NBA division futures - How will bets grade them if there is a prorated season?

**thomorino** · 08-07-20, 11:46 AM

Originally posted by eastvan09

Perhaps they will wait until the end of the seeding games.

A Raptors win vs Celtics tonight will clinic the Atlantic Division.

Many divisions have already been clinched and still no payouts, I have bets on Miami to win the division that haven’t been graded.

**RedApples** · 08-08-20, 03:54 PM

Originally posted by bubba

Betonline has (per their rules) properly cancelled all my clipper division futures (day after lakers clinched). Good job by betonline. Better communication on the matter over the last few months would have been nice, but end result was proper.

Wow nice win. My Raptors & Nets division futures are still live.

Not sure it makes any sense whatsoever that the Lakers clinched*. Per an 80+ game schedule they didn't clinch. Theres no reason that if the bets (per their rules) are being cancelled because they won't reach 80+ games that bets would be refunded based on clinching on the condensed schedule.

Makes no sense that all divisions weren't cancelled at the same time as the Pacific (in your case).

**RedApples** · 08-08-20, 04:30 PM

You: Are you there?

Teagan Fisher: Yes. I am still here with you. I am checking the information with the Wagering department. I appreciate your patience.
17:10, Aug 8

17:11, Aug 8
You: ask them why they cancelled Pacific wagers (lakers, clippers etc), but not the other divisions
17:11, Aug 8

17:11, Aug 8
You: all divisions were to be cancelled because the league wont play 80 games
17:11, Aug 8

17:20, Aug 8
Teagan Fisher: No worries, I am letting them know your request in order to get a response.
17:20, Aug 8

17:25, Aug 8
Teagan Fisher: Thank you so much for waiting, my apologies for the delay. I was verifying the information on your account and we are waiting until the 14th to see what the final decision is with the league on division winners. Therefore, wagers will stand.
17:25, Aug 8

17:25, Aug 8
Teagan Fisher: My apologies for all the inconvenience.

**milwaukee mike** · 08-08-20, 04:33 PM

Originally posted by RedApples

Wow nice win. My Raptors & Nets division futures are still live.

Not sure it makes any sense whatsoever that the Lakers clinched*. Per an 80+ game schedule they didn't clinch. Theres no reason that if the bets (per their rules) are being cancelled because they won't reach 80+ games that bets would be refunded based on clinching on the condensed schedule.

Makes no sense that all divisions weren't cancelled at the same time as the Pacific (in your case).

what betonline did was wait until someone clinched the division... then they graded the lakers as a WIN and gave a cancel to all the others

very generous and i'm guessing that is what they will do with the other divisions as well... they also did that for nhl, gave division winners a WIN and graded the others as no action/cancel

**RedApples** · 08-08-20, 04:35 PM

Originally posted by milwaukee mike

what betonline did was wait until someone clinched the division... then they graded the lakers as a WIN and gave a cancel to all the others

very generous and i'm guessing that is what they will do with the other divisions as well... they also did that for nhl, gave division winners a WIN and graded the others as no action/cancel

gotcha. that makes more sense. thanks.

**bubba** · 08-08-20, 06:38 PM

Originally posted by milwaukee mike

what betonline did was wait until someone clinched the division... then they graded the lakers as a WIN and gave a cancel to all the others

very generous and i'm guessing that is what they will do with the other divisions as well... they also did that for nhl, gave division winners a WIN and graded the others as no action/cancel

Extremely generous if they are doing this for all divisions (no reason to think they are not). I would think they would want to communicate it better. They should be advertising it on their front page! Emailing all their clients and then some. It should be good for business. But its almost like they are trying to keep it on the down low. I dunno!

**hank_kingsley** · 08-08-20, 06:53 PM

Bovada returned cancelled bets for the Pacific Division today. I got a Clippers division bet cancelled and returned this afternoon. I expect they'll do the others as divisions are clinched.

**sunshineSpecial** · 08-09-20, 04:21 PM

Strange that Toronto are now officially division winners but Miami are not.

**hank_kingsley** · 08-10-20, 04:01 PM

OKC loss today clinches the Northwest for Denver. All divisions have now been clinched so hopefully books will start paying out all the outstanding bets and refunding losers for those that are following that policy.

**pokerdevil** · 08-10-20, 04:07 PM

Originally posted by bubba

Extremely generous if they are doing this for all divisions (no reason to think they are not). I would think they would want to communicate it better. They should be advertising it on their front page! Emailing all their clients and then some. It should be good for business. But its almost like they are trying to keep it on the down low. I dunno!

Let's just wait and see what happens. This would be incredibly generous of them. I already stand to win money on divisions there.

If they actually give me pushes on stuff that's been drawing dead since February - like Portland to win Northwest - I'll probably be inclined to buy a promoted social media post for them with my money

**hank_kingsley** · 08-10-20, 06:17 PM

Curious if anyone else has NBA futures on 5dimes that have disappeared. I got some graded this afternoon (that were clear winners). But I have several division winner parlays that were mixed between winners and non-winners that have now just disappeared off my account. Not listed in pending wagers, not listed in graded wagers, just gone.

I'm hoping there's a good reason for it, like they're going through manually and either cancelling them, or pulling out the losers and grading them based on the winners. But I'd like to know if others are experiencing the same thing.

I'm not panicking because I think 5d is legit and I also have screenshots of everything, but it is odd to not see a record of them at all.

**bubba** · 08-10-20, 06:39 PM

Originally posted by hank_kingsley

Curious if anyone else has NBA futures on 5dimes that have disappeared. I got some graded this afternoon (that were clear winners). But I have several division winner parlays that were mixed between winners and non-winners that have now just disappeared off my account. Not listed in pending wagers, not listed in graded wagers, just gone.

I'm hoping there's a good reason for it, like they're going through manually and either cancelling them, or pulling out the losers and grading them based on the winners. But I'd like to know if others are experiencing the same thing.

I'm not panicking because I think 5d is legit and I also have screenshots of everything, but it is odd to not see a record of them at all.

What bets specifically disappeared? Are you 100% positive?

**DontTailMe** · 08-10-20, 06:44 PM

Originally posted by hank_kingsley

Curious if anyone else has NBA futures on 5dimes that have disappeared. I got some graded this afternoon (that were clear winners). But I have several division winner parlays that were mixed between winners and non-winners that have now just disappeared off my account. Not listed in pending wagers, not listed in graded wagers, just gone.

I'm hoping there's a good reason for it, like they're going through manually and either cancelling them, or pulling out the losers and grading them based on the winners. But I'd like to know if others are experiencing the same thing.

I'm not panicking because I think 5d is legit and I also have screenshots of everything, but it is odd to not see a record of them at all.

How old are they? Have you checked archived wagers? Also, Graded wagers can be a little tricky to navigate since you have to put in a date range. I've been in situations before where I thought a wager was missing but I just somehow skipped over it when changing between dates. I'd bet your wagers are there somewhere.

**pokerdevil** · 08-10-20, 06:46 PM

Originally posted by hank_kingsley

Curious if anyone else has NBA futures on 5dimes that have disappeared. I got some graded this afternoon (that were clear winners). But I have several division winner parlays that were mixed between winners and non-winners that have now just disappeared off my account. Not listed in pending wagers, not listed in graded wagers, just gone.
I'm hoping there's a good reason for it, like they're going through manually and either cancelling them, or pulling out the losers and grading them based on the winners. But I'd like to know if others are experiencing the same thing.

I'm not panicking because I think 5d is legit and I also have screenshots of everything, but it is odd to not see a record of them at all.

Everything good on my end. I also screenshot stuff

**hank_kingsley** · 08-10-20, 06:53 PM

Have checked archived wagers and went back and put the date range in for when they were originally placed (Jan 2020). Don't show there.

Graded wagers show up by the date the bet was originally made, and it's not possible to go back to January on the graded wagers screen. Transactions go by the date that it was graded and the division winning bets do show up there. But you can't go back further than May on the Transactions screen so no way to see into January.

So I've checked everywhere they could possibly be and they don't show up anywhere.

They were division winner parlays that had either 2 or 3 teams in them. One of the 2 or 3 would be graded a loser by normal standards, so all of the bets that disappeared would be considered losses if they grade them straight.

So for others that have division winners that were losers, are they showing graded as loss? Or pending?

**bubba** · 08-10-20, 07:17 PM

Originally posted by hank_kingsley

Have checked archived wagers and went back and put the date range in for when they were originally placed (Jan 2020). Don't show there.

Graded wagers show up by the date the bet was originally made, and it's not possible to go back to January on the graded wagers screen. Transactions go by the date that it was graded and the division winning bets do show up there. But you can't go back further than May on the Transactions screen so no way to see into January.

So I've checked everywhere they could possibly be and they don't show up anywhere.

They were division winner parlays that had either 2 or 3 teams in them. One of the 2 or 3 would be graded a loser by normal standards, so all of the bets that disappeared would be considered losses if they grade them straight.

So for others that have division winners that were losers, are they showing graded as loss? Or pending?

My losses show up as losses in my daily figure. Can you give a specific example of a "missing wager"? Have you asked them about it?

**hank_kingsley** · 08-10-20, 07:22 PM

Ok, I am now seeing them in the Weekly Figure. They're showing as losses.

Apologize for the detour. I've never really used Daily and Weekly Figure and figured they would show in Transactions if they were settled as losses. Still weird they didn't.

**milwaukee mike** · 08-10-20, 08:14 PM

Originally posted by hank_kingsley

Ok, I am now seeing them in the Weekly Figure. They're showing as losses.

Apologize for the detour. I've never really used Daily and Weekly Figure and figured they would show in Transactions if they were settled as losses. Still weird they didn't.

yeah mine did the same thing

stinks that 5dimes would grade stuff as losses when they were still up in the air... i mean the clippers are only 4.5 back and ordinarily would have 12 games left

**bubba** · 08-10-20, 09:08 PM

Originally posted by milwaukee mike

yeah mine did the same thing

stinks that 5dimes would grade stuff as losses when they were still up in the air... i mean the clippers are only 4.5 back and ordinarily would have 12 games left

They graded out the hockey divisions a while ago according to the standings. So this should be of no surprise to anyone they are doing the same in the nba (not taking a side how they should have gone about it. short of being overly generous, some players will be upset. I lost thousands with my nba divisions)

**thomorino** · 08-10-20, 10:12 PM

Several books paid out my Toronto futures, but my bets on Miami to win the division haven’t been paid.

**eastvan09** · 08-10-20, 11:48 PM

5DIMES paid out my Raptors to win the Atlantic furure today! Yeah +675 payout. It was only a sprinkle but still.

What was the biggest odds payout of an NBA division winner this year?

**rm18** · 08-11-20, 02:14 AM

Definitely Raptors. I think OKC might of been as high as like 80/1 but they fell just short.

**soobv** · 08-11-20, 03:27 AM

Milwaukee division was paid out today on 5dimes

**pokerdevil** · 08-11-20, 11:44 AM

Wow - just got paid out on BetOnline divisions.

They paid out winners in full, and refunded any losing bets. So you literally couldn't lose. Amazing gesture!

**sunshineSpecial** · 08-11-20, 12:15 PM

I wonder how bet365 will do it. For hockey they only voided in-range teams. I would hope, as industry leaders, that they would be the most generous.

**RedApples** · 08-11-20, 04:06 PM

happy to note that I received wins on my Raptors bets on BetOnline and refunds on my Nets bets. whilst I think things could've been handled a lot better, i am happy that they took this course of action.

**pokerdevil** · 08-11-20, 04:13 PM

Originally posted by RedApples

happy to note that I received wins on my Raptors bets on BetOnline and refunds on my Nets bets. whilst I think things could've been handled a lot better, i am happy that they took this course of action.

How could it possibly have been better? LOL

**bubba** · 08-11-20, 04:52 PM

Originally posted by pokerdevil

How could it possibly have been better? LOL

Maybe he means better communication? They had been silent on how they planned to handle this for nearly 5 months. But the end result was as player friendly as one can imagine.

**milwaukee mike** · 08-11-20, 05:19 PM

good stuff guys, congrats

i had all losers so i'm pretty happy with the cancels at betonline

**DontTailMe** · 08-11-20, 07:20 PM

Originally posted by bubba

Maybe he means better communication? They had been silent on how they planned to handle this for nearly 5 months. But the end result was as player friendly as one can imagine.

Well, a lot of people told him to chill out a bit. Because BOL makes player friendly decisions like this all the time, and other books had been making similar moves on things like NHL division winners. The chances that they were trying to change the rules and steal our money from right under our noses was about 0.1%.

**hank_kingsley** · 08-11-20, 08:44 PM

Man what a huge difference in books. Will be giving all my action to Betonline and Bovada based on their responses on these futures alone, and will stay away from 5dimes.

I had division winner parlays at Bovada and 5dimes of 2 or 3 teams. At Bovada, they cancelled the losing legs so the parlay was reduced to just the winners and then paid out. If a parlay had all losers, they cancelled it and refunded the original stake. At 5dimes they just graded straight losers.

If 5dimes had followed the same policy of Bovada, the difference to me would have been about 6-7k in my direction.

Pay attention people. These books that are giving players the benefit of the doubt and grading in player friendly ways are worth your business.

Competition is good for us and we need to reward the books that treat their players well.

BTW, I've never had any problems with 5dimes in terms of payouts and I think they're a fine book. But they're just way behind the curve on this issue and they look poor in comparison.

**bubba** · 08-11-20, 10:02 PM

Originally posted by DontTailMe

Well, a lot of people told him to chill out a bit. Because BOL makes player friendly decisions like this all the time, and other books had been making similar moves on things like NHL division winners. The chances that they were trying to change the rules and steal our money from right under our noses was about 0.1%.

They are not perfect. A simple " we are aware of the rule that was taken down from our website (and dont intend to screw people over with our rules now being different)" from anyone in customer service over the last 4-5 months would have gotten rid of a lot of the worry. They chose an amazing way to treat there customers in this instance, but they could have/should have communicated it better.

**bubba** · 08-11-20, 10:07 PM

Originally posted by hank_kingsley

Man what a huge difference in books. Will be giving all my action to Betonline and Bovada based on their responses on these futures alone, and will stay away from 5dimes.

I had division winner parlays at Bovada and 5dimes of 2 or 3 teams. At Bovada, they cancelled the losing legs so the parlay was reduced to just the winners and then paid out. If a parlay had all losers, they cancelled it and refunded the original stake. At 5dimes they just graded straight losers.

If 5dimes had followed the same policy of Bovada, the difference to me would have been about 6-7k in my direction.

Pay attention people. These books that are giving players the benefit of the doubt and grading in player friendly ways are worth your business.

Competition is good for us and we need to reward the books that treat their players well.

BTW, I've never had any problems with 5dimes in terms of payouts and I think they're a fine book. But they're just way behind the curve on this issue and they look poor in comparison.

Betislands was the most player friendly book there was. Free points and bonuses galore. I like those things of course, but I wouldnt want my book taking a huge hit just paying out wagers galore if they cant afford it (not implying books are doing that). I dont know anyone's financial position, but maybe 5dimes is just being responsible

**DontTailMe** · 08-11-20, 11:25 PM

Originally posted by bubba

They are not perfect. A simple " we are aware of the rule that was taken down from our website (and dont intend to screw people over with our rules now being different)" from anyone in customer service over the last 4-5 months would have gotten rid of a lot of the worry. They chose an amazing way to treat there customers in this instance, but they could have/should have communicated it better.

Sure, but there was no need to complain every other day that BOL was stealing player funds when there was zero evidence of that occurring yet.

**bubba** · 08-11-20, 11:52 PM

Originally posted by DontTailMe

Sure, but there was no need to complain every other day that BOL was stealing player funds when there was zero evidence of that occurring yet.

Did I ever say they were stealing? If yes point it out to me and I will apologize for the post. I still think their slow communication on the matter ( especially nhl whose season has been over since march) was wrong.

And this group of books is not perfect. They still owe me $ from the super bowl between the pats and the rams a year and a half ago (for at least 1 of the wagers in question in this thread). https://www.sportsbookreview.com/for...recording.html

So I cant apologize for not giving them the benefit of the doubt.