Yeah and betonline is a A book. Wtf ever.

**CanuckG** · 09-25-12, 02:42 PM

Wonder what BetOnline B+ did

**CanuckG** · 09-25-12, 02:53 PM

Love how they moved my BetOnline post.

**Bill Dozer** · 09-25-12, 02:59 PM

2 fouls for hijacking!

But seriously... post about BetOnline or any book all you you want but get your own audience. Don't be dropping your little doo doos in other good topics.

**CanuckG** · 09-25-12, 03:21 PM

Money talks Billy I understand

**firedawg** · 09-25-12, 03:45 PM

Unreal... Sbr is as bad as the nfl

**firedawg** · 09-25-12, 03:48 PM

So sick of the Sbr double standards and these monkies actually believe Sbr ratings are legit.......

**Bill Dozer** · 09-25-12, 04:12 PM

You guys talk it over.

**CanuckG** · 09-25-12, 04:23 PM

Funny it's D- I can find as many complaints towards BetOnline and they're B+. Oh wait you wont be able to read this post it will be moved

Difference between Sportsbook.com and BetOnline is Betonline pays to keep that solid rating.

**Bill Dozer** · 09-25-12, 04:41 PM

500 points for a legit standing claim against Betonline from the forums. Since you have a day off in the cool-down cooler you can look around the forums to kill some time. A livechat rep misquoting a bonus, a check that has to be resent, or someone forced to take neteller instead of moneybookers doesnt count...has to be a real claim for $. You can go back the full 10 years and firedawg can help.

**firedawg** · 09-25-12, 04:56 PM

Mathy will be here soon

**cutter2225** · 09-25-12, 05:37 PM

Originally posted by Bill Dozer

A livechat rep misquoting a bonus, a check that has to be resent, or someone forced to take neteller instead of moneybookers doesnt count.

Can you honestly say that none of those tactics were used to sucker in deposits or to stall payouts?
Since anyone with half a brain knows thats exactly why they do what they do, I ask you this...Is it acceptable behaviour in your opinion. Don't factor in the banner at the top sir.

**YPS** · 09-25-12, 05:54 PM

Originally posted by Bill Dozer

500 points for a legit standing claim against Betonline from the forums. Since you have a day off in the cool-down cooler you can look around the forums to kill some time. A livechat rep misquoting a bonus, a check that has to be resent, or someone forced to take neteller instead of moneybookers doesnt count...has to be a real claim for $. You can go back the full 10 years and firedawg can help.

No. I´m waiting since 5 weeks for a 15k wire
Or does this also not count?

**YPS** · 09-25-12, 06:02 PM

I mean, I believe in the words of betonline that the delay was because of a situation with the processor.

But I mean 5 weeks? That´s a long time. A very long time

**Bill Dozer** · 09-25-12, 06:15 PM

Originally posted by YPS

I mean, I believe in the words of betonline that the delay was because of a situation with the processor.

But I mean 5 weeks? That´s a long time. A very long time

Hi YPS, We don't have a complaint on file from your email reg'd to the forum. We have one other case like yours and the book is sending funds through alternate method. Shoot us your acct # and we'll follow it with you.

**tb1984** · 09-25-12, 06:20 PM

Bill, I think you should move this thread to Players Talk.

**YPS** · 09-25-12, 06:26 PM

Originally posted by Bill Dozer

Hi YPS, We don't have a complaint on file from your email reg'd to the forum. We have one other case like yours and the book is sending funds through alternate method. Shoot us your acct # and we'll follow it with you.

Ok its done

**Bill Dozer** · 09-25-12, 07:55 PM

Thanks YPS, Give us until tomorrow to verify details. In the meantime, feel free to share with the board.

**YPS** · 09-25-12, 08:10 PM

sure, thanks so far

**mathdotcom** · 09-25-12, 10:32 PM

BOL is an A book now..? Still says B+ on SBR to me, or did I miss something?

I think the gap between a C and D book is pretty small, yet there is a huge gap in my opinion between A+ and A and among A. According to SBR ratings, Pinnacle should be an A++++++++++++++++++++++++ book. Would like to hear of anyone else getting a $50k payout in under 30 minutes from CRIS/5Dimes/Greek/etc.

**mathdotcom** · 09-25-12, 10:39 PM

One question I've always wondered is...

How would SBR rate a book that was like Pinnacle in every respect except they dealt 100c juice on everything? i.e. they still have huge limits, great CS, super fast payouts, low payout fees, etc., but have extraordinarily high juice.

I would rate such a book in the C range but I have a feeling SBR would rate them at A.

So my conclusion is SBR bases its ratings solely on "probability you'll be paid". That's fine, but I feel ratings should start to encompass juice/honesty/CS/withdrawal fees.

**Hankwins** · 09-25-12, 11:16 PM

checks should be revieced with no more than 5 business days bottom line! BOL would meet any of my needs becuase I'll i'd use is p2p and if i request it monday and have by friday i am happy. But i understand I am a small time guy and they fall short in paying high rollers with constant ma payout checks ans wire's in the time frame that is quoted when that player makes the request. I think their areplently people on SBR complaining on their checks and wire's being very late.

So boasting of thier is no non payment issues is kinda lame. plenty of unhappy customers

**prop** · 09-26-12, 01:52 AM

I think if you look at SBR's history the ratings were long how safe players funds were. They were doing this before they had a forum and at the time posted on other forums, gained feedback on those books from forums, taking a lot of input. It was a free service a lot of players appreciated and they didn't really tout with anyone with much flash. In time things evolved but got to remember scams and fly by night sportsbooks were all over back then, online betting was just coming out, many bettors were still in the habit of calling in their bets. The ratings were not how a sites juice were but what was the risk to players funds.

I'd be the first to agree in pretty much all areas there is not a lot of B+ in BetOnline any longer (a few years ago sure). But what are we really arguing here? Should they be C+, B-, B. If we say they're a D+ book man that doesn't leave too much gap between the many scams out there.

Seriously I don't think I'm letting the cat of the bag here. I doubt (and am perhaps wrong) Bill, John, Lou, Justin, Sheri or anyone if they were just players and had no involvement with SBR ever at anytime in the past would rate them a B+ during the periods October 2011 to September 2012. The question is how unreasonable of a stretch is a B+ rating. You'd think it was way off the map by the way people respond in these threads.. But.. they do resolve the complaints that come up. A lot of them are the result of BetOnline pushing to become the top retail brand. They've been the most active with acquisitions. The most active with marketing. They've pushed all in making a run at building an empire. Like them or not, questionable pasts or w/e they have quite the experienced team behind the scenes. But going from where they were to where they are now is quite a massive leap. It is more of inability to find enough quality reps and get them trained that has led to the problems than anything else.

The book makes me personally a little nervous every time have money there. But ultimately I don't think they're close to a scam site. So is the allegation SBR is giving a B- type site a B+ rating. Do you guys think they're actually a scam? I mean SBR has a big staff, many contests, pays cash every single day for players that log in. I'm not sure what BetOnline pays them, but I'd suspect Topbet would pay big money to be SBR recommended. Probably more than half the sites on the current list now pay. For what's available to run a business I don't think BetOnline is too bad. Also just passing on what I heard (as I've not a dollar on the line or reason to be lied to) they had a meeting a few weeks ago where management was discussing the urgency required to clean up the many issues, as they're spending a lot on marketing and know they need to run significantly smoother to maximize results. I suspect this is sincere (and I'm a sceptic by nature) and suspect they will figure it out. I doubt B+ is any kind of massive stretch. But figured let's establish what it is we're arguing here.

**Hankwins** · 09-26-12, 01:56 AM

BOL will absolutly not steal a players money. I thought timeframes would play a role in a rating, like if a player recieves an email you'll get your check in 7-10 days and in reality it's 40. I think that is unaccepatable and there have numerous reports of that on here.

**prop** · 09-26-12, 02:29 AM

Payout time frames absolutely should imo play a roll is a sites rating. The line "have always paid" is the biggest marketing crock of you know what in the history of gambling sites. WSEX, PokerSpot, BetOnBet, Absolute Poker, Pitbull poker, UB, 28 different tusks sites, JetSet, Full Tilt, I mean could make a list of 50+ always paid until... right, until they stopped paying. Management can sell any line they'd like. The best thing there is to go on an evaluating a site is how fast they pay. Last I knew at Sportsbook.com payouts were quoted as 6-8 weeks for a check. The same on their Merge Poker Network, network wide. This could be a sign they want to discourage payouts, but it could also be cash flow issues keeping a pad for active marketing. Again, can sell any line they'd like but nothing speaks louder than a site's payout history. It's not about meeting quoted time either. If you quote 90 days and pay at 70, you're high risk and might not be able to easily absorb the hits that inevitably come up in the industry we're discussing.

**HedgeHog** · 09-26-12, 09:30 AM

Originally posted by Bill Dozer

500 points for a legit standing claim against Betonline from the forums. Since you have a day off in the cool-down cooler you can look around the forums to kill some time. A livechat rep misquoting a bonus, a check that has to be resent, or someone forced to take neteller instead of moneybookers doesnt count...has to be a real claim for $. You can go back the full 10 years and firedawg can help.

He'll need a lot more time than a day to sift through the vast number of complaints. You are correct that the BOL complaints aired at SBR seem to eventually get resolved favorably, but it has to make you wonder about the theft cases that never make it here. If this is an argument for BOL's B+ rating, it's a thin one IMO.

**SBR Lou** · 09-26-12, 01:15 PM

Originally posted by YPS

sure, thanks so far

YPS,

We were told BetOnline had to confirm your banking information. You will be contacted by a manager today and your payout should be received in five business days from that point.

**YPS** · 09-26-12, 01:58 PM

That´s great news. Thanks a lot. He already contacted me and I resend the banking details.

**gangeriver** · 09-26-12, 03:03 PM

Even bet365 was an A book when it was a forum sponsor.
I think they are b or c again...so guys I mean, money talks and don't care about raitings

**SBR Lou** · 09-26-12, 03:06 PM

Originally posted by gangeriver

I think they are b or c again...so guys I mean, money talks and don't care about raitings

I think you're a guy that hasn't even bothered to read the ratings guide... as you'd see Bet365 is in fact rated A-.

**DudleyDawson** · 09-26-12, 07:11 PM

Originally posted by YPS

No. I´m waiting since 5 weeks for a 15k wire
Or does this also not count?

Only 10% of people who bet offshore actually read gambling forums...how many hundreds to thousands of people out there are waiting like you..

**firedawg** · 09-26-12, 07:59 PM

Originally posted by DudleyDawson

Only 10% of people who bet offshore actually read gambling forums...how many hundreds to thousands of people out there are waiting like you..

A light

**SBR_John** · 09-26-12, 08:47 PM

Originally posted by mathdotcom

One question I've always wondered is...

How would SBR rate a book that was like Pinnacle in every respect except they dealt 100c juice on everything? i.e. they still have huge limits, great CS, super fast payouts, low payout fees, etc., but have extraordinarily high juice.

I would rate such a book in the C range but I have a feeling SBR would rate them at A.

So my conclusion is SBR bases its ratings solely on "probability you'll be paid". That's fine, but I feel ratings should start to encompass juice/honesty/CS/withdrawal fees.

Mathy the rating guide is made for the average bettor or the 98% of players who utilize it. In your example if players enjoyed playing at your high juice book and they had a long track record then they probably would get a good grade.

There are plenty of very regular players who choose Bet365(A-) over Pinnacle(A+) every day of the week. They actually sign up more from our site than Pinnacle. Bodog signs up more than Pinnacle despite a lower rating as well.

You have to be careful not to consider your experience and preference level as the norm. The right book for you may not be the same as the guy who woke up today and decided to throw in $50 into a book to make a few bets and hit the casino.

**mathdotcom** · 09-27-12, 05:36 PM

Originally posted by SBR_John

Mathy the rating guide is made for the average bettor or the 98% of players who utilize it. In your example if players enjoyed playing at your high juice book and they had a long track record then they probably would get a good grade.

There are plenty of very regular players who choose Bet365(A-) over Pinnacle(A+) every day of the week. They actually sign up more from our site than Pinnacle. Bodog signs up more than Pinnacle despite a lower rating as well.

You have to be careful not to consider your experience and preference level as the norm. The right book for you may not be the same as the guy who woke up today and decided to throw in $50 into a book to make a few bets and hit the casino.

My preferences and the average bettor's preferences are probably aligned on exactly everything except bet limits. The average bettor is rarely constrained by limits. But otherwise:

- We both like square lines
- We both like low juice (all else equal)
- We both like low payout fees
- We both like good CS
- We both like timely payouts

Of course a 10% payout fee might be considered small for a guy taking out $300 whereas it'd be considered outrageous for 5 figures, but otherwise I think the preferences are pretty well aligned.

If you asked me to choose between Bet365 and Pinnacle I would choose 365 in a heartbeat as well -- on the condition they can't ban me or reduce my limits

I guess "quickness to be shown the door" is another factor to be considered that wouldn't affect the average bettor, but I neglected to mention that in my original post.

**Courtesywipe** · 09-27-12, 06:09 PM

Normally you see a book become a punching bag with players ranting in groups and sometimes last for a few weeks. You hear moderators say that sometime a book will receive negative press and normally lasts for short spurts of time. I can honestly say..........That for the last YEAR.....BOL has been receiving criticzm from players and enough is a enough. This is well past a few weeks and there is obviously TRUTH to the hundred of threads start because of BOLs behavior.

When will SBR stand up for the player????