Expekt just scewed me over the pirates game

**LT Profits** · 05-02-07, 05:20 AM

jase,

Actually this excerpt of the rules you posted does not address the issue that the score should be based on the last completed inning unless the home team just tied or took the lead, but yes you are correct = Pittburgh is a Winner.

**jase81** · 05-02-07, 06:06 AM

just spoke to pinacle,greek and criss and they all graded the match as a win to pitsburg

**jase81** · 05-02-07, 07:07 AM

Dear Jason,

Thank you for your e-mail.

The game is suspended due to rain. It will be finished on Wednesday. According
to our rules:

"If a match is cancelled or moved to another date, all bets are considered void
and the odds is set to 1.00."

You can find our rules under the "help" tag.

Please get back to us if you would need further assistance.

Kind Regards,

Ali Güntekin
Expekt.com Support

this was the response I recieved from expect

**LT Profits** · 05-02-07, 07:18 AM

Email them back with For betting purposes, a match becomes official once 5 innings has been played (4.5 if the home team is in the lead), which is right in their rules.

**wack** · 05-02-07, 07:18 AM

that's arbing for you bud, just move on to the next one.

**LT Profits** · 05-02-07, 07:21 AM

Then email them back with the INDUSTRY STANDARD rule that all the other books you contacted deferrered to:

For betting purposes, if a game is called after five innings but before completion, moneyline grading is based on the score after the last COMPLETED inning unless the HOME team has just tied or taken the lead, in which case the grading will be based on the score at the time of suspension.

In this specific case, it was the ROAD team that just took the lead, so that becomes academic and the official score reverts to the end of the sixth inning, Pirates 5, Cubs 2.

**Hawaiian time** · 05-02-07, 07:21 AM

anybody with good baseball picks for today?

**rm18** · 05-02-07, 07:23 AM

pitt early game

**Hawaiian time** · 05-02-07, 07:28 AM

will spurs cover agianst denver?

**rm18** · 05-02-07, 07:32 AM

Might not even bet the game, but I would say yes, Denver looked like they had given up after the loss, also the Spurs know they need to take care of business because Phoenix probably will as well.

**jase81** · 05-02-07, 07:34 AM

Originally posted by wack

that's arbing for you bud, just move on to the next one.

who was arbing I made a bet and got screwed

**wack** · 05-02-07, 08:01 AM

I don't think so, it says if the game was moved or cancelled in their rules that the bet would be void. They have just graded according to their rules.

They aren't going to defer to las vegas rules like the US books. If this is a concern for the future (which I can't imagine that it will be as what happened last night was 1000/1 or more) then use US books only, especially if you were arbing.

**wack** · 05-02-07, 08:03 AM

Originally posted by LT Profits

Then email them back with the INDUSTRY STANDARD rule that all the other books you contacted deferrered to:

For betting purposes, if a game is called after five innings but before completion, moneyline grading is based on the score after the last COMPLETED inning unless the HOME team has just tied or taken the lead, in which case the grading will be based on the score at the time of suspension.

In this specific case, it was the ROAD team that just took the lead, so that becomes academic and the official score reverts to the end of the sixth inning, Pirates 5, Cubs 2.

That's all very well and good, but the game wasn't called here was it? It was suspended and the end will be played later, that's correct isn't it? I believe it wasn't called as in that particular situation MLB rules don't allow it to be called, it has to be suspended and completed later?

**LT Profits** · 05-02-07, 08:11 AM

Suspended or called, it does not matter. If a game is not completed on the date it was scheduled, this rule applies, which is why Pittsburgh was graded as a winner at all the other books. It seems odd to me that a book would have a house rule that overrides a basic rule that everyone else adheres to. Then again, this is a euro book, so I guess those idiots could do what they want. It is still not proper though, and jase was robbed.

I should clarify that when I say this rules still applies for suspended games, I mean for betting purposes only. Obviously if the Cubs win the completed game, they get the win in the standings. But for betting purposes, the Pirates are already a winner.

**BadAzz** · 05-02-07, 08:46 AM

I have to agree with Expekt here. It is clearly stated in their rules that bets are void if the match is canceled or moved to another date. Game was not called as Wack already stated.

**LT Profits** · 05-02-07, 08:51 AM

Right, I am saying it is a house rule that is exclusive to Expekt, and contradicts the industry norm that 99.9% of sportsbooks follow.

**jase81** · 05-02-07, 09:04 AM

They have now changed their minds and told me that the bet will stand until the match is complete even though I have allready won the bet below is the email they sent me

Dear customer,

Thank you for your e-mail.

A game that is postponed by more than 36 hours will be treated as void unless otherwise stated. The odds for such a game will be set to one (1.0) for settling purposes.

However this game will continue tonigth at 11:35 AM CT

Should you have any other questions, please, do not hesitate to contact us

Best Regards,
Lasse Mikalsen
Support
Expekt.com Ltd.

**d2bets** · 05-02-07, 09:05 AM

Guys, this is interesting. Matchbook, another exchange, seems to have basically the same rules as Expekt and does not have the "revert back to last full inning" rule.....YET they have graded Cubs as loss. Here is Matchbook's rules for baseball:

# If a match is played on a different date or at a different venue than originally scheduled, all wagers will be cancelled and refunded.
# If a game is abandoned all wagers played on Money Line markets will be void unless five innings have been played (or 4.5 innings if the home team is ahead).
# For Run Line and Totals wagering, games must go at least nine innings (or 8.5 innings if the home team is ahead). For extra-inning games, Totals and Run Line markets settle even if the game is suspended without an official result.
# For Live wagering, games must go at least nine innings (or 8.5 innings if the home team is ahead).
# Listed pitchers apply. Both pitchers listed must start or all wagers will be cancelled and refunded.
# A pitcher is deemed to start once he has thrown a single pitch to the opposing team's first batter.
# For playoff series, listed pitchers do not apply; all wagers have action.

Shouldn't MB cancel ML wagers?

**jase81** · 05-02-07, 09:21 AM

below is a copy of the bet slip they sent me

The slip "Slip created Tue 07-05-01 07:26" has been completed.

stake: $130.50
odds: 1.00
win: $130.50
date event type bet result odds
Wed 07-05-02 01:05 Pittsburgh Pirates - Chicago Cubs:Listed pitchers T. Armas - T. Lilly
MLB 1 cancelled 1.00

why have they changed their minds and sent me this email

Dear customer,

Thank you for your e-mail.

A game that is postponed by more than 36 hours will be treated as void unless otherwise stated. The odds for such a game will be set to one (1.0) for settling purposes.

However this game will continue tonigth at 11:35 AM CT

Should you have any other questions, please, do not hesitate to contact us

Best Regards,
Lasse Mikalsen
Support
Expekt.com Ltd.

what are they doing

**Justin7** · 05-02-07, 09:29 AM

I took a close look at their Rules, and T&C.

Was the game "canceled or moved to another date"? No. It was suspended, and is resuming today.

Reading their rules strictly, they should grade the game normally after it is resumed today.

The "match official" rule only applies when a game is completed - whether through regulation, weather or other. The game is not over, so this rule doesn't apply.

In their T&C, it also states "A game that is postponed by more than 36 hours will be treated as void unless otherwise stated. The odds for such a game will be set to one (1.0) for settling purposes." This rule implies that they are considering this situation. A postponement of less than 36 hours (as long as it started on the correct date) will still have action.

At this point, Expekt's most recent decision (to leave bets, and grade them after the resumption) is consistent with their rules.

**jase81** · 05-02-07, 09:35 AM

every other big sportsbook as graded pitts as the winner

**LT Profits** · 05-02-07, 10:05 AM

d2bets,

No Matchbook uses the standard rule. Read your second bullet:

# If a game is abandoned all wagers played on Money Line markets will be void unless five innings have been played (or 4.5 innings if the home team is ahead).

More than 5 innings were played, so moneyline plays stand.

Furthermore, if you look under 'Rules", Matchbook even added this clarrificarion to the rules this morning:

Notes on the May 1st Chicago/Pittsburgh game:
The game was played as scheduled on May 1st, at the scheduled venue. The cancellation clause above thus does not apply. The game was abandoned for the day once subsequent play was rescheduled for Wednesday, May 2nd. The abandonment clause above thus applies. For scoring purposes, under both MLB and Vegas/offshore rules, six full innings were played. The seventh inning, should it resume tomorrow, will not be considered for wagering purposes as it was not officially completed prior to the day's abandonment of play.
We thus graded the moneyline market using the scoreline at the end of six innings: Pittsburgh 5, Chicago 2. Runline and totals markets were graded as cancellations, under the clause requiring a minimum of 8.5 innings of play.

That perfectly summarizes the situation, as they followed the industry norm. That "bet stands if completed in 36 hours" nonsense is exclusive to Expekt.

**pico** · 05-02-07, 10:14 AM

i got screwed

Originally posted by LT Profits

d2bets,

No Matchbook uses the standard rule. Read your second bullet:

# If a game is abandoned all wagers played on Money Line markets will be void unless five innings have been played (or 4.5 innings if the home team is ahead).

More than 5 innings were played, so moneyline plays stand.

Furthermore, if you look under 'Rules", Matchbook even added this clarrificarion to the rules this morning:

Notes on the May 1st Chicago/Pittsburgh game:
The game was played as scheduled on May 1st, at the scheduled venue. The cancellation clause above thus does not apply. The game was abandoned for the day once subsequent play was rescheduled for Wednesday, May 2nd. The abandonment clause above thus applies. For scoring purposes, under both MLB and Vegas/offshore rules, six full innings were played. The seventh inning, should it resume tomorrow, will not be considered for wagering purposes as it was not officially completed prior to the day's abandonment of play.
We thus graded the moneyline market using the scoreline at the end of six innings: Pittsburgh 5, Chicago 2. Runline and totals markets were graded as cancellations, under the clause requiring a minimum of 8.5 innings of play.

That perfectly summarizes the situation, as they followed the industry norm. That "bet stands if completed in 36 hours" nonsense is exclusive to Expekt.

moneylined the cubs last night, and the 4 runs in the 7th doesn;t count. it seems that the rain delays always favorite the home team. the away team always get screwed.

**LT Profits** · 05-02-07, 10:28 AM

picoman,

It seems to favor the home team, but the logic behind the rule makes perfect sense: if the home team did not get to complete the inning, it did not get a fair chance to match the runs scored by the road team in the top half of the inning.

Note that this situation is handled differently for betting purposes than for MLB purposes. For betting purposes, you simply revert back to the last completed inning, which is why Pittsburgh is a winner. For MLB purposes, in a case where the road team takes the lead in the top of an inning and that inning is not completed, the game is suspended and must be picked up from that point. If the Cubs not not taken the lead in the 7th inning, then the game would have been FINAL and not resumed.

**BadAzz** · 05-02-07, 11:19 AM

I stand corrected. The current decision is indeed the right one.
I guess it shows that English is not my primary language.

**wack** · 05-02-07, 12:48 PM

Originally posted by LT Profits

picoman,

It seems to favor the home team, but the logic behind the rule makes perfect sense: if the home team did not get to complete the inning, it did not get a fair chance to match the runs scored by the road team in the top half of the inning.

Note that this situation is handled differently for betting purposes than for MLB purposes. For betting purposes, you simply revert back to the last completed inning, which is why Pittsburgh is a winner. For MLB purposes, in a case where the road team takes the lead in the top of an inning and that inning is not completed, the game is suspended and must be picked up from that point. If the Cubs not not taken the lead in the 7th inning, then the game would have been FINAL and not resumed.

I don't think it's the right rule though, and disagree that the logic makes perfect sense. In this case it is quite clearly unfair that the cubs were graded as losers, they were winning the game at the time of suspension. Logic and fairness would surely lead you to the only real reasonable conclusion, and that is a push.

The decision to make the result official for betting purposes here is simply to create more action, rather than to make a "logical decision". Books would rather grade wagers whenever they can rather than push, otherwise they may lose very nice books they had created on those games. If the cubs go on and win tonight but all moneyline wagers were lost, I don't see how that can be described as fair or logical.

**wack** · 05-02-07, 02:40 PM

And, in fact, the Cubs did win. Any rule which grades the winner of a wager as the opposite team to that which ACTUALLY wins the game in the official results is total bs.

**BigBollocks** · 05-02-07, 04:17 PM

That is stunning, as the industry standard is the team in the lead after the last full inning after five innings has been played. Pittsburgh was a winner in Vegas and almost across the board yesterday. I hope you got paid...

**jase81** · 05-02-07, 04:23 PM

Its official Ecpect took my money after origionally telling me that the bet would be refunded which it was and placed back in my account they then removed the funds and waited for the end result and took all of my money

this sucks and so do expect

**WileOut** · 05-02-07, 04:38 PM

Sorry about your loss, but I gotta wonder why you are playing at expect in the first place.

**BigBollocks** · 05-02-07, 04:38 PM

Jase you got absolutely screwed according to their own rules (and industry standard rules) mate, and I hope you are going to pursue this further....

**Santo** · 05-02-07, 04:57 PM

They settled it correctly. Industry standard has nothing to do with it whatsoever.

**d2bets** · 05-02-07, 06:02 PM

Originally posted by Santo

They settled it correctly. Industry standard has nothing to do with it whatsoever.

I agree. Industry standard is a copout to reading and applying a book's own posted rules. I think Matchbook has screwed up as well. They are relying on "industry standard" to say that the score reverts to the last full inning, even though that is nowhere in their rules, and even though there rules demand cancellation when the game is played (per MLB scheduling) on a date different from original schedule. Game was played today. Different from original schedule. MB incorrectly applied their rules.

**jase81** · 05-02-07, 06:08 PM

Bill can you please4 advise me on what course off action that I can take here