenues of 400,000,000 euros, in other words average revenue per customer is 20 euro per year. Very strange. Only 1.5 euro per month per customer.
I checked Ladbrokes financilas and other companies below, they are all profitable even in the current recession, which is not strange as gambling is a profitable business. Look at their profits:
Look at William Hill profits:
Party Gaming profits:
888 Holdings profits:
Now look at situation with Bwin:
http://www.bwin.org/InvestorRelation...tienchart.aspx
There will be bankruptcies in this industry, same as in any other industry and Bwin being the weakest from it's reputable competitors ( I am only sure about Ladbrokes and William Hill reputation, others I don't know), looks as such bankruptcy candidate. Time will show.Comment -
Price earning ratio: -33.93 wow
Myself I'm still playing at bwin. I have had problems with them several times. However they are poor when it comes to oddsmaking. Therefore you can find good valuebets on the site and that's why I continue to play there.Comment -
Madoff and Stanford Financial also offered above standard interest on low risk securities (bonds) and it helped them to become so big Ponzi schemes. Scamster know that greed is very important for investors, why to get 3% from UBS or J.P.Morgan on 10 year US government bonds, when Bernard Madoff and Allen Stanford promised to pay from 5-8% for the same safety bonds.
They also had sended their investors financial performance statements and published their quarterly reports on their websites, but not even 1$ was invested in anything. Allen Stanford used this deposits for his personal businesses ( on CNBC report about Stanford's fraud, there was shown one example how he bought an island in Antigua for 60 million $ and placed it's value on the books at 3 billion $ next day) and Madoff was even smarter, he just laundered this money to his offshore accounts to various jurisdictions. He did it for almost 30 years and regulators SEC when were first warned in 2005 that his financial accounts don't correspond to the facts as on the CBOE, where stock options are traded, the total volume traded a day, was much smaller from what he alone claimed he traded. (20 million Bwin customers)
This first people who warned about it, were told to shut up as Madoff had such a good reputation and nobody considered their warnings.
If I would write to Madoff or Stanford 1 year ago that they are scam, their lawyers would sue me for eternity and their customers would take out my eyes. But the time is a final judge, you can't cheat the time.
Look how their websites look today:
After first reports about fraud there, I immediately clicked to their websites, c'mon, if I would not be experienced investor, I would place all the money in the world how good they looked.
Stanford's motto was: HARD WORK. CLEAR VISION. VALUE for the CLIENT™
I am not sure if anybody from investment industry will take this trademarked phrase now.Comment
