Aussie online bookmakers taking bets only from losers

**jjgold** · 03-06-14, 07:12 PM

Hareeba is that you??

Great audio interview

Betstar cannot afford to take $2000 bets??

What Aussie books take bets from winners??

TAB??

**Hareeba!** · 03-06-14, 07:28 PM

Originally posted by jjgold

Hareeba is that you??

Great audio interview

Betstar cannot afford to take $2000 bets??

What Aussie books take bets from winners??

TAB??

No, not I. But my experience mirrors his.
Betstar and indeed all the major corporate cowards are always keen to publicise big bets they lay, particularly around racing carnival times - up to $1m at times.
There are a couple of independent online outfits which up to this point have a good reputation for taking decent bets: TopSport, Palmerbet and also Unibet (for racing only). There are also on-course bookies who will take good sized bets which you need to bet with over the phone.
Richard, is I believe primarily only a racing punter. But those NT bookies (and Ladbrokes licensed in Norfolk Island) do the same to sports punters.
Personally I have yet to be flagged by the Tabcorp or Tatts on racing and can still get on decent sized bets but I expect that won't last based on the experience of several punters I am in touch with.
Tabcorp limits me to peanuts on sports, as do Unibet.

**jjgold** · 03-07-14, 07:06 AM

Hareeba how the heck can you find edges in horse racing?? IN USA it s a death sport meaning no such thing as a sharp, is Aussie racing different and more legit?

**Domestic** · 03-07-14, 07:45 AM

Good interview, thanks for posting.
Echoes what many say around here.

**mikenhl** · 03-07-14, 02:04 PM

this seems to be SOP for books now unfortunately

**Hareeba!** · 03-07-14, 02:16 PM

Originally posted by jjgold

Hareeba how the heck can you find edges in horse racing?? IN USA it s a death sport meaning no such thing as a sharp, is Aussie racing different and more legit?

It must be very different to the US scene. Supervision, particularly at the top end, is excellent and by and large has the public's confidence.
No doubt at all that it is easier to make more profit on turnover betting horses than sports.
US is mainly if not totally pari mutuel? That would be more difficult but exotics would be the way to go if the takeout isn't too high.
Fixed odds betting in Australia provides plenty of opportunity to beat the bookies. There are many punters very well skilled in maintaining rating databases and applying them. The bookies lag behind the best in that regard and thus ban them and their followers rather than attempt to take them on.

**jjgold** · 03-08-14, 02:11 PM

Hareeba I forgot about the fixed odds betting angle..that does make it beatable

UK has fixed odds betting also??

**JayZ** · 03-08-14, 04:41 PM

Originally posted by jjgold

Hareeba I forgot about the fixed odds betting angle..that does make it beatable

UK has fixed odds betting also??

Indeed it does, plus Ireland.

**jjgold** · 03-10-14, 06:09 AM

Books are in business to make money though so why would they want winners?? That is argument on other end.

**dirtdog52658** · 03-10-14, 06:30 AM

Originally posted by jjgold

Books are in business to make money though so why would they want winners?? That is argument on other end.

On top of that they normally do not close you out, they limit you to 50 bucks. This is done so if anyone ever complains about the marketing that they do they can say they were not interested in those limits but would be happy to give you the average amount a person bets, because lets face it aside from a few whales and the pros no one really bets more than a couple hundred a game.

**AzNDooM** · 03-10-14, 09:35 AM

I believe Sportingbet and Sportsbet would take your Bets. I've placed a few sizeable bets and have never been knocked back by them. They do give you a call however when winning big and try to convince you to play more based on my experience

**dirtdog52658** · 03-10-14, 09:43 AM

Originally posted by AzNDooM

I believe Sportingbet and Sportsbet would take your Bets. I've placed a few sizeable bets and have never been knocked back by them. They do give you a call however when winning big and try to convince you to play more based on my experience

Between me and friends I've never seen sporting bet allow someone to get above being up 10k and thats being generous. The second you start betting dimes you hit the radar and will be chopped down. Had an account only last 4 days here once. But they do pay.

**Hareeba!** · 03-10-14, 05:44 PM

Originally posted by AzNDooM

I believe Sportingbet and Sportsbet would take your Bets. I've placed a few sizeable bets and have never been knocked back by them. They do give you a call however when winning big and try to convince you to play more based on my experience

'fraid not mate.
Sportingbet/Centrebet won't allow me to bet even $1 at fixed odds on racing.
And for sports, generally they limit me to winning $250 at most ... a good deal less on some options.

as for Sportsbet - I can't bet at all - the cowards closed my account!

**mr.ed** · 03-10-14, 10:48 PM

I wouldn't say they are cowards, but more like smart businessmen. This is how 5dimes has mananged to stay around for so long...they are very good at ID'ing winners and take appropriate measures to neutralize them. I've been cut off or limited by many books....and although I'm never happy about it, I certainly understand why they do it. Books that don't won't last very long (Pinnacle is the exception). To suggest that sportsbooks should take on all comers regardless of their skill level is nonsense.

**lecubs28** · 03-10-14, 11:02 PM

on this note, if you're playing at sportsinteraction marathonbet bet365 or william hill...you are a huge sucker and should move on to a book that isn't raping you with shitty odds and immediately closing the accounts of anyone that has a clue

all of those books are afraid to take a bet and it's not fair that they target the worst losing degenerates but don't let winners stay more than a few days.

**Hareeba!** · 03-10-14, 11:03 PM

Originally posted by mr.ed

I wouldn't say they are cowards, but more like smart businessmen. This is how 5dimes has mananged to stay around for so long...they are very good at ID'ing winners and take appropriate measures to neutralize them. I've been cut off or limited by many books....and although I'm never happy about it, I certainly understand why they do it. Books that don't won't last very long (Pinnacle is the exception). To suggest that sportsbooks should take on all comers regardless of their skill level is nonsense.

Bookmakers licensed to operate on racecourses throughout Australia have long been obliged to lay to any patron, a horse/dog to lose up to a certain sum depending on the course and enclosure in which they are working. My understanding is that that sum is $5,000 on the rails in Melbourne and Sydney for example. I've never heard any complaint about that. Why shouldn't the same apply to online bookies?

The interesting thing is that a couple of years ago the NT commission did introduce a rule obliging them to lay a horse for $1,000. But unfortunately they caved in to the desires of the corporate cowards and did away with that requirement last year. Not that it was really worth the paper it was written on in practice so long as they were still free to deny fixed odds betting to any customer they didn't want as the requirement didn't extend to all-comers.

In Australia, we are supposed to be operating in a fair trading / non-discriminatory business environment. There a Federal, State and Territory laws which are supposedly designed to ensure such fairness. Why is it that the appropriate bodies are all reluctant to take up complaints against bookmakers?

**Cessation** · 03-10-14, 11:07 PM

Hareeba

Are you worried about V'Landys comment in the media the other week about lobbying the federal government to make it illegal for banks to process financial transactions to offshore books. His motive is to wipe out the vanuatu books that are popping up and offering Aus racing without paying the turnover tax. However it would also make it impossible to bet with Pinnacle, SBO, Matchbook etc for Australians.

**Hareeba!** · 03-10-14, 11:19 PM

Originally posted by Cessation

Hareeba

Are you worried about V'Landys comment in the media the other week about lobbying the federal government to make it illegal for banks to process financial transactions to offshore books. His motive is to wipe out the vanuatu books that are popping up and offering Aus racing without paying the turnover tax. However it would also make it impossible to bet with Pinnacle, SBO, Matchbook etc for Australians.

Of course I'd have to be worried if that were ever to come about.

But we do still live in a land of the relatively free and I hope it stays that way.

New Zealand is a pretty nice place to live though.

**jjgold** · 03-11-14, 06:06 AM

sportsbet,au takes tops $10 per game after you win a little. Its a micro limit book only and run by UK PaddyPower. I am surprised The UK and Aussie allows residents to bet with Pinnacle and SBOBET types that even though really safe are not truly regulated .

**Hareeba!** · 03-11-14, 03:05 PM

Originally posted by jjgold

sportsbet,au takes tops $10 per game after you win a little. Its a micro limit book only and run by UK PaddyPower. I am surprised The UK and Aussie allows residents to bet with Pinnacle and SBOBET types that even though really safe are not truly regulated .

Why should you be "surprised"?
This is (generally) a free country.
So long as you're not harming others we are pretty well free to do as we please.

**jjgold** · 03-12-14, 06:47 AM

Aussie must be a nice place to live as is New Zealand

**farmer33** · 03-12-14, 11:42 PM

All of the recent books licensed out of Vanuatu are to be totally avoided if you have any respect for your money. No financials are required to get one and just a promise they will get some cash later is enough. Every one of them is under capitalized and a major risk to players. I am even aware of a couple of committee men from a County Racing Club in Australia who have applied for a license in Vanuatu. They are obviously greedy low life's looking to dodge the new product tax,s which in turn harms the incomes of their very own club and all others in the industry. Its shameful what's going on in Australia with all these corporate bookies,if you can term them Bookies.

**farmer33** · 03-12-14, 11:48 PM

Sorry I repeated myself.

**Hareeba!** · 03-13-14, 12:02 AM

Originally posted by farmer33

All of the recent books licensed out of Vanuatu are to be totally avoided if you have any respect for your money. No financials are required to get one and just a promise they will get some cash later is enough. Every one of them is under capitalized and a major risk to players. I am even aware of a couple of committee men from a County Racing Club in Australia who have applied for a license in Vanuatu. They are obviously greedy low life's looking to dodge the new product tax,s which in turn harms the incomes of their very own club and all others in the industry. Its shameful what's going on in Australia with all these corporate bookies,if you can term them Bookies.

Yes, one has to really be pretty vigilant in this area.
BetJack is one which certainly falls into that category.
However, I've been assured by a couple of pretty astute punters that PuntingPal and VIPBet are safe enough.
I'd certainly be wary about leaving a lot of cash in such places though.

**jjgold** · 03-13-14, 06:00 AM

Stay away from unregulated books period, its an accident waiting to happen.

**steve1845** · 03-13-14, 10:12 AM

Originally posted by Hareeba!

Yes, one has to really be pretty vigilant in this area.
BetJack is one which certainly falls into that category.
However, I've been assured by a couple of pretty astute punters that PuntingPal and VIPBet are safe enough.
I'd certainly be wary about leaving a lot of cash in such places though.

Me and a few people I know had good experiences with puntingpal although they've sadly banned non-Australian residents now. I didn't have a balance in when this was announced but somebody I know had mid 4 figures returned to bank very promptly.

**davidchong** · 03-13-14, 12:11 PM

Originally posted by jjgold

Aussie must be a nice place to live as is New Zealand

My parents had two option, live in Australia or Panama, Australia looks better than here,

**Vaughany** · 03-13-14, 01:00 PM

Lol isnt it pretty obvious? They wouldnt exist if only winning bettors bet !

**farmer33** · 03-14-14, 09:05 PM

Hareeba... We all know about Betjack and its owners from all the bad press it gets,stay clear. Puntingpal is a small time operation who WILL be tangled up with Betezy (they are related) very very soon,and VIP bet is run by the guy who just sold Betezy and WILL still be tangled up with them.Stay clear of them all as there is NO ONE in Vanuatu who is over seeing them,NO ONE monitoring their activity and NO ONE checking their balance sheets and NO ONE to complain to at all. Why risk it ? a free bet? Why bad Betjack and not the others I ask as they are all in the same boat..Ask yourself why are they there,to dodge what the t/o tax? no they are to small to be a factor.They are there because they would NEVER get a license in OZ because of the bonds required which they do not have. Certainly not having a go at you there mate , you seem to know the ropes about the low life corporates etc.Just making everyone aware of Vanuatu,s lax laws and that is why it attracts under capitalized would be bookies. BET ELSWHERE.

**Hareeba!** · 03-15-14, 05:15 AM

Originally posted by farmer33

Hareeba... We all know about Betjack and its owners from all the bad press it gets,stay clear. Puntingpal is a small time operation who WILL be tangled up with Betezy (they are related) very very soon,and VIP bet is run by the guy who just sold Betezy and WILL still be tangled up with them.Stay clear of them all as there is NO ONE in Vanuatu who is over seeing them,NO ONE monitoring their activity and NO ONE checking their balance sheets and NO ONE to complain to at all. Why risk it ? a free bet? Why bad Betjack and not the others I ask as they are all in the same boat..Ask yourself why are they there,to dodge what the t/o tax? no they are to small to be a factor.They are there because they would NEVER get a license in OZ because of the bonds required which they do not have. Certainly not having a go at you there mate , you seem to know the ropes about the low life corporates etc.Just making everyone aware of Vanuatu,s lax laws and that is why it attracts under capitalized would be bookies. BET ELSWHERE.

I hear what you say Farmer but don't necessarily believe that it is folly to distrust them all. Be cautious by all means. Many years ago I was betting with the #1Betting Shop in Vanuatu and never had a problem with them. It was run by the Tripps who moved it to Australia and set up Sportsbet and made a killing by selling it for big money to Paddy.
The Betezy connection doesn't faze me. They are sound. And now Matt Tripp is taking over there.
Frankly mate, I smell a vested interest in your sudden joining of SBR to post on this issue.

**RedDevil1974** · 03-19-14, 12:06 AM

Its that free a country you cant put a bet online in running. they only reason its better than the US is that you can send money offshore. but still cant bet online in running with 90% of them

**Hareeba!** · 03-19-14, 12:14 AM

Originally posted by RedDevil1974

Its that free a country you cant put a bet online in running. they only reason its better than the US is that you can send money offshore. but still cant bet online in running with 90% of them

We can bet in running on horse racing.

We also have online and on-course bookmakers in Australia whom you can bet with legally. I don't think you can do that in the US?

And (generally speaking) gambling winnings aren't taxable.

**jjgold** · 03-19-14, 06:15 AM

USA horse Racing is horrific compared to Aus. USA does not offer race track bookies, fixed odds betting and live betting.

**RedDevil1974** · 03-31-14, 08:54 PM

you can bet on course in the US i think

and no aus based bookies let you punt any sport live in play. im not interested in or bet horses, it makes the IPL and lower level tennis look non dodgy.