From A Vegas gambling expert: Had to get banned New Jersey William Hill

[ikid2groove415]

Anyone who has worked inside the big UK books will tell you those books don't want winners. They aren't there to provide a service. They're there to make money. Bouncing people who win is a sound business strategy. The best way to avoid being noticed is to make bets that won't return a 4-figure sum. Don't bet 500 at +100, bet 490. Don't bet 250 at +300, bet 240. If you're a winner it will eventually get noticed whatever you do, but if you're not a big bettor then make it harder for them - stay under their radar.

Would you want winners? If you ran a sportsbook? Common sense fella - they feast on losers - Winners get lost

[RudyRuetigger]

Anyone who has worked inside the big UK books will tell you those books don't want winners. They aren't there to provide a service. They're there to make money. Bouncing people who win is a sound business strategy. The best way to avoid being noticed is to make bets that won't return a 4-figure sum. Don't bet 500 at +100, bet 490. Don't bet 250 at +300, bet 240. If you're a winner it will eventually get noticed whatever you do, but if you're not a big bettor then make it harder for them - stay under their radar.

wow

is this true????

[ikid2groove415]

You would have to win consistently before books even take notice - 50-100k - Plus

[jjgold]

Always remember most winners give most of it back long-term

[ikid2groove415]

Always remember most winners give most of it back long-term

Books know this - they will waited it out - but let’s just say your still winning consistently over 1 year plus? That’s when they might pull the plug

[SBR Tony]

If you had 10 books? And 1 person keeps killing you every month? Would you allow him to continue doing this? It’s common sense - People think all this books and sportsbook open to give out free money? They profit every year - Anyone that consistently win? Will be gone !!! Case closed

define consistently ?

[jjgold]

The law of averages and statistician say it is impossible to win long term because of juice, books just too stupid and too scared

Pinnacle knows you can’t win

[ikid2groove415]

define consistently ?

Winning over 1 year plus - (books will take note)

[SBR Tony]

Winning over 1 year plus - (books will take note)

so would you say a guy like Billy walters would be banned from all offshore books ?
as much as people believe, he doesn't win all the time, but wins more than losses

[ikid2groove415]

[QUOTE=SBR Tony;27925779]so would you say a guy like Billy walters would be banned from all offshore books ?
as much as people believe, he doesn't win all the time, but wins more than losses[/QUOTE
Tony it’s common sense fella? Logic shows house always win long term - very few players can overcome this- Books will always wait out on players - they are going by the % that the house will eventually win - But for Sharp players that are consistently denting there profits ? It’s goodbye - Nobody wins all the time - but billy won bottom line - sportsbooks don’t profit dealing with him

[Drydin]

Some good info on here , some people i have no idea where you're thought process comes from...

In Las Vegas it is very difficult to be banned outright betting over the counter at places like MGM & Caesars properties it's impossible unless you are doing something nefarious money laundering, trying to bet mistake lines, etc. I have never seen someone banned over the counter betting for simply just winning by MGM. When your betting over the counter they have time to look at there risk factor, balance money , counter your bet maybe you want 10k they don't want to take that they offer you 5k. In a previous post a person mentioned players cards they don't do that to monitor how much you are winning , they do that to monitor themselves and not miss a title-31 which happens more than you think. And if internal audit catches a missed 10k transaction that was not filled correctly gaming can fine the Casino's they take that very seriously.

Where the banning takes place in Las Vegas is Mobile Apps! Casino's have no time to counter anything balance the money especially the smaller casino's that offer apps. If you bet steam , scalp , or yes just beat them consistently the smaller casinos will limit or ban you from using the apps.

[ikid2groove415]

Some good info on here , some people i have no idea where you're thought process comes from...

In Las Vegas it is very difficult to be banned outright betting over the counter at places like MGM & Caesars properties it's impossible unless you are doing something nefarious money laundering, trying to bet mistake lines, etc. I have never seen someone banned over the counter betting for simply just winning by MGM. When your betting over the counter they have time to look at there risk factor, balance money , counter your bet maybe you want 10k they don't want to take that they offer you 5k. In a previous post a person mentioned players cards they don't do that to monitor how much you are winning , they do that to monitor themselves and not miss a title-31 which happens more than you think. And if internal audit catches a missed 10k transaction that was not filled correctly gaming can fine the Casino's they take that very seriously.

Where the banning takes place in Las Vegas is Mobile Apps! Casino's have no time to counter anything balance the money especially the smaller casino's that offer apps. If you bet steam , scalp , or yes just beat them consistently the smaller casinos will limit or ban you from using the apps.

Wrong about casinos don’t have time for over the counter ? They right down every 10K bet and ask for your ID- you think there dumb to keep letting a guy pound them every month at 100 plus thousand ? Laughable - they track everything

[Drydin]

Wrong about casinos don’t have time for over the counter ? They right down every 10K bet and ask for your ID- you think there dumb to keep letting a guy pound them every month at 100 plus thousand ? Laughable - they track everything

I said they do have time over the counter was the entire point of my post?

[SBR Tony]

[QUOTE=ikid2groove415;27925794]

so would you say a guy like Billy walters would be banned from all offshore books ?
as much as people believe, he doesn't win all the time, but wins more than losses[/QUOTE
Tony it’s common sense fella? Logic shows house always win long term - very few players can overcome this- Books will always wait out on players - they are going by the % that the house will eventually win - But for Sharp players that are consistently denting there profits ? It’s goodbye - Nobody wins all the time - but billy won bottom line - sportsbooks don’t profit dealing with him

I'm not saying the books don't Win. and agree that the house always wins. But shops are not going to boot Sharps like BW, because they want his action, they want to know what he's on so they can adjust their lines.

now if you are talking about placing Limits on those guys, yes that's what they do.

also, I'm not saying every book will take a BW type player. but the ones that do know how to handle it.
there are a bunch of Top books that take his or others action. but they have a limit on what they can wager. thus the reason for his many beards that he uses to get more action. Plus he likes to confuse books with his play, as he will play both sides of a game, then you need to guess which one is the real wager.

[KVB]

You don't have to win to get limited at some places online.

I've been limited for beating the closing lines over a large number of bets in NCAAB totals, my porofit/loss was about even at the time, only slightly ahead.

I was hitting early lines.

I wasn't winning a huge amount, there was give and take, but I was beating the closer pretty bad for a stretch.

They notices.

[ikid2groove415]

I once know a fella name Dwight - was killing Harvey’s in South Lake Tahoe - work them for 100k month during NBA season in 2014- they just kindly told him ? We can’t take your bets anymore -

[KVB]

I once know a fella name Dwight - was killing Harvey’s in South Lake Tahoe - work them for 100k month during NBA season in 2014- they just kindly told him ? We can’t take your bets anymore -

Those conglomerates leave South Shore out to dry, they only move the lines in Vegas. They have no other form of protection than to ask someone to walk.

Doesn't happen often, that's for sure.

[SBR Tony]

Some good info on here , some people i have no idea where you're thought process comes from...

In Las Vegas it is very difficult to be banned outright betting over the counter at places like MGM & Caesars properties it's impossible unless you are doing something nefarious money laundering, trying to bet mistake lines, etc. I have never seen someone banned over the counter betting for simply just winning by MGM. When your betting over the counter they have time to look at there risk factor, balance money , counter your bet maybe you want 10k they don't want to take that they offer you 5k. In a previous post a person mentioned players cards they don't do that to monitor how much you are winning , they do that to monitor themselves and not miss a title-31 which happens more than you think. And if internal audit catches a missed 10k transaction that was not filled correctly gaming can fine the Casino's they take that very seriously.

Where the banning takes place in Las Vegas is Mobile Apps! Casino's have no time to counter anything balance the money especially the smaller casino's that offer apps. If you bet steam , scalp , or yes just beat them consistently the smaller casinos will limit or ban you from using the apps.

the above is true. they want to see WHO is making the wager. so they rather be face to face

[ikid2groove415]

Tony I wanna ask you a simple question? If you own a book? Would you let a certain player crush you for over 1 year plus? And dent most of your profits?

[ikid2groove415]

Those conglomerates leave South Shore out to dry, they only move the lines in Vegas. They have no other form of protection than to ask someone to walk.

Doesn't happen often, that's for sure.

Harvey’s is own by ceasers entertainment pretty dam big company

[Grits n' Gravy]

Tony I wanna ask you a simple question? If you own a book? Would you let a certain player crush you for over 1 year plus? And dent most of your profits?

If you are a book and 1 player can dent most of your profits then you shouldn't be booking. That is just a terrible business model.

[SBR Tony]

Tony I wanna ask you a simple question? If you own a book? Would you let a certain player crush you for over 1 year plus? And dent most of your profits?

I would limit his play just to get his plays, if I couldn't absorb the hit each week, i would lay off his action.
bottom line is I want to know what he's on.

[KVB]

Harvey’s is own by ceasers entertainment pretty dam big company

Yeah, and I've pointed out mistakes (typos) in their lines to the managers more than once and they had no ability to move the lines.

He held me, then called Vegas to make the change. They thought it extremely unusual for me to call a manager to get the errors fixed.

I thought it extremely unusual that the managers weren't bookmakers, they really were just retail floor managers.

Then with the Giants and the Warriors, the hits they took during playoffs and titles had to suck. They had no means of local protection, none.

I was there, I saw the action getting placed.

Same thing next door to Harrah's and Harveys, those books are Will Hill.

[Drydin]

If you own a book? Would you let a certain player crush you for over 1 year plus? And dent most of your profits?

You are looking at it wrong. A lot of the time the Casino needs the action to balance the money and the big player's are valuable. If your normal limit for a NFL game is 20k and you are going to lose $-500,000 on team A and the game starts in under a hour. Big bettor comes up to window wants to bet however much he can get on Team B you are gonna let him have up to $400,000 to even the action and you will still be rooting for Team B cause that is what makes your Casino more money. We get guys like this all the time where we hafta shade line to encourage action and they either want to value bet or scalp. You need players like this , but i do get your point if your a smaller casino yes if one guy keeps siding you and you cant balance the action they will ban. But if you're betting at smaller outfits they should not be taking huge wagers in the first place.

[KVB]

...I've been limited for beating the closing lines over a large number of bets in NCAAB totals, my porofit/loss was about even at the time, only slightly ahead...

I would limit his play just to get his plays...

Notice, they didn't kick me.

[KVB]

Exactly Drydin, not so much online in the chop shops, but the big guys are willing to play the game with sharps because they know they will collect so much from the rest of the players, and the vig.

The business model allows for it and it has been acceptable for a long time, in places like Vegas.

Then Will Hill came along.

[KVB]

Will Hill offers cheap prices but they protect themselves a lot more to compensate.

Vegas still at -110.

[ikid2groove415]

[QUOTE=Drydin;27925855]You are looking at it wrong. A lot of the time the Casino needs the action to balance the money and the big player's are valuable. If your normal limit for a NFL game is 20k and you are going to lose $-500,000 on team A and the game starts in under a hour. Big bettor comes up to window wants to bet however much he can get on Team B you are gonna let him have up to $400,000 to even the action and you will still be rooting for Team B cause that is what makes your Casino more money. We get guys like this all the time where we hafta shade line to encourage action and they either want to value bet or scalp. You need players like this , but i do get your point if your a smaller casino yes if one guy keeps siding you and you cant balance the action they will ban. But if you're betting at smaller outfits they should not be taking huge wagers in the first place.[/QUOTE
Wasn’t billy boy jail Walters ban from all Vegas books?

[ikid2groove415]

[KVB]

One thing is for sure, the hey days are over and it's not like it used to be. Not at all.

All we can do now is look for the next gold rush, which could come in the form of local legal books, the East Coast is the testing ground.

We get $1000 trades, that's it. That's what we have to work with.

[ikid2groove415]

One thing is for sure, the hey days are over and it's not like it used to be. Not at all.

All we can do now is look for the next gold rush, which could come in the form of local legal books, the East Coast is the testing ground.

We get $1000 trades, that's it. That's what we have to work with.

The last gold rush is in Silicon Valley- get your kids into technology

[KVB]

The last gold rush is in Silicon Valley- get your kids into technology

Yeah, when I say gold rush I just mean in the gambling landscape.

I think dedicated and disciplined trading can get you there too, some of these companies are positioned to get bought or create there own goldrush.

You're right though, tech is growing, AI is growing, it's all growing.

Dedication gets us there, whether it's building a network or expanding a dream.

[jjgold]

I wonder Fan duel New Jersey has banned anyone yet

[BrickJames]

In my opinion a licensed public establishment should by law not be allowed to turn away people simply for being sharp and winning.

That is the exact thing that every person in there is trying to accomplish.

There's no reason you should be punished once you finally win.

Not to mention they are super square, if they think the guys action is that sharp why not just mirror it into another book at two times the play?

[RudyRuetigger]

In my opinion a licensed public establishment should by law not be allowed to turn away people simply for being sharp and winning.

That is the exact thing that every person in there is trying to accomplish.

There's no reason you should be punished once you finally win.

Not to mention they are super square, if they think the guys action is that sharp why not just mirror it into another book at two times the play?

hey bro thats why i said they should SUE