Be careful playing with 5Dimes

[raydog]

As been discuss several times in this thread the books have (or should have) mechanism in place that downgrade the line after being hit by a large or max bet... Bet opening numbers at Cris or pinnacle and you will see this in action.... After reading this thread I can no longer see how it is the player's responsibility to verify the line... Clearly the current system gives book more (not less) incentives to not post and verify good numbers as they can set and wait on notifying the player (either intentionally or through incompetence and ego as, as we are suppose to believe is the case for Tony's A+ rated 5dimes?) Does anyone who has read this entire thread (and obviously not shilling) believe that 5dimes rating is justified given whatever their (apparently?) non-existent line verification system is and the antics of Tony?

edit: Make books like 5dimes eat a couple max bets at 20-1 that should be 2-1 (or face rating downgrades) and I bet you will see some of the needed improvements very quickly in this area and, hopefully, customer service as well...

you are better than this herbie...it was human error and this guy flat out attempted to steal money from the book by betting into bad lines...and he did it more than once... the guy bets a lot of golf..he knows players and he knows odds.... nobody deserves a dime when they get caught taking a shot...

Tony: to win was 50/1
Tony: top 5 was 8/1
Tony: top 10 was 4/1
Tony: and what price do you think top 20 should have been?

elementary education and its obvious the guy knew he was taking a shot...it really is sad that this thread has made it this far...

[BewareOf5Dimes]

Just posting the story. You can make your own conclusions. I do know that books would NOT exist without players, and that most players can see what happened and they do NOT like it.

The book controls the money, so it is on them to be honorable at ALL TIMES. Tony proved he will lie about important facts regarding disputes. He said he JUST found out about my play Sunday, when the facts show that he had to know about it the previous Tuesday or Wednesday.

The story is the story. Take whatever side you wish. The book controls the money and if they are not honorable and LIE then how can you ever do business with them?

[BetterBizness]

I still think a better policy (then the one advocated by SBR) is that bad lines should stand after a certain (and short) period of time (and, for sure, once the events starts)... Given the current situation books have no incentive to have necessary procedures to verify the lines they are offering and it opens the door to books taking shots at players or( as is probably the case here) having the book's integrity questioned...

Books always have the right to refuse any future action so personally I think they need to suffer the consequences for being to incompetent to verify the lines they offering... The truth is services and ratings, like those SBR provides, are one of the few legit regulatory forces against books because rating downgrades actually effects their bottom line... (Cascade still being operational is proof of this)... Therefore SBR should be working to correct flawed rules such as this either through advocacy or through their ratings...

There is so much clutter ITT.. This is an awesome post...

[raydog]

you can do business with them by being honest and treating the book the way you want to be treated...jaysus fukking christ son, you got caught betting bad lines and are crying about the way you were treated by the guy you tried to steal from....seriously... what players dont like is when other players try to steal from the book and in return, gives all players a bad name.... it aint tony and 5dimes first rodeo with a guy trying to steal from them by betting bad lines.... and again, when the odds were changed makes 0 difference.. YOU STILL TOOK A SHOT! you deserve nothing and are very lucky to get paid anything on the bet.

yes, they need serious improvement in the data entry department and yes, the customer service can be bad at times, but i dont blame their cust. service reps sometimes...they have to deal with ignorant people like yourself all the time and that shit gets old. dont try to cheat or steal from the book and it will all work out.

[LVHerbie]

If books had this kind of software sharps would absolutely crush the books every time a few squares bet into a line causing it to move automatically, even worse sharps would manipulate lines betting half the max causing the line to move and than coming back over the top and hammering the other end after the line has moved.

Being a head linesman of an online book is a whole different beast than in Las Vegas within seconds sharps and syndicates can absolutely demolish a bad line.

The book did not take a shot at him they paid him 3-1 on a 2-1 bet Tony was an ass to him because he wanted to make it clear that he was aware of and was not going to tolerate the OP taking shots at him. What is there to not understand about this?

The OP is trying to manipulate people and degrade the book I am no shill but I am not going to tolerate some disgruntled idiot degrading and deterring players from playing at one of the top 5 books in the industry over something this ridiculous.

Books (at least quality books) do have this type of software in place or are you suggesting betcris and pinnacle have people trying to make 50 line chances at once when they open all lines for a college sport at once? This is the exact opposite of the system used in Vegas (if you ever went to the Stardust (before they imploded it) and watched them open numbers they used to draw numbers at random and let one better at a time take a shot at their openers until it got adjusted right)... Without this type of software they would be opening themselves to the exact scenarios you suggested...

IMO books (like 5dimes) that offer unique props (that mimic the behavior of offering openers) should be held accountable for the lines they offer... It is absurd to expect a player (especially a rec player) to held accountable for a book offering obscure props that are mis-priced...

Further if books, like Tony's, want to keep pulling his type of antics (which have been going on for years) I personally feel that SBR has a responsibility to protect the player and downgrade the book... How can SBR claim to be looking out for the player when they recommend rec-players jump into a 5dimes like company where an asshole like Tony feels entitled to unjustifiable go off on someone for which likely wasn't an intentional mistake? Tony wouldn't last two days as a manager at McDonald's yet support and referrals from companies (like SBR) allow God to maintain absurd antics...

Honestly I say let Tony run his ship however he wants... IMO SBR needs to explain how they can continue to recommend a book ran by a shit bag like this as A+ to THEIR unknowing customers who are expecting good customer service from a SBR A+ rated book...

[sharpcat]

Just posting the story. You can make your own conclusions. I do know that books would NOT exist without players, and that most players can see what happened and they do NOT like it.

The book controls the money, so it is on them to be honorable at ALL TIMES. Tony proved he will lie about important facts regarding disputes. He said he JUST found out about my play Sunday, when the facts show that he had to know about it the previous Tuesday or Wednesday.

The story is the story. Take whatever side you wish. The book controls the money and if they are not honorable and LIE then how can you ever do business with them?

Might as well not play with anybody than because 5dimes is one of the top 5 books that cater to US players right there with The Greek, Bet Jamaica, and Bookmaker. Coming from a player who has been in this industry for many years and who is currently funded with close to 10 books I can assure you that you will not find a book with better prices and faster payouts in the industry, customer service is not great but it is not all that bad.

[BetterBizness]

If books had this kind of software sharps would absolutely crush the books every time a few squares bet into a line causing it to move automatically, even worse sharps would manipulate lines betting half the max causing the line to move and than coming back over the top and hammering the other end after the line has moved.

Being a head linesman of an online book is a whole different beast than in Las Vegas within seconds sharps and syndicates can absolutely demolish a bad line.

But when you open up the beast....

How can you have it both ways... Offer it and take the dough, but then take it back when you want...

You then have what 11 pages of this thread is talking about.. regardless of right/wrong ...shot taking...Bad lines...This threads needs a movie!

[sharpcat]

Books (at least quality books) do have this type of software in place or are you suggesting betcris and pinnacle have people trying to make 50 line chances at once when they open all lines for a college sport at once? This is the exact opposite of the system used in Vegas (if you ever went to the Stardust (before they imploded it) and watched them open numbers they used to draw numbers at random and let one better at a time take a shot at their openers until it got adjusted right)... Without this type of software they would be opening themselves to the exact scenarios you suggested...

IMO books (like 5dimes) that offer unique props (that mimic the behavior of offering openers) should be held accountable for the lines they offer... It is absurd to expect a player (especially a rec player) to held accountable for a book offering obscure props that are mis-priced...

Further if books, like Tony's, want to keep pulling his type of antics (which have been going on for years) I personally feel that SBR has a responsibility to protect the player and downgrade the book... How can SBR claim to be looking out for the player when they recommend rec-players jump into a 5dimes like company where an asshole like Tony feels entitled to unjustifiable go off on someone for which likely wasn't an intentional mistake? Tony wouldn't last two days as a manager at McDonald's yet support and referrals from companies (like SBR) allow God to maintain absurd antics...

Honestly I say let Tony run his ship however he wants... IMO SBR needs to explain how they can continue to recommend a book ran by a shit bag like this as A+ to THEIR unknowing customers who are expecting good customer from a SBR A+ rated book...

Yes Pinnacle has software in place but because of their very high limits square action is not capable of manipulating lines and every other book in the industry is forced to tail Pinnacle and CRIS lines if not every book would have different lines which would open them up to sharps and arb players much like you would have seen in the 90's.

I personally would love to see the industry go this route but bookmakers realized years ago that they need to keep their lines consistent with the market.

Actually most books appear to have software that tail either CRIS or Pinnacle lines but if you know any thing about code and programming the slightest error in your coding could result in an extra "0" being slipped in on a line, this can be a headache for a linesman.

[BewareOf5Dimes]

Might as well not play with anybody than because 5dimes is one of the top 5 books that cater to US players right there with The Greek, Bet Jamaica, and Bookmaker. Coming from a player who has been in this industry for many years and who is currently funded with close to 10 books I can assure you that you will not find a book with better prices and faster payouts in the industry, customer service is not great but it is not all that bad.

When I was frozen out of my account and had to talk to Tony that Sunday morning I was up in arms about the whole thing. There are a few people whom I called ranting and raving about this. I may have bet a line that was a bad line, but my thought process the whole way was pure. The line, in hindsight was too good to be true, but that does not take away from the facts of the case.

The line looked good to me so I bet it. It was adjusted twice. There are numerous other facts in the case. 5Dimes and Tony discovered the line error on Tuesday or Wednesday because we know that a poster bet Watney at 2.15-1 on Wednesday. So, they HAD to know about my plays before the tourney started, and therefore they KNEW that I would be rooting in my play in good faith for four days. On the last day they decide to notify me of their mistake. Miraculously, Watney was somehow leading by 3 and only had to finish in the top 20.

So, when all of the facts are known, even if they claim the right to be able to change/void plays that are made into bad lines, then there still has to be some decency involved.....human decency. The facts show otherwise.

They assumed I took a shot, so they KNOWINGLY took a shot back. That is not right. Anybody who talked to me that day knows that I felt cheated and that I did NOT take a shot. It was a good line, or else I would NOT have played it the way I did. When you watch golf for 3-4 weeks in a row and see thousands of props and all you are doing is scrolling and scrolling and scrolling you are bound to see some good bets and bad bets. A lazy or careless line is NOT an obviously bad line. Just like Oosty at 450-1 in the British Open. He was ranked 54th in the world....his true odds HAVE to be lower than 450-1, probably by a factor of 7-8, the same difference in my Watney odds and the final Watney odds.

Once again I will try to stop posting about this. Does Tony deserve to lose business for the way he handled the matter? I think so, but that is not my intent. That is the natural consequence of telling this story, which does not happen without his HORRIFIC and LYING behavior in chat.

[LVHerbie]

Yes Pinnacle has software in place but because of their very high limits square action is not capable of manipulating lines and every other book in the industry is forced to tail Pinnacle and CRIS lines if not every book would have different lines which would open them up to sharps and arb players much like you would have seen in the 90's.

I personally would love to see the industry go this route but bookmakers realized years ago that they need to keep their lines consistent with the market.

And I'm arguing that books (like 5dimes) that offer unique props should take the responsibility for their lines as betcris and pinnacle do... They already balance this by offer low max bets on them so they either need to step up and take responsibility for the lines they post or SBR needs to do their job and protect the players that aren't aware that they need to spend their time constantly comparing Tony's lines on obscure props to Euro-exchanges (they may have never heard of) or face getting treated like shit when they bet a line that that Tony's book incompetently over prices by 10 times the "fair market price" (and he, as a self-proclaimed God, gets to decide whatever the **** that is suppose to mean later) and doesn't get around to notify the player until after the event has significantly started (and the player's position is likely to cover) and, after all this, they corrected the line before the event started but didn't get around to checking who bet their wrongly price prop for several days (and, conveniently, had time to see that the wrong position likely would hit)...

Sounds like a quality A+ book I want my money at....

[Optional]

I may have bet a line that was a bad line, but my thought process the whole way was pure.

Had you taken a 20/1 prop for the maximum there before?

[sharpcat]

And I'm arguing that books (like 5dimes) that offer unique props should take the responsibility for their lines as betcris and pinnacle do... They already balance this by offer low max bets on them so they either need to step up and take responsibility for the lines they post or SBR needs to do their job and protect the players that aren't aware that they need to spend their time constantly comparing Tony's lines on obscure props to Euro-exchanges (they may have never heard) of or face getting treated like shit when they bet a line that that Tony's book incompetently over prices by 10 times the "fair market price" (and he, as a self-proclaimed God, gets to decide whatever the **** that is suppose to mean later) and doesn't get around to notify the player until after the event has significantly started (and the player's position is likely to cover) and, all this, after they corrected the line before the event started but didn't get around to checking who bet their wrongly price prop for several days (and, conveniently, had time to see that the wrong position likely would hit)...

Sounds like a quality A+ book I want my money at....

It clearly states in the rules on every sportsbook I have ever played with that erroneous lines may be voided you should read the rules before you play if you do not like the rules than you have the option to not play. I do not like the hidden fees that my credit card company hits me with but since it is in the fine print those are the rules I need to abide by if I want to use that credit card it is that simple. This makes it the players responsibility and even Justin7 has agreed on many occasions that this is a fair practice file a complaint and see what Justin says.

Throughout this thread the OP has refered to betting for value, hedging bets and even stated that he had heard that Tony can be a dick so he knew fully well that he was betting a bad line and as Tony pointed out in their chat it is clearly stated in their rules that the bet can be voided at the discretion of the manager. Tony knew he took a shot at him on several occasions and still did not void the wager and actually gave him better than what true odds were.

Also I have never seen a golf bet at 5dimes that was not offered at Pinnacle they tail Pinnacles lines on all of their golf offers.

[BewareOf5Dimes]

Had you taken a 20/1 prop for the maximum there before?

Don't know about maximums.....$250 does not sound maximum to me. The two other $250 bets I have made are Titans to win the Super Bowl for $250 and TCU to win NCAA title for $250. The following week I lost close to $1,500 betting Nick Price over Corey Pavin in a Senior event matchup, as well as Bernard Langer over Tom Lehman ($600 to $800 each, I think). I do not think those bets were capped at 250. I think I bet the whole thing each time....not 250 at a time. I bet golf every week for about a month.....watched all kinds of tourneys. You won't believe me, but if $250 is max bet then that is coincidence, and if I was taking a shot would I knowingly MAX BET a bad line twice two full days before the event started at odds I knew were 7-10 times higher than it should be?

The obvious answer is no. I played the $250.....then double-checked to make sure Watney was even playing and that my mind wasn't playing tricks on me since I thought I remembered him from the previous week at Firestone (he finished 16th in the Firestone it turns out). I had played him in my group of 100 win bets, too.

Once I saw that he was a decent play and was not scratched from the event I played another $250 at 15-1 later in the day, since the line had been adjusted down from 20-1. If you do not play props you like the lines could change. After I bet the second time the line adjusted to 10-1. I did not make any more plays.

This was Tuesday. It does not seem plausible to think I could get away with two max bets (assuming what you say is true about 250 being max bet) on a line that was out of whack. No way a shot taker would do that. I did NOT take a shot....period. They would obviously figure it out real quick. I never checked back after I saw the odds at 10-1 on Tuesday. It turns out that a poster here bet Watney to finish top 20 like I did, but at 2.15 to on Wednesday. So, they had to know of their mistake then (and therefore, they knew about my plays well before the tourney started). It doesn't make me look worse, it makes them look worse.....and they are the SHOT TAKERS, not me.

I tried not to post buy you had a good question that deserved an answer.

[Marigold HD]

I have $5600 in 5dimes currently. I'm cashing out thursday morning. Switching back to the Greek. I wish I knew about this two weeks ago. They better not **** me on the cash out. Stay tuned.

[LVHerbie]

It clearly states in the rules on every sportsbook I have ever played with that erroneous lines may be voided you should read the rules before you play if you do not like the rules than you have the option to not play. I do not like the hidden fees that my credit card company hits me with but since it is in the fine print those are the rules I need to abide by if I want to use that credit card it is that simple. This makes it the players responsibility and even Justin7 has agreed on many occasions that this is a fair practice file a complaint and see what Justin says.

Throughout this thread the OP has refered to betting for value, hedging bets and even stated that he had heard that Tony can be a dick so he knew fully well that he was betting a bad line and as Tony pointed out in their chat it is clearly stated in their rules that the bet can be voided at the discretion of the manager. Tony knew he took a shot at him on several occasions and still did not void the wager and actually gave him better than what true odds were.

I agree with everything you said in the first paragraph, I'm arguing that the rule needs to be changed, and, honestly, no longer care about the original poster or his attentions... Given this, IMO, let Tony run his company to the exact lettering of whatever legal agreement he can muster up (as he probably at least as scummy as the typical people I'm mentally assuming are in-charge of credit card companies anyhow)...

At this point I don't see much value in continuing this argument as I've already expressed my opinion several times and at this point would only be happy to see either A) a public (and sincere... which I guess I need to add given the individual we are discussing... ) apology from Tony to OP representing all the other nameless people he has obviously treated equally as bad or B) a downgrade from SBR in their rating of 5dimes...

As I feel I'm unlikely to see either of these things achieved through my continued posting in this thread I'm done with it...

[austin]

it amazes me how some posters try to threaten by withdrawing their balances, when it's only them who are going to lose out long-term (unless of course they have pinnacle)

[sharpcat]

$500 dollars is the max wager.

They did not take a shot at you they paid you 3-1 on a 2-1 wager.

It is a shame that you made such a big stink about this silly issue the line was a bad line its clearly stated in the rules that the bet can be voided and now as Tony makes it a point to read these boards that not only will you be banned from playing at this book and have now limited yourself to no longer having an out with .10 cent lines but I would also expect a hard time cashing out should your futures wagers hit, Tony is probably not going to appreciate seeing posters pulling money from their accounts because you can not read the rules.

Have fun playing .20 cent lines folks

[Optional]

if I was taking a shot would I knowingly MAX BET a bad line twice two full days before the event started

That might be why Tony gave you the benefit of the doubt.

Like I said earlier, I think you had a win overall.

[BewareOf5Dimes]

$500 dollars is the max wager.

They did not take a shot at you they paid you 3-1 on a 2-1 wager.

It is a shame that you made such a big stink about this silly issue the line was a bad line its clearly stated in the rules that the bet can be voided and now as Tony makes it a point to read these boards that not only will you be banned from playing at this book and have now limited yourself to no longer having an out with .10 cent lines but I would also expect a hard time cashing out should your futures wagers hit, Tony is probably not going to appreciate seeing posters pulling money from their accounts because you can not read the rules.

Have fun playing .20 cent lines folks

There you have it, folks! This 5Dimes defender tells me I will likely have a tough time cashing out if my future bets hit. That is what it is all about. Even the defenders know! By the way, I have $1,300 in future bets......I think $1,296 to be exact.

All of my bets are documented in this thread. Trust me, if I hit I will do a transfer out quickly...one way or the other. I don't even believe what you said. I am not sweating getting paid, since I will just tell everyone I got stiffed if it happens.

When I started this thread I thought I was putting my future plays at risk, but I truly don't believe I will get stiffed. But you, a 5Dimes defender, seems to think it is likely.

Is there anything else to say?

[BigDaddy]

$500 dollars is the max wager.

They did not take a shot at you they paid you 3-1 on a 2-1 wager.

It is a shame that you made such a big stink about this silly issue the line was a bad line its clearly stated in the rules that the bet can be voided and now as Tony makes it a point to read these boards that not only will you be banned from playing at this book and have now limited yourself to no longer having an out with .10 cent lines but I would also expect a hard time cashing out should your futures wagers hit, Tony is probably not going to appreciate seeing posters pulling money from their accounts because you can not read the rules.

Have fun playing .20 cent lines folks

that might be the dumbest statement i have ever read.

so you think its ok for tony aka GOD to keep his money if he wins his pending bets?

news flash for all squares

5dimes is a rec book its not the end of the world to lose them as an out.

[sharpcat]

There you have it, folks! This 5Dimes defender tells me I will likely have a tough time cashing out if my future bets hit. That is what it is all about. Even the defenders know! By the way, I have $1,300 in future bets......I think $1,296 to be exact.

All of my bets are documented in this thread. Trust me, if I hit I will do a transfer out quickly...one way or the other. I don't even believe what you said. I am not sweating getting paid, since I will just tell everyone I got stiffed if it happens.

When I started this thread I thought I was putting my future plays at risk, but I truly don't believe I will get stiffed. But you, a 5Dimes defender, seems to think it is likely.

Is there anything else to say?

Ohh you will get paid but I know if I was Tony I would make it a point to slow pay the hell out of you and ironically run into some processor issues and maybe a few document verification problems. Karma is a bitch and after 75 posts bashing his book in 3 days running off current and future customers you should not expect VIP treatment.

[sharpcat]

that might be the dumbest statement i have ever read.

so you think its ok for tony aka GOD to keep his money if he wins his pending bets?

news flash for all squares

5dimes is a rec book its not the end of the world to lose them as an out.

This statement is even dumber

Where do you derive not being paid from "expect a hard time cashing out"?

[BewareOf5Dimes]

Ohh you will get paid but I know if I was Tony I would make it a point to slow pay the hell out of you and ironically run into some processor issues and maybe a few document verification problems. Karma is a bitch and after 75 posts bashing his book in 3 days running off current and future customers you should not expect VIP treatment.

Trust me, I am not looking for VIP treatment. How about human treatment? If I get human treatment I don't tell this story to the boards, but guess what? The story is 100 percent trul, as nobody has disputed a single thing I have said.

Now, it is only right to tell the story. And this is the best place to tell it. People can play there all they want. All I am telling you is that the two times something went right, it turned into bullshit. From the running around faxing CC info when I tried to withdraw a part of my British Open win (even though I deposited by **), to the hell I went through on the Watney bet, the story needed to be told.

I took their word that when I faxed my CC info that they truly couldn't read it, even though I sent it 5-6 different ways when I went to Kinkos multiple times. Now, I am inclined to think that they were sitting there laughing their asses off that Sunday as I ran back and forth to that stupid ass place paying a total of about $15 in faxes.....all for a winning bet that was made by ** deposit.....not CC.

I do not trust a word they say about anything. Period.

[Extra Innings]

shit....i would have just gave this guy 10k to shut his mouth.

[LVHerbie]

Lots of players have concluded it was a bad line

Wow, another amazing example of Coach's investigative journalism skills... Crazy that SBR isn't better utilizing JJ in resolving player's disputes...

[Extra Innings]

He is a professional LV...you knew that.

[clarkacal]

What if you placed 120 similar previous wagers on games at the amount of $500 and lo and behold in the confusion and excitement of getting the bet in before kickoff because 6 other games are starting at the same time (college football saturday) you bet and confirm $5.00 on a game. Turns out this bet is a winner. Does anyone expect to call the book and have your bet corrected to $500? It was an obvious mistake and bad bet amount but we have to live with our mistakes and so should the book, even though they write disclaimers saying they won't.

[sickler]

This statement is even dumber

Where do you derive not being paid from "expect a hard time cashing out"?

What I think he means is when you experience a "hard time" attempting to do something, the result is often a fail, no matter how much time is spent on it. For some it's solving the rubix cube.

By hard time you meant stalling on payment, not stiffing. Some could read it the other way.

[tkim8404]

This is pretty scary. I'm not feeling secure with my money in my 5 dimes account no more.

[BigDaddy]

that is a classic video

bend down

LMFAO!

[Doug]

I think you will get paid promptly on the futures....and booted !

[Brick]

Didnt read the whole thread, but if your defense is that you bet tons of crazy bets and whatnot what are the odds that your $500 bet be on this guy? Tony is a dick, but he is right about you playing stupid.

[hawaiiboy396]

Hope this all gets resolved

[BewareOf5Dimes]

Didnt read the whole thread, but if your defense is that you bet tons of crazy bets and whatnot what are the odds that your $500 bet be on this guy? Tony is a dick, but he is right about you playing stupid.

That's what you get for not reading the thread. You are wrong. As it turns out my facts are true, and just today we found out that 5Dimes/Tony knew about my play at least a full day before the tourney started.

So, even though I did not take a shot, they KNOWINGLY held back informing me about the bad line until my guy couldn't lose......5 days after I made the bet. That means they took a shot, since if they would have informed me before the tourney started I likely would not have bet the $500.....$500 less than they could get if they waited to see what happened (they know I played $250 at 20-1 and $250 at 15-1, so they can't expect me to play it at 2-1 if they let me know they made a mistake). If my guy is terrible they make $500. If my guy plays great they will claim bad line and reduce odds to whatever they want. My guy is up 3 heading to the last round and at this point they know they can't win, so they freeze the account that Sunday morning until I talk in chat with Tony.

Bad line or not, it was not a bad line in my mind when I bet....and when I rooted. Their actions would be a joke even if I did take a shot, even though I didn't. Remember, they ASSUME I took a shot, so what do they do? They KNOWINGLY take their own shot. That is not professional. Turns out I did not take a shot, they are the only shot takers. They can't know for sure if someone bet a bad line intentionally every time it happens with them, and if they act like this the players will vote with their feet.

One shot was taken......they took it.

[LVHerbie]

that is a classic video

bend down

LMFAO!

My favorite line was ""Honey? I'm not your honey... We're not married, you're not my girlfriend!" Classic stuff Coach