These offshore outfits are straight crooks, they want you to lose and go to great lengths to make sure you do. They smile in your face while they find ways to make you give up your cash and then the chance you win they make it as hard as possible to collect with delays and fees. We have a legal option in the US where they WANT YOU TO WIN! They take a percent out of the pools and every dollar you wager means they make more money, obviously the more you win the more likely you are to bet more and thus raise their revenue. You can deposit instantly for FREE from a bank account and take your winnings for FREE back to your account funds often hitting next day! No bounced checks or non english speaking reps. You have wagering options from 7am est-1am est daily every 10 minutes or less. You have FREE video of the races and if you bet a very small amount bottom line per month you have free access to any and all handicapping materials. Also many many sites will give you rebates on your wagers most states being eligible for 3-7% back of what you bet win or lose! There are people who push big money through and break even or even lose a few percent and still make 10's of thousands a year just off rebates. A few even clear a million a year just in rebates obviously they are not the common man and do this with vast hours of computer models and programs etc. The point is there is an option where you are welcomed, treated fairly, receive services and rebates for free win or lose and have unlimited action at your fingertips. Xpressbet, twinspires, horseplayersbet, betamerica and best of all betPTC etc. all great sites which reward players want your biz, want you to win and offer you piece of mind. They all also offer some type of bet $100 get $100 free type offer for new accounts. More people should give the game a try. It takes time to learn and can be intimidating at first but there really is no better gambling game in the world. Everyday you get numerous +300, 500, 1200 betting interests that are SOLID and in a sporting event would be -150 or even money. Most people talk about how hard it is to win at the races and that is because they bet 10 races an hour every hour and they would lose at any gambling venture. Pick your spots learn the game and never worry about your money. If you bet 20k a month in wagers and break even in most states you will still be profiting at least $600 in rebates from the sites. In VA I get stiffed because of source market fees but still get back a few hundred a month in rebates whether I win that month or not. Think about it and give t a try, you really have nothing to lose at most sites because as I said they will match your initial deposit win or lose with no rollover or bs shold or stipulations.
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Topper, it's so nice to have you back posting on a regular basis. I really am so happy that you have finally grown up and are staying out of the clink. You have a beautiful girlfriend and wonderful family that really supports and cares for you. You not only hurt yourself but they also suffer when you are locked up. Please never ever go back inside!המוסד
המוסד למודיעין ולתפקידים מיוחדים
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not a bad point
Horses are tough though because of takeoutsComment -
Thanks fler, I do have a good life and am doing well now. Would not change the past though it makes you stronger and builds character. You learn and see things on the inside you never would otherwise.
JJ very valid point that the takeouts are what makes the game tough as tracks have made them high. The key to lowering them is players making a stand and betting low takeout tracks and wager types. As many may know the new low takeout 50 cent pick 5's around the country are killing it! The more peole who play and push for lower takeouts can bring racing back to its glory days. The rebates also serve to help minimize the takeout to an extent. I love the game and would like to see it flourish and more people get involved. The way I see it is the top players will overcome the takeout and find edges just as in sports an those who lose would lose most places regardless. Not saying give up sports or offshore completely but get to know and experience an adrenaline instant game with thousands of opportunities daily.
You won't get rich but you can grind profits with discipline. Up a few % this month so far and will get a few bucks rebated on top of that.
Amount Wagered:$2,874.50
Refunds:$24.00
Winnings:$2,968.80
Net Profit/(Loss):$118.30Comment -
Horses are a very tough game if you're a degenerate gambler. I don't know anything about professional horse players.Comment -
All gambling for profit takes much research, skill, stat analysis and spot picking. If you are a complete degenerate you will probably get destroyed playing too many combos but at least you get some money back and never have to worry that the one time you actually do "hit big", which in horse racing can be tens of thousands for a few dollar ticket or over 1k for 10 cent superfecta combos, they will not try to weasel out of paying. I play way more spots than I should and acknowledge that but recently have still started turning a small profit and rebate bucks. If I had a bit more discipline I could supplement my income substantially but still have been grinding a few percent out. Honestly the action and puzzle is exciting and challenging and when you cap a complicated race to the T it feels great even before you see the $ flow in. Those looking at it more seriously with large amounts of free time can really make in roads quickly. It is similar to poker in you try to beat your fellow bettor, be smarter and have more info or better perspective than the guy across the table. There is constantly dead or misguided money just sitting there to be taken.Comment -
You can't beat the horses..take it from someone who knows many insiders....unless u know about rigged races or horses that will be stiffed. Your only chance is to bet pick 6 when there is dead money and big carryovers..that is syndicate betters. You have to make up for the 20 plus percentage that is taken out from the track on each pool.Comment -
It is no more likely to beat the books or the casino than it is to beat the ponies. Never said it is easy but it is possible. There are dead money carryovers, dumb money pools, misinformed money pools, early money fool pools. Obviously knowing fixes or the like will elevate you to the next tier but the game is beatable when you specialize your game and play spots. Playing the high take pools definitley puts you at a disadvantage so play 15% take pool where you still can get rebated 2 -3% knocking effective takeout to 12%. Not claiming everyone wins or gets rich but certainly not many here do either or the books would not be in biz. From a security of funds, options for wagering, ability to get down action, legality, and ease of use the game has massive upside. And if you are able to play tight and be wise finding +ev opportunities and make some money all that much better. As previously stated as well with rebates many more people are able to break even or make money even if they lose a few percent day to day, find a way to make a few percent and then get rebated and all the better.Comment -
dude. poker is #1. then sports betting. these are positive expectation.s
horse wagering requires long hours. of study. but maybe. i don't know. i'd rather spend my time at the poker tables and watching sports.
in the end who cares so much about the horses. you can just put ur money on the dodgers in la land on the under. cuz its golden right now.Comment -
craps has its odds. but the house still retains the slightest of edges. but in poker. you call when you got pot odds. + expectation.Comment -
yeah and in honesty i don't know about horses. its seems time consuming. and long shots.
98% of the books in vegas are race and sports books.
their is a single stand alone race book or two.Comment -
Poker is no doubt the "easiest" game to beat long term if you are playing the right game and know what you are doing but it is also a very slow grind out effort. If you are playing live games and doing well congrats and that is good to hear but if you are betting online you still face a very real risk when the DOJ shuts down sites or shadier merchants go out of biz with players funds in their possesion. I rather play a game that is legit and I know the workings of. I can make legal claims to my funds should I win and face any issues etc. The hassle of offshore is minimizing the fun and adventure it used to hold. I still play time to time with sites like betjam for big sporting events to have a good time but I can't bring myself to play a game as rigorous as sports betting just to pray I get paid after a decent score. I rather grind a game that is just as if not more exciting that is constantly available and open for biz where if I turn a 10 cent super bet into $1500 I know that cash will be hitting my bank account in 2 days max, with no chance of funds bouncing, free of charge and no questions asked.Comment -
Horses are extremely slow money, and put more guesswork into the situation than sports such as basketball, football, baseball, hockey, tennis, soccer, or any other 1 team vs 1 team sport. I do agree that the offshore books are getting worse and worse. I am feeling skeptical about posting with even the best of the best these days. Say for instance, I hit BetJamaica or the Greek for 100,000 + sometimes within the next month. I could seriously see them simply saying we are shutting our doors to US customers, refunding my money, if I am lucky, and moving on stating that the recent busts forced them out, and what the phuck can SBR do about it? Nothing
Vegas is not doing good now I hear. I think they will bounce back soon on the strength of some of the offshore big boys bowing out. Who would ever have thought Pinnacle (arguably the best at the time) would bounce?Comment -
Agreed great, really lets face it that most who bet lose anyways most of the time and hit big occasionally, I just don't see the reason for not playing a game that gives back and takes care of it losers and winners alike, a game that will pay 100% no matter what because they are legally required as public companies based on US soil. You can bet as small as a buck up to thousands and know the results of your wager in 2 minutes or so with options going off to bet on all day and night and get funds within 2 days when you want your cash. I am a serious advocate for horse racing in general and for years supported offshore books with high confidence as well but no longer have confidence in the offshore industry. Even the biig boys may not be able to or may choose not to stand against the wave of BS that is hitting these days.Comment -
have been around the site on an off for several years with 9k+ posts and have discussed personal information on numerouse occasions, there are things hiwever that flyer somehow has figured out about me as well that many people I know don't even know though so he clearly is a big timer with inside sources. Most of my served time has been for bad choices to drive after drinking not realizing how little you really have to drink to be over the limit on a more than one occasion however I have done a bit of time for serious charges which were brought and later rightfully reduced in court. The legal system is a tough nut to crack in America, people who should be doing life get off scott free and others do a bit of time for crimes they were not a party to or that hurt noone but themselves. Dealt with it and moved on life is too short to focus on the bull shit. Even in short periods of time you can learn a lot about life from old timers in the clink.Comment -
Top Gamer where do you play horses at??Comment -
Why don't you give out colorful brochures detailing wonderful cliffs to jump off of, you miserable bastard.
Only an evil f*ck or an idiot would try to get people into the ponies.
Can't deduce what you are yet, but if you flash a second month of winnings at the track - an evil f*ck you will be.
"Grind profits".
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I play at ezhorseplay.com right now JJ, it is a whitelabel of ebet technologies which runs different branded faces of ADW's. Being a VA resident they have the best rebate program in place because they are owned by the only in state track (colonial downs) so I can get the most bang for my buck. I do like to play a few tracks they don't offer at ezhorseplay and get in on those at xpressbet or twinspires. If I was not living in Virginia I would be playing at betPTC (players turf club) because they have great service and give huge rebates depending on level of play, track bet, and type of wager you can get 7%+ of every dollar you bet back win or lose in many instances. I miss them as I played there for a short time before they shut out VA residents. A new player on the scene with some serious potential is horseplayersbet as well which also use the ebet tchnologies software but offer higher rebates placed in players accounts daily. They all offer pretty good signup offers and fairly knowledgeable reps.Comment -
The problem with horses is that there are so man state restrictions
NJ we are locked out of everything except njbets and it is whore shit
With solid rebates horses are not a bad playComment -
A degenerate will be a degenerate no matter what game they play if you get slaughtered at the ponies yu will at any gambling venture eventually. There are plenty of people who do well on the horses. It is a far better option than playing a casino a lottery or betting into a book that will take your money and run if you hammer them. What good is having a game you think you can beat in sportsbetting only to have them confiscate your winnings? Where can you find that on a wager, that is a shoe in, getting even money or +250 or +500? Not every race has these opportunities and not every 1-1 is better than a 30-1 or vice versa but often every horse in a race is just as qualified if not more so to take a race at 10-1 than the public choice at 1-1. You get burned occasionally and most people lose until they can learn and get a read just like with any betting but eventually if you fine tune and learn to recognize bad pools you can and will make money. At some small tracks a $500 win wager will make a horse that should be 4-1 1-1 and his biggest opponent who should be 2-1 3.5-1. people can slam horse racing but there is always value to be found for those with a keen eye who give dedication and time to learn and understand the game. I personally have found 1 90-1 shot this year who was my top choice in a race and many 10 or 20-1's that won. tell me where you get that opportunity in sports? You have many things to consider in horses including jockeys, breeding, distance pace numbers, speed numbers, track conditions, pool size and distribution, understanding PP's not just how they did their last few races but why they finished where they did etc. Maybe a horse got killed last time out but its because another horse bumped him or the track was muddy that day or the race was a bit further and today the conditions are better for the horse or his position won't get him bumped and he is going off 4-1 because of his poor last outing which can be thrown out. That is some serious money waiting to be taken by someone smart enough to see the discrepency on current odds and fair odds.Why don't you give out colorful brochures detailing wonderful cliffs to jump off of, you miserable bastard.
Only an evil f*ck or an idiot would try to get people into the ponies.
Can't deduce what you are yet, but if you flash a second month of winnings at the track - an evil f*ck you will be.
"Grind profits".Comment -
The states are extremely greedy and without the regs from place to place the game becomes a lot more attractive and more handle gets pushed through helping everyone, obviously they are shortsighted and just want to make every penny they can now but when the golden goose dries up they will be sorry. The rebates make the game very lucrative when offered at high levels and I may move out of VA at some point in the near future to take full advantage of them again currently I get 2% or under and that has helped to make me sit in the green for the past few months but at 3 times that level I would be doing a lot better.Comment -
AS a NJ resident can I deposit at BetPTC? Do these guys have live feeds from the tracks? TXComment -
Unfortunately as JJ noited the answer is no DS. NJ are pains in the ass like VA is in regards to this, they run their own site 4njbets.com and don't allow other companies to operate in NJ so they can make the most money possilbe. Over half the states are eligible unfortunately several are not including VA and NJ.Comment -
Smart? One of your main selling points on playing the horses is that they will pay you if you win!
I played the horses for years and the smartest guys, and I mean the guys who really knew the game, always had holes in their shoes.
It's one thing to talk horses with other horseplayers - great stuff in fact - but it's a whole 'nuther ballgame to evangelize horse racing to non-players for its inherent value. No smart or honest horseplayer would ever do this.
I've been through the wringer and seen others go through really bad sh*t. Not letting you shuck this bulljive uncontested.Comment -
Honestly most horseplayers are bitter old men and talk and shoot the shit bitching and moaning through the whole process. Just as in sports many claim to be great or understanding of the game but are really just full of it. Not denying that it is hard but to say it can't be done is ridiculous. It takes a lot of time and dedication. Another thing to consider is that most of these old timers are playing a game that has long left them behind, they have not the education nor the understanding of technology to form good information or take full advantage of todays handicapping tools, they also all receive no rebates or very limited ones through on track programs. Most of the guys you are talking about are the old bodies at the track with their PP's and a dream. It has become a sophisticated game with much more transparency and data if you care to do the research. Serious players in any game have a chance when they take advanatge of the full resources. On the other hand I am not just talking to people who plan to make a consistent profit but also rec players who enjoy betting and on the occasion they hit something nice have to be as nervous that they will get paid as they were waiting for their wager to hit, whereas this can be a thing of the past. Also never forget horse racing is PARI-MUTUEL there is enough bad money in many pools that certain people are always making a profit even after the takeout, horse racing has many degenerates who have no clue what they are doing dumping lots of cash into pools (I know I was one of them for years and played at a track full of them for years) and then you have computer layers betting money on several horses knowing long tern with a formula and rebates they will come out on top long term although today they are lacing pools they won't win. With these people constantly pumping money well over the 15-20% takeout there is vast opportunity to pull money out of pools. Horseplayers that say they never win are just degens who have way too much action at their finger tips and when they win give it back or good horseplayers who don't want other smart people getting involved in the game because they will cut into their piece of the pie so they just declare it "unbeatable" yet they continue to play daily for years, kind of odd all the smart horseplayers continue to play when they claim they can't win isn't it? It is just because they can and do win at the very least after rebates and the last thing they want is a huge influx of smart money joining into the game.Comment -
I don't follow this advice to a T or anything and bet more races than I should and minimize my profits but if you can puzzle together handicapping races and then watching pools up to just before post time to see where dead money is coming in there are tons of +ev daily at tracks around the counry and the world at your fingertipsComment -
I never claimed that it was a cake walk or anything along those lines or that many make a living from it (although a small number do just as with sports) simply that it is a fun game, with nonstop action all day if that is your thing or the ability to find edges and make spot plays if you are looking to play more seriously. The site you play with WANTS YOU TO WIN! If it is US based ADW at least. You can negotiate to get money back win or lose on every wager at most sites and never have to worry about not getting paid should you win. Deposits/withdrawals are pretty much always fast and free and they offer good new client perks. All in all it is worth trying the game out not just judging it and listening to the bitter begrudged old degens or wise guys who don't want competition saying it is "unbeatable". You can play all day for $50 bucks with small minimum bets or fire away at the big tracks betting a few K a race. It has something for everyone.Comment -
Horse racing has always been my favorite type of gambling. Still gamble a little, but not nearly as much. Racing's problems. The takeout. 15 to 25% is taken out of every winning ticket, one of the worst percentages in all gambling. Drugs. Trainers with 30% and above winners, and then in the big races where all horses are checked, win under 10%. Clean it up. Small fields. 5 and 6 horse fields, especially in stakes races, doesn't cut it. Foals this year were way down, which makes the future even bleaker. Think it's probably too late to save racing. When politicans figure out that they can still have their casinos without race tracks, good-bye. And you know what? The racing industry has nobody to blame but themselves.Comment -
Who is joining club??Comment -
thanks for your posts, topgame. I have been using BetAmerica for the free
live track video feeds, and some info, but am still wagering with an offshore.
Obviously onshore is taxable, I don't know if that will become a factor for you
or not.
What I really want to say though, is that I'm especially saddened to see greyhound
racing wane in the US. There aren't nearly as many tracks as there used to be. Those animal do-gooders never stop. Florida, West Virginia, Iowa and Arizona are the only states with functioning tracks if I'm not mistaken, there might be one more. (still in Texas ?) But it's dead now in New England, when it used to be real popular and the pools were rather large, back in the day. Indian casinos, video slots/poker all changed that, even though the payouts were much larger in dog racing, most of your average janes and joes are not going to bother reading a program, they would
rather just press the buttons and look at the pretty colors.
For me, greyhound wagering is far superior to horse wagering. I started doing it at age 18 right through my late 30's. Let's consider some facts. In dog racing there are only 8 dogs. In horse racing there are often 10-12 horses. You're automatically at better odds for most races right on that. Sure there are some <8 entry horse races but they are the minority. Another thing is the jockey factor, the stables factor, training, etc. All this is a complicator.
You don't have that with dogs. Another thing I really think is a joke is the harness tracks. They look to me like they can't even pass one another. Tell me that's not at least somewhat rigged, I don't believe it's not. Dog racing has less unknowns. I can read the program, look at what gate the dog likes and a bunch of other indicators and do well. thegreyhoundchannel.com and dayatthetrack.com are two i need
to look into more.Comment -
greyhound racing is dying faster than horse racing...especially when pita gets done banning it like they did in NE...the pools are too small now and who wants to rely on how a dog thinks when is put in the box to race...unfortunately the sports bettors think they know something about the sport their betting on and are dedicated to that to a tee...horse players are a different breed entirely..mostly old which will eventually doom the sport as there not enough replacement people into it...but with patience and discipline you can do ok at it...it's true there are absolutely no worries about being paid...the sports bettors if going good are going to get limited by these offshore books or not paid on time or stonewalled to discourage them or to get them to leave their money in...i've always maintained if you don't withdraw they will treat you like gold...let's face it most lose and redeposit more than they withdraw but the greedy books scowl at withdrawers and find a way to mess with their minds...Comment -
horse, dogs and harness are much better in aussie and UKComment -
it wasn't PETA that made Lincoln now known as Twin River shut down the dogs, it
was the fact that the new owners didn't want to pay the kennels, and the state
gov stopped supporting the dog owners financially, struck a deal with the new venue owners and let them shut down the dogs. It's rather funny to see people say horses
and dogs are losing bets, when they are far better than slots/video games. Studies have been done to this accord. Anyway at least it's not totally dead. Look at
this rather large list of tracks to bet on for this Saturday, for example.
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