maiden special weight @ large tracks for all ages through end of belmont

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  • JBEX
    SBR Posting Legend
    • 01-02-12
    • 23400

    #1
    maiden special weight @ large tracks for all ages through end of belmont
    this will coincide time-wise with the last race thread but want it separate so it's less cluttered

    won't be graded


    the idea was to have a few other races to handicap besides the final races..if you're doing too many defeats purpose of the other thread which is to focus
    on those particular races..not that the focus has done me any good
  • Pigpen
    SBR MVP
    • 05-09-08
    • 2750

    #2
    Originally posted by JBEX
    this will coincide time-wise with the last race thread but want it separate so it's less cluttered

    won't be graded


    the idea was to have a few other races to handicap besides the final races..if you're doing too many defeats purpose of the other thread which is to focus
    on those particular races..not that the focus has done me any good
    Good stuff JBEX, I enjoy reading your thoughts on the pedigree side of the puzzle. Maybe catch a young dam with only a few progeny. On that note and this can be very subjective, what is the most influential sire the industry has ever produced?
    Comment
    • Pigpen
      SBR MVP
      • 05-09-08
      • 2750

      #3
      I'm going to guess and say Northern Dancer and Storm Cat may pop up.
      Comment
      • BOA12
        SBR Posting Legend
        • 02-19-12
        • 20622

        #4
        Originally posted by JBEX
        this will coincide time-wise with the last race thread but want it separate so it's less cluttered

        won't be graded


        the idea was to have a few other races to handicap besides the final races..if you're doing too many defeats purpose of the other thread which is to focus
        on those particular races..not that the focus has done me any good
        This is an example that even a disciplined man like J can exploit his own weaknesses & is able to stop the madness. What chance do the rest of US have ?. You are one of SBR Finest, should be your ignore handle.
        Last edited by BOA12; 05-22-22, 10:06 AM. Reason: US
        Comment
        • JBEX
          SBR Posting Legend
          • 01-02-12
          • 23400

          #5
          Originally posted by Pigpen
          I'm going to guess and say Northern Dancer and Storm Cat may pop up.
          northern dancer for sure..the influence he's had not only over here in the states but in Europe is hard to comprehend..actually Europe is more powerful than here..(more turf)

          storm cat was a grandson and probably the best in line over here..giant's causeway an elite sire was a son of storm cat..last crop races this year as 3yo's danzig early 80's to well into the 90's probably #2

          both storm cat and danzig sires of sires of sires etc

          one other off the top deputy minister (grandson)


          by far these are the best lines here



          Europe (talking nd) is just too much to talk about but the best one over there was this line.. sadlers well/galileo/frankel ..these are some of the greatest sires of all time each a son of the other..there's another big name in there I'm forgetting and if I think of it I'll mention it..son of sw or gal


          these are some of the more prominent of his lineage



          others over here (deceased)

          mr prospector
          (not as great with him off top of my head)

          seattle slew (a p indy his son) and tremendous sire line going forward ..tapit (grandson apindy being the best)

          secretariat wasn't a superstar sire but he's the dam sire of storm cat and a p indy which is pretty amazing..was known more for his daughters being big producers and possibly runners


          those are the ones that come to me off the top of my head as some of the best



          .
          Last edited by JBEX; 05-22-22, 09:51 AM.
          Comment
          • JBEX
            SBR Posting Legend
            • 01-02-12
            • 23400

            #6
            Originally posted by BOA12
            This is an example that even a disciplined man like J can exploit his own weaknesses & is able to stop the madness. What chance do the rest of have ?. You are one of SBR Finest, should be your ignore handle.
            Comment
            • JBEX
              SBR Posting Legend
              • 01-02-12
              • 23400

              #7
              Originally posted by JBEX
              northern dancer for sure..the influence he's had not only over here in the states but in Europe is hard to comprehend..actually Europe is more powerful than here..(more turf)

              storm cat was a grandson and probably the best in line over here..giant's causeway an elite sire was a son of storm cat..last crop races this year as 3yo's danzig early 80's to well into the 90's probably #2

              both storm cat and danzig sires of sires of sires etc

              one other off the top deputy minister (grandson)


              by far these are the best lines here



              Europe (talking nd) is just too much to talk about but the best one over there was this line.. sadlers well/galileo/frankel ..these are some of the greatest sires of all time each a son of the other..there's another big name in there I'm forgetting and if I think of it I'll mention it..son of sw or gal


              these are some of the more prominent of his lineage



              others over here (deceased)

              mr prospector
              (not as great with him off top of my head)

              seattle slew (a p indy his son) and tremendous sire line going forward ..tapit (grandson apindy being the best)

              secretariat wasn't a superstar sire but he's the dam sire of storm cat and a p indy which is pretty amazing..was known more for his daughters being big producers and possibly runners


              those are the ones that come to me off the top of my head as some of the best



              .
              another important one to mention ..into mischief the most expensive stallion in the USA $250k is a great grandson of storm cat
              Comment
              • JBEX
                SBR Posting Legend
                • 01-02-12
                • 23400

                #8
                mth

                R3 #6 splendid summer (16-1 @ 20 mtp)
                Comment
                • Pigpen
                  SBR MVP
                  • 05-09-08
                  • 2750

                  #9
                  Originally posted by JBEX
                  northern dancer for sure..the influence he's had not only over here in the states but in Europe is hard to comprehend..actually Europe is more powerful than here..(more turf)

                  storm cat was a grandson and probably the best in line over here..giant's causeway an elite sire was a son of storm cat..last crop races this year as 3yo's danzig early 80's to well into the 90's probably #2

                  both storm cat and danzig sires of sires of sires etc

                  one other off the top deputy minister (grandson)


                  by far these are the best lines here



                  Europe (talking nd) is just too much to talk about but the best one over there was this line.. sadlers well/galileo/frankel ..these are some of the greatest sires of all time each a son of the other..there's another big name in there I'm forgetting and if I think of it I'll mention it..son of sw or gal


                  these are some of the more prominent of his lineage



                  others over here (deceased)

                  mr prospector
                  (not as great with him off top of my head)

                  seattle slew (a p indy his son) and tremendous sire line going forward ..tapit (grandson apindy being the best)

                  secretariat wasn't a superstar sire but he's the dam sire of storm cat and a p indy which is pretty amazing..was known more for his daughters being big producers and possibly runners


                  those are the ones that come to me off the top of my head as some of the best



                  .
                  Thanks J, one last question and I will leave you alone for a while. How does Bold Ruler stack up?
                  Comment
                  • JBEX
                    SBR Posting Legend
                    • 01-02-12
                    • 23400

                    #10
                    Originally posted by Pigpen
                    Thanks J, one last question and I will leave you alone for a while. How does Bold Ruler stack up?
                    Don't mind at all pigpen but it is a lot to cover in a few posts lol..The ones i gave i would call the dominant lines with nd crossing over to europe the most..There are so many other directions northern dancer goes but the sw/gal/frankel is the top one




                    in general bold ruler was one of the great stallions of the 60's and admittedly i know almost none of the specifics..below is just scratching the surface but without question is the most important thing about his bloodlines going forward

                    he's the sire of secretariat with his last crop in 1970

                    he's the great grandsire of seattle slew which of course gets you to a p indy (his most prominent carry forward line)

                    so bold ruler is part of the paternal and maternal lines of a p indy's pedigree

                    through seattle slew on top and secretariat (dam sire) on the
                    bottom..in other words a p indy's dam is by secretariat
                    Comment
                    • JBEX
                      SBR Posting Legend
                      • 01-02-12
                      • 23400

                      #11
                      thought this was worth highlighting as it's a very important point




                      I'm not great with terminologies but storm cat (1983) and a p indy (1989) are probably the most recent mega influences on us pedigrees that there are..both of there dams are by secretariat with the former being a paternal grandson of northern dancer and the latter a paternal great great grandson of bold ruler (through seattle slew)

                      (foal year)







                      .
                      Last edited by JBEX; 05-23-22, 06:08 AM.
                      Comment
                      • Pigpen
                        SBR MVP
                        • 05-09-08
                        • 2750

                        #12
                        Good stuff, thanks man!!!
                        Comment
                        • JBEX
                          SBR Posting Legend
                          • 01-02-12
                          • 23400

                          #13
                          Originally posted by Pigpen
                          Good stuff, thanks man!!!
                          no problem pigpen
                          Comment
                          • JBEX
                            SBR Posting Legend
                            • 01-02-12
                            • 23400

                            #14
                            Originally posted by JBEX
                            northern dancer for sure..the influence he's had not only over here in the states but in Europe is hard to comprehend..actually Europe is more powerful than here..(more turf)

                            storm cat was a grandson and probably the best in line over here..giant's causeway an elite sire was a son of storm cat..last crop races this year as 3yo's danzig early 80's to well into the 90's probably #2

                            both storm cat and danzig sires of sires of sires etc

                            one other off the top deputy minister (grandson)


                            by far these are the best lines here



                            Europe (talking nd) is just too much to talk about but the best one over there was this line.. sadlers well/galileo/frankel ..these are some of the greatest sires of all time each a son of the other..there's another big name in there I'm forgetting and if I think of it I'll mention it..son of sw or gal


                            these are some of the more prominent of his lineage



                            others over here (deceased)

                            mr prospector
                            (not as great with him off top of my head)

                            seattle slew (a p indy his son) and tremendous sire line going forward ..tapit (grandson apindy being the best)

                            secretariat wasn't a superstar sire but he's the dam sire of storm cat and a p indy which is pretty amazing..was known more for his daughters being big producers and possibly runners


                            those are the ones that come to me off the top of my head as some of the best



                            .

                            I feel guilty not expanding on mr prospector more as he was truly an exceptional sire and imo off the top of my head in the neighborhood of northern dancer in importance to the breed..will try to give a few examples in boldface over the next few days



                            .
                            Comment
                            • JBEX
                              SBR Posting Legend
                              • 01-02-12
                              • 23400

                              #15
                              connections of major bloodlines to today's top (most expensive) us based stallions

                              Originally posted by JBEX
                              northern dancer for sure..the influence he's had not only over here in the states but in Europe is hard to comprehend..actually Europe is more powerful than here..(more turf)

                              storm cat was a grandson and probably the best in line over here..giant's causeway an elite sire was a son of storm cat..last crop races this year as 3yo's danzig early 80's to well into the 90's probably #2

                              both storm cat and danzig sires of sires of sires etc

                              one other off the top deputy minister (grandson)


                              by far these are the best lines here



                              Europe (talking nd) is just too much to talk about but the best one over there was this line.. sadlers well/galileo/frankel ..these are some of the greatest sires of all time each a son of the other..there's another big name in there I'm forgetting and if I think of it I'll mention it..son of sw or gal


                              these are some of the more prominent of his lineage



                              others over here (deceased)

                              mr prospector
                              (not as great with him off top of my head)

                              seattle slew (a p indy his son) and tremendous sire line going forward ..tapit (grandson apindy being the best)

                              secretariat wasn't a superstar sire but he's the dam sire of storm cat and a p indy which is pretty amazing..was known more for his daughters being big producers and possibly runners


                              those are the ones that come to me off the top of my head as some of the best



                              .


                              danzig and giants causeway (by storm cat) are northern dancer line stallions (nd)


                              mr prospector (mr p)






                              into mischief

                              most expensive us stallion @ $250k

                              grandsire storm cat




                              tapit

                              sire pulpit by a p indy and out of a (mr p) mare

                              dam sire's grand sire (mr p)

                              so (mr p) in male and female family





                              curlin

                              grandsire (mr p)





                              medaglia d'oro

                              grandsire sadlers well (nd)





                              uncle mo

                              dam sire's dam sire danzig (nd)

                              also has some other interesting
                              bloodlines on the bottom..if i was going to go another level of importance 2 influences are found in his female family





                              quality road


                              great grandsire (mr p)
                              great grandsire dam sire secretariat




                              war front

                              sire danzig (nd)
                              dam's great grandsire (mr p)




                              speightstown

                              grandsire (mr p)
                              grandsire damsire secretariat





                              gun runner

                              ggg grandsire (mr p)

                              dam giants causeway (storm cat)

                              2nd dam's paternal great grandsire (mr p)





                              so you have to go back 5 generations paternal and maternal to get to (mr p)







                              .
                              Last edited by JBEX; 05-26-22, 05:53 AM.
                              Comment
                              • JBEX
                                SBR Posting Legend
                                • 01-02-12
                                • 23400

                                #16
                                Originally posted by JBEX
                                thought this was worth highlighting as it's a very important point




                                I'm not great with terminologies but storm cat (1983) and a p indy (1989) are probably the most recent mega influences on us pedigrees that there are..both of there dams are by secretariat with the former being a paternal grandson of northern dancer and the latter a paternal great great grandson of bold ruler (through seattle slew)

                                (foal year)







                                .
                                wanted this right below the above post
                                Last edited by JBEX; 05-26-22, 05:49 AM.
                                Comment
                                • BOA12
                                  SBR Posting Legend
                                  • 02-19-12
                                  • 20622

                                  #17
                                  Originally posted by JBEX
                                  wanted this right below the above post
                                  The four I use to follow are Pleasant Colony, A P Indy, Storm Cat and Mr Prospector. I still look for these at the cheaper tracks mostly.
                                  Comment
                                  • JBEX
                                    SBR Posting Legend
                                    • 01-02-12
                                    • 23400

                                    #18
                                    Originally posted by BOA12
                                    The four I use to follow are Pleasant Colony, A P Indy, Storm Cat and Mr Prospector. I still look for these at the cheaper tracks mostly.
                                    pleasant colony was a solid sire but not a superstar like the other 3..I don't think he was a sire of sires though..my guess is he probably had a few minor ones many years ago
                                    Comment
                                    • JBEX
                                      SBR Posting Legend
                                      • 01-02-12
                                      • 23400

                                      #19
                                      Originally posted by JBEX
                                      pleasant colony was a solid sire but not a superstar like the other 3..I don't think he was a sire of sires though..my guess is he probably had a few minor ones many years ago
                                      my bad as he sired quite a few who were decent sires








                                      .
                                      Comment
                                      • BOA12
                                        SBR Posting Legend
                                        • 02-19-12
                                        • 20622

                                        #20
                                        Originally posted by JBEX
                                        Thanks for the link.
                                        Comment
                                        • JBEX
                                          SBR Posting Legend
                                          • 01-02-12
                                          • 23400

                                          #21
                                          belmont


                                          R4 #1 biondi (4-1)
                                          Comment
                                          • JBEX
                                            SBR Posting Legend
                                            • 01-02-12
                                            • 23400

                                            #22
                                            belmont

                                            R1 #2 andiamo a firenze (9-5)

                                            homebred fts with an excellent pedigree and trainer who offers value with debuters..that being said I think he'll be around even money..serious worktab




                                            churchill


                                            R2 #7 wonder wheel (4-1)

                                            fts by #1 sire into mischief and dam sire a speed influence..another serious work tab


                                            R3 #1 mindful (15-1)

                                            another fts ..cost a lot,trainer very undervalued first out and overall,steady tab back to march and not impressed with the line-up overall her



                                            laurel


                                            R1 #2 general j r (4-1)


                                            guess what this one is (also,lol)..speed pedigree top, bottom and this trainer really kicks ass with debuters
                                            ..works hint there's some talent


                                            .
                                            Last edited by JBEX; 06-03-22, 09:07 AM.
                                            Comment
                                            • JBEX
                                              SBR Posting Legend
                                              • 01-02-12
                                              • 23400

                                              #23
                                              added cd 2 3 and laurel 1
                                              Comment
                                              • BOA12
                                                SBR Posting Legend
                                                • 02-19-12
                                                • 20622

                                                #24
                                                Originally posted by JBEX
                                                belmont

                                                R1 #2 andiamo a firenze (9-5)

                                                homebred fts with an excellent pedigree and trainer who offers value with debuters..that being said I think he'll be around even money..serious worktab




                                                churchill


                                                R2 #7 wonder wheel (4-1)

                                                fts by #1 sire into mischief and dam sire a speed influence..another serious work tab


                                                R3 #1 mindful (15-1)

                                                another fts ..cost a lot,trainer very undervalued first out and overall,steady tab back to march and not impressed with the line-up overall her



                                                laurel


                                                R1 #2 general j r (4-1)


                                                guess what this one is (also,lol)..speed pedigree top, bottom and this trainer really kicks ass with debuters
                                                ..works hint there's some talent


                                                .
                                                Jumped on BEL R1 #2. BOL J. CD R4 #7 Wonder Wheel. CD R3 Scratch #1 and 1A.
                                                Last edited by BOA12; 06-03-22, 11:43 AM.
                                                Comment
                                                • JBEX
                                                  SBR Posting Legend
                                                  • 01-02-12
                                                  • 23400

                                                  #25
                                                  Originally posted by BOA12
                                                  Jumped on BEL R1 #2. BOL J. CD R4 #7 Wonder Wheel. CD R3 Scratch #1 and 1A.

                                                  thanks b o a
                                                  Comment
                                                  • BOA12
                                                    SBR Posting Legend
                                                    • 02-19-12
                                                    • 20622

                                                    #26
                                                    Originally posted by JBEX
                                                    thanks b o a
                                                    Jumped on all your plays 2day. Best Of All 2B W/U then against U. Thanks J. A beautiful sun filled day, never a better time 2play.
                                                    Comment
                                                    • BOA12
                                                      SBR Posting Legend
                                                      • 02-19-12
                                                      • 20622

                                                      #27
                                                      Originally posted by BOA12
                                                      Jumped on all your plays 2day. Best Of All 2B W/U then against U. Thanks J. A beautiful sun filled day, never a better time 2play.
                                                      So far a self fulfilling prophecy for US WP players J.
                                                      Comment
                                                      • JBEX
                                                        SBR Posting Legend
                                                        • 01-02-12
                                                        • 23400

                                                        #28
                                                        Originally posted by BOA12
                                                        Jumped on all your plays 2day. Best Of All 2B W/U then against U. Thanks J. A beautiful sun filled day, never a better time 2play.
                                                        Originally posted by BOA12
                                                        So far a self fulfilling prophecy for US WP players J.
                                                        glad you had them b o a winners were short prices and laurel got 2nd @ 5-1 for those who don't know
                                                        Comment
                                                        • Easy-Rider 66
                                                          BARRELED IN @ SBR!
                                                          • 02-14-12
                                                          • 36098

                                                          #29
                                                          Originally posted by JBEX
                                                          glad you had them b o a winners were short prices and laurel got 2nd @ 5-1 for those who don't know
                                                          Comment
                                                          • BOA12
                                                            SBR Posting Legend
                                                            • 02-19-12
                                                            • 20622

                                                            #30
                                                            Originally posted by JBEX
                                                            glad you had them b o a winners were short prices and laurel got 2nd @ 5-1 for those who don't know
                                                            I'm in the know. Keep 'em coming J.... a good day for those who play.
                                                            Comment
                                                            • JBEX
                                                              SBR Posting Legend
                                                              • 01-02-12
                                                              • 23400

                                                              #31
                                                              belmont


                                                              R4 #7 don't overlook me (6-1)
                                                              R5 58 ex box

                                                              5 - rivka (5-2) 8- ranting (4-1)

                                                              guessing it would be high teens /low 20's ex for $2




                                                              churchill


                                                              R6 #5 polyglot (3-1)




                                                              .
                                                              Last edited by JBEX; 06-05-22, 11:30 AM.
                                                              Comment
                                                              • JBEX
                                                                SBR Posting Legend
                                                                • 01-02-12
                                                                • 23400

                                                                #32
                                                                added churchill 6
                                                                Comment
                                                                • BOA12
                                                                  SBR Posting Legend
                                                                  • 02-19-12
                                                                  • 20622

                                                                  #33
                                                                  Originally posted by JBEX
                                                                  belmont


                                                                  R4 #7 don't overlook me (6-1)
                                                                  R5 58 ex box

                                                                  5 - rivka (5-2) 8- ranting (4-1)

                                                                  guessing it would be high teens /low 20's ex for $2




                                                                  churchill


                                                                  R6 #5 polyglot (3-1)




                                                                  .
                                                                  Riding with you on these plays J. BOL to US.
                                                                  Comment
                                                                  • JBEX
                                                                    SBR Posting Legend
                                                                    • 01-02-12
                                                                    • 23400

                                                                    #34
                                                                    Originally posted by BOA12
                                                                    Riding with you on these plays J. BOL to US.
                                                                    bol b o a
                                                                    Comment
                                                                    • JBEX
                                                                      SBR Posting Legend
                                                                      • 01-02-12
                                                                      • 23400

                                                                      #35
                                                                      cd r7 #1 york tavern(12-1)

                                                                      first time starter

                                                                      was looking at the pp's of this one at about a half hour to post (now about 17 mins)..hadn't looked at odds and when I did was 4-1 (12-1 ml)..like pedigree,works,trainer good meet and good value 1st out
                                                                      Comment
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