BetOnline is trying to steal $65,000 from me (cliff notes at end)

**Patrick McIrish** · 11-23-11, 04:14 PM

Originally posted by bigloser

They say repeatedly that he has been chip dumping. It must follow, therefore, that the analysis has already taken place.

Exactly what I thought as well when I read Justin coming out to make excuses for this lengthy delay. So they don't have the personnel/resources to analyze this sort of data but somehow already know enough to confiscate balances of this magnitude? Odd how that works.

**marcojuiceman** · 11-23-11, 04:50 PM

Occupy SBR

**HedgeHog** · 11-23-11, 05:09 PM

Originally posted by wrongturn

Guys, let SBR work it out first. It is part of deal with sponsors.

Really. There's a written rule that sponsors can accuse a player of cheating, not provide any proof whatsoever, and take over a week to doctor up the evidence to SBR's satisfaction? That would make that monthly ad check--Hush Money.

Seriously, the whole process is tainted at this point. BOL had its chance to present its case and their rep, Alex, that posts here says nothing. Innocent parties tend to speak the loudest. BOL's response, on the other hand, remains mute.

**HedgeHog** · 11-23-11, 05:12 PM

Originally posted by marcojuiceman

Occupy SBR

That would explain SBRJohn's absence in this thread. He's too busy purchasing the pepper-spray.

**sharpcat** · 11-23-11, 05:46 PM

Lou,

Do yourself a favor and step away from this one!!! Don't let yourself get Wilheimed!!!

Justin7 and SBR_John put a giant target on their backs with their smear campaign against that other forum for them protecting affiliate books don't take a bullet for something you had no part in.

**Bill Dozer** · 11-23-11, 05:59 PM

I'm late in this thread... but of course BetOnline will pay the player in full unless they can show evidence of cheating. BetOnline has never cheated a player and I don't expect there to be any issue with a resolution. Assuming this is resolved in the next few days they know they need to staff up for the amount of poker action they are getting. Besides this gentlemen's dispute there were a bunch of others who eventually admitted to cheating after SBR worked with them. These guys slow everything down. Regardless BetOnline knows it has to get better equipped to handle their new poker.

**HedgeHog** · 11-23-11, 06:07 PM

Originally posted by Bill Dozer

I'm late in this thread... but of course BetOnline will pay the player in full unless they can show evidence of cheating. BetOnline has never cheated a player and I don't expect there to be any issue with a resolution. Assuming this is resolved in the next few days they know they need to staff up for the amount of poker action they are getting. Besides this gentlemen's dispute there were a bunch of others who eventually admitted to cheating after SBR worked with them. These guys slow everything down. Regardless BetOnline knows it has to get better equipped to handle their new poker.

I sincerely appreciate your response, Bill. However, can you explain why a 65k complaint isn't even on the radar with the SBR newswire a week or so after the fact; and more importantly can you correct it? Thank you.

**Greg242** · 11-23-11, 06:25 PM

Originally posted by Bill Dozer

I'm late in this thread... but of course BetOnline will pay the player in full unless they can show evidence of cheating. BetOnline has never cheated a player and I don't expect there to be any issue with a resolution. Assuming this is resolved in the next few days they know they need to staff up for the amount of poker action they are getting. Besides this gentlemen's dispute there were a bunch of others who eventually admitted to cheating after SBR worked with them. These guys slow everything down. Regardless BetOnline knows it has to get better equipped to handle their new poker.

While I am sure there were others who really did cheat I do not know if you saw earlier in my thread, but this exact same thing happened to Jamin Stokes, a well known poker pro, who came forward on 2+2 and notified me that the same thing was happening to him. He was about to go public with his story like myself. He was probably one of the winniest regs on the site and he was accused of "chip dumping" like myself and they refused to show him or send him the hand histories and kept making up excuse after excuse. Somehow he miraclely was able to get in touch with someone in charge in management and get his situation taken care of and his account unfrozen. He was nice enough to tell them about my situation and that they need to resolve it ASAP as the exact same thing is happening to me that happened to him. This should be VERY concerning as it seems any winning reg on BetOnline is going to be subject to this happening to them. He also had less money frozen on the site than I did yet his situation was somehow taken care of quicker then mine.

**Bill Dozer** · 11-23-11, 06:35 PM

Originally posted by HedgeHog

I sincerely appreciate your response, Bill. However, can you explain why a 65k complaint isn't even on the radar with the SBR newswire a week or so after the fact; and more importantly can you correct it? Thank you.

We've discussed putting it up and will. It's been on the whiteboard since the weekend. It's relevant for the guys who are thinking of going over to poker from sports but we generally don't report on poker. They almost always work themselves out and audits are very common especially at places that aren't majoring in poker. You don't see them much here because its predominantly sports.

Originally posted by Greg242

While I am sure there were others who really did cheat I do not know if you saw earlier in my thread, but this exact same thing happened to Jamin Stokes, a well known poker pro, who came forward on 2+2 and notified me that the same thing was happening to him. He was about to go public with his story like myself. He was probably one of the winniest regs on the site and he was accused of "chip dumping" like myself and they refused to show him or send him the hand histories and kept making up excuse after excuse. Somehow he miraclely was able to get in touch with someone in charge in management and get his situation taken care of and his account unfrozen. He was nice enough to tell them about my situation and that they need to resolve it ASAP as the exact same thing is happening to me that happened to him. This should be VERY concerning as it seems any winning reg on BetOnline is going to be subject to this happening to them. He also had less money frozen on the site than I did yet his situation was somehow taken care of quicker then mine.

Right, anytime there is an audit or delay in the process it's no fun for the player and no good for the poker brand. I don't get over to twoplustwo but sounds like everything worked out for the player you mentioned. I'm confident they will get yours right too.

**mighty maron** · 11-23-11, 06:44 PM

Billdozer

How can a site be relied on to crack chip dumping and other various poker crimes yet cant or wont figure out how to send a complete Hand History to op? His rake paid for services like that and the more open this is the better it looks for all parties involved.

Why is a straight forward task like assmebling and emailing a hand history (raw and complete) that difficult?

**El Stufruado** · 11-23-11, 07:10 PM

how is this any different then what wil did with ez.... shiesty shit so far lets see some fcking proof

**Al Masters** · 11-23-11, 08:01 PM

Originally posted by HedgeHog

No hint of the $65,000 BOL case on the newswire yet. On the bright side, the BetGrizzly $50 freeplay caper was solved

Well placed line.........got a good chuckle out of it.

**WVU** · 11-23-11, 08:27 PM

Originally posted by Bill Dozer

I'm late in this thread... but of course BetOnline will pay the player in full unless they can show evidence of cheating. BetOnline has never cheated a player and I don't expect there to be any issue with a resolution. Assuming this is resolved in the next few days they know they need to staff up for the amount of poker action they are getting. Besides this gentlemen's dispute there were a bunch of others who eventually admitted to cheating after SBR worked with them. These guys slow everything down. Regardless BetOnline knows it has to get better equipped to handle their new poker.

depending on the circumstances, chip dumping is not necessarily cheating. Are you alluding to the fact that BOL is preparing a case of collusion which is indeed cheating?

**erickvivar** · 11-23-11, 08:57 PM

Now, I have a crazy idea here. What if BOL actually is not keeping records of the hand history? or just keeping the last 100 hands or so?

THAT! will be funny.

**Monte** · 11-23-11, 09:46 PM

BOL is broke, simple. Look at all these complaints here, like the guy getting slow payed for 4.5k.
These poker stories are a chance for them to make easy money, obviously they have no interest at all in "fixing" it by estabilishing some security.
The player is the fool at this place.

**mighty maron** · 11-23-11, 09:50 PM

The site is not releasing the hand histories.....Dishonest

**SBR_John** · 11-23-11, 11:18 PM

Originally posted by El Stufruado

how is this any different then what wil did with ez.... shiesty shit so far lets see some fcking proof

Agree. There is no reason to with hold the hand history ala the Cory case. It should of been released the instant the player had a complaint.

By not releasing the hand history it puts 3rd parties in a position that they can not help settle the dispute.

To not release the hand history at least to SBR is a breakdown in the offshore system that gives players some basic standard of fair play.

**bubba** · 11-24-11, 12:05 AM

Originally posted by SBR_John

Agree. There is no reason to with hold the hand history ala the Cory case. It should of been released the instant the player had a complaint.

By not releasing the hand history it puts 3rd parties in a position that they can not help settle the dispute.

To not release the hand history at least to SBR is a breakdown in the offshore system that gives players some basic standard of fair play.

this is the harshest someone on the sbr payroll has spoken against betonline over the situation at hand

**Monte** · 11-24-11, 12:07 AM

^^ it's the harshest any of them *ever* has spoken about BOL, maybe they are waking up a bit now.

**princecharles** · 11-24-11, 02:18 AM

Originally posted by SBR_John

Agree. There is no reason to with hold the hand history ala the Cory case. It should of been released the instant the player had a complaint.

By not releasing the hand history it puts 3rd parties in a position that they can not help settle the dispute.

To not release the hand history at least to SBR is a breakdown in the offshore system that gives players some basic standard of fair play.

Well said.
John may have his business interests to protect, and it's great to see that doesn't hinder his above board straight shooter values.

Whether a beef is over 6,500 or 65,000 I believe SBR will do what is right.

Working with them recently has only impressed me with their character and honesty, and I know I am in their debt.

**shari91** · 11-24-11, 02:40 AM

Originally posted by princecharles

Well said.
John may have his business interests to protect, and it's great to see that doesn't hinder his above board straight shooter values.

Whether a beef is over 6,500 or 65,000 I believe SBR will do what is right.

Working with them recently has only impressed me with their character and honesty, and I know I am in their debt.

SBR can only do what they can do. Bubba's referring to SBR's payroll: John owns this company. He IS the payroll. He's not answering to anyone.

I really hope that some of you step back now. Everyone's been chirping about why there isn't a newswire and calling for Lou's head... you do realise that SBR isn't a poker review site? The last time you saw a poker related wire was....???? Of course this was going to hit the wire, if for nothing else because of the amount of cash involved and it's a known book, but to reiterate what Bill said: Normally poker issues sort themselves out or else they do quickly when SBR is involved. When it became apparent that this one was taking some time, it hit the whiteboard. When it became more apparent that the resolution is not as timely as one would hope - it hit the wire.

Greg chose to come here and SBR is grateful he placed his trust in us... but come on now. You can have people spewing about the intricacies of online poker for ages - and yes Prop, I used to play FT for years until I had a kid - but I think maybe we should just be patient here. You have heard from the owner of this company and also from two of his Admins. Please just wait until SBR actually posts a decision before assuming what it will be.

**frankel** · 11-24-11, 03:21 AM

Ive never had a problem with this lot, love playing there. I do only play in the sportsbook though

**mighty maron** · 11-24-11, 08:27 AM

Originally posted by SBR_John

Agree. There is no reason to with hold the hand history ala the Cory case. It should of been released the instant the player had a complaint.

By not releasing the hand history it puts 3rd parties in a position that they can not help settle the dispute.

To not release the hand history at least to SBR is a breakdown in the offshore system that gives players some basic standard of fair play.

Thank you for addressing the lack of the release of the hand histories.

Now everyone knows where they stand on the lack of hand histories.

It has been addressed...Now let the process play out....for the amount involved in this dispute it might take a while.

Thank you again SBR for addressing the hand histories...

**mighty maron** · 11-24-11, 08:28 AM

The newswire blurb on BOL is fair...no need to be inflamatory until it plays out

**tracker2208** · 11-24-11, 11:55 AM

Originally posted by princecharles

Well said.
John may have his business interests to protect, and it's great to see that doesn't hinder his above board straight shooter values.

Whether a beef is over 6,500 or 65,000 I believe SBR will do what is right.

Working with them recently has only impressed me with their character and honesty, and I know I am in their debt.

Good to see you are in their debt. If they were in your debt you could be the next accused chip dumper.

**mighty maron** · 11-24-11, 12:00 PM

BOL wont pay or cant. The 65k may be stuck from players on the action poker network. Action poker network has awful rep for no paying people.

BOL issues have been going on for a while. BOL is this years Bet Phoenix.

**5mike5** · 11-24-11, 12:07 PM

jump off the BOL boat while a life jacket is available....the water is rising.........

**katstale** · 11-24-11, 12:10 PM

You guys jumpin on Justin related to BOL are unaware that a couple years back he was THE ONLY PERSON at SBR who called out BOL when they were hijacking winners who had accepted large bonuses. Since Alex came on board, these heavy handed tactics were stopped. I don't play poker there, but if I could, would happily deposit 5k there today and hammer them in the sportsbook. No offense Alex? lol

So while I can't speak to the direct issue of the poker, I do know these guys a little bit. They have plenty of cash to pay people. I will be shocked if they don't resolve this with SBR assistance and if Justin is assigned to work on this--I will place a bet it all comes out clean in the wash.

**5mike5** · 11-24-11, 12:15 PM

if they have so much cash to pay people then why have they been stalling and not paying people for 2 months now???

BOL is having BIG problems

**katstale** · 11-24-11, 12:32 PM

Originally posted by 5mike5

if they have so much cash to pay people then why have they been stalling and not paying people for 2 months now???

BOL is having BIG problems

So everyone is not being paid? Let's agree that hyperbole in this situation makes people look like fools. This particular case, hand history should have been turned over to the guy immediately. Doubt Alex would even question that. Processing problems? For sure, and everyone has them now. People are being paid every day there. That is a fact.

**Legions36** · 11-24-11, 12:33 PM

Originally posted by katstale

You guys jumpin on Justin related to BOL are unaware that a couple years back he was THE ONLY PERSON at SBR who called out BOL when they were hijacking winners who had accepted large bonuses. Since Alex came on board, these heavy handed tactics were stopped. I don't play poker there, but if I could, would happily deposit 5k there today and hammer them in the sportsbook. No offense Alex? lol

So while I can't speak to the direct issue of the poker, I do know these guys a little bit. They have plenty of cash to pay people. I will be shocked if they don't resolve this with SBR assistance and if Justin is assigned to work on this--I will place a bet it all comes out clean in the wash.

Finally someone reputable has come forward sticking up for them. All these chumps on here ragging on Betonline don't even know about them and talking trash, also they don't know how lucrative they are and what they say +ev. Finally someone else that knows how much $ these guys have and how they could pay this out with there eyes closed. Half the people on here probably don't use them just bashing them for anything they can.

**kisado** · 11-24-11, 01:10 PM

F betonline.

**marcojuiceman** · 11-24-11, 01:16 PM

I know BOL capital is not bigger than Book Maker or Five Dimes.. So i will stick with the big dogs on this one

**Legions36** · 11-24-11, 02:13 PM

Originally posted by marcojuiceman

I know BOL capital is not bigger than Book Maker or Five Dimes.. So i will stick with the big dogs on this one

Isn't the betting limit on football 20k? So what does that tell u about these guys. So for me i will stick with them, all the big dogs and some so i can have a wide variety of options to choose from.

**Legions36** · 11-24-11, 02:20 PM

U know what guys even if OP is all clear here(which im not a believer given what was going on there lately), can u blame them for looking into all of this thorough as there were massive amounts of fraud and cheating going on which they have to find out about, your talking about from what it looks like to be at least a few 100k that they even know about. Let them finish everything, these guys are legit when it comes to payouts.