Pinnacle Sportsbook is a high-roller at betfair

Hareeba! · 08-28-10, 05:41 PM

how do you "see this" ?

who's American?

moonbeam · 08-28-10, 05:47 PM

I guess you are good enough to don´t need any explanation of this Hareeba.
Just open your eyes

Hareeba! · 08-28-10, 05:50 PM

Originally posted by moonbeam

I guess you are good enough to don´t need any explanation of this Hareeba.
Just open your eyes

very helpful, thanks for that

lukahh · 08-28-10, 05:55 PM

it's weekend! time to get drunk & post around some rumors.
moonbeam - obviously pinny isn't registered in US, and second, while they probably do have hedging going on, it is not obvious to me. pls elaborate.

moonbeam · 08-28-10, 05:59 PM

yes that´s rumors. And it´s time to get drunk.

moonbeam · 08-28-10, 06:18 PM

ok I explain it. Place 2 or 3 $5000 bets on not so liquid markets and Pinnacle try to buy it back at betfair. On the other hand, the betfair traders at Malta do the same.

This whole market is insane these days

durito · 08-28-10, 06:29 PM

Who do you think makes those 30k+ mlb offers at matchbook sometimes?

I thought you got kicked out of pinny moonbeam.

Hareeba! · 08-28-10, 06:41 PM

Originally posted by moonbeam

ok I explain it. Place 2 or 3 $5000 bets on not so liquid markets and Pinnacle try to buy it back at betfair. On the other hand, the betfair traders at Malta do the same.

This whole market is insane these days

Why is that so insane?
Isn't that how free markets have always operated?

Have Betfair ever admitted to being traders?
What makes you believe they are?

Chopsticks · 08-28-10, 06:42 PM

I have never seen this but it would not surprise me. However I very much doubt that they do it on MLB or the mainstream markets, but maybe on some of the more obscure events where they can't get a balanced book.

I remember someone mentioning that TheGreek (?) took down a line way early, and their explanation was that the book they laid the bet off at took down the line. As best I remember this was some obscure market. It is doubtful that TheGreek or Pinnacle have to lay down cabbage at Betfair or any other book.

moonbeam · 08-28-10, 07:09 PM

Originally posted by Hareeba!

Why is that so insane?
Isn't that how free markets have always operated?

Have Betfair ever admitted to being traders?
What makes you believe they are?

betfair stated they have ten traders trading their own markets.

Thats insane

moonbeam · 08-28-10, 07:14 PM

Originally posted by durito

Who do you think makes those 30k+ mlb offers at matchbook sometimes?

I thought you got kicked out of pinny moonbeam.

I don´t know who makes this durito. Please tell me.

Yes Pinnacle kicked me out.

Hareeba! · 08-28-10, 07:49 PM

Originally posted by moonbeam

betfair stated they have ten traders trading their own markets.

Thats insane

why?

moonbeam · 08-28-10, 07:52 PM

because they don´t have this 7 seconds delay in live-betting... for example

Dr.Gonzo · 08-28-10, 07:54 PM

Betfair should not be arbing their own markets. It is a scum act from those limey cunts.

Dr.Gonzo · 08-28-10, 07:55 PM

Originally posted by moonbeam

betfair stated they have ten traders trading their own markets.

Thats insane

Where have they stated this?

Citation please.

(It's not that I don't believe, 'caus I do, you I just want a link)

moonbeam · 08-28-10, 08:07 PM

Originally posted by Dr.Gonzo

Where have they stated this?

Citation please.

(It's not that I don't believe, 'caus I do, you I just want a link)

It´s late at night but I will send you the link tomorrow.

Betfair confirms they have 10 traders trading their own markets in an official live chat (12month ago or so)

Chopsticks · 08-28-10, 08:12 PM

Are you sure that they meant trading on the actual exchange and not setting prices and managing Betfair Multiples?

chachi · 08-29-10, 01:52 AM

Allegedly BF Malta's trading operation is purely for dealing with the multiples.

They have full synthetic capabilities in place to cross-match (ie in an A v B market, if you are willing to lay teamA at evens, you are willing to back teamB at evens as its the same, so putting in a lay of 1k on A will cause 1k of backing interest to appear on the teamB line) as well on many markets nowadays.

the sink · 08-29-10, 03:54 AM

u can also se on betfair when a market is suspended for a goal, when they open it again u can count the seconds and there will be big moneyoffers out before a normal person can put his up. There is a 8second delay for us but there will be money up 5-6 seconds after they open

lukahh · 08-29-10, 04:35 AM

Originally posted by moonbeam

ok I explain it. Place 2 or 3 $5000 bets on not so liquid markets and Pinnacle try to buy it back at betfair. On the other hand, the betfair traders at Malta do the same.

This whole market is insane these days

interesting stuff.

at what level below their accepted bet do they hedge? i mean say you placed 2x 5000$ on odds 2.00. what will appear for offer at BF? 1.95?

Ruifgalmeida · 08-29-10, 06:17 AM

Originally posted by moonbeam

I don´t know who makes this durito. Please tell me.

Yes Pinnacle kicked me out.

this is bullshit, pinnacle doesnt kick anybody out.

vitalyo · 08-29-10, 06:54 AM

Originally posted by Ruifgalmeida

this is bullshit, pinnacle doesnt kick anybody out.

He had a wager in live betting that Pinny voided . He put out an dispute . Pinny paid him and closed his account .

Hareeba! · 08-29-10, 03:39 PM

Originally posted by Ruifgalmeida

this is bullshit, pinnacle doesnt kick anybody out.

you do the wrong thing and they'll show you the door

DIF · 06-17-11, 06:28 AM

betfair told me that they do not operate with own traders on their own market. Sounds crazy but I really doubt betfair telling the truth. Can you confirm this chat moonbeam.

King_Suckerman · 06-17-11, 06:54 AM

Originally posted by moonbeam

ok I explain it. Place 2 or 3 $5000 bets on not so liquid markets and Pinnacle try to buy it back at betfair. On the other hand, the betfair traders at Malta do the same. This whole market is insane these days

I can see how it would be possible to observe that. Not sure why its so suprising though. Don't all books do this to some degree?

noyb · 06-17-11, 07:10 AM

Originally posted by DIF

betfair told me that they do not operate with own traders on their own market. Sounds crazy but I really doubt betfair telling the truth. Can you confirm this chat moonbeam.

they have "traders" to manage their multiple products and the associated risks. they're not "traders" in the way some of us are.

Fa11en · 06-17-11, 10:29 AM

Books layoff on betfair all the time, books layoff on other books all the time. Usually not in major sports where western books control most of the market. However, you will see tons of soccer layoffs as asia controls the soccer market. Nothing new.

Fa11en · 06-17-11, 10:30 AM

All their "traders" do is keep an eye on the market. Very little overhead for betfair.

Stefan · 06-17-11, 02:13 PM

Who cares whether Pinnacle trades at Betfair or not? But I think the chances are much bigger that someone buys the opposite line at Pinnacle than at Betfair.

Sawyer · 06-17-11, 03:25 PM

Some people in USA can use Betfair. Betfair is always open for people with high volume.

jairocon · 06-17-11, 04:16 PM

Citations would be nice... otherwise it's just a rumor. Anyway... wouldn't it be more advantageous for pinny to just drop the odds so that arbers can come and balance out the other side? I think that's why pinna loves arbers - they soften lots of market moves.

CHUBNUT · 06-17-11, 04:16 PM

you guys should get a hobby your good at

chachi · 06-18-11, 12:17 AM

BF used to run a 'large account facilitation service' where one could get a single price for say 100k or 200k laying and they trade out/against the position effectively to get you to bet more with them, so if the market was 2.00 / 2.04 25k up they might offer you 1.96 for 200k and then scalp as much of the spread out as they can to cover ... don't know if they still offer this or not

chance · 06-18-11, 02:58 AM

Smart bookmakers lay money off. Pinnacle are super smart.