Jamacia canceled my bet

[ShamsWoof10]

You don't have to agree with what NJ did but it's not hearsay. That is what BJ stated. And it's obvious what happened as you can see here.

Where other book's lines are is very relevant and dictates whether the player took a monetary loss. If BetJam was keeping its straddle on the market they would have given the player his only 3 minute window at that low price and then canceled it away. The player said it cost him 156 dollars and I am saying it didn't and would have actually saved him money if he rebet it at the next best price, which was better after his bet was canceled.

I would have liked to seen BJ eat the price difference like they usually do but they feel a sharp player is jumping on a line move and there was no reason why he shouldn't accept it as an error. It's rare but sometimes books, including Pinny do immediately cancel bets after an error.

Bill let me make it very clear that I am not trying to discredit you... When I say hear say I mean it from the BetJam side telling you or I that...

HELL NO I don't agree with it because it gives an oppurtunity for books to be dishonest to balance their books as they see fit... There is no rule that says they can't lie about why they cancelled a bet...especially when it was not a bad line...

As far as another book being relevant... Come on Bill you know that's saving face by BJ and should not even be recognized... BJ cancelled a bet not some other book or because another book told them he can get a better deal somewhere... Why pass the blame...? BetJam claims "well he could have gotten a better price somewhere else" I am glad they have our best interest at heart...

In light of the fact the books have our best interest in mind Bill the next time I place a bet and see I could get a better price somewhere else do you think you can have them cancel it for me and let them know I could have gotten a better price elsewhere..?

Thanks

[magnavox]

It was the best line by far. It would have been the best price of the whole day actually.

If I understand it correctly there was a better line to get elsewhere?

[magnavox]

Also, there were mid-tier books that cancelled bets on close-to-obvious bad lines and then "had to" settle and pay the players on the market-average price.

In this case it is an A+ rated book and a low margin sport. Email notification doesn't do any good. If they can't take wagers "live" then impose a delay on all players. What good is a ticket number for...?

[Lucas]

matchbook
07/01 12:06 PM +130 -131
07/01 12:12 PM +131 -132

BJ
07/01 12:06 PM +130 -140
07/01 12:11 PM +118 -128
07/01 12:15 PM +128 -138

cancel -128 when market is -130.5 ????
good job

[magnavox]

matchbook
07/01 12:06 PM +130 -131
07/01 12:12 PM +131 -132

BJ
07/01 12:06 PM +130 -140
07/01 12:11 PM +118 -128
07/01 12:15 PM +128 -138

cancel -128 when market is -130.5 ????
good job

Matchbook's -131 makes it -133.67 after commission and for newbies it is at the original -131.

I actually believe that Jamaica made a mistake, but this tiny slip-up should not warrant these kind of actions whatsoever. As said earlier -- very bad precedent.

[Bill Dozer]

Also, there were mid-tier books that cancelled bets on close-to-obvious bad lines and then "had to" settle and pay the players on the market-average price.

In this case it is an A+ rated book and a low margin sport. Email notification doesn't do any good. If they can't take wagers "live" then impose a delay on all players. What good is a ticket number for...?

If it's an obvious bad line and it's caught after the game results are in then they are asked to honor a fair price. If the game hasn't begun and they send the time-stamped email to show the player's funds were not at risk and there was a bad-line, that and a low rate of occurrence is all we can ask for. I agree with your second part and how it pertains to this situation.

Had the player not checked his pending wagers and rebet the game and came in the next day saying where is my bet... I just checked my email and see it was canceled...BetJam would be asked to honor it. But also keep in mind the book can look and see if the player viewed his pending wagers after it was canceled.

If I understand it correctly there was a better line to get elsewhere?

No, BJ's "screw-up" line was the best. The best legit line was at Pinnacle and the line got better as the game approached.

matchbook
07/01 12:06 PM +130 -131
07/01 12:12 PM +131 -132

BJ
07/01 12:06 PM +130 -140
07/01 12:11 PM +118 -128
07/01 12:15 PM +128 -138

cancel -128 when market is -130.5 ????
good job

That wouldn't be the market. You are talking about a cent, almost no vig price and then a fee and the chalk was likely available for one person at a thousand bucks. You could say Pinny's line plus a few cents is a decent market price.

Matchbook's -131 makes it -133.67 after commission and for newbies it is at the original -131.

I actually believe that Jamaica made a mistake, but this tiny slip-up should not warrant these kind of actions whatsoever. As said earlier -- very bad precedent.

That's a fair assessment. You could argue that a faulty line move should never be canceled. But, I don't think there is a precedent here. Each of these situations are different and there are always different variables. Players are always inconvenienced but usually the bottom line is, did the mistake cost the player money?

[Dark Horse]

I wish books would clearly state what a bad line actually is. Plenty of ways to qualify it, but 'bad' alone is open to far too wide a range of interpretation.

[ShamsWoof10]

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The biggest problem I have with this Bill is AS IF THE HOUSE DOESN'T ALREADY HAVE A BIG ENOUGH ADVANTAGE this creates a psychological advantage among other possible advantages... I'm sitting in the bar watching the Dolphins game thinking I have Miami +170... I think.. unless BJ decided to cancel it... You can't leave your computer until the game is over...

You guys can't be serious about BJ making a mistake... EVERYDAY during bases and I mean EVERYDAY I see 6 cent difference from book to book on MANY GAMES... I am not talking about scalps ..a 6 cent difference without being a scalp I see all the time....

I can deal with 3-4 week payments I can deal with withdraw fees I can even deal with no bonuses and deposit fees but when books start canceling a bet based on this garbage.. that's when I go...

[sean72]

This sucks bill It gives books an opportunity to cancell bets for no reason at all and say OOPs we went the wrong way, thats why we canceled. Once a bet is accepted as it was in this case then the bet should stand. A bad line is one that is an obvious error like +128 instead of -128
I see lines move by more than ten cents all the time and Jamacia offtern have the best price.

So I do believe they are in the wrong here and should honour the price that I origionally recieved or this could give all books an opportunity to do this in the future and create a precident that wouldnt be able to be reversed

I believe you should go int Bat for me because if you dont then this could happen again and again in the future

Once again a bad line is an obvious error this wasn't my bet was accepted and my bet should stand

[louis]

I once called in to Jamaica and told them about a bad line, rather than betting it. They thanked me and gave me a $50 bonus. The line was a total of a basketball game, which was about 10% what it should have been, something like 18 instead of 180. I could have put a chunk of change on the over, but decided to call them instead, since there was a high risk they would cancel it anyhow and I wanted them to continue allowing me to bet there. But I still can't understand why in Vegas if they make a mistake with a line and then agree to a bet, the bet stands, but online books are allowed to be sloppy and then correct themselves after the fact by cancelling bets.

[sean72]

I dont believe this was a bad line It was Jamacia balancing their books

[Santo]

I once called in to Jamaica and told them about a bad line, rather than betting it. They thanked me and gave me a $50 bonus. The line was a total of a basketball game, which was about 10% what it should have been, something like 18 instead of 180. I could have put a chunk of change on the over, but decided to call them instead, since there was a high risk they would cancel it anyhow and I wanted them to continue allowing me to bet there. But I still can't understand why in Vegas if they make a mistake with a line and then agree to a bet, the bet stands, but online books are allowed to be sloppy and then correct themselves after the fact by cancelling bets.

If you bet over 18 on a 180 total game in Vegas, you'd be barred from the shop (and affiliates) I would imagine.

[Lucas]

That wouldn't be the market. You are talking about a cent, almost no vig price and then a fee and the chalk was likely available for one person at a thousand bucks. You could say Pinny's line plus a few cents is a decent market price.

xxx

Market prize is a term usually used /maybe incorrectly or misleadingly/ for the situation where prize would be at perfect market, which does not exist of course. Like at discussion about rental prize of flats is good to substract from some specifics of the market /regulation of prize etc/ and try to search the prize thru some markers or border prizes, the same should be IMO applied here. At a perfect exchange would be Tampa +130.49999 and Cleveland -130.5001 with highest probability which i derive from all info we can see. This middle-no vig market prize I am using also thanks Mr. Noble article http://sportsinfo.pinnaclesports.com...-square-books/

With this many wagering options and the public betting like mad, it’s not uncommon to see prop lines move on public money alone. At Pinnacle Sportsbetting, there are several professional prop players that will take a contrarian view on our props and bet almost any one that moves more than 20 cents (betting towards the original price). Therefore, the "Pinnacle Lean" is useful for measuring market prices on props as well as on sides and totals. For example, www.PinnacleSports.com is offering the following prop: "Who will score the first TD?" at Colts -145/Bears +130. This suggests that the no-vig price based on our 15-cent line is -137.5/+137.5. Therefore, you can "play the lean" if you find another book with the Yes at -136.5, or the No at +138.5.

where the term market prize was used correctly.

Yes we can make discussion, which market should be used... 2 factors should be used: liquidity and vig.

Far most liquid market was pinnacle

07/01 12:04 PM +128 -136
07/01 12:25 PM +126 -134

with market prize around +132/-132 (only 1.5 cent aside from Matchbook and 4 cents from cancelled prize at BetJam!!!), but actually it can be anything within interval (+128;-136).

Market with lowest vig was Matchbook, and its prices were perfectly within pinny´s range:

07/01 12:06 PM +130 -131

so IMO is correct to set sharper market line around +130.5/-130.5

[Pareto]

If the market price was -130½/+130½ that would indicate that the probabilities of the outcomes are 56,61%/43,39%.

If the punter bet 2200 dollars at -128 ( 1,78125) that would give BJ an expected loss of 2200 * 1,7825 * 0,5661 - 2200= 20 Dollars!

Its strange BJ didn't just take this expected loss of 20 dollars, instead of spending time canceling the bet and notifying the player and thereby risking bad publicity.

I think either BJ was balancing its books, or the player had previously bet "semi"-bad lines and BJ wanted to teach him a lesson.

[Bill Dozer]

I wish books would clearly state what a bad line actually is. Plenty of ways to qualify it, but 'bad' alone is open to far too wide a range of interpretation.

Right and it often is applied in ways which isn't fair, as in after the game begins when it can't be rebet, or on lines at a book that was sleeping at the wheel and after it is canceled prices in that range are no longer available.

The biggest problem I have with this Bill is AS IF THE HOUSE DOESN'T ALREADY HAVE A BIG ENOUGH ADVANTAGE this creates a psychological advantage among other possible advantages... I'm sitting in the bar watching the Dolphins game thinking I have Miami +170... I think.. unless BJ decided to cancel it... You can't leave your computer until the game is over...

You guys can't be serious about BJ making a mistake... EVERYDAY during bases and I mean EVERYDAY I see 6 cent difference from book to book on MANY GAMES... I am not talking about scalps ..a 6 cent difference without being a scalp I see all the time....

If you are watching the screen or looking back at the lines it's easy to see that they made a minor mistake. BJ doesn't lead offshore MLB and wanted the -138. Of course at 10c there is no way for the player to know for sure until BJ tells him.

You should never have to worry about losing your play and there shouldn't be any risk of losing a bet that went on to win if it was not on an obvious error. If you walk up to your computer and make a bet on a line that's 30 cents off and then walk away, it's a bet. The player who refreshes constantly and is ready to fire knows what's up and usually understands since they don't lose any money (unless its an arb of some sort). They just go on firing. If the player emailed back BJ after the game started or ended and said, I just saw this!!, BJ would have to, and should honor it. I think as a recreational book BJ should have took it as an opportunity to spot a guy playing moves, and shown him the door. Pinnacle might say OK but if you want it we are closing your account and cashing you out. The difference is a Pinnacle error usually puts the odds way out of line because of the low margin.

This sucks bill It gives books an opportunity to cancell bets for no reason at all and say OOPs we went the wrong way, thats why we canceled. Once a bet is accepted as it was in this case then the bet should stand. A bad line is one that is an obvious error like +128 instead of -128
I see lines move by more than ten cents all the time and Jamacia offtrn have the best price.

So I do believe they are in the wrong here and should honour the price that I origionally recieved or this could give all books an opportunity to do this in the future and create a precident that wouldnt be able to be reversed

I believe you should go int Bat for me because if you dont then this could happen again and again in the future. Once again a bad line is an obvious error this wasn't my bet was accepted and my bet should stand

BJ isn't claiming it's an obvious bad line. They just expected a player who bets those kind of numbers to accept it as a clerical error and rebet it minutes later. Had the game started or had there have been a market change you probably wouldn't have to ask twice.

BJ has agreed to give you the difference ($146?).

[ShamsWoof10]

The player who refreshes constantly ready to fire knows what's up and usually understands since they don't lose any money. They just go on firing.

That's fine ok I can see that but why don't you just say it in plain english Bill... They are fishing for scaplers and will toss them out when they find them or cancel their bets if they can't move it fast enough...

In my opinion this was very intentional... They put it up on purpose looking for scalpers to jump on... I agreed with a post in another thread about how books do that to clean out the players they don't want... You guys can talk about the market price garbage but I think it's clear...

[Lucas]

i would not be so suspicious about fishing... i guess bookies have another work to do and line moving bettors can be spotted without traps;
this line was not bad and the odds were not in arb position, it really seems they made a mistake and they wished -138... but they should reconsider this policy in future; the typo clearly was not obvious

[sean72]

BJ has agreed to give you the difference ($146?).

Thanks Bill

But I just checked both my BJ account and my neteller account and they havnt refunded anything

[sean72]

Still nothing

[Omnivorous Frog]

Now I see the arrival of Sean72. Not Raiders72001, Sean1 or Raiders72002. Should have known.

[sean72]

stop stalking me

[Omnivorous Frog]

Stop boring us. No one on the entire planet would stalk you. You seemed fascinated with jj, I suggest you troll there instead. He craves the attention, and for some unknown yet suspicious reason, you seem to play into that. He says something incredibly stupid, and you feed into that, why does this seem like a rerun? This show is worse every time I see it.

[sean72]

I said stop stalking me puke breath