Poker: Luck vs Skill

[steveharris]

Poker Masters, can you give your views about poker being a game of skill or luck?

Skill over luck for me..

[smitch124]

Short Term: Luck

Long Term: Skill

[ProPicker713]

Luck on Sbr
Skill in Real Life

[theballsflop]

I'll rather be the luckiest mofo for life than the most skilled player anyday.

[Sledge187]

Word homies!

[Optional]

52% skill 48% luck

Just enough edge so the really good players rise to the top consistently, whilst the rest of us blame bad beats and card racks instead of realizing that the few hands we play wrong can quickly swing our personal chances the opposite way, to 48% skill and 52% luck.

[blankoblanco]

Short Term: Luck

Long Term: Skill

Yep...

[SharkAA]

Short term-luck, long term-skill combined with luck and BR management.

[dare]

52% skill 48% luck

Just enough edge so the really good players rise to the top consistently, whilst the rest of us blame bad beats and card racks instead of realizing that the few hands we play wrong can quickly swing our personal chances the opposite way, to 48% skill and 52% luck.

[lunch]

poker is 100% skill

play 10 000 hands hu vs a good regular and find out how much you lose

[aggieshawn]

You yahoo.. The American gov't proved that poker is 79% skill. Thus not a game of chance.
Thus not a casino game..

What are we in the kiddie pool here.....

[blankoblanco]

poker is 100% skill

play 10 000 hands hu vs a good regular and find out how much you lose

No. Chess is 100% skill (or close enough). You're right that a good HU reg will destroy a bad player in 10k hands, but 10k hands isnt the only considerable sample, and HU isn't the only form of poker

Tournaments are poker too. A below average poker player can win a poker tournament vs good players if he's lucky enough. A below average chess player cannot win a chess tournament vs good players. Key difference

I agree poker is ultimately a skill game overall, but I also define it as gambling (the 2 aren't mutually exclusive) and I think to call it "100% skill" is silly when it has such clear differences from a game like chess that actually is pure skill

[daneblazer]

If it was all skill and no luck, the poker player pool would be drastically reduced

[Timmay]

poker is 100% skill

play 10 000 hands hu vs a good regular and find out how much you lose

True

[knight]

No. Chess is 100% skill (or close enough). You're right that a good HU reg will destroy a bad player in 10k hands, but 10k hands isnt the only considerable sample, and HU isn't the only form of poker

Tournaments are poker too. A below average poker player can win a poker tournament vs good players if he's lucky enough. A below average chess player cannot win a chess tournament vs good players. Key difference

I agree poker is ultimately a skill game overall, but I also define it as gambling (the 2 aren't mutually exclusive) and I think to call it "100% skill" is silly when it has such clear differences from a game like chess that actually is pure skill

Tournament chessplayer and poker player here. Blanko speaks the truth; I could play a grandmaster at chess and lose every time for 1000 games, easily, and I'm not a terrible player. A mediocre poker player stands a chance over a small sample size - say 10000 or so hands, because he may make the wrong decision but still be rewarded by hitting his flush draw when the odds weren't right for him to call.

The more hands the poker master vs. poker amateur play, the closer the result will come to the expected result, by the law of large numbers. The expert will make better decisions, and eventually will get paid off.

[steveharris]

So, as of 01/27/2014

SKILL -- 17 votes -- 70.83% LUCK -- 7 votes -- 29.17%

[theballsflop]

Even chess isnt 100% skill. The coinflip at the start to determine who starts first makes it a 99.9% skill game.

[The Giant]

Poker is a lot like baseball. In a three or four game series, either team could win. Over the long haul of a 162 game season, the better team will eventually pull away.

And then the playoffs start, and it's a crapshoot all over again.

[sinmiedo]

It does have a strong luck factor, that when not in you favor, takes away the profits, concentration , and eventually tllt the best players .
this luck factor influence plays and makes room for the gambling aspect of the game.
I found more of this in cash games and during the crushing times at tournaments when blinds and ants chips away your sack,
do to this factor It is very important your skill in controlling your bank roll,

[Mitchell88]

sin where did you end up finishing the 10 am there was a lot of us still there at the end

[greenhippo]

Depends on what you're playing: SBR Tournaments have a bigger luck factor, blinds increase so rapidly that you either go all in or fold, no skill involved there. Cash game I'd say is 3:1 skill once you get up to higher stakes. Low stakes it's mostly luck in my opinion, people will call a $4 bet with j-6 suited in a 1/2 game but might not call a $40 bet with the same game in a $10/20 game.

[itchypickle]

I'm with greenhippo in the above post.

There is definitely a mix but it's all about the game structure. A NL ring game is more skill because you have the time and ability to pick your spots. Tourneys are a great example of skill vs luck though since a structured satellite or turbo tourney is hugely based on luck vs a bigger buy in, longer blinds and high round structure. The faster tournaments, just based on math, are huge luck fests since if you calculate how much you blind off in the first couple of rounds leaving you with nowhere near enough chips to outplay a player after the flop in the middle late rounds. Basically you can't sit and wait on premium hands or play semi tight before you are forced to go all in with the fast tournaments. Joe Nobody has as much chance as beating a pro in a fast tourney.

[daneblazer]

Anyone who thinks it's all luck likely sucks at poker.

Anyone who thinks poker is all skill is delusional.

It's a skill game with luck involved. Poker is gambling, but the skill comes in being able to adjust to your opponents and consistently put yourself in situations where you come out ahead. There's also many different "skills" of playing poker. If it was all luck, we'd all be break even players in the long run with nobody winning but the rake.

[sinmiedo]

sin where did you end up finishing the 10 am there was a lot of us still there at the end

id not play 10 am today