JazzBet and JazzSports

**durito** · 04-09-11, 12:03 PM

Same book, sbr didn't update the ratings guide.

**stevex** · 01-16-12, 06:20 PM

Figured I'd bring back an old thread because i can't really find much info on this group. Secure at all?

**RickySteve** · 01-17-12, 09:29 PM

No, stay away.

**Bill Dozer** · 01-17-12, 10:52 PM

Right, not financially sound. If you are looking for the odds shown on the website BetIslands could be an option. They start with the same wagering feed and adjust after the openers.

**RickySteve** · 01-18-12, 12:18 AM

Originally posted by Bill Dozer

Right, not financially sound. If you are looking for the odds shown on the website BetIslands could be an option. They start with the same wagering feed and adjust after the openers.

This still makes me uncomfortable. If someone considered reputable opens a book and all the players are happy, but it's hosted by WSEX or Cascade, does that book deserve a high rating? Why should Lenny or JC or Jazz Mike get to hide behind someone else and keep profiting while their own players go penniless?

**nick86** · 01-18-12, 01:29 AM

stay AWAY from jizzsports

**mtneer1212** · 01-18-12, 01:39 AM

Use BetIslands - they have the same platform as Jazz, but are much better run and backed.

**prop** · 01-18-12, 01:57 AM

How about a year later one is rated D and the other B still.

Are JazzBet and JazzSports any different? Some reasons one still stays at B?

**Monte** · 01-18-12, 06:39 AM

Originally posted by RickySteve

This still makes me uncomfortable. If someone considered reputable opens a book and all the players are happy, but it's hosted by WSEX or Cascade, does that book deserve a high rating? Why should Lenny or JC or Jazz Mike get to hide behind someone else and keep profiting while their own players go penniless?

100% agree with this, i don't understand how Betislands can have such a high rating after
a) not being around for more than a few years max. (i didn't follow when exactly, but never heared about 'em when Jazz was still an ok book)
b) sitting in the same building as an almost-stiff book

**TugBoatCapt** · 01-18-12, 09:57 AM

Originally posted by Monte

100% agree with this, i don't understand how Betislands can have such a high rating after
a) not being around for more than a few years max. (i didn't follow when exactly, but never heared about 'em when Jazz was still an ok book)
b) sitting in the same building as an almost-stiff book

Simple, the owner of BetIslands IS financially sound. BI outsourced its services to Jazz who provides its software and call center services for a fee.

Jazz is going through a rough patch. BI is an entirely different company and a safe out.

As far as time in service, I have no answer for you. If SBR is confident in its rating you should feel pretty safe betting there.

**SBR Lou** · 01-18-12, 10:10 AM

Originally posted by prop

How about a year later one is rated D and the other B still. Are JazzBet and JazzSports any different? Some reasons one still stays at B?

No...

What you see are search results from a newswire in 2008.

It's a good catch, we're adding their rating page and of course it will be rated same as JazzSports/ABC Islands/Looselines etc.

**Monte** · 01-18-12, 11:29 AM

Originally posted by TugBoatCapt

If SBR is confident in its rating you should feel pretty safe betting there.

Why? I had high balances at Cascade and Wsex *before* all hell broke loose, and got away with no losses...it's a miracle.

**wrongturn** · 01-18-12, 11:41 AM

BetIsland's all cash, no ID, fast pay model is pretty good. So far they are excellent. Yes it is a concern for Jazz connection, but so it was for Matchbook with WSEX and turned out to be non-issue. I guess there is always risk involved in this.

**RickySteve** · 01-18-12, 01:43 PM

Originally posted by TugBoatCapt

Simple, the owner of BetIslands IS financially sound. BI outsourced its services to Jazz who provides its software and call center services for a fee.

Jazz is going through a rough patch. BI is an entirely different company and a safe out.

There is a vanishingly small chance that Jazz isn't taking some part of the action. Even a pure PPH deal is still associating with and benefiting a stiff book.

**RonPaul2008** · 01-18-12, 07:20 PM

Jazz is not great and getting paid is a bit like pulling teeth...but they do pay.

They are not Cascade. (FU Lenny!)

**RickySteve** · 01-18-12, 07:49 PM

Originally posted by RonPaul2008

Jazz is not great and getting paid is a bit like pulling teeth...but they do pay.

They are not Cascade. (FU Lenny!)

I'm quite sure Cascade pays its long-time losers, just like WSEX and Jazz do. They are all bankrupt stiff books.

**RonPaul2008** · 01-18-12, 08:24 PM

Originally posted by RickySteve

I'm quite sure Cascade pays its long-time losers, just like WSEX and Jazz do. They are all bankrupt stiff books.

Jazz pays long time winners.

**RickySteve** · 01-18-12, 08:28 PM

Originally posted by RonPaul2008

Jazz pays long time winners.

They have paid less than 10% of my balance dating back 2 years.

**Monte** · 01-18-12, 08:33 PM

Originally posted by RonPaul2008

Jazz is not great and getting paid is a bit like pulling teeth...but they do pay.

You aware this is a slap into the face of ppl that don't get paid? God i love forums.

**RonPaul2008** · 01-18-12, 08:40 PM

Originally posted by Monte

You aware this is a slap into the face of ppl that don't get paid? God i love forums.

I can only go by my experience. Sorry to hear that some are not getting paid..

**5mike5** · 01-18-12, 08:43 PM

baffles me why players deposit in books like this

**durito** · 01-18-12, 09:09 PM

Originally posted by 5mike5

baffles me why players deposit in books like this

perhaps because they were rated B and an sbr advertiser when all of the owed players ran up balances.

jazz goes broke because they suck at bookmaking, but betislands is supposed to be fine on the same lines + better bonuses/promos?

**SBR Lou** · 01-18-12, 09:39 PM

Originally posted by durito

perhaps because they were rated B and an sbr advertiser when all of the owed players ran up balances. jazz goes broke because they suck at bookmaking, but betislands is supposed to be fine on the same lines + better bonuses/promos?

The difference is that BetIslands services a different kind of player. They don't take in players all over the globe, don't offer eWallet, and primarily deal in cash. Their model allows them to make same-day or one-day payments - for a North American player, that's pretty damn good. The bonuses you speak of ain't redeemed by 950 Lithuanians, Romanians, Ukrainians and the like. The fact that they cracked the SBR posters poll top five so soon is telling.

**durito** · 01-18-12, 09:46 PM

Originally posted by SBR Lou

The difference is that BetIslands services a different kind of player. They don't take in players all over the globe, don't offer eWallet, and primarily deal in cash. Their model allows them to make same-day or one-day payments - for a North American player, that's pretty damn good. The bonuses you speak of ain't redeemed by 950 Lithuanians, Romanians, Ukrainians and the like. The fact that they cracked the SBR posters poll top five so soon is telling.

jazz didn't have much in the way of bonuses before. i don't see 950 lithuanians claiming slow/no pays, just a few americans owed a few hundred thousand dollars. most of whom i'm sure are now playing at BI as well.

**taxer** · 01-19-12, 09:22 AM

They outsource their wagering to Jazz which is what they focus on the most now , price per head. Betislands will continue to be a solid shop .. you gotta hand it to Jon not one complaint in history of the sportsbooks he has ever been involved with.

People trying to see something were there is nothing to see.

A good book that outsources its wagering.

**RickySteve** · 01-19-12, 04:05 PM

Originally posted by taxer

They outsource their wagering to Jazz which is what they focus on the most now , price per head. Betislands will continue to be a solid shop .. you gotta hand it to Jon not one complaint in history of the sportsbooks he has ever been involved with.

People trying to see something were there is nothing to see.

A good book that outsources its wagering...

...to a book that went bankrupt and stiffed mid-six-figures because it has no clue how to book and is now profiting from this "oopsies, our bad, let's take a fresh start" approach that $omehow seems to be flying around here.

**taxer** · 01-19-12, 04:12 PM

I see your point but then why do they payout good , why is Jon there ?

They use diff banking , diff staff everything

**RickySteve** · 01-19-12, 08:53 PM

OK, then I'm going to start paying Jay Cohen $40K a year to use the WSEX software. No one has a problem with that, right?

**Bill Dozer** · 01-19-12, 11:19 PM

Originally posted by RickySteve

This still makes me uncomfortable. If someone considered reputable opens a book and all the players are happy, but it's hosted by WSEX or Cascade, does that book deserve a high rating? Why should Lenny or JC or Jazz Mike get to hide behind someone else and keep profiting while their own players go penniless?

There are different kinds of service providers from complete turnkey hosts to cost consolidators. We can't always pass along what we know about book relationships. Here, we can say that no BI player money passes through Jazz and BetIslands which has their own mgt, CS and are hands on with their lines. I agree being on the same servers negatively impacts BetIslands. Despite being a forum voted top 5, they are rated for how long they've been in business and where they are now. Jazz needs to cough up some cash for Ricky.

Originally posted by Monte

100% agree with this, i don't understand how Betislands can have such a high rating after
a) not being around for more than a few years max. (i didn't follow when exactly, but never heared about 'em when Jazz was still an ok book)
b) sitting in the same building as an almost-stiff book

The people behind BetIslands have been around a lot of years and are known by other books you may play with. BetIslands is rated B.

Originally posted by RickySteve

There is a vanishingly small chance that Jazz isn't taking some part of the action. Even a pure PPH deal is still associating with and benefiting a stiff book.

They aren't.

Originally posted by durito

perhaps because they were rated B and an sbr advertiser when all of the owed players ran up balances.

jazz goes broke because they suck at bookmaking, but betislands is supposed to be fine on the same lines + better bonuses/promos?

Jazz had a bring it on bookmaking style for all and got beat up. When you take unbalanced action that way it is a risk and then when it's a bad foots season, you don't have the square money to balance it out. BI has a $500 limit on halftimes and doesn't take Billy Walters crew. Jazz was downgraded to C in June of 2010. Most players can react when there are signs of issues. Unfortunately players who hold six figure balances are the ones most likely to see the hiccups before they grow to bigger problems. Unfortunately with a big balance you are many more weeks away from getting out than the typical player. The average balance holders often have the big guys to thank as canaries deeper in the mine. Most of the sharp folks know what they are doing and they know that with a $X max per week, that they are Y weeks away from getting out. They would rather have those big balances in A+ books but then the question is if they were at a typical A+ book, would they have been able to run the balance up that high.

Hopes are still high for those stuck at Jazz. The feeling is they kept enough money to stay in the game with their other business and it's been a decent season for books. Obviously it's not a place you want to win a 8 teamer at.

**durito** · 01-20-12, 01:53 AM

i couldn't get a dime for 9 months after their first downgrade.

**wrongturn** · 01-20-12, 10:46 AM

Unless BI pissed you off, there is no reason to bash it, especially if you are still waiting payout from Jazz.

**gmcarroll33** · 12-18-12, 10:25 AM

Bump. Rip Rickysteve. Sharpest guy to ever post here. Hilarious that he called this out years in advance, and sbr lied to everybody's face or was actually this clueless about what's going on in the sports betting industry

Originally posted by RickySteve

This still makes me uncomfortable. If someone considered reputable opens a book and all the players are happy, but it's hosted by WSEX or Cascade, does that book deserve a high rating? Why should Lenny or JC or Jazz Mike get to hide behind someone else and keep profiting while their own players go penniless?

Originally posted by SBR Lou

No...

What you see are search results from a newswire in 2008.

It's a good catch, we're adding their rating page and of course it will be rated same as JazzSports/ABC Islands/Looselines etc.

Originally posted by RickySteve

There is a vanishingly small chance that Jazz isn't taking some part of the action. Even a pure PPH deal is still associating with and benefiting a stiff book.

Originally posted by SBR Lou

The difference is that BetIslands services a different kind of player. They don't take in players all over the globe, don't offer eWallet, and primarily deal in cash. Their model allows them to make same-day or one-day payments - for a North American player, that's pretty damn good. The bonuses you speak of ain't redeemed by 950 Lithuanians, Romanians, Ukrainians and the like. The fact that they cracked the SBR posters poll top five so soon is telling.

Originally posted by RickySteve

...to a book that went bankrupt and stiffed mid-six-figures because it has no clue how to book and is now profiting from this "oopsies, our bad, let's take a fresh start" approach that $omehow seems to be flying around here.

Originally posted by RickySteve

OK, then I'm going to start paying Jay Cohen $40K a year to use the WSEX software. No one has a problem with that, right?

Originally posted by Bill Dozer

There are different kinds of service providers from complete turnkey hosts to cost consolidators. We can't always pass along what we know about book relationships. Here, we can say that no BI player money passes through Jazz and BetIslands which has their own mgt, CS and are hands on with their lines. I agree being on the same servers negatively impacts BetIslands. Despite being a forum voted top 5, they are rated for how long they've been in business and where they are now. Jazz needs to cough up some cash for Ricky.

The people behind BetIslands have been around a lot of years and are known by other books you may play with. BetIslands is rated B.

They aren't.

Jazz had a bring it on bookmaking style for all and got beat up. When you take unbalanced action that way it is a risk and then when it's a bad foots season, you don't have the square money to balance it out. BI has a $500 limit on halftimes and doesn't take Billy Walters crew. Jazz was downgraded to C in June of 2010. Most players can react when there are signs of issues. Unfortunately players who hold six figure balances are the ones most likely to see the hiccups before they grow to bigger problems. Unfortunately with a big balance you are many more weeks away from getting out than the typical player. The average balance holders often have the big guys to thank as canaries deeper in the mine. Most of the sharp folks know what they are doing and they know that with a $X max per week, that they are Y weeks away from getting out. They would rather have those big balances in A+ books but then the question is if they were at a typical A+ book, would they have been able to run the balance up that high.

Hopes are still high for those stuck at Jazz. The feeling is they kept enough money to stay in the game with their other business and it's been a decent season for books. Obviously it's not a place you want to win a 8 teamer at.