Originally <a href='https://www.sportsbookreview.com/forum/showthread.php?p=30238466'>posted</a> on 04/28/2021:
This is a solid statement by the Operator Betcoin.
Operator Betcoin is to be congratulated - clearly the author is a competent and literate individual - and the fact that the Operator employs such people reflects well on the company.
Now for the bad news:
" arbitrage betting is banned by nearly every site" - this is an untrue statement. I have gone to the trouble of reviewing a handful of A+ / A bookmaker t&c (Pinnacle, Betcris/Bookmaker, Betonline, others) and these bookmakers do NOT have such a term.
Perhaps what Betcoin should have said is "arbitrage betting is banned by nearly every C or lower site"
That is not a good start Betcoin - you have deliberately issued a *clearly false* statement to this forum in order to attempt to defend your position and t&c. You have already lost credibility.
Rather - these A / B bookmakers have the wherewithal to ** adjust their lines / odds accordingly when pressure is put on a certain line. They are smart enough to limit their market max while the market is shaping **
The particular books mentioned do not react at all (against the customer) when faced with obvious arbitrage bets (for the reasons given) - they have the wherewithal and the infrastructure to cope with sharp plays. They *benefit* from these types of plays as it shapes their market while limits are small.
Certain other A / B books may limit the player's max bets and effectively force the player to go elsewhere - but they would NEVER "suspend all payouts to the player" for making obvious arbitrage / value / surebets. Whether these bets are arbitrage or surebets (or not) the fact remains that these are LEGITIMATE bets and NOT palps (palpable errors). This is just a fact. This is why you - Betcoin - are C and they are A / B.
Can you imagine an A-rated book like William Hill confiscating player funds because the player arbed? Of course not. This would be an absolute scandal for an A-rated book. Rather - the player is limited to $1 bets and is effectively forced to withdraw all.
Operator Betcoin - You "suspend all payouts to the player" - proper A and B books limit the player and allow the player to withdraw. That is the difference here and your position is not defensible - and I think you know this.
Operator Betcoin - you will NEVER achieve higher than your current C+ rating if you have a term (that you are clearly willing to invoke) that involves "suspending all payouts to the player" in the case of arbing / valuebetting / surebetting - because you do not have the wherewithal to adjust your lines and limits accordingly. This is where the story ends.
Betcoin Statement:
10 years ago, multiple accounts would login with the same IP and say the other account was their "roommate". Everyone knew it was not their roommate, so sites started allowing 1 account per household. Now abusive players have ways around the matching IPs and we have been forced to spend hundreds of thousands of dollars on additional tools, which allow us to connect accounts in different ways.
In this case, it was quickly found that these accounts had been funded by the same Bitcoin wallet. This was clearly a private wallet, as it had5 total transactions, 4 of which involved Betcoin from 2 different accounts.
8.7 Accounts must be self-funded. Any accounts found to have the same source of funds will be dealt with per our policy regarding multi-accounting.
These accounts were further linked through other behavioral and biometric data.
As gryzonko stated, he was able to withdraw his account balance in full. The newer account received his most recent deposit back, which is the resolution recommended by SBR in these matters.
Regarding SportsBettor74's statement, arbitrage betting is banned by nearly every site. What we are specifically talking about in these cases are people using technology which scans thousands of sites for guaranteed arbitrage (surebet) and valuebet opportunities. Just like you don't want bots infested on poker sites, these are bots that find guaranteed profit on sportsbooks and they are a plague on the industry. They force sportsbooks to ban certain regions and offer less bet types, because the large majority of the play from those regions and bet types are abusive. We have lost millions of dollars to them that could have been better spent improving our product and offering promotions to legitimate players.
We have been investigating these for many years and are able to detect and confirm the use of these apps. If a player is suspected of this, the account will be closed for further investigation. The investigation is costly and can take several weeks, but it can confirm without a doubt that this technology was used. In this case, the account was closed due to suspicion of the use of these services, but we never got far enough to confirm it because we found the shared Bitcoin wallet.
Nearly every sportsbook has a TOS that a player can be banned at their discretion. The legitimate sites use this rarely, if ever. Betcoin has been around for 8 years and has tens of thousands of weekly, satisfied players. We have cooperated with SBR on every dispute and nearly all have been found in our favor. If you are a legitimate player, you will get paid. It's that simple.
10 years ago, multiple accounts would login with the same IP and say the other account was their "roommate". Everyone knew it was not their roommate, so sites started allowing 1 account per household. Now abusive players have ways around the matching IPs and we have been forced to spend hundreds of thousands of dollars on additional tools, which allow us to connect accounts in different ways.
In this case, it was quickly found that these accounts had been funded by the same Bitcoin wallet. This was clearly a private wallet, as it had5 total transactions, 4 of which involved Betcoin from 2 different accounts.
8.7 Accounts must be self-funded. Any accounts found to have the same source of funds will be dealt with per our policy regarding multi-accounting.
These accounts were further linked through other behavioral and biometric data.
As gryzonko stated, he was able to withdraw his account balance in full. The newer account received his most recent deposit back, which is the resolution recommended by SBR in these matters.
Regarding SportsBettor74's statement, arbitrage betting is banned by nearly every site. What we are specifically talking about in these cases are people using technology which scans thousands of sites for guaranteed arbitrage (surebet) and valuebet opportunities. Just like you don't want bots infested on poker sites, these are bots that find guaranteed profit on sportsbooks and they are a plague on the industry. They force sportsbooks to ban certain regions and offer less bet types, because the large majority of the play from those regions and bet types are abusive. We have lost millions of dollars to them that could have been better spent improving our product and offering promotions to legitimate players.
We have been investigating these for many years and are able to detect and confirm the use of these apps. If a player is suspected of this, the account will be closed for further investigation. The investigation is costly and can take several weeks, but it can confirm without a doubt that this technology was used. In this case, the account was closed due to suspicion of the use of these services, but we never got far enough to confirm it because we found the shared Bitcoin wallet.
Nearly every sportsbook has a TOS that a player can be banned at their discretion. The legitimate sites use this rarely, if ever. Betcoin has been around for 8 years and has tens of thousands of weekly, satisfied players. We have cooperated with SBR on every dispute and nearly all have been found in our favor. If you are a legitimate player, you will get paid. It's that simple.
Operator Betcoin is to be congratulated - clearly the author is a competent and literate individual - and the fact that the Operator employs such people reflects well on the company.
Now for the bad news:
" arbitrage betting is banned by nearly every site" - this is an untrue statement. I have gone to the trouble of reviewing a handful of A+ / A bookmaker t&c (Pinnacle, Betcris/Bookmaker, Betonline, others) and these bookmakers do NOT have such a term.
Perhaps what Betcoin should have said is "arbitrage betting is banned by nearly every C or lower site"
That is not a good start Betcoin - you have deliberately issued a *clearly false* statement to this forum in order to attempt to defend your position and t&c. You have already lost credibility.
Rather - these A / B bookmakers have the wherewithal to ** adjust their lines / odds accordingly when pressure is put on a certain line. They are smart enough to limit their market max while the market is shaping **
The particular books mentioned do not react at all (against the customer) when faced with obvious arbitrage bets (for the reasons given) - they have the wherewithal and the infrastructure to cope with sharp plays. They *benefit* from these types of plays as it shapes their market while limits are small.
Certain other A / B books may limit the player's max bets and effectively force the player to go elsewhere - but they would NEVER "suspend all payouts to the player" for making obvious arbitrage / value / surebets. Whether these bets are arbitrage or surebets (or not) the fact remains that these are LEGITIMATE bets and NOT palps (palpable errors). This is just a fact. This is why you - Betcoin - are C and they are A / B.
Can you imagine an A-rated book like William Hill confiscating player funds because the player arbed? Of course not. This would be an absolute scandal for an A-rated book. Rather - the player is limited to $1 bets and is effectively forced to withdraw all.
Operator Betcoin - You "suspend all payouts to the player" - proper A and B books limit the player and allow the player to withdraw. That is the difference here and your position is not defensible - and I think you know this.
Operator Betcoin - you will NEVER achieve higher than your current C+ rating if you have a term (that you are clearly willing to invoke) that involves "suspending all payouts to the player" in the case of arbing / valuebetting / surebetting - because you do not have the wherewithal to adjust your lines and limits accordingly. This is where the story ends.