Rain Delay in Clev - did it go enough innings?

[Dad]

Is 7 innings enough to cash for us Mariner backers if this game does not continue?

[yisman]

Yes.

[neverstoppers23]

usually it needs to go 8.5 innings for books to cash it. although wise its a refund.

[neverstoppers23]

Yes? What book are you using, usually it says in fine print it must go 8.5 on bodog.

[AlwaysDrawing]

I have the UNDER so just cancel it!

[chilidog]

"Baseball games are official on the Money Line after the 4.5 innings if the home team is winning and 5 innings if the away team is winning; so all of the bets on the totals and run-lines will be cancelled."

This is from the website that my local uses.

[rfr3sh]

usually it needs to go 8.5 innings for books to cash it. although wise its a refund.

thats the worst rule ever lol most books is around 5/6 innings

[Dad]

Chili is correct.

I just asked the book:

Sylvia: A baseball game becomes official for money line wagering purposes after 4 1/2 innings if home team is winning, or 5 innings if visiting team is winning. Totals and Run lines will have No Action.
Sylvia: For run lines and game totals (over/under), a baseball game becomes official after 8 1/2 innings if home team is winning, or 9 innings if visiting team is winning.
Sylvia: If a game is cancelled or suspended, the winner is determined by the score after the last full inning (unless the home team scores to tie, or takes the lead in the bottom half of the inning, in which case the winner is determined by the score at the time the game is called).
Sylvia: Wagers will be refunded on money line bets if the home team ties the game, and the game is then suspended or cancelled.
Sylvia: If a game goes past 9 innings and is not completed (i.e. suspended, curfew, rain delay, etc.), there is action on game total and run line wagers.

[yisman]

"Baseball games are official on the Money Line after the 4.5 innings if the home team is winning and 5 innings if the away team is winning; so all of the bets on the totals and run-lines will be cancelled."

This is from the website that my local uses.

Every sportsbook I've heard of only requires it to be an official game for the ML to count.

So it's not just your local.

[yisman]

Dad, I answered you. You didn't need to go into the sportsbook live help.

[LT Profits]

The OP has Mariners ML, so yes it's official.

[starfire]

Dad- I'm disappointed in u...
U should already know this?

[firehoyt]

sweet....I had the under and it was losing!!! Got my unit back!

[Raider3]

Pinny graded my live under 21 as a win.

[AlwaysDrawing]

Well, that's a good way to not lose a few hundred bucks.

[chemicalbrother]

awesome that you could go from winning an over in the top of the 3rd to pushing. lol

[DHK]

Why couldnt the rain come on the 4th inning

[yisman]

Did I just get ripped off?

I had the over and both team totals over.

[moses millsap]

brutal beat for over backers

[yisman]

$&*%^#&*$ing 5 dimes. I shut the game off after it went to 4-4.

The total was already decided. Pushing this is bogus.


<table class="Grid" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="1"><tbody><tr class="NonAlt "><td class="NoWrap">89161582-1</td><td>9/19/11 4:03pm</td><td class="MiddleRight Currency">
</td><td class="MiddleRight Currency">
</td><td class="MiddleRight Currency GradedOnly AmountPaidColumn">
</td><td>Cancelled</td><td>9/19/11 4:05pm Reduced Baseball 969 Seattle Mariners/Cleveland Indians Over 9 +105* (C Furbush - L must Start D Huff - L must Start)</td></tr><tr class="GridSeparator"><td colspan="7">
</td></tr><tr class="Alt "><td class="NoWrap">89161405-1</td><td>9/19/11 4:01pm</td><td class="MiddleRight Currency">
</td><td class="MiddleRight Currency">
</td><td class="MiddleRight Currency GradedOnly AmountPaidColumn">
</td><td>Cancelled</td><td>9/19/11 4:05pm MLB Baseball 970 Cleveland Indians Over 4½ -115* <small>vs</small> Seattle Mariners (C Furbush - L must Start D Huff - L must Start)</td></tr><tr class="GridSeparator"><td colspan="7">
</td></tr><tr class="NonAlt "><td class="NoWrap">89161361-1</td><td>9/19/11 4:00pm</td><td class="MiddleRight Currency">
</td><td class="MiddleRight Currency">
</td><td class="MiddleRight Currency GradedOnly AmountPaidColumn">
</td><td>Cancelled</td><td>9/19/11 4:05pm Reduced Baseball 969 Seattle Mariners/Cleveland Indians Over 9 +105* (C Furbush - L must Start D Huff - L must Start)</td></tr></tbody></table>

[yisman]

and DSI

<table cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0"><tbody><tr class="oddRow"><td class="dateCell">09/19/2011 - 01:10 PM</td><td class="idCell">MLB </td><td class="pickCell">[969] TOTAL o8½-120 (SEA MARINERS vrs CLE INDIANS)( C FURBUSH -L / D HUFF -L )
Score: SEA MARINERS(12) - CLE INDIANS(6)</td><td class="statusimgCell">N/A SHORT</td></tr></tbody></table>

[AlwaysDrawing]

Scoring is a monotonically increasing function, and so it makes no sense for totals which have already reached the total to be graded no action. I should've lost--Yisman should have won. Nothing but the weather could have changed the outcome of our bets, and honestly even that shouldn't have.

Books should WANT to change their policy too, since they don't make money when a bet gets no actioned. I wonder if this will change over the next few years.

[Boxer300]

Legend's counts it after 4.5 innings apparently

[Dad]

Dad, I answered you. You didn't need to go into the sportsbook live help.

Yisman, I had to double check after what everybody else was saying.

[gangeriver]

yes enough for off shore books and Vegas but some of euro books say "game should complete"

[Dad]

Dad- I'm disappointed in u...
U should already know this?

Starfire, I am truly sorry that I have disappointed you. But as you can see in this thread I was not the only one who was not 100% sure about this.

How can I ever make it up to you though, Starfire??

Oh... Maybe with this?

[LT Profits]

Scoring is a monotonically increasing function, and so it makes no sense for totals which have already reached the total to be graded no action. I should've lost--Yisman should have won. Nothing but the weather could have changed the outcome of our bets, and honestly even that shouldn't have.

Books should WANT to change their policy too, since they don't make money when a bet gets no actioned. I wonder if this will change over the next few years.

But what if a game is 'under' when it is shortened? That HAS to be a refund right because teams did not get a chance to go 'over' due to missing at-bats. Thus, books basically have to either grade all shortened totals No Action (which they do) or make them all official, and the former seems the lesser of the two evils. Otherwise, 'over' bettors would essentially be freerolling when games are shortened.

[LT Profits]

Legend's counts it after 4.5 innings apparently

All USA books count money lines after 4.5 innings if home team is winning or after 5 innings if road team is winning, but totals and run lines need 9 innings (or 8.5 if home team wins).

[AlwaysDrawing]

But what if a game is 'under' when it is shortened? That HAS to be a refund right because teams did not get a chance to go 'over' due to missing at-bats. Thus, books basically have to either grade all shortened totals No Action (which they do) or make them all official, and the former seems the lesser of the two evils. Otherwise, 'over' bettors would essentially be freerolling when games are shortened.

That's not true. All bets would be no action if the total hadn't been met. Totals aren't like spread bets--once they are won, they are won. There's no going back.

As far as I'm concerned, my bet is settled as an over or an under once A) the over is reached or B) the game is over. When a game is shortened and the total hasn't been reached, there is still a chance either side could win, and it is rightly considered no action. That is because it didn't meet the second condition--the game wasn't over!

What circumstance could have changed the outcome of the Indians total today? Could I have magically gotten the under if the game went 2 more innings? If there's no chance the bet could have resulted in another outcome, it should be settled. If it could still go either way, it should be no action.

Grading this wager a win for over bettors and a loss for under bettors wouldn't change anyone's betting strategy.

I'm very interested in hearing a potential reason my logic is flawed, but I'm pretty sure that I'm right, and books will eventually make that a house rule.

[LT Profits]

That's not true. All bets would be no action if the total hadn't been met. Totals aren't like spread bets--once they are won, they are won. There's no going back.

As far as I'm concerned, my bet is settled as an over or an under once A) the over is reached or B) the game is over. When a game is shortened and the total hasn't been reached, there is still a chance either side could win, and it is rightly considered no action. That is because it didn't meet the second condition--the game wasn't over!

What circumstance could have changed the outcome of the Indians total today? Could I have magically gotten the under if the game went 2 more innings? If there's no chance the bet could have resulted in another outcome, it should be settled. If it could still go either way, it should be no action.

Grading this wager a win for over bettors and a loss for under bettors wouldn't change anyone's betting strategy.

I'm very interested in hearing a potential reason my logic is flawed, but I'm pretty sure that I'm right, and books will eventually make that a house rule.

You missed the most important part of my post, that being that 'over' players would be freeloading a rain-shortened game. That is the whole point of the rule.

[yisman]

But what if a game is 'under' when it is shortened? That HAS to be a refund right because teams did not get a chance to go 'over' due to missing at-bats. Thus, books basically have to either grade all shortened totals No Action (which they do) or make them all official, and the former seems the lesser of the two evils. Otherwise, 'over' bettors would essentially be freerolling when games are shortened.

No, there are books that actually no action the totals unless it's already clearly won (like if you bet over 40.5 tennis games and there's a retirement after 42 games, you win).

It makes no sense to no action overs after they hit.

I got screwed.

[yisman]

LT, "freeloading" is irrelevant unless the bettor somehow knew ahead of time it would be rain-shortened and bet the over. Since they couldn't possibly know that, there's no "freeloading" or "freerolling".

[LT Profits]

Tennis is a different animal because matches are not a finite length, whereas all baseball totals are based on nine innings.

[LT Profits]

LT, "freeloading" is irrelevant unless the bettor somehow knew ahead of time it would be rain-shortened and bet the over. Since they couldn't possibly know that, there's no "freeloading" or "freerolling".

But WHEN it occurs, the books would be in a no-win position if overs win and unders push. That is the very reason for the rule.

[AlwaysDrawing]

Nothing could take those runs off the board. How would you be able to angle shoot games this way?

How is it fair I got my money back despite clearly losing my bet--what could have happened that would have changed the outcome?