[lonnie55]

No idea what you mean

[piterp]

I mean even if pinnacle have curacao licence that not make curacao bookmakers safe

Most complaints on this this forum 18bet ,1xbet and bet construct bookmakers- all of them curacao

[lonnie55]

And how many is bookmakers like pinnacle with curacao licence?

Few. But that is not the point. The point is that the governments fail.

Where are IBC, Singbet, BetISN, CMD368, GA288 etc licensed? Philippines? Cagayan de Oro? Nowhere? What are those licenses worth? Nothing, right? Yet it doesn't matter. We give them our money because those books pay and they have a long and good history of paying their customers. Nevertheless they could disappear at any time and go away with our money. And there would be nothing we could do about it. So governments would fail again.

The point is: If online gambling is legal in a country the governments have to protect the customers. They cannot take the tax money from the industry but give a sh*t on whether a customer gets paid or not. Yet this is the reality.

[theviking]

I have 4 friends , that was 18bet customer, fully verified, got small withdrawls with no problem , at once they won bigger amount, 18bet cancel their payout, stole their money the last months.

All of them has been betting online for more than 10 years with nothing like this

[Optional]

I have 4 friends , that was 18bet customer, fully verified, got small withdrawls with no problem , at once they won bigger amount, 18bet cancel their payout, stole their money the last months.

All of them has been betting online for more than 10 years with nothing like this

Would you please ask them to send in a sportsbook complaint? https://www.sportsbookreview.com/sportsbook-complaint/

The more reports the better.

[realloque]

I also have very bad memories about this total thief bookie . This year , i made accoutn in 18bet , to see if i can bet there . It was not izi , because they copy odds , prematch is copied from pinnacle , live is copied from bet365 or from pinnacle . And accepting odds its like 40 seconds . So it was no use . But they gave me 200 EUR bonus for French open , if i deposit 1000 EUR . So , i did it . Then i saw i need to make a turnoer , it was like 5000 eur to turn . Since no arbitreages and so on , i did random bets on my types for tennis big games ( most french open or all , i dotn remember ) and i was betting on MLB games money line , on higher odds ( hehe ) , because i needed to make a turnover . I got op lucky , and i gathered 5000 eur . Been waiting only for making turnover . When was done , i tried to withdrawal . Then circus has started . They blocked my withdawal . It been taking some days , finally these putos CHANGED HISTORY , funny thing is , this changed history still indicated like i should have won some good money ( like 2000 EUR ) , and on account i saw blistering 40 EUR . I talked to them . they didnt talk to me AT ALL . Total ignoring me . Finallly , after i noticed i dont win and im entraped , i decided to withdraw 40 EUR . Couldnt , hehe . Finally i just left , losing some decent money . Whats funny more , they still offerring me very high bonus ( hehe ) , like nothing have had happened before . Its just a circus . What can i say , i played only big matches , or French open , or MLB , no pulps , just prematch games to make turnover . This bookie in normal country should land in a jail for some decents years . Beware these trashes please .

[curry2211]

Maybe they are just running out of money, I was pretty suprised when I saw them partner up with sportsmarket e.g. With their odds they are definitely not competitive in the asian market and behind all this stolen money is just pure desparation. Is there any update in the communication with SBR and you just dont share it for strategic reason, or are the just ignoring everything? I guess the will be out of business within 8 months.

[Optional]

Maybe they are just running out of money, I was pretty suprised when I saw them partner up with sportsmarket e.g. With their odds they are definitely not competitive in the asian market and behind all this stolen money is just pure desparation. Is there any update in the communication with SBR and you just dont share it for strategic reason, or are the just ignoring everything? I guess the will be out of business within 8 months.

Nothing useful to update I am afraid.

[lonnie55]

Nothing useful to update I am afraid.

Any plans on publishing an article on SBR's main page?

[Optional]

Any plans on publishing an article on SBR's main page?

I'll suggest that

[redcar]

18bet by phone now even with bonus offers

[KittiP]

I have 4 friends , that was 18bet customer, fully verified, got small withdrawls with no problem , at once they won bigger amount, 18bet cancel their payout, stole their money the last months.

All of them has been betting online for more than 10 years with nothing like this

You know 4 people that have had this same problem all with the same bookmaker.
Are their accounts linked anyhow?

Can you get them all to send complaints to MGA and also to link this thread:
https://www.sportsbookreview.com/for...cancelled.html

and also the summary thread?:
https://www.sportsbookreview.com/for...g-scandal.html

At some point they should realise that a problem is happening.

They can't keep replying telling everyone that someone has hacked into their computer stolen their password for only 18Bet, BabiBet and 1Bet at the time that they have a pending withdrawal, cancel the withdrawal, place a series of losing bets (which somehow get manually inputted incorrectly sometimes, by an automated system) and that the player must keep their accounts passwords secure.

[KittiP]

I also have very bad memories about this total thief bookie . This year , i made accoutn in 18bet , to see if i can bet there . It was not izi , because they copy odds , prematch is copied from pinnacle , live is copied from bet365 or from pinnacle . And accepting odds its like 40 seconds . So it was no use . But they gave me 200 EUR bonus for French open , if i deposit 1000 EUR . So , i did it . Then i saw i need to make a turnoer , it was like 5000 eur to turn . Since no arbitreages and so on , i did random bets on my types for tennis big games ( most french open or all , i dotn remember ) and i was betting on MLB games money line , on higher odds ( hehe ) , because i needed to make a turnover . I got op lucky , and i gathered 5000 eur . Been waiting only for making turnover . When was done , i tried to withdrawal . Then circus has started . They blocked my withdawal . It been taking some days , finally these putos CHANGED HISTORY , funny thing is , this changed history still indicated like i should have won some good money ( like 2000 EUR ) , and on account i saw blistering 40 EUR . I talked to them . they didnt talk to me AT ALL . Total ignoring me . Finallly , after i noticed i dont win and im entraped , i decided to withdraw 40 EUR . Couldnt , hehe . Finally i just left , losing some decent money . Whats funny more , they still offerring me very high bonus ( hehe ) , like nothing have had happened before . Its just a circus . What can i say , i played only big matches , or French open , or MLB , no pulps , just prematch games to make turnover . This bookie in normal country should land in a jail for some decents years . Beware these trashes please .

Sorry to hear about your's too man, I hope we can get some of our money back

[KittiP]

Its now been about 18 days since i sent the message to MCAA about MGA, they said someone will get in contact in 2 days, after I sent the message.

Do you think this means that they are taking the case seriously and that is why its taking much longer than expected, or do you think they are ignoring the email?

[Optional]

Its now been about 18 days since i sent the message to MCAA about MGA, they said someone will get in contact in 2 days, after I sent the message.

Do you think this means that they are taking the case seriously and that is why its taking much longer than expected, or do you think they are ignoring the email?

I don't know. But if they replied at all it is a good sign. I'd just follow them up about weekly for as long as it takes now.

[lonnie55]

Another new complaint came up in a German betting forum. The customer claimed that 18bet changed manipulated their bonus terms to legitimate the confiscation of winnings retroactively:

A google-translated version of his post:

I realized this morning that 18bet IT has made a brazen and embarrassing attempt to cover up their scams. They have now exchanged the link under point 11 (18bet.com/en/tc-pages/1-psb60b) so that it now leads to the "complete" version of the conditions. It struck me how amateurish these fraudsters proceeded: Deviating from the English version (where everything is in the right order) is in the German version, the wrong order. In the German version, point 8 comes after the 9th At 9, they have simply added the bonus rules from the partner website sportempire.com using copy & paste. Apparently their IT is even too incapable to enumerate the "bonus conditions" as point 8 and to rename the chapter "complaints" in point 9 and copy this into the right place with copy & paste. I am looking forward to sending these screenshots to the MGA and the Dispute Settlement Body Pardee Consulta Ltd if they believe 18bet more than me.Here are the two versions:18bet.com/en/pages/terms-and-conditions (By the way, when I opened the link in the logged-out state, I was contacted by the live chat, whether I'm looking for a bonus: D)18bet.com/de/pages/terms-and-conditions

In a previous post he said that he has also submitted a complaint to SBR. @Optional: Did you receive it? (I think his name is Dennis)

@KittiP: Did you contact Pardee Consulta Ltd?

https://adrbypardee.eu/

They claim to be the official ADR service on behalf of the MCCAA. I've just heard about it for the first time.

[Ilya Gorbunov]

Hi guys,

I believe I am yet another victim of 18bet. I have an account with them since the start of 2018, never really had a problem before September 2019. I decided to withdraw the money I had left there (around 3500 euros) on 05/09/2019. About a week and half later (16/09/19) i received an email from 18bet asking for verification docs, although i have to say my account was fully verified in the past and i did withdraw money from them from time to time with no problem (they were always quite slow, asking for all kinds of docs, so at that point i was not surprised nor suspicious that it took them that long). I also have to mention, that i didn't have bank statement (one of the documents requested) on hand and it took me some days to get it. Once having the necessary documents, I replied to the email from 18bet and also spoke on livechat with an agent of theirs. I also noticed that my balance is missing and was somewhat worried as i knew that upon the withdrawal being rejected (which had to happen in 48 hours after i received an email from them) the money had to come back to my account. So when I asked the agent where my money was, I was stunned at his response: You (me) supposedly cancelled the withdrawal manually and lost money betting!!!! I quickly checked my bets history and indeed there were 2 losing bets pre match (around 30min before) of 2500 and 1000 staked (WTA tournaments). I obviously have to be completely insane not to remember to place these bets myself and of course cancelling the withdrawal, which is a complete nonsense.

As advised by livechat agent, I wrote an email (06/10/19) to csd@18bet.com explaining my situation. I didn't get a response and wrote another email (18/10/19) asking to provide IP logs. On 20/10/19 I finally received the response (not that I expected anything different):

Dear Ilya,

We are reaching you with an update in regards to your e-mail.

After you reached us the first time on chat, we informed you that we will look into the matter, as in rare occasions it is possible that if you cancel a withdrawal request, a bug may occur and the funds may indeed not go back to your account balance.

However, after we revised your case in further detail, we confirmed that there was no such issue after you cancelled your withdrawal. The funds were returned to your account immediately after you performed this action and afterwards it seems you continued playing in the sport section, which is why we did not previously reply, as after cancelling your withdrawal you chose to continue your gaming session on your own accord.

In conclusion, no issue has been identified, as you have placed your funds on losing bets, after canceling your withdrawal request.

We hope you find this e-mail informative.

Yours,
Daniel N. | Customer Care Team

I also wrote to Paul Fairhead, who offers free advice to people having issues with bookies. Paul told me 18bet doesn't have a UK licence (MGA) and his main area of expertise is predominantly in this market. He did however, refered me to Konrad Kwiatkowski of Green Table Legal, who had considerable experience in pursuing legal cases against firms licenced by MGA. Having spoken to Konrad, he told me the case is going to be v challenging (I quote his words):

- if you are dealing with thieves don't expect they will play fair, they will do whatever they can to keep your money
- there is a problem with evidence - they have everything (logs, etc) and it is you who have to prove your point
- Maltese authorities (MGA) are not very keen to do anything other than rubber-stamp bookmakers point of view


It doesn't mean the situation is hopeless. I think the way to go with it is:
1. ask them (or rather force) to reveal their logs: IP addresses, log in times, time of bet was placed etc.

2. obtain the same from your Internet Provider
3. cross-examine it

I also was encouraged by Konrad to submit a complaint to MGA along with other people affected from this forum. He thinks it may lead MGA actually doing something and the matter being resolved quicker. Tbh I don't really have high hopes from what i read here and how the whole situation looks. It is just sad that something like this can occur in the first place as if we are living in the times of the Wild Wild West.

[Raulik1]

Hi guys,

I have also a bad experience with Babibet. 2 days ago I sent my request for a withdraw. I didnt receive my money and next day was my betting account closed. And reason?

Your account is considered as inactive and as a result, it was closed. You may to the following point in our Terms and conditions - "4. Accounts having no recorded activity for a period of 6 months are considered to be inactive. Should an account be inactive for 6 consecutive months or longer (no deposit and betting/gaming activity), babibet reserves all rights to terminate the customer's account and therefore; all outstanding balances are forfeited."

I lost "only" 308 EUR but Babibet doesnt want to pay.

[lonnie55]

Hi guys,

I have also a bad experience with Babibet. 2 days ago I sent my request for a withdraw. I didnt receive my money and next day was my betting account closed. And reason?

Your account is considered as inactive and as a result, it was closed. You may to the following point in our Terms and conditions - "4. Accounts having no recorded activity for a period of 6 months are considered to be inactive. Should an account be inactive for 6 consecutive months or longer (no deposit and betting/gaming activity), babibet reserves all rights to terminate the customer's account and therefore; all outstanding balances are forfeited."

I lost "only" 308 EUR but Babibet doesnt want to pay.

So? Was your account inactive for 6 months or not (beside the fact that this rule is absolutely ridiculous and would be quashed by any court in the world)?

[Raulik1]

Really I dont know. I was less active now, but I didnt receive any email nothing. They are just waiting to collect my money. I have never seen such terms and conditions with any bookmaker. Also Babibet support sent me the rules 1bet and not the rules Babibet.

[MrSink]

what a fckn scam it is .

[lonnie55]

Really I dont know. I was less active now, but I didnt receive any email nothing. They are just waiting to collect my money. I have never seen such terms and conditions with any bookmaker. Also Babibet support sent me the rules 1bet and not the rules Babibet.

What do you mean you don't know? When did you place your last bet? When was your last log-in approximately?

[Raulik1]

What do you mean you don't know? When did you place your last bet? When was your last log-in approximately?

I bet now very recreationally because I have any time. Also I have a lot of bookies not only Babibet. My last bet? Maybe 3 months ago, maybe 5 or 7, really I dont know because my account is closed and I cant to see my betting history. I logged in 2 days ago. I sent a request for withdraw and then Babibet closed my account.

[KittiP]

I don't know. But if they replied at all it is a good sign. I'd just follow them up about weekly for as long as it takes now.

Thanks, but I don't actually know how to, because the email response that I initially got when I submitted the complaint was sent by a non-reply email address.

And when submitted the complaint, I did it though the website, so I'm guessing that if I send another complaint in and reference the old one, it will have its own ticket number and then probably wont get replied to again.

[KittiP]

@KittiP: Did you contact Pardee Consulta Ltd?

https://adrbypardee.eu/

They claim to be the official ADR service on behalf of the MCCAA. I've just heard about it for the first time.

Hi, sorry for the late reply, I sort of gave up on this for a while and didn't want to come back onto the forum for a while.

Thanks for the link, I will look into this tonight, thanks.

I remember that you recently posted about 18bet voiding your bets for stupid reasons, did they end up changing their minds about the decision? Or using the same logic to void your losing bets?

[KittiP]

Hi guys,

I believe I am yet another victim of 18bet. I have an account with them since the start of 2018, never really had a problem before September 2019. I decided to withdraw the money I had left there (around 3500 euros) on 05/09/2019. About a week and half later (16/09/19) i received an email from 18bet asking for verification docs, although i have to say my account was fully verified in the past and i did withdraw money from them from time to time with no problem (they were always quite slow, asking for all kinds of docs, so at that point i was not surprised nor suspicious that it took them that long). I also have to mention, that i didn't have bank statement (one of the documents requested) on hand and it took me some days to get it. Once having the necessary documents, I replied to the email from 18bet and also spoke on livechat with an agent of theirs. I also noticed that my balance is missing and was somewhat worried as i knew that upon the withdrawal being rejected (which had to happen in 48 hours after i received an email from them) the money had to come back to my account. So when I asked the agent where my money was, I was stunned at his response: You (me) supposedly cancelled the withdrawal manually and lost money betting!!!! I quickly checked my bets history and indeed there were 2 losing bets pre match (around 30min before) of 2500 and 1000 staked (WTA tournaments). I obviously have to be completely insane not to remember to place these bets myself and of course cancelling the withdrawal, which is a complete nonsense.

As advised by livechat agent, I wrote an email (06/10/19) to csd@18bet.com explaining my situation. I didn't get a response and wrote another email (18/10/19) asking to provide IP logs. On 20/10/19 I finally received the response (not that I expected anything different):

Dear Ilya,

We are reaching you with an update in regards to your e-mail.

After you reached us the first time on chat, we informed you that we will look into the matter, as in rare occasions it is possible that if you cancel a withdrawal request, a bug may occur and the funds may indeed not go back to your account balance.

However, after we revised your case in further detail, we confirmed that there was no such issue after you cancelled your withdrawal. The funds were returned to your account immediately after you performed this action and afterwards it seems you continued playing in the sport section, which is why we did not previously reply, as after cancelling your withdrawal you chose to continue your gaming session on your own accord.

In conclusion, no issue has been identified, as you have placed your funds on losing bets, after canceling your withdrawal request.

We hope you find this e-mail informative.

Yours,
Daniel N. | Customer Care Team

I also wrote to Paul Fairhead, who offers free advice to people having issues with bookies. Paul told me 18bet doesn't have a UK licence (MGA) and his main area of expertise is predominantly in this market. He did however, refered me to Konrad Kwiatkowski of Green Table Legal, who had considerable experience in pursuing legal cases against firms licenced by MGA. Having spoken to Konrad, he told me the case is going to be v challenging (I quote his words):

- if you are dealing with thieves don't expect they will play fair, they will do whatever they can to keep your money
- there is a problem with evidence - they have everything (logs, etc) and it is you who have to prove your point
- Maltese authorities (MGA) are not very keen to do anything other than rubber-stamp bookmakers point of view


It doesn't mean the situation is hopeless. I think the way to go with it is:
1. ask them (or rather force) to reveal their logs: IP addresses, log in times, time of bet was placed etc.

2. obtain the same from your Internet Provider
3. cross-examine it

I also was encouraged by Konrad to submit a complaint to MGA along with other people affected from this forum. He thinks it may lead MGA actually doing something and the matter being resolved quicker. Tbh I don't really have high hopes from what i read here and how the whole situation looks. It is just sad that something like this can occur in the first place as if we are living in the times of the Wild Wild West.

Sorry to hear this, man.

Hope that you can get some money back.

This scam has affected so many people now.

Its surprising that nothing has happened to 18bet or their staff yet.

[KittiP]

Guys, I still have 1k+ EUR in my account since the last time I checked.

What do you guys think I should do?

If I try to withdraw it, I'm pretty sure that it will go missing like the other 6,600 EUR.

If I leave it, it will disappear into the pockets of 18bet due to inactivity.

[slobib]

Why not ban yourself and make a screenshot of it? Then try to withdraw and let them try to cheat you.

[curry2211]

I'm pretty sure they will withdraw it, they would have stolen it already - for some reason they don't steal all the money. Had similiar experience in the past.

[Ilya Gorbunov]

Sorry to hear this, man.

Hope that you can get some money back.

This scam has affected so many people now.

Its surprising that nothing has happened to 18bet or their staff yet.

Thanks mate! I hired a lawyer from greentablelegal, i am sure it will be v challenging and slow process. I will keep posting updates on this thread. As far as your money left at 18bet, (if u have other accounts at other thrust worthy bookies) I would try to bet both sides on events (2 market), trying to lose money on 18bet and win it at other bookie (ex. Handicaps, overs, or low/high odds). There is some risk to it obviously (like hitting 6-7 wins in a row at 18bet and being limited) but it worked for me in the past. After all u need to be v unlucky going all in on high odds and keep hitting wins. Just make sure u know the bookie sport rule if u bet ML. Also this would only work accepting a small loss resulting from the books margin, unless u can find 100% payout markets. Good luck

[Alfa1234]

Thanks mate! I hired a lawyer from greentablelegal, i am sure it will be v challenging and slow process. I will keep posting updates on this thread. As far as your money left at 18bet, (if u have other accounts at other thrust worthy bookies) I would try to bet both sides on events (2 market), trying to lose money on 18bet and win it at other bookie (ex. Handicaps, overs, or low/high odds). There is some risk to it obviously (like hitting 6-7 wins in a row at 18bet and being limited) but it worked for me in the past. After all u need to be v unlucky going all in on high odds and keep hitting wins. Just make sure u know the bookie sport rule if u bet ML. Also this would only work accepting a small loss resulting from the books margin, unless u can find 100% payout markets. Good luck

Trying to lose money at 1 book and "win" it at another is a recipe for disaster. Think about it for 10seconds. If you are "sure" you can win the money at 1 book, why would you bother "losing" it at the other? You could end up with your entire bankroll at the book you are trying to lose money. It's one of the most stupid things you can. Don't say making the other bet is "insurance", if you can't withdraw it there it's not insurance to have the money at that book.

[Optional]

^^^ agree, be careful.

If you consider the money in 18bet bad, then it is not really an even hedge anyway.

[KittiP]

Why not ban yourself and make a screenshot of it? Then try to withdraw and let them try to cheat you.

This is a brilliant idea. Thanks for that, I think this is the best way forward for those funds, thanks.

[KittiP]

Thanks, but I don't actually know how to, because the email response that I initially got when I submitted the complaint was sent by a non-reply email address.

And when submitted the complaint, I did it though the website, so I'm guessing that if I send another complaint in and reference the old one, it will have its own ticket number and then probably wont get replied to again.

I don't know how I missed their email when I looked.

I sent a follow up email to info@mccaa.org.mt to see if it gets things moving.

[KittiP]

Thanks mate! I hired a lawyer from greentablelegal, i am sure it will be v challenging and slow process. I will keep posting updates on this thread. As far as your money left at 18bet, (if u have other accounts at other thrust worthy bookies) I would try to bet both sides on events (2 market), trying to lose money on 18bet and win it at other bookie (ex. Handicaps, overs, or low/high odds). There is some risk to it obviously (like hitting 6-7 wins in a row at 18bet and being limited) but it worked for me in the past. After all u need to be v unlucky going all in on high odds and keep hitting wins. Just make sure u know the bookie sport rule if u bet ML. Also this would only work accepting a small loss resulting from the books margin, unless u can find 100% payout markets. Good luck

How long ago did you get in contact with greentablelegal?

I think I will use the ADR that @lonnie55 posted (https://adrbypardee.eu/)


I don't think betting against the funds in the 18Bet account is a good idea, because it could just end up getting more money trapped in there, no matter how tempting it is.