Matchbook Commission Changes 1st November 2016

**Hareeba!** · 10-31-16, 02:42 PM

Not sure that I'm overly happy about this.
I do put up a lot of offers so in theory it should benefit me but I'd be concerned that they will now not be as attractive to accept.
At evens (+100) accepting a posted offer is the equivalent of 1.9704.
It's 1.9851 should someone accept your offer.

Accepting evens works out better at Smarkets (1.98)

**sheepgotwool** · 10-31-16, 03:03 PM

Does anyone put offers up there besides the same screwy market maker or two over there ? Things have changed completely at matchbook since good ole days of 2011 or before. Also if market maker puts up wrong price funds still do not change hands if bet goes awry ? Hmmm..............

**Hareeba!** · 10-31-16, 03:11 PM

Originally posted by sheepgotwool

Does anyone put offers up there besides the same screwy market maker or two over there ? Things have changed completely at matchbook since good ole days of 2011 or before. Also if market maker puts up wrong price funds still do not change hands if bet goes awry ? Hmmm..............

Been betting there every day for years now and never experienced that!
But I guess if you take a palpable bad line you might suffer the same fate as at any bookie.

I post a lot of offers.
More often than not you can achieve better odds than at Pinnacle.

**Optional** · 10-31-16, 03:34 PM

Intuitively I'd guess people are more often accepting offers as odds drop and posting them as odds raise.

I wonder if this will result is slightly higher offers, offsetting the commission difference anyway?

**sheepgotwool** · 10-31-16, 04:09 PM

They are not a bookie though . That is the point. They are a betting exchange !! Also how can you call yourself matchbook when you cannot see the odds that are matched anymore like in previous years ???? Is it because so few odds are matched !!! Without a doubt.

**Hareeba!** · 10-31-16, 04:25 PM

Originally posted by sheepgotwool

They are not a bookie though . That is the point. They are a betting exchange !! Also how can you call yourself matchbook when you cannot see the odds that are matched anymore like in previous years ???? Is it because so few odds are matched !!! Without a doubt.

Bottom line is I can almost always get better odds than at Pinnacle!
That's what really matters isn't it?

**SBR Forum** · 10-31-16, 04:28 PM

Thanks for sharing this, Hareeba!

**dealer wins** · 10-31-16, 05:48 PM

Most big bettors will have access to Pinnacle, so unless matchbook have higher odds after tax than Pinny, they will not get the action.

Matchbook are not like betfair, they dont have and probably will never have loads of recreational customers. I use them a lot, but if Pinny are even 0.1% higher I obviously use them, and the commission hike isnt going to help things IMO.

**rangerz2478** · 10-31-16, 09:37 PM

Are they using the bet placed date or bet settled date for this change? In other words, does the change apply to bets placed before November 1st (election futures) that will be settled after November 1st?

**luctens** · 11-01-16, 09:13 AM

Originally posted by rangerz2478

Are they using the bet placed date or bet settled date for this change? In other words, does the change apply to bets placed before November 1st (election futures) that will be settled after November 1st?

Can't see anywhere on their site or anything where it distinguishes between whether bets placed before 1st November but settled after 1st November apply to the new commission structure or not. You are best to contact them by live chat or call them up to confirm.

It would be an extremely underhand thing to do if your bet was changed to the new commission structure as you would have made the bet not knowing about this new commission structure and if they change your bet to the new commission structure, that's like a bookmaker changing the price of your bet just because their margins have changed between you placing your bet and the result being known, and obviously a bookmaker wouldn't be allowed to do that, so there's no way Matchbook should be doing any of that either. So Matchbook certainly should be honouring the previous commission structure on any bets placed before but settled after 1st November, otherwise the one offering the price at the time is going to get a better price than previously agreed and the one accepting the price at the time is going to get a worse price than previously agreed, and that just isn't good enough.

Matchbook are a complete arsewipe of a site, so I wouldn't put it past them doing that, but if they do say they've changed it to the new commission structure, don't settle for any of that crap and take it as far as is needed so you get the price you agreed on when you made the bet.

**qwaszx123** · 11-01-16, 09:22 AM

"Matchbook are a complete arsewipe of a site, "

luctens, I have seen plenty of your posts on various betting forums around the web and this is the 1st time I wholly 100% agree with you. Congratulations and well done.

**Matchbook** · 11-01-16, 12:40 PM

Originally posted by rangerz2478

Are they using the bet placed date or bet settled date for this change? In other words, does the change apply to bets placed before November 1st (election futures) that will be settled after November 1st?

Hi rangerz2478,

The commission rate that was in place at the time you placed the bets will apply.

Thanks,

Matchbook

**Matchbook** · 11-01-16, 12:43 PM

Originally posted by Optional

Intuitively I'd guess people are more often accepting offers as odds drop and posting them as odds raise.

I wonder if this will result is slightly higher offers, offsetting the commission difference anyway?

Hi Optional,

This is certainly the intention - our goal is to have as many punters betting against each other as possible and we believe that these changes will help affect that. This is about affecting betting behaviour and if more customers are posting offers, that means better odds are available. It's important to remember, even if you just want to accept a bet, you only need to get odds that are 1 point bigger on the decimal odds ladder to offset the extra commission charged.

Thanks,

Matchbook

**Hareeba!** · 11-01-16, 02:08 PM

Originally posted by qwaszx123

"Matchbook are a complete arsewipe of a site, "

luctens, I have seen plenty of your posts on various betting forums around the web and this is the 1st time I wholly 100% agree with you. Congratulations and well done.

I too have seen plenty of luctens' posts and I'd have to say that this is the first time I've 100% DISAGREED with him!!

Matchbook are quite clearly the #1 site for betting on US sports.

**rangerz2478** · 11-01-16, 02:49 PM

Originally posted by luctens

Can't see anywhere on their site or anything where it distinguishes between whether bets placed before 1st November but settled after 1st November apply to the new commission structure or not. You are best to contact them by live chat or call them up to confirm.

It would be an extremely underhand thing to do if your bet was changed to the new commission structure as you would have made the bet not knowing about this new commission structure and if they change your bet to the new commission structure, that's like a bookmaker changing the price of your bet just because their margins have changed between you placing your bet and the result being known, and obviously a bookmaker wouldn't be allowed to do that, so there's no way Matchbook should be doing any of that either. So Matchbook certainly should be honouring the previous commission structure on any bets placed before but settled after 1st November, otherwise the one offering the price at the time is going to get a better price than previously agreed and the one accepting the price at the time is going to get a worse price than previously agreed, and that just isn't good enough.

Matchbook are a complete arsewipe of a site, so I wouldn't put it past them doing that, but if they do say they've changed it to the new commission structure, don't settle for any of that crap and take it as far as is needed so you get the price you agreed on when you made the bet.

As a previous poster said, for once I agree with you 100%. I have made an incredible amount of trades on U.S. election futures that were all placed before the new structure and will be settled after the new structure. The 0.5% difference would add up to a decent amount and is not what I signed up for when the wagers were placed. My margins on these are very small and are placed across many sites. My bets were placed based on a certain price/commission structure and is exactly like changing the odds after the fact if they were to settle them based on the new structure.

**rangerz2478** · 11-01-16, 02:52 PM

Originally posted by Matchbook

Hi rangerz2478,

The commission rate that was in place at the time you placed the bets will apply.

Thanks,

Matchbook

I am happy to hear this. I got an email from ac88 saying that the new structure from them will take place on November 7th. I found this incredibly peculiar that the new structure will go into effect the day before the election as I know you have taken an incredible amount of money on this election. But I will take your word for it and I am happy to hear the old rates will be honored on these.

**Grivas_Digeni** · 11-02-16, 10:09 AM

Originally posted by Matchbook

Hi Optional,

This is certainly the intention - our goal is to have as many punters betting against each other as possible and we believe that these changes will help affect that. This is about affecting betting behaviour and if more customers are posting offers, that means better odds are available. It's important to remember, even if you just want to accept a bet, you only need to get odds that are 1 point bigger on the decimal odds ladder to offset the extra commission charged.

Thanks,

Matchbook

So you go to 2.25% instead of 2.00% (a 12.5% increase in your total take) and this is supposed to help liquidity?

**Hareeba!** · 11-02-16, 01:53 PM

Originally posted by Grivas_Digeni

So you go to 2.25% instead of 2.00% (a 12.5% increase in your total take) and this is supposed to help liquidity?

Effectively it's going from about 2% to 3% if you're accepting an offer and down to 1.5% if your offer is accepted.

**Grivas_Digeni** · 11-02-16, 07:47 PM

Originally posted by Hareeba!

Effectively it's going from about 2% to 3% if you're accepting an offer and down to 1.5% if your offer is accepted.

No matter how you slice it, there is exact same amount of $$ on both sides of each matched offer.

So their take goes up 12.5% and I'm guessing they simulated this move and they are going to lose less than 10% overall matched volume in short- and middle-run (and if miraculously their volume remains the same or grows, even merrier!)

**tradeout** · 11-02-16, 07:58 PM

Step in the wrong direction by matchbook.

I have been using matchbook regularly and can say from experience - offers NEVER get matched there unless the odds shift against you and traders need to adjust.

**Grivas_Digeni** · 11-02-16, 08:44 PM

If they want to really grow, they should make incentives for low and mid-stake market makers - people who will monitor dozens of markets all day long and provide betting opportunities to those betting $100 or less. Perhaps experiment with a couple sports and make it zero commission for a full season, then start charging 0.5% - but only AFTER they've established themselves as a definite go-to place for hundreds/thousands of regulars who know to open matchbook before they open pinnacle when they want to bet on those markets.

This is a blatant attempt at monetizing / charging more. Similar to skrill/neteller just doing a price hike out of the blue.

Well done, Matchbook. Now go to hell.

**Hareeba!** · 11-02-16, 08:51 PM

Agree it's a price hike and nobody likes those.

However I've still managed to get both my offers today matched at odds better that Pinnacle's after factoring in commission.

**dealer wins** · 11-03-16, 06:26 AM

The fact their commission is the same as Betfair now (With my discount) means I just wont bother to even check their odds anymore. Shame really as I put quite a bit through there but only because they were slightly better priced than BF due to the lower rate.

**Hareeba!** · 11-03-16, 01:57 PM

Originally posted by dealer wins

The fact their commission is the same as Betfair now (With my discount) means I just wont bother to even check their odds anymore. Shame really as I put quite a bit through there but only because they were slightly better priced than BF due to the lower rate.

Ok, but I find Betfair's liquidity on US sports is not in Matchbook's league. And they don't have the same range of lines.

**jjgold** · 11-03-16, 08:51 PM

Most of matchbook markets are seeded by professional bettors who work at matchbook and not a bad thing

It still has lowest juice in business

Basically traders us betting against them and of course some player liquidity here and there

Bottom line low juice and real safe

**luctens** · 11-03-16, 10:34 PM

Originally posted by jjgold

Most of matchbook markets are seeded by professional bettors who work at matchbook and not a bad thing

It still has lowest juice in business

Basically traders us betting against them and of course some player liquidity here and there

Bottom line low juice and real safe

"Lowest juice in the business"?!

They now have the net win commission equivalent of 3.00% or 3.40% for UK and Ireland residents for bet accepters (which would be the overwhelming majority of any exchange users), whilst Smarkets has 2.00% net win commission for both bet accepters and bet offerers and are working towards trying to bring their commission down to under 1.00% net win commission for everybody, so you're talking complete and utter rubbish.

And you say that "most Most of matchbook markets are seeded by professional bettors who work at matchbook" like that's some special thing that they do, whereas the reality is that pretty much every single market on every single exchange is seeded by exchange bots operated by professional exchange traders that are either employed by the exchange themselves or are outsourced by the exchange to do the job.

Check the facts before you come up with such crap.

**dealer wins** · 11-04-16, 03:22 AM

On a lot of their markets they simply copy pinnacle, but offer slightly less odds. Then add on commission. Any same person will place the bet at pinnacle?

**Optional** · 11-04-16, 03:32 AM

Sounds like non-users are doing the griping.

Yet what an actual user says...

Originally posted by Hareeba!

Agree it's a price hike and nobody likes those.

However I've still managed to get both my offers today matched at odds better that Pinnacle's after factoring in commission.

**Hareeba!** · 11-04-16, 03:33 AM

Originally posted by dealer wins

On a lot of their markets they simply copy pinnacle, but offer slightly less odds. Then add on commission. Any same person will place the bet at pinnacle?

OK, I plead insanity.

I always check for where I can get the best odds and about 85% of the time it's Matchbook.

**DGG23** · 11-04-16, 04:33 PM

why not remove commision on loser bets?
imo is the worst thing in matchbook ,is a nonsense

**Hareeba!** · 11-04-16, 07:10 PM

Originally posted by dealer wins

On a lot of their markets they simply copy pinnacle, but offer slightly less odds. Then add on commission. Any same person will place the bet at pinnacle?

NY +7.5 -104 Matchbook, -113 Pinnacle ..where do you think I should place the bet Dealer?

**tradeout** · 11-04-16, 08:23 PM

Originally posted by dealer wins

On a lot of their markets they simply copy pinnacle, but offer slightly less odds. Then add on commission. Any same person will place the bet at pinnacle?

Agree with the above

**tradeout** · 11-04-16, 08:26 PM

Originally posted by Hareeba!

NY +7.5 -104 Matchbook, -113 Pinnacle ..where do you think I should place the bet Dealer?

Sure, you can occasionally find better offers at Matchbook. But how does this justify the price hike?

**Hareeba!** · 11-04-16, 08:30 PM

Originally posted by tradeout

Sure, you can occasionally find better offers at Matchbook. But how does this justify the price hike?

Far more frequently than "occasionally" mate!

No, the price hike is quite a different issue and I'm not in any way trying to justify it.