BetOnline is trying to steal $65,000 from me (cliff notes at end)

[gridiron guru]

What in the world is "chip dumping" anyway

[DHB]

What in the world is "chip dumping" anyway

see here http://bit.ly/1zkI6n

[HedgeHog]

My 7-day express check from BOL finally arrived today. It took 17 days total, but I'm just glad to get it. SBR should request that BOL update their payout times to match reality. They should also consider removing BOL from their recommended list given all that has transpired lately, especially after this attempted poker theft of 65k. JMO.

[Legions36]

My 7-day express check from BOL finally arrived today. It took 17 days total, but I'm just glad to get it. SBR should request that BOL update their payout times to match reality. They should also consider removing BOL from their recommended list given all that has transpired lately, especially after this attempted poker theft of 65k. JMO.

Come on Hedge u already know u might have to wait sometimes to get your $ from here, there is so much value in this place that it makes up for the wait and they will always pay u. This place would not steal from anyone seems OP was stuck in the middle of a big scam, i even apologized to OP for doubting him. Give them a chance!!!! don't let all these haters make u lose extra value and money.

[sharpcat]

Come on Hedge u already know u might have to wait sometimes to get your $ from here, there is so much value in this place that it makes up for the wait and they will always pay u. This place would not steal from anyone seems OP was stuck in the middle of a big scam, i even apologized to OP for doubting him. Give them a chance!!!! don't let all these haters make u lose extra value and money.

I have never seen Pinnacle slow pay a single player, I have also never seen Pinnacle offer "so much value".

Books who offer as you put it "so much value" do not do it because they are looking to hand out free money, they do it because they are incompetent. The fact that you continue to state that they offer you such great value to play there compared with their slow ability to pay should be extremely alarming to you.

[bubba]

Come on Hedge u already know u might have to wait sometimes to get your $ from here, there is so much value in this place that it makes up for the wait and they will always pay u. This place would not steal from anyone seems OP was stuck in the middle of a big scam, i even apologized to OP for doubting him. Give them a chance!!!! don't let all these haters make u lose extra value and money.

still it would be nice if they had the actual payout times listed on the website instead of fantasy times.

there website should list each method and have the expected payout time for other books. then it should say to add 1-4 weeks onto timeframe for betonline to process said payout!

[Legions36]

I have never seen Pinnacle slow pay a single player, I have also never seen Pinnacle offer "so much value".

Books who offer as you put it "so much value" do not do it because they are looking to hand out free money, they do it because they are incompetent. The fact that you continue to state that they offer you such great value to play there compared with their slow ability to pay should be extremely alarming to you.

Wow how do u bring Pinnacle into this, do u not realize that some of us live in the US and do not have this as an option. Also i don't live paycheck to paycheck so if i have to wait some i don't care, but if your doing this offshore stuff and need your money fats then go to places that pay fast, Betislands pays the same day if u want. If Betonline ever doesn't pay me thats a different story , but while they keep giving me bonuses when i want and having great lines i will continue to use them. If it wasn't for SBR i would not have found them and have them as an out, ty SBR for all your help in helping me to find all these places that have been just great to me.

[Legions36]

still it would be nice if they had the actual payout times listed on the website instead of fantasy times.

there website should list each method and have the expected payout time for other books. then it should say to add 1-4 weeks onto timeframe for betonline to process said payout!

Your absolutely right about the timeframe stated, but the new methods are fairly new and into football season so that could be the reason why the delays. Also noted Alex did recently say that they took on crazy new amounts of business so maybe they are overwhelmed, it sucks that so many people won't even give them a chance or even consider some possibilities.

[prop]

Sharpcat this should tell you what you want to know.

It is either A)

while they keep giving me bonuses when i want and having great lines i will continue to use them.

or it's B)

If it wasn't for SBR i would not have found them and have them as an out, ty SBR for all your help in helping me to find all these places that have been just great to me.

A is obvious. B appears obvious but A is so obvious that I could somehow be convinced B is just a byproduct...

[mighty maron]

I hope op gets his first wire before football season ends....

[Legions36]

Sharpcat this should tell you what you want to know.

It is either A)


or it's B)


A is obvious. B appears obvious but A is so obvious that I could somehow be convinced B is just a byproduct...

If your trying to mock me go ahead. Yes i like bonuses and especially theres i get a bonus everytime i load whether i withdraw or not anytime i want, i rollover my bonus take it out and do it again. How stupid can u be. I also like to bet dimelines on hockey why would i wanna pay extra when i have to.
I guess your trying to claim im a degenerate but sir im quite the opposite.

[skrtelfan]

What in the world is "chip dumping" anyway

Chip dumping is intentionally losing chips to another player. Say player A makes a deposit with a stolen CC, or one that he intends to charge back. He loses all his chips to player B. The stolen card is then credited back to the owner, or a ********** is made. Player B can now say "Hey, I won these chips fair and square!" If the book can prove chip dumping, they will revoke the winnings from player B.

[bubba]

Your absolutely right about the timeframe stated, but the new methods are fairly new and into football season so that could be the reason why the delays. Also noted Alex did recently say that they took on crazy new amounts of business so maybe they are overwhelmed, it sucks that so many people won't even give them a chance or even consider some possibilities.

no excuse not to have the correct time frames stated. everyone who reads this board knows that there "7 day payout" does not come in 7 days. it needs to be changed. either pay in the stated time frame or change the time frame on the website. overwhelmed might be an excuse for a week or 2 but its been this way for 3 months(at least).

[mighty maron]

Update by OP please. I would be emailing every day about the money.

[sapidoc]

Congrats to the OP on the favorable decision. However, you won a battle not the War as BOL will slow-pay you for sure (same as they are doing with my $2500 check). Your first wire will not be received before 2012 and I'll bet anyone even money on this. Also, I'm not so sure you'll have your full 65k by next Thanksgiving. BOL is a joke at B+, even SBR knows it.

OK lets set the clock then for the first 15K wire.....what is the quoted time on the BOL website or a reasonable time for the wire to hit.....

Dax can we get a line in the SBR book pls?

[Quarius]

I've always liked Betonline.

[lt56]

After reading through this long thread; how does Betonline stay B+? The ratings of these sites mean nothing if sites can delay payments for a month as 5Dimes did or clearly try to rob people as BOL just did. The ratings mean nothing if they maintain their ratings here. And to the owner of the other site; Prop; how much were you paid off to remove BOL from your blacklist? You also lose credibility. They haven't paid a dime to the OP yet and clearly lied and tried to rob him. Prop; you as much as anyone knew from the start that BOL had no chip dumping proof on the OP. What I learn from this thread is to no longer trust the ratings of any internet sites and to get away from offshore once I either lose this week or win and close my 5D account. I think most of the books have major money problems now

[SBR Lou]

After reading through this long thread; how does Betonline stay B+? The ratings of these sites mean nothing if sites can delay payments for a month as 5Dimes did or clearly try to rob people as BOL just did.

If ratings fluctuated along with the knee-jerk reactions of the public, I don't think any sportsbook would maintain an A rating longer than a prom dress stays on.

Fortunately, we don't have to talk in theory - we can look at things like the results of the SBR users posters poll last month, the monthly payout reports thread, the news feeds etc. Personally I think it's great having you guys as sounding boards. What gets lost in the fray though is that forums are prone to squeaky wheels. Google some reviews of your laptop. I bet you'll come away thinking your machine will explode in a year.

If customer service was more important than payouts then I'd say the flack is well-deserved at times. The fact remains BetOnline has never not paid a player and really cares about getting better in the areas you guys have pointed out.

[Greg242]

UPDATE: Hey guys sorry I have not updated my thread sooner. I must say I am happy with the way I am being treated now by BetOnline but of course nothing can ever justify the original situation happening in the first place. On Saturday I got an email from the director of operations stating that she would like to talk with me about my situation and had tried calling my phone twice but I did not answer. Here is what was discussed on Monday when she called again and I answered:

1) My first $15,000 wire withdrawal I had requested on Friday had been expedited personally by her and I actually had recieved the wire in my account before I even spoke to her on Monday. I must admit this was impressive.

2) I requested another $15,000 on Monday and it has already been processed today so I think I will have it tomorrow in my account.

3) Because of what I have gone through I was told that all of my bank wires will be expedited.

4) She told me where in the rules it talks about the 1x rollover but admitted that it should not have applied to me because of all of the rake I contributed in the poker room and refunded me half of my wager back (so I recieved $650 back).

5) She explained that it was unacceptable that the hand histories had not been released in a timely matter and apologized for that. Their explanation was that there was miscommunication with the front lines people about not giving hand histories of other players out. However I made sure to ask that they were saving the hand histories and she confirmed they were and offered to send them to me if I would still like. Not sure exactly what she said about the fron line hand histories procedures but take it for whatever it is worth ...

6) I was told that they were new to poker and that is why this mistake happened. They told me I was the biggest mistake they had made because of them being new and unfamiliar with poker operations and they were going to try and make it up to me anyway possible ...


Will still update this thread to tell when I recieve the wires.

[mighty maron]

If ratings fluctuated along with the knee-jerk reactions of the public, I don't think any sportsbook would maintain an A rating longer than a prom dress stays on.

Fortunately, we don't have to talk in theory - we can look at things like the results of the SBR users posters poll last month, the monthly payout reports thread, the news feeds etc. Personally I think it's great having you guys as sounding boards. What gets lost in the fray though is that forums are prone to squeaky wheels. Google some reviews of your laptop. I bet you'll come away thinking your machine will explode in a year.

If customer service was more important than payouts then I'd say the flack is well-deserved at times. The fact remains BetOnline has never not paid a player and really cares about getting better in the areas you guys have pointed out.

BOL plays on an online poker network that does not allow US customers. The action poker network is non-US. The reason why its non-US is because any public owned poker company left the US market after the UIGEA was implemented. The reason why they did was to protect their stockholders.
The Action poker network is owned by Playsafe. Playsafe is on the Norwegian stock exchange. By BOL being an american friendly site on a non-usa poker network they are risking the stockholders of the company who may not know what is happening.

#2. How can a site even think of seizing 65k for chip dumping when it can not handle hand histories?

#3 BOL may not deserve this comparison but last year Bet Phoenix was having all sorts of slower pay issues being rated B+. When they stopped advertising the rating dropped. BOL has the same rating...has had slower payouts... the comparison might be unfair but at first glance they appear similiar

[mighty maron]

UPDATE: Hey guys sorry I have not updated my thread sooner. I must say I am happy with the way I am being treated now by BetOnline but of course nothing can ever justify the original situation happening in the first place. On Saturday I got an email from the director of operations stating that she would like to talk with me about my situation and had tried calling my phone twice but I did not answer. Here is what was discussed on Monday when she called again and I answered:

1) My first $15,000 wire withdrawal I had requested on Friday had been expedited personally by her and I actually had recieved the wire in my account before I even spoke to her on Monday. I must admit this was impressive.

2) I requested another $15,000 on Monday and it has already been processed today so I think I will have it tomorrow in my account.

3) Because of what I have gone through I was told that all of my bank wires will be expedited.

4) She told me where in the rules it talks about the 1x rollover but admitted that it should not have applied to me because of all of the rake I contributed in the poker room and refunded me half of my wager back (so I recieved $650 back).

5) She explained that it was unacceptable that the hand histories had not been released in a timely matter and apologized for that. Their explanation was that there was miscommunication with the front lines people about not giving hand histories of other players out. However I made sure to ask that they were saving the hand histories and she confirmed they were and offered to send them to me if I would still like. Not sure exactly what she said about the fron line hand histories procedures but take it for whatever it is worth ...

6) I was told that they were new to poker and that is why this mistake happened. They told me I was the biggest mistake they had made because of them being new and unfamiliar with poker operations and they were going to try and make it up to me anyway possible ...


Will still update this thread to tell when I recieve the wires.

Very Happy it all worked out for you and have a good holiday...you deserve it

[sq764]

6) I was told that they were new to poker and that is why this mistake happened. They told me I was the biggest mistake they had made because of them being new and unfamiliar with poker operations and they were going to try and make it up to me anyway possible ....

wow, 'new to poker' and they defer to seizing your account due to chip dumping accusations... thats definitely erring on the side of who the hell knows what

[DHB]

awesome greg, glad to hear they have finally paid you.

well done SBR

[prop]

mighty maron I'm not sure what their corporate status or action has to do with any of this? I've seen you mention this several times. There are other poker sites that use software of publicly traded companies, as well as many that use OTC (which I'm pretty sure playsafe holding is). The reasons others left was to avoid lawsuits from their shareholders - not protect them - or to cover their own ass or just be good law abiding foreigners . There is more here that would be foolish to go into on an open forum - but plenty of public listed companies have benefited from US gambling and quite a few still do.

For what can be talked about more openly is how about sites on say the cake poker network or merge poker network - that are licensed in Malta and don't accept US players. These companies are not taking players from United States, France, Italy, Australia, Turkey and several other countries, for legality reasons. Meanwhile they operate on a network that has players from these countries - but that's someone else not them supplying these players access.

I don't really care to speculate too deeply here on how their relationship is structured but I can think of a dozen or more scenarios and will cover one in a moment. To comment quickly though "Playsafe is on the Norwegian stock exchange" they are listed on the OTC which functions similar to but isn't a traditional exchange. In any case you have another entity involved which is actually a publicly listed company LVFH which supplies the software.

If someone's name isn't Trevor and you ask him 100 different ways if his name is Trevor more likely than not he's never going to admit to his name being Trevor. The reason BetOnline has never claimed they are on the Action Network and the Action Poker Network has stated several times BetOnline is not part of their network a dozen times is more likely for reason that BetOnline is not on this network. Yes they share players. However one potential scenario here: BetOnline purchases an enterprise license from LVFH (whatever that might entail). Their version is made compatible with action (either with assistance from the provider or via their own internal modifications). The two enter an agreement to share players (each using same or similar software they purchased -or licensed from the same provider). Their operations are entirely separate with details worked out for batching, problem resolution, security, system upgrades or whatever else all outlined by their contract). BetOnline is dealing with US players - Action is not. Action can't handle BetOnline issues, BetOnline can't handle action issues. I could go on and on here forever - but the most likely truth here is "BetOnline and Action Network share players - that about as far as it gets".

There are very serious issues with their poker room. Every time brought up to counter with something about the Action Network and shareholders etc to lend support, isn't effective - I don't think anyways. The share holder aspect and them taking US players / Action not - that part I don't believe has any relevance to the very serious issues BetOnline poker has. As supporting details - saying there is some sort of b2b relationship with Action who has a horrible history and this might affect BetOnline - okay that makes sense. All the other points you are quoting responses with and making I don't understand one bit.

[runner5k]

Congrats on getting your first wire so quick and hope the second one hits you tomorrow! Impressive for BOL to pay out 30k that quick when they have been supposedly "stealing" $100 from others

[lt56]

If ratings fluctuated along with the knee-jerk reactions of the public, I don't think any sportsbook would maintain an A rating longer than a prom dress stays on.

Fortunately, we don't have to talk in theory - we can look at things like the results of the SBR users posters poll last month, the monthly payout reports thread, the news feeds etc. Personally I think it's great having you guys as sounding boards. What gets lost in the fray though is that forums are prone to squeaky wheels. Google some reviews of your laptop. I bet you'll come away thinking your machine will explode in a year.

If customer service was more important than payouts then I'd say the flack is well-deserved at times. The fact remains BetOnline has never not paid a player and really cares about getting better in the areas you guys have pointed out.

Lou, you do a great job helping people recover their money; especially Greg here; assuming he gets paid in full, which I think he will. But for every gambler like Greg, there might be many who do get ripped off. No one here has gotten ripped off by BOL that you know of, but many might get told they aren't getting paid and simply don't know about your site or don't bother to fight it. I'm just 1 player and I understand your point that fast upgrades and downgrades would not be good. So your job isn't easy. But after reading this long thread I think BOL clearly attempted to rob a player and they would have robbed the player if it wasn't for your help and the players persistance. So for me; the ratings mean nothing anymore--any site can turn bad now

[allin1]

Lou, you do a great job helping people recover their money; especially Greg here; assuming he gets paid in full, which I think he will. But for every gambler like Greg, there might be many who do get ripped off. No one here has gotten ripped off by BOL that you know of, but many might get told they aren't getting paid and simply don't know about your site or don't bother to fight it. I'm just 1 player and I understand your point that fast upgrades and downgrades would not be good. So your job isn't easy. But after reading this long thread I think BOL clearly attempted to rob a player and they would have robbed the player if it wasn't for your help and the players persistance. So for me; the ratings mean nothing anymore--any site can turn bad now

You do have a point considering that they should have handed out the hands history in less than 72 hours regardless of the human errors/mistakes, because the dispute was public so they were definitely aware of the issue. The fact that it took so long to get this sorted out makes it very very suspicious imo.

[Hankwins]

i think they are legit, i deposited $200 and ran it upto $2300 before busting out in the casino. I have doc's on file so I look to try out a P2P withdrawl soon.

[BigOrange]

Good thing that you came to SBR. I doubt they would have paid otherwise.

[Glitch]

Good thing that you came to SBR. I doubt they would have paid otherwise.

i wonder how sbr helped them "realize" they were cheating you

"hey- you guys are making sh*t up right? please fix it"

perhaps something like that.

nice work sbr.

[Greg242]

UPDATE: I recieved my second $15,000 wire on November 30th. I wll be requesting my third wire tomorrow because the limit is two per week.

[Justin7]

I have played at Betonline for the last 2 years. I am no longer keeping a balance there.

[mtneer1212]

I have played at Betonline for the last 2 years. I am no longer keeping a balance there.

I have decided to sit this year out there as well until things stabilize a bit.

[durito]

I have played at Betonline for the last 2 years. I am no longer keeping a balance there.

i think i will deposit more

[bubba]

I have played at Betonline for the last 2 years. I am no longer keeping a balance there.

why now?