[Justin3587]

Iowa State/UNC finish.

Classic NCAAB shit show finish.

[seaborneq]

Kid has to shoot a 3/4 shot. Roy knows better than to call a time out.

[Justin3587]

Kid has to shoot a 3/4 shot. Roy knows better than to call a time out.

But the clock didn't start, so whose fault is it that Roy thought he was getting a timeout with around a second left?

[jjgold]

They had no shot anyway

[Richkas]

They could play this game 10 times and Iowa State covers at least 7.....Iowa State played like shit....NC was the wrong side

[mcdonae101]

They could play this game 10 times and Iowa State covers at least 7.....Iowa State played like shit....NC was the wrong side

Yes, but in this game with 2 minutes left. Unc was wayyy the better side to b on. Nothing u can do about Iowa state making 4 3s in a 2 minute span

[Ronald S.]

But the clock didn't start, so whose fault is it that Roy thought he was getting a timeout with around a second left?

I think Roy wanted the timeout right away, as in he didn't want them to inbound the ball. Timeout also gives the refs a chance to review and put a few tenths of a second back on the clock. Also, the kid should have just heaved it at mid court once they did inbound. Makes no sense to call a timeout with less than a second left.

Great game though definitely an awkward ending.

[Seattle Slew]

It's amazing to me these teams have no idea what to do in these situations. Williams has to tell his team, "if they score, call a timeout." If not, "if they score, don't call timeout, just go." Why is that so hard? UNC players had no idea what to do there.

[Maargs]

over coacing

[jjgold]

THis is not the pros where guys get shots up so quick. not a major screwing at all. It would of been a pipe dream.

[THam12]

It's amazing to me these teams have no idea what to do in these situations. Williams has to tell his team, "if they score, call a timeout." If not, "if they score, don't call timeout, just go." Why is that so hard? UNC players had no idea what to do there.

They did what they normally do. Quick inbounds and go. Then Roy wanted a timeout.
Players were ready to go, but saw coach wanting timeout. Not their fault.

[MarcusPaige]

Roy specifically stated they had practiced this exact situation and all five players were supposed to be signaling for a time out as soon as the ball went through and none of them did. But Jackson Simmons was in the game for whatever reason and he only plays like 3-4 minutes a game, he apparently panicked and inbounded it in a split second without thinking, but Roy had the TO called and not one of 3 refs was looking his way. Roy was tapping his shoulders for a 30 second time out before the ball got inbounded and the black ref ran right by him and didn't call it.

Then, Britt is looking up at the clock thinking he has 1.6 seconds to get across half court and call a timeout so he tries and apparently succeeds. But then the refs say time had expired. AS IF THE KID WOULD NOT HAVE CALLED TIME OUT SOONER IF THE CLOCK INDICATED HE NEEDED TO.

You can say there was hardly any chance but there are a lot of miracle finishes in the NCAA tourney AND in the history of this program and Paige is clutch as they come. We also had multiple 6-9 players for a tap when their tallest player was 6-6. The way the game ended was complete bullshit and every ref involved in it should have their competence seriously evaluated. Disgraceful to see even a chance at a win stolen by the refs.

ETA: The equitable thing to do would have been at least to let UNC inbound the ball from the other side of the court, because Britt was CLEARLY looking at the clock and there is NO WAY he does not call time out to get a shot in that situation unless the clock indicates he has time.

[RavensFan2k3]

Roy specifically stated they had practiced this exact situation and all five players were supposed to be signaling for a time out as soon as the ball went through and none of them did. But Jackson Simmons was in the game for whatever reason and he only plays like 3-4 minutes a game, he apparently panicked and inbounded it in a split second without thinking, but Roy had the TO called and not one of 3 refs was looking his way. Roy was tapping his shoulders for a 30 second time out before the ball got inbounded and the black ref ran right by him and didn't call it.

Then, Britt is looking up at the clock thinking he has 1.6 seconds to get across half court and call a timeout so he tries and apparently succeeds. But then the refs say time had expired. AS IF THE KID WOULD NOT HAVE CALLED TIME OUT SOONER IF THE CLOCK INDICATED HE NEEDED TO.

You can say there was hardly any chance but there are a lot of miracle finishes in the NCAA tourney AND in the history of this program and Paige is clutch as they come. We also had multiple 6-9 players for a tap when their tallest player was 6-6. The way the game ended was complete bullshit and every ref involved in it should have their competence seriously evaluated. Disgraceful to see even a chance at a win stolen by the refs.

ETA: The equitable thing to do would have been at least to let UNC inbound the ball from the other side of the court, because Britt was CLEARLY looking at the clock and there is NO WAY he does not call time out to get a shot in that situation unless the clock indicates he has time.

The black ref tho lol...if it were a white ref, things woulda worked out right?

[MarcusPaige]

The black ref tho lol...if it were a white ref, things woulda worked out right?

I'm just identifying the one that initially missed Roy jumping and screaming for a TO as he ran right by him and didn't look. The two white ones didn't rectify the situation in the review and are just as guilty.

[robbeduagain]

Roy specifically stated they had practiced this exact situation and all five players were supposed to be signaling for a time out as soon as the ball went through and none of them did. But Jackson Simmons was in the game for whatever reason and he only plays like 3-4 minutes a game, he apparently panicked and inbounded it in a split second without thinking, but Roy had the TO called and not one of 3 refs was looking his way. Roy was tapping his shoulders for a 30 second time out before the ball got inbounded and the black ref ran right by him and didn't call it.

Then, Britt is looking up at the clock thinking he has 1.6 seconds to get across half court and call a timeout so he tries and apparently succeeds. But then the refs say time had expired. AS IF THE KID WOULD NOT HAVE CALLED TIME OUT SOONER IF THE CLOCK INDICATED HE NEEDED TO.

You can say there was hardly any chance but there are a lot of miracle finishes in the NCAA tourney AND in the history of this program and Paige is clutch as they come. We also had multiple 6-9 players for a tap when their tallest player was 6-6. The way the game ended was complete bullshit and every ref involved in it should have their competence seriously evaluated. Disgraceful to see even a chance at a win stolen by the refs.

ETA: The equitable thing to do would have been at least to let UNC inbound the ball from the other side of the court, because Britt was CLEARLY looking at the clock and there is NO WAY he does not call time out to get a shot in that situation unless the clock indicates he has time.

Not being a smartass, but asking a question. I've coached basketball for 30 yrs (Indiana HS) and I've never signaled for a timeout by tapping my shoulders. That's usually done by putting your hands in the shape "T". Why would he signal for the type of timeout before he got the timeout. Stick your hands out and signal for the timeout. I didn't see all the replays, but that makes no sense to me.

[MarcusPaige]

Not being a smartass, but asking a question. I've coached basketball for 30 yrs (Indiana HS) and I've never signaled for a timeout by tapping my shoulders. That's usually done by putting your hands in the shape "T". Why would he signal for the type of timeout before he got the timeout. Stick your hands out and signal for the timeout. I didn't see all the replays, but that makes no sense to me.

You call for a 30 second time out by tapping your shoulders, you call for a full TO by making the T symbol. A 30 can also be converted to a full TO after you call it. It may have been that Roy knew he only had a 30 or that all he needed to do was call a 30 and convert it if he had it.

I'm not sure if there is a consequence to calling a full TO when you only have a 30 but regardless, he was calling for it in a way the rulebook says you can call it, and the ref missed it when he should have been looking straight at him to see if he wanted it.

[robbeduagain]

You call for a 30 second time out by tapping your shoulders, you call for a full TO by making the T symbol. A 30 can also be converted to a full TO after you call it. It may have been that Roy knew he only had a 30 or that all he needed to do was call a 30 and convert it if he had it.

I'm not sure if there is a consequence to calling a full TO when you only have a 30 but regardless, he was calling for it in a way the rulebook says you can call it, and the ref missed it when he should have been looking straight at him to see if he wanted it.

I understand the difference between the signals. Normally you make the T symbol, and the ref will ask you if you want a full or 30. Hands out symbol means full, tapping shoulders means 30. I've never seen someone try to initially try to call a timeout by using any signal but the T signal.

[MarcusPaige]

Here is the video. Start at about the one minute mark of the video. Roy jumping up and down giving TO symbol, black ref runs right by him and doesn't call it, then what seems like an eternity later Britt shows up calling TO. They later said Britt called TO too late even though there was time showing on the clock, but Roy was calling one way earlier which was ignored.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lf4jZayv-jg

[jtoler]

I'm just identifying the one that initially missed Roy jumping and screaming for a TO as he ran right by him and didn't look. The two white ones didn't rectify the situation in the review and are just as guilty.

Wouldnt have mattered homer, Iowa St. got in them guts just like UAB did.

[jtoler]

Here is the video. Start at about the one minute mark of the video. Roy jumping up and down giving TO symbol, black ref runs right by him and doesn't call it, then what seems like an eternity later Britt shows up calling TO. They later said Britt called TO too late even though there was time showing on the clock, but Roy was calling one way earlier which was ignored.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lf4jZayv-jg

What about the clock not starting till he was already at halfcourt.

[MarcusPaige]

Glad to give UAB and your UNC pedigree coach something positive to hang your hat on this season.

[robbeduagain]

Here is the video. Start at about the one minute mark of the video. Roy jumping up and down giving TO symbol, black ref runs right by him and doesn't call it, then what seems like an eternity later Britt shows up calling TO. They later said Britt called TO too late even though there was time showing on the clock, but Roy was calling one way earlier which was ignored.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lf4jZayv-jg

I saw the play when it happened. Coaches make all kinds of gestures during a game, but the signal for a timeout is universal and its a T symbol. Then you tell the ref what kind of timeout you want. Granted, he was yelling timeout and any ref worth his salt would have been looking at the UNC bench to see if Williams wanted a timeout. Coached a long time, just my observation.

[Justin3587]

Bottom line. Bad officiating. You absolutely have to be looking at the bench expecting a timeout if you are an official. For all of them to miss it is absurd.

[MarcusPaige]

The whole point is that Roy was calling TO when the ball went through the hoop and well before Britt got to half court. It's indisputable in the video that Roy was calling TO way before Britt gets to half court. Furthermore, it's not Britt's fault they didn't start the clock, he would have called time out sooner on the court if the clock wasn't wrong. Britt had every right to rely on that clock when deciding to try to make it past half court before using the TO.

[jtoler]

The whole point is that Roy was calling TO when the ball went through the hoop and well before Britt got to half court. It's indisputable in the video that Roy was calling TO way before Britt gets to half court. Furthermore, it's not Britt's fault they didn't start the clock, he would have called time out sooner on the court if the clock wasn't wrong. Britt had every right to rely on that clock when deciding to try to make it past half court before using the TO.

Where on the video can you see Roy calling a T.O. as the ball went through the hoop?

[jtoler]

Bottom line. Bad officiating. You absolutely have to be looking at the bench expecting a timeout if you are an official. For all of them to miss it is absurd.

Not the first time a ref wasnt watching a coach in that situation, why wouldnt the player call a TO while out of bounds? You would think he would or at least see the coach calling for one if he was at that point in time.

[robbeduagain]

Justin, you're definitely right. Hard to believe the ref ran right by him without looking. No excuse for that.
Marcus, not disputing anything you've said. Just making an observation. If Williams would have had his hands extended out to signal the timeout, it might have caught the attention of the ref, although he should have been looking anyway.

[MarcusPaige]

Here is a link to the Rulebook. http://ncaambb.arbitersports.com/Gro...files/BR15.pdf

Page 121 tapping shoulders is signal for 30 second timeout. Also around page 60 they discuss timeouts in general and it is supposed to be granted on visual OR oral request by a coach or player. It's clear in the video Roy is jumping up and down doing BOTH and the ref runs right by him and calls nothing, then Britt shows up several seconds later. You really think Roy wasn't calling that TO when there was time on the clock?? OK, if you're friggin' blind I can;t help you see.

[jtoler]

The whole point is that Roy was calling TO when the ball went through the hoop and well before Britt got to half court. It's indisputable in the video that Roy was calling TO way before Britt gets to half court. Furthermore, it's not Britt's fault they didn't start the clock, he would have called time out sooner on the court if the clock wasn't wrong. Britt had every right to rely on that clock when deciding to try to make it past half court before using the TO.

Why not call TO while youre out of bounds before you inbounds the ball, dont blame the ref.

[MarcusPaige]

Also, if you watch the video that is on Roy the whole time around the one minute mark on the link, Roy is jumping up and down and taps his shoulders TEN times literally. Then on the video that shows Britt cross half court you only see Roy tap them once. He had tapped his shoulders nine times before Britt got to half court. It's obvious he was calling for it the entire time.

I know I don't need to convince most people on this board that college officiating sucks balls but most of the time it's judgment calls like charges that cost teams a chance to win. This is flat out undeniable video evidence that they screwed up.

[MarcusPaige]

Why not call TO while youre out of bounds before you inbounds the ball, dont blame the ref.

Player definitely should have called it too but rules specifically say can be called by coach or player. As others have said at least one of three refs has to anticipate TO there and at least glance at the coach, and video shows ref run straight by him without even looking. He is jumping up and down, even a split second glance would have resulted in TO being called.

[robbeduagain]

Here is a link to the Rulebook. http://ncaambb.arbitersports.com/Gro...files/BR15.pdf

Page 121 tapping shoulders is signal for 30 second timeout. Also around page 60 they discuss timeouts in general and it is supposed to be granted on visual OR oral request by a coach or player. It's clear in the video Roy is jumping up and down doing BOTH and the ref runs right by him and calls nothing, then Britt shows up several seconds later. You really think Roy wasn't calling that TO when there was time on the clock?? OK, if you're friggin' blind I can;t help you see.

I'll try to be as clear as I can. Most coaches signal for a timeout with the T symbol. The ref grants the timeout and then asks him what kind of timeout he wants. I know the signals for 30 and full, and I know he was calling a timeout. Just use a signal that better gets the refs attention. Stick your damn hands out in front of the ref.

[2daBank]

Lost in all of Marcus homer bs is the fact timeout wasn't changing shit. What was retard Roy gonna draw up some genius full court play? Highly unlikely..

[MarcusPaige]

I'll try to be as clear as I can. Most coaches signal for a timeout with the T symbol. The ref grants the timeout and then asks him what kind of timeout he wants. I know the signals for 30 and full, and I know he was calling a timeout. Just use a signal that better gets the refs attention. Stick your damn hands out in front of the ref.

I don't care how most coaches call it. A coach should be able to call it in any way the rulebook states is allowed and have it granted. And as others have said any competent ref should be looking at the coach anyway, and this was all the result of a ref not looking, not the way Roy was asking for it.

[MarcusPaige]

Lost in all of Marcus homer bs is the fact timeout wasn't changing shit. What was retard Roy gonna draw up some genius full court play? Highly unlikely..

Kind of like there was no way Stephen F. Austin could make a 4 point play to tie it at the end of regulation or Laettner couldn't make make a 3 on a full court inbounds pass to beat Kentucky right? Crazy shit happens in the NCAA tourney, it happens every year, and if you think it's OK to excuse bad officiating because it probably would not have mattered you are just a goddamned idiot.