Mr. Jones is playing around folks. Guy means business.
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Tracer Is On The First List
I am sharp as a fukking arrow. You guys are squares
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well you are melissa to me. cheers!Can't say I totally disagree with this, as I have seen issues with the credit side and employees at the other place, but playing post up there really? You want a bunch of people working that don't gamble at ANY of the books? Seems a bit harsh...
I hate to break it to you, but my first name is not Melissa...
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well that list shows one thing, the actual CASH BI took was not nearly what the reports are claiming. That list is mostly make believe money created by BI top pay off SBR and the employees of SBR who were subsequently getting paid by SBR in funds to this book.
Basically these guys got stiffed out of money BI offered them, they didnt earn it, they didnt win it, it was a wink and a handshake pay off in monopoly money to sell their swamp land to people.
So SBR John gets 10K a month to pimp that site (assuming he wasnt the owner outright) That 10K didnt exist, John didnt send it in, and Bet Islands certainly didnt have it to give to him, it went on a balance sheet as was 'accounted' for. Same as Justin/daringly/elihu whatever these scammers call themselves where ever they are. Guy didnt 'lose' 85K, I would bet my life he isnt out anything from his own pocket. He 'lost' 'wages' that were 'paid' to him from SBR that were in the form of deposits (probably into a book of his choice), and then used that 'money' to gamble with.
The biggest question is why are these balances so big? Didnt anyone ever request a pay out, if so then how much did they get? I had some major balances in Pinnacle, the Greek, and Canbet and a few others in the past, but a couple on that list were more than I ever had in any one account, and Bet Islands certainly wasnt on the level of any of those books. So I am also certain that anything with a large balance was most definitely a credit account. But it still begs the question of why werent guys taking money out?
Like I said the odds BI actually got away with 1.5 mil in cash were less than zero. I would say they got away with less than 25K and only if thy had people still trying to post up with them when the shit started to hit the fan.
But once you get past the accounts of guys getting padded the numbers are not all that impressive. Which basically shows the guys with the biggest balances were directly related to SBR website either as employees of SBR or owners of SBR. Maybe why they didnt take any money because they owned part of BI as well. That is conjecture but makes sense.
But again if you take away the largest balances and SBR mods on that list youre left with a number of outstanding balances in the neighborhood of 225K Not nearly enough to hurt any legit bookmaker let alone break one.
I would guesstimate that from that 225K, 'legit' players (guys not affiliated with SBR in anyway other than maybe posters, who posted up thinking it was a legit book) made up maybe half of it. So around 115k or so.
Difficult if not nearly impossible to find out, but there are 400 names on that list, and the number of people complaining here is very very small. So the number of people that didnt know might even be smaller than I think.Comment -
I've wondered for a while about the wisdom of J7 being involved with SBR. He does not seem to be one of the bad guys who run this place (their political views revealed their corruption long before BI's collapse did) or idiots or squares, and from my sense of him, from his posts over the years, I would say he should be completely separated, by reputation, from the SBR crew. He strikes me as an honorable and intelligent man; you can't say that of anyone else here (Ganchrow being long gone).
But I can't say I have sympathy for his BI account loss, though it's a large number, because anyone who was in BI should have been figuring the chance of being stiffed into their EV calculations (actually, I do have sympathy for all who got stiffed, but that's the human in me, not the sports bettor).
Personally, I've long believed in letting Spiro at The Greek do my book safety evaluations. If he transfers money with them, they're cool. But if he doesn't trust them, I don't. Did the Greek ever do book-to-books with BI?Last edited by Pokerjoe; 12-22-12, 10:20 AM.Comment -
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I don't know (neither do you) whether this is true, but I suspect it is, more or less. And I admit that the possibility that it is true damns J7, and if evidence is presented that he was paid this much by BI, even in what turns out to be monopoly money, then I will retract my previous post suggesting his reputation be spared.Comment -
Given that Lenny from Cascades is still walking around with solid knee caps and WSEX is still kicking around enough to happily accept your p2p if you are naive enough to send one to them I doubt John will lose much sleep over your silly "not a threat" warning...Comment -
Trigga, let me hold some b4 the hoes get it...Comment -
Spare me the drama. BI was a B rated sponsor that went belly up. It's a terrible thing and we regret allowing them on here. Over the past 12 years there have been several B books and a couple of A books that have failed. There have been many locals vanish as well. Its one of the ugly risks of unregulated gaming.Comment -
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You guys got it. If they comment or say anything that can be proved to be a lie it will sink them and increase any knowledge of their collusion and hence liability.
Why else with SBR, a business we all know now that chases the dollar, not respond when their future dollars are at risk.
Very clear.
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hakan?
or
shaker?
maybe
Hsiao-en Jeff?
tracer give bear a winnerComment -
simple question for the board, did the value of sbr's business go down by more than $1.5 million over the past 2 weeks, and if so, would it have been smarter to just pay everyone a couple weeks ago?Comment -
SBR_John
Weak sauce. Really now all the BI was a B rated book that failed. Your misrepresentation of reality and your involvement is disheartening. They were a big sponsor, they paid you big money and your relationship with them is obvious. To state it in such a detached way is poor. People lost real money, while you made big money.
Do not belittle this and separate you and SBR from BI; you are insulting many.
We know you will not state any facts with dates or names or any particulars because you are covering your lying ass.Comment -
I couldn't read this whole post because it's so full of nonsense. Normally I wouldn't reply to a post like this, but you're not the first person to claim that the larger balances had to be credit accounts. NO THEY ARE NOT. BI was a terribly run book, or a ponzi scheme. It was possible to bet $100K of volume per week with an expected ROI approaching 5%. The half point promo was amazing, and that's not even getting into the other weaknesses the book had. People deposited money and ran up big balances. When you are winning $10K per week, you can't withdraw fast enough. And when you see that you can get your $50K balance all in on insanely +EV bets every Friday, then you don't really want to draw down your balance. You can call it being greedy and stupid, or you can call it maximizing profits.
I can show you posts of mine from 2011 where I was saying BI's entire business model was a joke. But in 2012 I deposited because SBR had them highly rated, SBR posters loved them, and they had been paying out for at least a couple of years. I thought "well, they at least have to survive until the Super Bowl". I also concluded that the average SBR poster must be so incredibly square that it was possible to run a book with insane promos and bonuses and high processor costs. Wrong on all counts... This book was absolutely hemorrhaging money. People simply ran up those big balances you see.Comment -
well that list shows one thing, the actual CASH BI took was not nearly what the reports are claiming. That list is mostly make believe money created by BI top pay off SBR and the employees of SBR who were subsequently getting paid by SBR in funds to this book.
Basically these guys got stiffed out of money BI offered them, they didnt earn it, they didnt win it, it was a wink and a handshake pay off in monopoly money to sell their swamp land to people.
So SBR John gets 10K a month to pimp that site (assuming he wasnt the owner outright) That 10K didnt exist, John didnt send it in, and Bet Islands certainly didnt have it to give to him, it went on a balance sheet as was 'accounted' for. Same as Justin/daringly/elihu whatever these scammers call themselves where ever they are. Guy didnt 'lose' 85K, I would bet my life he isnt out anything from his own pocket. He 'lost' 'wages' that were 'paid' to him from SBR that were in the form of deposits (probably into a book of his choice), and then used that 'money' to gamble with.
The biggest question is why are these balances so big? Didnt anyone ever request a pay out, if so then how much did they get? I had some major balances in Pinnacle, the Greek, and Canbet and a few others in the past, but a couple on that list were more than I ever had in any one account, and Bet Islands certainly wasnt on the level of any of those books. So I am also certain that anything with a large balance was most definitely a credit account. But it still begs the question of why werent guys taking money out?
Absolutely agree. It was like stock options, No one posted up funds like that; this was pay for referrals or services that accumulated. The players who lost money, real money were the ones referred to BI but if you believe real people left over 50k in their accounts with BI, think again. Sharps are sharp for a reason. They are not sharp with their bets but square with their money. Think about it. The guys with the best betting strategies who invest all their time in this endeavor are then going to have the worst money management strategy????
Kickbacks, referrals and and a business relationship set up to trick players was evident.
You wonder why SBR was the last to the BI death party, their principles did not want to lose their paper money and were trying to do anything they could to not put a nail in their own money coffin. If they let players know the truth their monopoly was sure to be worthless.Comment -
Nah. Im actually nowhere on that list. I dont think I signed up through the SBR banner. But they definitely knew who I was. One time I called on a Sunday morning to deposit and the guy(Ben, or Nick or Ryan_I forgot) told me that he tailed one of my sbr nfl threads.
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Point taken KGambler, I disagree but to each their own.
You believe sharp guys would send big money to BI, a book with limited history, outside of SBR no history, where they could only withdraw short money. Slim chance. I would never send more than 10K to such a book. If I can not get my money wired or meet an agent to settle up for a majority of my account at my desired time than I would not send serious money.
Maybe I am different than most but I place far more value in money protection, accessibility and mobility than in a 1/2 point or reduced juice. I would rather buy the half point or shop it than play under that model.Comment
