BetOnline golf wager grading issue (part 2!)

**HedgeHog** · 02-08-21, 06:45 PM

Your math agrees with mine. BOL is clueless on how to calculate dead heat payouts.

**reallyhardtowin** · 02-08-21, 07:17 PM

I had similar issue Sunday morning with Dubai but less complicated as there were 2 people that tied for 2nd (winner excluding Dustin Johnson). I had $25 at 33:1 on Justin Rose. Since he tied they took the wager and divided by 2 (12.50) at same odds for winnings of 412.50. With the 12.50 wager left I got paid back $425. The confusion is that the graded wager showed as being paid at $ 437.50.

What is confusing on yours is that there were 21 people in the top 20 so basically one extra person. I would think you would get 95% of the payout since there were 20/21 people. Said a different way you should get $5 x 5.5 x.95 plus .95 of your original $5 bet

Originally posted by finkjason

Hi everyone - Several months back, I posted about an issue I had with BOL grading a golf wager incorrectly. After a great deal of back and forth with BOL, that issue was ultimately resolved in my favor via a successful SBR complaint. I was hoping this would be a one-time issue, but unfortunately I'm back with another saga currently playing out. Again, I wanted to do a quick sanity (and math) check before opening a complaint with SBR.

In this case, I bet on Cameron Tringale to finish in the Top 20 at the Waste Management Phoenix Open at +550 odds. He finished in a five-way tie for 17th (leaderboard), so it's 5 players tied for 4 spots in the top 20. I know the dead heat rule applies, but I believe it's being calculated wrong by BOL.

[As an aside, last time I had an issue, there were 4 players tied for 17th (so, 4 players for 4 spots) and they invented a dead heat where none existed and tried to pay me less. Something about those T-17s!]

Anyway, back to the present situation. For the purposes of this discussion, let's say I bet $5 (actual amount is substantially more, but this makes the math simple to follow). Here is my understanding of how I should have been paid out.

Winning portion of stake at +550 odds: (4/5 winning portion) * $5 wager * 5.5 = $22

Losing portion of stake: (-1/5 losing portion) * $5 wager = -$1

Net result: $21 win

Expected payment amount: $26 ($5 initial wager + $21 win)

I get the same result using this dead heat calculator. BOL paid me the equivalent of a $16.66 win instead of $21.

Last time, I worked through BOL CS over the phone (it was right after the most recent security breach and their email was down) and it was a disaster. This time, I figured I'd give email a shot. I laid out everything I stated above, including the calculation steps, and I've already heard back that it's been reviewed by the line managers and they aren't budging, claiming I was paid accurately according to the dead heat rule.

So, am I crazy, bad at math, or is BOL jerking me around once again? I shot them one more email asking for this to be escalated/re-reviewed to give them a chance to make it right on their own, but I plan to open a complaint if that doesn't go anywhere. Thanks in advance for any responses.

**HedgeHog** · 02-08-21, 07:28 PM

Originally posted by reallyhardtowin

I had similar issue Sunday morning with Dubai but less complicated as there were 2 people that tied for 2nd (winner excluding Dustin Johnson). I had $25 at 33:1 on Justin Rose. Since he tied they took the wager and divided by 2 (12.50) at same odds for winnings of 412.50. With the 12.50 wager left I got paid back $425. The confusion is that the graded wager showed as being paid at $ 437.50.

What is confusing on yours is that there were 21 people in the top 20 so basically one extra person. I would think you would get 95% of the payout since there were 20/21 people. Said a different way you should get $5 x 5.5 x.95 plus .95 of your original $5 bet

You are correct about there being 1 extra person in the top 20, but the only spots in question are the ones tied for 17th thru 21st. The top 16 are clear winners for top 20 and would get a full payout. The 5 way tie for 17th thru 21st requires a partial payout (80% win and 20% loss) for the 5 golfers involved in the tie.

**finkjason** · 02-08-21, 07:36 PM

Thanks for double-checking the math. Much appreciated! I'll update the thread with any progress on getting this corrected.

Originally posted by HedgeHog

Your math agrees with mine. BOL is clueless on how to calculate dead heat payouts.

**Optional** · 02-08-21, 08:25 PM

Try keeping it simpler and emailing them back just talking about their own rules

Dead Heat Rule:

For golf wagers containing more than two participants (3 balls or groups) where two or more players tie for the same place the dead heat rule is applied as follows:

The wager is reduced according to how many players tie and is then applied to the full odds with the remainder of the stake deemed as lost.

For example:

You wager $100 at odds of +200 and 2 players tie for the same position.
Half the stake is lost -$50
The other half wins and is paid the same odds. So $50 wins at +200
If 3 players tie for the same position then:
Two thirds of the stake is lost -$66.66
The remaining third $33.33 wins.

5 players tied for the final 4 spots = 4/5ths of your stake wins and 1/5th loses.

$4 * +450 is the profit = $18.00

plus 4/5ths of the stake returned = $4.00

Total $22.00

If you send an email laid out that simply and CS still do not respond, I am sure we can get a manger to tell them to.

**finkjason** · 02-08-21, 08:32 PM

Sure, I'm happy to use your format. Minor correction just so we're aligned on the calculation - the odds were +550, not +450, so:

5 players tied for the final 4 spots = 4/5ths of your stake wins and 1/5th loses.

$4 * +550 is the profit = $22.00
plus 4/5ths of the stake returned = $4.00

Total $26.00

Thanks. I'll let you know what comes of it.

**Optional** · 02-08-21, 10:07 PM

You are correct. I think I read odds as 5.50 decimal for some reason.

**finkjason** · 02-09-21, 04:09 PM

Here is BOL's response to my email using Optional's suggested language. They are actually now arguing that I was *overpaid.* (Dollar amounts in [brackets] have been adjusted to be consistent with my initial example.)

"Please be kindly informed that this wager was paid as a 3 way tie instead of a 5 way tie, please note that on a 5 way tie you loose 4/5 from the original risk in this case you are risking [$1] for odds of +550 you would be winning [$5.50] which would bring a total credit amount of [$6.50], I have sent the claim back to the department in charge for further review, we will be contacting you within the next 24 hours or less with the proper resolution to your case."

The glaringly obvious miss on their part is that it was a five-way tie for 17th place, so there are 4 winning spots in the top 20 being shared by these five players, not one. So their suggested payout for one spot ($6.50) multiplied by 4 would be the correct amount ($26) that everyone here seems to be aligned on. I'm honestly dumbfounded that this is so difficult for one of the world's leading sportsbooks to understand. Here's my response:

Your math on calculating a dead heat is correct when there is a five-way tie for *one* winning position. In this case, the 5 tied players are sharing *four* winning positions in the top 20 (17th, 18th, 19th, and 20th), which is why the correct payout is not the [$6.50] you arrived at, but [$6.50] x 4 = [$26.00].

Put another way, each of the five tied players shares 1/5 of 17th place (win), 1/5 of 18th place (win), 1/5th of 19th place (win), 1/5th of 20th place (win), and 1/5th of 21st place (loss). As I've stated repeatedly, 5 players tied for the final 4 spots in the top 20 = 4/5ths of my stake wins and 1/5th loses.

[$4] * +550 is the profit = [$22.00]
plus 4/5ths of the stake returned = [$4.00]
Total [$26.00]

Optional - What do you propose as a next step, assuming my balance stays the same or goes down (!) after their review is completed?

**Locktober** · 02-09-21, 05:46 PM

Just an fyi that you may or may not be aware of...Bovada offers Ties paid in full for top 10 & 20.typically need to get down early before markets stabilize or else you will likely be paying a higher price. for example Max Homa is currently priced at +150 at Bovada & Bol while Sam Burns is +165 at Bol and +125 at Bovada with ties paid in full at Bovada.The limits can be an issue at Bovada

**Locktober** · 02-09-21, 05:47 PM

^^^^^^these are for top 20

**finkjason** · 02-09-21, 06:40 PM

Thanks for the reply and it's a great suggestion for any golf bettor to be aware of! I actually started betting golf on Bovada after the last time I had an issue like this with BOL and I've had a great experience there. As you said, it just comes down to the price--if it's the same, I will use Bovada every time to get paid in full on the ties. In this case, there was a substantial enough difference that it was worth it to make the bet at BOL--though I'm obviously now wondering if it was, in fact, worth it!

Originally posted by Locktober

Just an fyi that you may or may not be aware of...Bovada offers Ties paid in full for top 10 & 20.typically need to get down early before markets stabilize or else you will likely be paying a higher price. for example Max Homa is currently priced at +150 at Bovada & Bol while Sam Burns is +165 at Bol and +125 at Bovada with ties paid in full at Bovada.The limits can be an issue at Bovada

**finkjason** · 02-09-21, 06:53 PM

UPDATE: I never heard back from anyone at BOL after my last email, but a few minutes ago the mistake was fixed and my balance is now correct. Thanks again to everyone for your help! Really appreciate it.

**Optional** · 02-09-21, 09:30 PM

Originally posted by finkjason

UPDATE: I never heard back from anyone at BOL after my last email, but a few minutes ago the mistake was fixed and my balance is now correct. Thanks again to everyone for your help! Really appreciate it.

Thank the lord for that. I didn't want to have to try and explain this. I'd say you final email was clear enough that someone finally 'clicked' about what they had wrong.