New poker rake structure - what are your thoughts?

[eaglesfan371]

Recently was introduced to a new online poker site with mobile capabilities and wanted to try it out. Their rake structure is intriguing though. At first I loved the idea of it but now I’m not sure. Still think it will be great.

For online players like user crusher on here, curious what you think.

Typical online rake structure: 5% up to $3
This platform’s rake structure: No rake taken in hands, if you leave table with profit, the house keeps 5% of your profit, uncapped, no rake if you lose.

At what point would you imagine this to be equal to standard 5% rake up to $3. I’m guessing a 200NL or 500NL? Let’s say for calculations, 1 hour of play on a table by the average user.

[BigJay]

What site?

[Crusherrr]

PokerKingClub? (PKC) I'm guessing is the one you are talking about.

I've never used that club/app but know other's that have. I don't have any direct opinions on it.

I play on PPPoker in a couple of clubs but don't use a windows emulator so I usually just play 1 table of it on the side of my normal games.
The biggest issue with PPPoker is the rake. I won an $1,100 pot last night and it was $10 rake in a 200NL game. The club I'm in does rake races and reload bonuses if you use BTC but it equates to 50% RB and the rake race I usually don't play enough to get any significant return from it.

The other thing I don't like about PKC or some of the chinese apps/sites is they use HKD instead of USD. Ante games are a lot of fun for cash games though. I've seen some of the most insane 3-6 and 5-10 5 card PLO games in my life on these apps.

It's a good alternative for many players because the games are quite soft and you can play in small unions with people you know or trust. There are also a lot of unions that are straight up scams like (NewYorkPokerKing) club who somehow scams hundreds of thousands and then does it again 2 months later.

[Ian]

As a business model I don't think this will work. Poker players put up with rake in part because it's taken out of the pot before it ends up in their pocket. Psychologically, it would "feel" worse to have to give up a percentage after you have already made it.

To figure out what limit the rake is equivalent to just count the amount of money people at the table bought in for and multiply that number by .05. Then take the average pot size for your table and multiply that by the hands/hour (6max is roughly 90 hands/hour, 9 max roughly 75). Compare the two numbers and you'll get a rough idea of the difference in rake between the two structures.

[funnyb25]

So there would never be any rake for me. Solid

[ddittie]

This is better. Raking from every hand continually takes money from the table. After hours, if players haven't reloaded, or new money hasn't come to the table, the rake will kill the game.

[Crusherrr]

Also worth noting many clubs I've been in will kick players out if their VPIP levels are below 35. They want action, which is why most games have straddles and antes making them play a lot bigger than a traditional online game.

[milwaukee mike]

This is better. Raking from every hand continually takes money from the table. After hours, if players haven't reloaded, or new money hasn't come to the table, the rake will kill the game.

exactly, especially in a limit game, just drip drip drip and the house ends up the only winner

are a lot of people still making a decent living playing poker? only way i ever was ahead was from poker propping... otherwise i'm guessing it's really difficult to make even $10/hour

[eaglesfan371]

PokerKingClub? (PKC) I'm guessing is the one you are talking about.

I've never used that club/app but know other's that have. I don't have any direct opinions on it.

I play on PPPoker in a couple of clubs but don't use a windows emulator so I usually just play 1 table of it on the side of my normal games.
The biggest issue with PPPoker is the rake. I won an $1,100 pot last night and it was $10 rake in a 200NL game. The club I'm in does rake races and reload bonuses if you use BTC but it equates to 50% RB and the rake race I usually don't play enough to get any significant return from it.

The other thing I don't like about PKC or some of the chinese apps/sites is they use HKD instead of USD. Ante games are a lot of fun for cash games though. I've seen some of the most insane 3-6 and 5-10 5 card PLO games in my life on these apps.

It's a good alternative for many players because the games are quite soft and you can play in small unions with people you know or trust. There are also a lot of unions that are straight up scams like (NewYorkPokerKing) club who somehow scams hundreds of thousands and then does it again 2 months later.

Yeah I've avoided PPPoker due to the rake and the NYPK scam. This 5% when you leave seems good cause as someone said, money is not leaving table immediately like standard rake.

Going to try this club for hundred or two and see how it goes.

[eaglesfan371]

exactly, especially in a limit game, just drip drip drip and the house ends up the only winner

are a lot of people still making a decent living playing poker? only way i ever was ahead was from poker propping... otherwise i'm guessing it's really difficult to make even $10/hour

A lot of people play it a side gig. For example, I still have not been able to find employment but have been surviving on poker (and sports somehow, not betting much though as NHL is over). Made ~25k past 5 months, not much but it has paid the bills. I'm headed to Texas for 1-2 months next month, play in the poker clubs down there, while looking for employment there. The PLO action there (Houston) was great when I visited before since there aren't any casinos, just hoping clubs aren't raided further while there.

NLHE is harder to beat these days but mix/alternate games are still very juicy in my experiences. Feel like everyone has a basic understanding of NLHE and when to bet/fold so there are less exploitable moments.

[eaglesfan371]

Also worth noting many clubs I've been in will kick players out if their VPIP levels are below 35. They want action, which is why most games have straddles and antes making them play a lot bigger than a traditional online game.

Really? I've never heard of this. It makes sense though, you want money moving between all players, not just a couple winning and draining the funds in play.

[milwaukee mike]

A lot of people play it a side gig. For example, I still have not been able to find employment but have been surviving on poker (and sports somehow, not betting much though as NHL is over). Made ~25k past 5 months, not much but it has paid the bills. I'm headed to Texas for 1-2 months next month, play in the poker clubs down there, while looking for employment there. The PLO action there (Houston) was great when I visited before since there aren't any casinos, just hoping clubs aren't raided further while there.

NLHE is harder to beat these days but mix/alternate games are still very juicy in my experiences. Feel like everyone has a basic understanding of NLHE and when to bet/fold so there are less exploitable moments.

good luck with it

i would consider 5k/month a good living, not just a side gig

[eaglesfan371]

good luck with it

i would consider 5k/month a good living, not just a side gig

Thank you, hoping it works out in Texas and I find a position. Gambling for a living is not a career though and I've been running extremely above EV in sports. 5k per month is not long term sustainable.

[Crusherrr]

Really? I've never heard of this. It makes sense though, you want money moving between all players, not just a couple winning and draining the funds in play.

Yeah but 35% isn't too bad as all games are 6 max and I often start them meaning my numbers are even more inflated.

[asiagambler]

Isn't it the player that wins the pot that's effectively paying the rake anyway? This method seems beneficial to losing players if only for psychological reasons.

The best method for winning players is the time cut in my opinion, where no rake is taken from the pot and everyone just pays a flat fee for a specified period of time.

[eaglesfan371]

Isn't it the player that wins the pot that's effectively paying the rake anyway? This method seems beneficial to losing players if only for psychological reasons.

The best method for winning players is the time cut in my opinion, where no rake is taken from the pot and everyone just pays a flat fee for a specified period of time.

Time cut is by far the best rake structure but is only the case in 5/10 or higher live games generally. $5-$10 per player, per half hour depending on the game. Not to mention the fun that usually happens - time flop, first card on flop, that seat pays for everyone's time for the half hour (~$60). One time was the unlucky soul 3 times in a row.

[Grivas_Digeni]

So there would never be any rake for me. Solid

LoLoLoL