zenyatta vs Rachael

**SamsNCharge99** · 06-14-10, 08:47 AM

Zenyatta way better horse

**JUST A MAN** · 06-14-10, 09:18 AM

Zenyatta is one of the greatest horses to walk this planet. Zenyatta is the Queen, Rachel is just a "princess".

I love both horses and there is no comparison.

**DrunkHorseplayer** · 06-14-10, 09:31 AM

RA had a chance to meet Zenyatta in last year's BC and declined; no reason to think that'll change this year.

**str** · 06-14-10, 09:42 AM

Zenyatta was all out?
That is not the race that I saw..
Zenyatta went up to and by the leader inside the 1/8 pole with her ears pricked.
As hard as St. Trinians ran, and she was completely full of run at the 3/16 pole,it might have looked in doubt for a few seconds but it was not.

**SamsNCharge99** · 06-14-10, 09:43 AM

What also sux about these power horses is that there is NO VALUE AT ALL in better them.

1/5 and 1/2 odds, betting $2 win and collect $2.20, 20 cents on the $2 is just awful

**Vegas Jake** · 06-14-10, 09:44 AM

Anyone have the Beyer numbers of their races to maybe help compare a bit.

**BeeMore** · 06-14-10, 09:47 AM

Rachel was 1-9 on saturday in a 5 horse field

No show payout

**str** · 06-14-10, 10:06 AM

Originally posted by Vegas Jake

Anyone have the Beyer numbers of their races to maybe help compare a bit.

PLEASE,do not try to compare Beyer numbers to see who is better.
They are the MOST FLAWED numbers in the racing form.

**Vegas Jake** · 06-14-10, 10:10 AM

Okay but they are something to look at so we have something to compare. Without nothing then how do we compare?

Much better then just saying I think so and so ran better. If used correctly then can get you closer to answering some questions and that is what we are trying to do.

**Chi_archie** · 06-14-10, 10:38 AM

should be good

**jetsjets1028** · 06-14-10, 10:40 AM

zenyatta is better got the modern day record and if you saw yesterdays race where horse was 10 lengths back and STILL got up to win at wire just very impressive

**Vegas Jake** · 06-14-10, 10:40 AM

Would be great for horse racing if they could somehow get these two in the same race before one calls it quits. Looking more and more like that may never happen. The hype would be awesome.

**jetsjets1028** · 06-14-10, 10:41 AM

i would love to see them race vs each other tho

**mikemca** · 06-14-10, 10:52 AM

Originally posted by jetsjets1028

zenyatta is better got the modern day record and if you saw yesterdays race where horse was 10 lengths back and STILL got up to win at wire just very impressive

That is her style she does that every time.

**mikemca** · 06-14-10, 10:53 AM

Where as Rachel is usually the one setting the pace so she just runs away.

**cadillac pete** · 06-14-10, 11:08 AM

Zenyatta had to carry 9 more lbs than the runner up. No horse should be running at that distance w/that much weight to carry.

**mproud1** · 06-14-10, 11:14 AM

Originally posted by Pharieswheel

The weekend has come and gone, Zenyatta was all out to win her field, although she ran against a nice filly. Rachael won off in her race, one needed to keep her top billing. But remember a key difference between the two, Zenyatta is a mature mare, where Rachael was a 3-year-old last year, how good will be she when she's 5 (if she makes it that is)

Horses RARELY regain their top form once they regress(Zenyatta never regressed(17-0). If Rachael is able to(doubtful) then she could compete once again with Zenyatta, but NOT RIGHT NOW

**Brewers in 7** · 06-14-10, 01:47 PM

Rachel was a freak 3 year old, who probably was at her peak at 3, now as other horses mature they have caught up to her a bit. would love to see how shed do in a full field again, would be interesting

**gtkid911** · 06-14-10, 01:54 PM

Zenyatta no doubt. She beat Zardana who beat RA, as well as St. Trinian who is probably the second best mare in the country. 17-17 sorta speaks for itself. And to say Zenyatta was "all out" to get St. Trinian is a bit misleading as St. Trinian got first run into the lane and was carrying less weight that Zenyatta. Also Mike Smith carried Zenyatta out at least two paths further than Martin Garcia did. Zenyatta is a beast and always will be.

**adlai** · 06-14-10, 01:59 PM

bc this year is our only shot at seeing these two head on... i'd have to lay my money on zenyatta, i love to watch that old girl run.

**floridagolfer** · 06-14-10, 02:14 PM

Originally posted by str

Zenyatta was all out?
That is not the race that I saw..
Zenyatta went up to and by the leader inside the 1/8 pole with her ears pricked.
As hard as St. Trinians ran, and she was completely full of run at the 3/16 pole,it might have looked in doubt for a few seconds but it was not.

Then you and I were looking at two different races. Zenyatta was beaten with 100 yards to go and even though I knew the result before I saw the replay, I couldn't believe she made up that half-length or so in the final 50 yards.

**str** · 06-15-10, 04:36 PM

Originally posted by floridagolfer

Then you and I were looking at two different races. Zenyatta was beaten with 100 yards to go and even though I knew the result before I saw the replay, I couldn't believe she made up that half-length or so in the final 50 yards.

The angle of the camera is very deceiving. She was on even terms with 60 yards to go.Not my opinion, the chart callers.
Must say though ,the T.V. camera angle at most tracks always looks funny. Best way to check it out is their feet as they hit the track. Sometimes helps .

**madmaxx** · 06-16-10, 12:36 AM

Originally posted by str

The angle of the camera is very deceiving. She was on even terms with 60 yards to go.Not my opinion, the chart callers.
Must say though ,the T.V. camera angle at most tracks always looks funny. Best way to check it out is their feet as they hit the track. Sometimes helps .

This is especially true in quarter horse races where the angle makes it seem like a horse is pretty far behind but the announcer has him on even terms/ahead the whole way.

**wtt0315** · 06-16-10, 05:48 AM

i love both horses they have been great for the sport

**Richkas** · 06-16-10, 07:26 AM

St. Trinians lost a shoe in the race. She dont lose a shoe and Zenyatta runs 2nd. That being said, Zenyatta I think would beat Rachael. And if neither horse gets injured, they should face each other in this years BC.

**blg123** · 06-16-10, 08:06 AM

There is 1 single difference between Zenyatta and Rachel... You can just see and tell Zenyatta KNOWS where the finish line is! Her ears perk up and she comes 100 mph those horses she passes every freaking race are not walking they are sprinting.... just coming 80/90 mph. I wasn't a believer last year but Breeders Cup and this year I am convinced enough forget this poly and dirt crap if she has a target and pace to shoot at it's over she will find a way.

The only way this mare will EVER get beat is if they walk a 49 or 50 half for a 1 1/4 or 1 1/8 on a dirt track that is speed favoring and the leader opens 5-7 lengths that specific day. That's the only way. She will inhale whoever as long as she has a target to shoot at. It's called heart some horses have a huge one others just don't care. Personal Ensign is another HUGE heart for mare/filly! Those are the only 2 I can think of.

**blg123** · 06-16-10, 08:08 AM

Actually Go For Wand would be another until she tragically passed away!

**3PtShooter** · 06-16-10, 08:33 AM

Zenyatta was giving up 9 to 17 pounds !!

**mikemca** · 06-16-10, 09:59 AM

Originally posted by 3PtShooter

Zenyatta was giving up 9 to 17 pounds !!

Rachel was giving up 8 lbs to the runner up.Lighthouse was giving up 7 to 16 pounds also last Saturday.Why is everyone making this into a big deal every top tier horse gives up a lot of weight.Especially when they choose races that are cakewalks.

**BarkingToad** · 06-18-10, 05:47 AM

Originally posted by blg123

There is 1 single difference between Zenyatta and Rachel... You can just see and tell Zenyatta KNOWS where the finish line is! Her ears perk up and she comes 100 mph those horses she passes every freaking race are not walking they are sprinting.... just coming 80/90 mph. I wasn't a believer last year but Breeders Cup and this year I am convinced enough forget this poly and dirt crap if she has a target and pace to shoot at it's over she will find a way.

The only way this mare will EVER get beat is if they walk a 49 or 50 half for a 1 1/4 or 1 1/8 on a dirt track that is speed favoring and the leader opens 5-7 lengths that specific day. That's the only way. She will inhale whoever as long as she has a target to shoot at. It's called heart some horses have a huge one others just don't care. Personal Ensign is another HUGE heart for mare/filly! Those are the only 2 I can think of.

Sharp post, well said. As huge as Zenyatta is, her heart is the biggest thing on her.

**BarkingToad** · 06-18-10, 05:51 AM

Originally posted by mikemca

Rachel was giving up 8 lbs to the runner up.Lighthouse was giving up 7 to 16 pounds also last Saturday.Why is everyone making this into a big deal every top tier horse gives up a lot of weight.Especially when they choose races that are cakewalks.

How many horses have carried 129 lbs the past 10 years? I wouldn't call St Trinians a cakewalk.

**DennisT** · 06-18-10, 11:10 AM

These two will meet Cup Day at Churchill! Win or lose this will be a race for the ages!

**mikemca** · 06-18-10, 02:11 PM

Originally posted by BarkingToad

How many horses have carried 129 lbs the past 10 years? I wouldn't call St Trinians a cakewalk.

Monday at Philadelphia Park 2 horses carried 133 lbs .She is probably the best horse out there ,male or female, so putting her in any race that is just fillies is a cakewalk IMO.Leaving everyone to embellish how she gave up 10 pounds and St Trinians was so good and she ran around the gate twice on two legs before starting .I don't think the owners care as much about being known as the best as you guys do or else they would put her against the toughest colts everytime.

**BarkingToad** · 06-18-10, 08:03 PM

Originally posted by mikemca

Monday at Philadelphia Park 2 horses carried 133 lbs .She is probably the best horse out there ,male or female, so putting her in any race that is just fillies is a cakewalk IMO.Leaving everyone to embellish how she gave up 10 pounds and St Trinians was so good and she ran around the gate twice on two legs before starting .I don't think the owners care as much about being known as the best as you guys do or else they would put her against the toughest colts everytime.

While you're the 1st ardent Rachel supporter to at least make a bit of a case, I'm talking about horses carrying high weights in Stakes dirt races. Not some 4 year old trying to break her maiden at some low level track where all the other maidens carried 128, or steeplechase. If weight doesn't matter, then why don't they all carry the same amount? The Woodward may have had a different outcome last year if Macho Again could shed 8 lbs that race.

I think the owners do care, why else would Big Z come out of retirement, and all her races are Grade 1. They're not going to change their schedule to prove something to the haters. The best girls are probably better than the boys, anyway. St Trinians could probably beat most of the boys. In another thread you were saying how good Macho Again, Bullsbay, and Da Tara are. You don't think St trinians can run with them, a la Cocoa Beach who beat the boys in Japan a couple of years ago? I bet St Trinians Breeders Cup results will be better then the previous mentioned boys were or will be.