sportsbook ratings drop

[bozeman]

so what is up with all sbr ratings drop from a to c all of a sudden? did sportsbooks just pull out funding from SBR? Or what is the matter?

[agon]

None of them deserves an A.Unless they offer juice free markets.

[bozeman]

lol charity business eh? actually very disappointed canada closed betfair and other exchanges.

but really what happened is SBR dying off and books sick of complaints? Was covid too much of a hit to the industry?

[PD77]

It all started when Tony got knocked off. Once 5Dimes finally pulled out it was game over.

[bozeman]

kidding right?

[agon]

lol charity business eh? actually very disappointed canada closed betfair and other exchanges.

but really what happened is SBR dying off and books sick of complaints? Was covid too much of a hit to the industry?

Well you still can get on betfair through agents.
Piwi247.AC has exchange too.Also betinasia.and some others agents.

[jjgold]

They will all be re done

[HedgeHog]

lol charity business eh? actually very disappointed canada closed betfair and other exchanges.

but really what happened is SBR dying off and books sick of complaints? Was covid too much of a hit to the industry?

How the hell would covid adversely affect offshore gambling? If anything just the opposite. Online gambling should increase when people are spending more time at home.

[HedgeHog]

so what is up with all sbr ratings drop from a to c all of a sudden? did sportsbooks just pull out funding from SBR? Or what is the matter?

You answered your own question. An A+ Book at SBR was basically an actual B (or worse) Book that committed to paying a monthly fee to this site. The fact that there are no A Books at this site means that they no longer have sponsors buying the increased rating.

[DontTailMe]

How the hell would covid adversely affect offshore gambling? If anything just the opposite. Online gambling should increase when people are spending more time at home.

Well, there was the 3-4 month sports outage. That couldn't have helped, especially some of the smaller books. Honestly, a few of the books haven't been the same since. You see examples of them tightening their belts all over.

[BigJay]

“It’s alright. This kind of thing’s gotta happen every five years or so - 10 years. Gets rid of the bad blood. Been 10 years since the last one,” Clemenza, The Godfather

[Optional]

so what is up with all sbr ratings drop from a to c all of a sudden? did sportsbooks just pull out funding from SBR? Or what is the matter?

Every book rating is being re-evaluated using a set subjective standard.

It will take some weeks, at least, until they are all re-evaluated.

lol charity business eh? actually very disappointed canada closed betfair and other exchanges.

but really what happened is SBR dying off and books sick of complaints? Was covid too much of a hit to the industry?

You'll find a thread called "SBR Announcement" in Players Talk forum. It explains the change in ownership and future plans.

[jjgold]

USA books all B+ or A

Really all the same

[juicername]

None of them deserves an A.Unless they offer juice free markets.

More like none of them deserves an A until they pay for it.

[thomorino]

There's no point in evaluating books that are legal, they've already been evaluated by regulators. Evaluating the books format and bonus structure might have some value, but the traditional review process for legal books is worthless.

[Optional]

There's no point in evaluating books that are legal, they've already been evaluated by regulators. Evaluating the books format and bonus structure might have some value, but the traditional review process for legal books is worthless.

LOL at regulators evaluating books. They do not even "evaluate" their terms let alone their performance.

And as a lawyer you should be able to guess why first go.

We'll make the effort for all those that don't already know it all like your fine self. And I'd wager you are surprised how useful it is once done.

[thomorino]

LOL at regulators evaluating books. They do not even "evaluate" their terms let alone their performance.

And as a lawyer you should be able to guess why first go.

We'll make the effort for all those that don't already know it all like your fine self. And I'd wager you are surprised how useful it is once done.

I think it would be worthwhile to evaluate the difference between legal books bonuses and format.

I'm not saying reviewing legal books has no value, I'm saying that all legal books obviously will pay and not scam you, so the traditional review process SBR has used with offshore books has no value here.

There is a big difference between the promotions and bonuses that the books offer, a good examples of this is comparing betmgm, fanduel, and draftkings.

Fanduel is the only book that offer a full cash return as part of their risk free bet bonus program, all other books offer only a freebet. The rollover requirements for betmgm's casino bonuses are far worse than for fanduel and draftkings too.

I'm simply saying that if the book is legal they will pay you, you don't have to worry about being scammed, as was of course often an issue offshore. Obviously there is a huge difference between legal books and reviewing the quality of the books would I think have a lot of value to many bettors, in particular novice or recreational bettors.

[Optional]

The new USA licensed books will play nice for a while. And hopefully better than older UK, Malta, Curacao etc jurisdictions do forever.

But the majority of really frustrating disputes come against regulated books who use their license conditions and laws to justify not paying with no consideration for fairness in that instance.

I know many will think I am just biased after having worked with offshore for so long, but the big names are definitely less risk for a big bettors money than mainstream regulated outfits.


if I was a 100k+ balance holder sort of bettor. I would feel much more comfortable having that money in the hands of Bookmaker than Bet365 or Betfair or Kambi or William Hill or [insert any big name book]

[thomorino]

The issue with legal books will be lines, not if they will pay you.

Offshore does have a better cost structure since they aren't paying 40% taxes to the government as is the case in Pennsylvania.

The big question is if legal books can survive offering standard vig and paying the higher taxes which obviously gives them lower margins than most offshore players.

The legal books will pay, draftkings alone could easily buy out every offshore book combined, they are in over 30 billion dollar company.

[Optional]

The issue with legal books will be lines, not if they will pay you.

Offshore does have a better cost structure since they aren't paying 40% taxes to the government as is the case in Pennsylvania.

The big question is if legal books can survive offering standard vig and paying the higher taxes which obviously gives them lower margins than most offshore players.

The legal books will pay, draftkings alone could easily buy out every offshore book combined, they are in over 30 billion dollar company.

Just wait until you hear about the first time Draftkings asks your local bookie or drug dealer for SoF or SoW proof and see if they pay.

Right now they are not following the guidelines even 10% as strictly as UK does.

[thomorino]

Just wait until you hear about the first time Draftkings asks your local bookie or drug dealer for SoF or SoW proof and see if they pay.

Right now they are not following the guidelines even 10% as strictly as UK does.

Draftkings has been around for many years, first as a player in the fantasy business, now as a sportsbook. I don't know of a single complaint of a major US sportsbook not paying. Not 1.

[Optional]

I hope it stays that way.

I just doubt it will as it hasn't anywhere else and US books agree to the same AML and Responsible Gambling guidelines as those books.

[Vyasports]

There's no point in evaluating books that are legal, they've already been evaluated by regulators. Evaluating the books format and bonus structure might have some value, but the traditional review process for legal books is worthless.

I think it would be worthwhile to evaluate the difference between legal books bonuses and format.

I'm not saying reviewing legal books has no value, I'm saying that all legal books obviously will pay and not scam you, so the traditional review process SBR has used with offshore books has no value here.

There is a big difference between the promotions and bonuses that the books offer, a good examples of this is comparing betmgm, fanduel, and draftkings.

Fanduel is the only book that offer a full cash return as part of their risk free bet bonus program, all other books offer only a freebet. The rollover requirements for betmgm's casino bonuses are far worse than for fanduel and draftkings too.

I'm simply saying that if the book is legal they will pay you, you don't have to worry about being scammed, as was of course often an issue offshore. Obviously there is a huge difference between legal books and reviewing the quality of the books would I think have a lot of value to many bettors, in particular novice or recreational bettors.

The issue with legal books will be lines, not if they will pay you.

Offshore does have a better cost structure since they aren't paying 40% taxes to the government as is the case in Pennsylvania.

The big question is if legal books can survive offering standard vig and paying the higher taxes which obviously gives them lower margins than most offshore players.

The legal books will pay, draftkings alone could easily buy out every offshore book combined, they are in over 30 billion dollar company.

Draftkings has been around for many years, first as a player in the fantasy business, now as a sportsbook. I don't know of a single complaint of a major US sportsbook not paying. Not 1.

100% correct. Good posts.

[Optional]

100% correct. Good posts.

If 100% correct why don't YOU try to back yourself up and make a point of your own?



He's not close to 100% correct.

He is VERY naive to think regulation is anything to do with player protection, at all.

And it's nothing to do with evaluating terms or basic fairness of those terms either. Regulators do not approve terms, or even read terms before letting a book pay them to oversee them.


Over time posters here will find they are "stiffed" by regulated books FAR more often than they ever have been by the A rated offshore books.

it will not even be a close comparison in 10 years time.

You will talk about the good old days when you could easily access low vig and fair minded bookmakers who did not require a DNA test and copy of your tax return to get paid.

[thomorino]

If 100% correct why don't YOU try to back yourself up and make a point of your own?



He's not close to 100% correct.

He is VERY naive to think regulation is anything to do with player protection, at all.

And it's nothing to do with evaluating terms or basic fairness of those terms either. Regulators do not approve terms, or even read terms before letting a book pay them to oversee them.


Over time posters here will find they are "stiffed" by regulated books FAR more often than they ever have been by the A rated offshore books.

it will not even be a close comparison in 10 years time.

You will talk about the good old days when you could easily access low vig and fair minded bookmakers who did not require a DNA test and copy of your tax return to get paid.

Legal books in the US are extremely well capitalized, that part of the regulation.

My point is that the big question about whether or not legal betting provide advantages to the professional player like myself is whether or not legal books can offer -108 or -110 vig and be profitable paying 10 to as much as 40 percent of their revenues in taxes.

Of course legal books will pay, they will pay or they will lost their license. They will also pay because they have lots of capital and no one players is that big of a deal. The legal books in the US are far better capitalized than the books you are referring to. Draftkings is an over 30 billion dollar company, they could be every offshore company out many times over.

Again, the issue with legal books is can they offer promotions and -110 vig and be profitable long-term - that is the issue, not if they will pay.

[thomorino]

My larger point is SBR will need to evolve their rating process and likely spend more time focusing on lines and bonuses, not if people are getting scammed, I still think the ratings process can have value, their are too many books to for bettors to know every promotion that each book is offering across different states.

[DontTailMe]

I don't know. From what I've seen, there are certainly sportsbook which make things a lot more difficult than others. Barstool has gained a very poor reputation, for one example.

[thomorino]

I don't know. From what I've seen, there are certainly sportsbook which make things a lot more difficult than others. Barstool has gained a very poor reputation, for one example.

Barstools promotions are stupid, they require you to spend 10 minutes reading the fine print and the rollover on the bonuses is absurd.

[DontTailMe]

Barstools promotions are stupid, they require you to spend 10 minutes reading the fine print and the rollover on the bonuses is absurd.

I'm not talking about that. I mean withholding player balances, not grading correctly, and forcing people to seek assistance from the commission rather than being reasonable. Sounds an awful like what we saw with certain offshores / SBR.

[temple2010]

Barstools promotions are stupid, they require you to spend 10 minutes reading the fine print and the rollover on the bonuses is absurd.

I receive a sweatshirt every week from these guys- not a joke lmao

[Optional]

Legal books in the US are extremely well capitalized, that part of the regulation.

My point is that the big question about whether or not legal betting provide advantages to the professional player like myself is whether or not legal books can offer -108 or -110 vig and be profitable paying 10 to as much as 40 percent of their revenues in taxes.

Of course legal books will pay, they will pay or they will lost their license. They will also pay because they have lots of capital and no one players is that big of a deal. The legal books in the US are far better capitalized than the books you are referring to. Draftkings is an over 30 billion dollar company, they could be every offshore company out many times over.

Again, the issue with legal books is can they offer promotions and -110 vig and be profitable long-term - that is the issue, not if they will pay.

It sounds like you imagine there is a US owned Sportsbook that is better capitalized than Bet365, Ladbrokes/Coral, 888, Flutter, WillHill or the rest of the 100 year old Euro bookies?

You won't find a US book anywhere near the top 10, yet. Scientific games is the only USA gambling company of any type that would be near them.

Plus, how on earth does being capitalized or not affect the regulatory requirements that will continue to steadily become more onerous over time?


You are just repeating common assumptions, but will be proven wrong about the "of course they will always pay" thinking in time.

For pros like yourself the vig is not all you have to be concerned about onshore. If you do not have provable Source of Wealth and Source of Funds to match the extent of your betting turnover, you are at risk too for example.

[thomorino]

It sounds like you imagine there is a US owned Sportsbook that is better capitalized than Bet365, Ladbrokes/Coral, 888, Flutter, WillHill or the rest of the 100 year old Euro bookies?

You won't find a US book anywhere near the top 10, yet. Scientific games is the only USA gambling company of any type that would be near them.

Plus, how on earth does being capitalized or not affect the regulatory requirements that will continue to steadily become more onerous over time?


You are just repeating common assumptions, but will be proven wrong about the "of course they will always pay" thinking in time.

For pros like yourself the vig is not all you have to be concerned about onshore. If you do not have provable Source of Wealth and Source of Funds to match the extent of your betting turnover, you are at risk too for example.

Disagree because for instance looking at books like draftkings and FanDuel alone, they are billion dollar companies that were around long before gambling was legalized since they were in the fantasy business.

[Optional]

Disagree because for instance looking at books like draftkings and FanDuel alone, they are billion dollar companies that were around long before gambling was legalized since they were in the fantasy business.

No matter how much money they have they are still subject to the same regulations that have pushed the industry into a horrible state for players in UK.

Like I said first time, let's hope the USA does not follow the same route as them, but logic says we should expect it to.

[thomorino]

No matter how much money they have they are still subject to the same regulations that have pushed the industry into a horrible state for players in UK.

Like I said first time, let's hope the USA does not follow the same route as them, but logic says we should expect it to.

The US market is completely different than the UK in many ways, the main way is the US is licensing books at the state level. If books don't like a state's regulation they don't have to go to that state.

[DontTailMe]

Sportsbooks are never going to turn down the potential income of an entire state because of regulations, especially the kind which Optional is talking about - those which make players' lives more difficult. The next time a large corporation turns down revenue in an ethical stand for the customer's wallet will be the first.