Does it really matter if Joe Paterno knew or not?

[opie1988]

Lots of debate going on right now over whether or not Joe Pa was knowingly harboring and enabling that convicted child rapist Sandusky. But I fail to see if him having full knowledge of the situation absolves him from guilt.

No one can question that Joe ruled over Penn St football. He was a dictator. Every facet of the program, and basically the entire school, ran through him. So in my opinion, rather or not he totally knew what Sandusky was doing....he's 100% responsible for this going on during his watch. That's how it works when you're the boss. You take responsibility for everything, good and bad. Do you honestly think the CEO of BP knew abou the day-to-day on all of the 1000's of wells they were running? Absolutely not. But when the small leak happened, and all the libtard fukks freaked out like this was going to be the end of every fukkin dolphin in the ocean, who went down? That's simply part of the job description.

For the record, I think he knew full well what was happening. But by the .001% chance he didn't, in my opinion, he's still to blame. It was his program. Happened on his watch.

[King Mayan]

what's up with all the "libtard" bullshit lately?

Nobody should give a fukk about dirty oil in our water?

Jesus.

[acl123]

Small leak

[Chi_archie]

This is why I think SBR JOHN owes TTWARRIOR a huge apology for all the prank phone calling that he says he has been experiencing.

Also John needs to make amends to Bobbyfk because Patty Venditto and Zeta were bankrupting him in some chat, because he forced them out of SBR chat where these shanigans and horse porn hi-jinx could be tolerated.

John, also owes me an apology for tempting me with the easy pickins in the SBR book, to take him for about 75k in points two years ago and buy a bunch of betphoenix freeplays.

these minor failures have been more than covered for in the 10,000 great things John has done...

but let me find out that JJ is fondling samsncharge at the race track and it will all be tarnished

[opie1988]

Jesus. This is a thread about Joe Pa's guilt. Must you force your liberal agenda on everything?

I only used the BP example as a parallel between their CEO and Paterno. Regardless of how microscopic the actual amount of oil leaked in the ocean, he had to go. Same with Joe.

[Cougar Bait]

Arch you had me at JJ is fondling samsincharge

[ttwarrior1]

This may be the most ridiculous of all of the "blame Joe" nonsense that has come out since the Boards "Cover Our Ass Freeh" report came out. Freeh was hired by the Board to dig up and place as much blame on Joe as possible to help fend off the Paterno family's wrongful termination suit. But the most absurd slide of all in this BS is the one that says "after 1998 Joe failed to closely monitor Sandusky's behavior". First, that might be because Sandusky left PSU in 1999. But more over, Joe Paterno was a football coach, not a law enforcement official, or a Child Welfare Department employee, or anybody who was in any position to know what Sandusky was doing much less "monitor" his behavior. The alleged notes that claim to say that Joe wanted to be kept informed of the 1998 investigation led to him being informed that the charges were dropped and Sandusky was cleared. So what a reporter is saying is Joe should have confronted Sandusky and said "even though you don't work here any more, and you have been cleared of the charges against you, I am going to monitor your private life behavior?" Ridiculous. It was also made clear that Sandusky was given emeritous status and access to PSU by The President of the University, not by Joe Paterno and it was part of a retirement package, not because he was connected to the football program. Nobody knows what, if anything, Joe discussed with Tim Curley until Curleys trial.

Joe Paterno's job was coaching the football team, not "watching" Jerry Sandusky when he was on campus. Joe had no way of knowing when Sandusky was on campus much less have the time to follow him around "watching" him. If the university has suspicions, they should have had security watch him. How can you say that after the 1998 incident (where Sandusky was cleared) that Joe never said "get away from PSU football?". Sandusky quickly decided to retire in 1999. You don't think Joe was behind that and that was his way of saying "I don't care if you were cleared, I don't want you around my program"? Freeh said he could not draw any conclusions about that. Also don't overlook several other facts. The incident in the shower in 2001 took place at 9:30 at night. Long after the Lash Building was closed. Where was security? Joe was no longer there to "watch" him. How do you know Joe was "OK" with Sandusky having an office right next to him? Sandusky was given office space by Graham Spanier as part of his retirement package. Another important fact left out by Freeh was that Tim Curley and Graham Spanier told Sandusky not to bring any more kids on campus and took away his keys to the locker room after the 2001 shower incident. Mike McQueary testified at the Curley/Schultz hearing that he saw Sandusky around campus after 2001 but he never saw him on campus with a child after that. I am not in denial about anything. I am just not willing to drink the Freeh Report coolaide. Especially when he states that the cornerstone of his investigation was a conversation between Joe and Curely that he admits he knows nothing about other than a vague reference in an email. He never talked to either party so he has no way of knowing what Joe said. Is Joe guilty of poor judgement, probably; he is guilty of making a mistake, probably. But is he guilty of knowingly "enabling" or "allowing" Sandusky to molest children? No way in hell. Is he "complicit" in the crimes of a former employee? No way in hell. And no bogus report by anybody is ever going to change that.

[DrStale]

It's the difference between him being responsible for what happened and him being a callous asshole who was responsible for what happened.

[ttwarrior1]

joe did take responsibility , but that doesn't mean your guilty or its your fault

Read my last post, good stuff and an eye opener

[PickWinnerAllDay]

can we please move on? Love you Opie.

[King Mayan]

Jesus. This is a thread about Joe Pa's guilt. Must you force your liberal agenda on everything?

I only used the BP example as a parallel between their CEO and Paterno. Regardless of how microscopic the actual amount of oil leaked in the ocean, he had to go. Same with Joe.

you're the one using libtard...somehow making fun of handicapped kids is acceptable to neo clowns as well

[seaborneq]

No one else hired a relatively young defensive coordinator of Linebacker U, yet old ass Galen Hall was the offensive coordinator this year. He coached at Florida in the late 70's and early 80's. Paterno knew what Sandusky was capable of and everyone in the coaching professional did too for not allow the freak on their campus for the sake of wins. Not even a D2 or D3 program wanted Sanfucsky.

[opie1988]

you're the one using libtard...somehow making fun of handicapped kids is acceptable to neo clowns as well

Silly Queen Mayan.

I'm not making fun of you being mentally challenged, I'm only making fun of you being a liberal.

Even I have my limits, pal.

By the way, have I told you I think you're a very brave little boy lately? Cause you sure are, pal!

[boeing power]

Where the Fuk did ttwarrior copy and past that?

TT doesn't know the difference between there and their, then he comes in here with a novel and punctuation.

[Chi_archie]

in 2009 Sandusky was piddling with a HS kid and stalking him after meeting him as a volunteer wrestling coach.

the kid told his mom that Sandsuky was a creep, the mom called the school....

SANDUSKY WAS BANNED FROM THE SCHOOL PROPERTY

that mom had more power in her phone voice and a HS principal had more balls than the great powerful Paterno???

Joe PA built that school but couldn't get a guy that mcqueary saw pounding a boy in the ass to be banned from the campus?

Mcqeary is a man with balls and he told who he told and didn't pursue it again for years and years? just letting that animal run loose on butt holes at bowl games, after games, 2nd mile camps ON CAMPUS!!!!!!

that high school is a REAL school

PSU had many staff that had no right to be assocaiated with the word school or education

[King Mayan]

I would be careful using words like "tard"(retard), old man...They always come back and BITE!!

I hope you humble up, before humility kicks you in the ass.

[Deuce]

I agree. I happen to be frustrated though with the entire punishment forced upon the current roster.

Those whom were in charge and are to blame should face the consequences. Most already have. That being said, I disagree that the current team, as well as the 98-11 teams should be penalized because of one sick fukk's actions. The current coach and players should not be penalized. An analogy would be one of this nature: grandfather is a murder so in return his sons as well as grandchildren should be punished and face consequences because of the grandfather's actions. It doesn't make any sense.

[Chi_archie]

gotta clean house and help them create an entire new culture..

and I don't really see current athletes not getting to play for a national chmpionship as a "punishment"

they still get to play a great sport in return for free education.... I'd be okay with that punishment

If they are really good they can go play somewhere else, many of them are...

if they don't want to play they still can and they KEEP their scholarship.

it ain't the end of the world

PSU football players had been top 10 over the last decade in criminal activity so I bet half of them deserved punishment for the stuff they HADN"T been caught for.

lack of institutional control indeed

[CarpeDime]

Jesus. This is a thread about Joe Pa's guilt. Must you force your liberal agenda on everything?

I only used the BP example as a parallel between their CEO and Paterno. Regardless of how microscopic the actual amount of oil leaked in the ocean, he had to go. Same with Joe.

interestingly, Joe Pa was a very well-known and active Republican, even gave a speech at the '88 convention

[Chi_archie]

interestingly, Joe Pa was a very well-known and active Republican, even gave a speech at the '88 convention

OH SNAP

Loshak Nixoned the thread...

Mods DELETE this thread immediately

[opie1988]

interestingly, Joe Pa was a very well-known and active Republican, even gave a speech at the '88 convention

Hey Pete.....was this thread about how much fukkin acid you dropped at last years Bonnaroo Festival?

No? Then don't be bringing your hippie, liberal sh*t in here, pal. This is about Joe Pa's culpability in a tragedy, with a comparison to a minor oil leak that created a national fukkin outroar amongst tree hugging' greenpeacers like yourself.

Let's stick to joe pa. Got it, pal?

[Dutch]

Jesus. This is a thread about Joe Pa's guilt. Must you force your liberal agenda on everything?

You brought up the libtard agenda and then bitched when people responded to it? lol, That's fuk'd up.

[opie1988]

You brought up the libtard agenda and then bitched when people responded to it? lol, That's fuk'd up.

How in the fukk do you figure that? I did no such thing.

I simply paralleled the fall of a great leader like Tony Hayward, who got strung up by a bunch of hippies for basically nothing more than blip on mother natures radar....to the fall of Joe Pa.

In no way did I bring up any liberal agenda. I resent the accusation.

[muldoon]

Do you honestly think the CEO of BP knew abou the day-to-day on all of the 1000's of wells they were running? Absolutely not. But when the small leak happened, and all the libtard fukks freaked out like this was going to be the end of every fukkin dolphin in the ocean, who went down?

Small leak? 11 people were killed and 17 seriously hurt. Not to mention the fact that people still don't want to import seafood from that region.

[muldoon]

I simply paralleled the fall of a great leader like Tony Hayward, who got strung up by a bunch of hippies for basically nothing more than blip on mother natures radar....to the fall of Joe Pa.

11 dead. 4.9 (est) million barrels of oil.

Nice "blip" in Opie-land

[ChalkyDog]

Main difference, legally - the buck didn't stop at joe, there was an ability to go upward.

The only question here is do we hold a football coach to a higher standard, i.e. does he have a legal duty to act more than tell his superiors.

Depending on the money and lawyer - the answer differs.

[manny24]

after what he was told, if joe pa had gone directly into those showers with the switch and cut sandusky's throat from ear to ear they would be dipping his statue in gold today.

[Djstucky]

can we please move on? Love you Opie.

So you are saying we should all pull a Joe Pa going forward and say nothing going forward?

[opie1988]

Small leak? 11 people were killed and 17 seriously hurt. Not to mention the fact that people still don't want to import seafood from that region.

The injuries were from the explosion on the rig. Nothing to do with the oil spill.

You couldn't be anymore wrong if you tried by saying seafood isn't imported from this area. The shrimping and fishing business has substantially increased since before the event. Those areas provide a tremendous amount of seafood for the entire country.

[Cougar Bait]

Opie, give me some oil.

[muldoon]

The injuries were from the explosion on the rig. Nothing to do with the oil spill.

You couldn't be anymore wrong if you tried by saying seafood isn't imported from this area. The shrimping and fishing business has substantially increased since before the event. Those areas provide a tremendous amount of seafood for the entire country.

Actually I should have said "many" people don't want to import from some areas (since I'm invested in an East Coast restaurant that still refuses to)

http://www.popsci.com/science/article/2012-04/shocking-deformities-gulf-seafood-found-after-bp-oil-spill

11 dead. Nice blip douche.

A great leader like "I'd like my life back" Hayward. That's rich


The irony of all this is that I agree with your original post. Except I want to see people who overlook abuse or head up companies like BP do jail time.

[Chi_archie]

Legalty is still NOT the question

its not illegal for coaches to text message 15 year old recruits in America

but it is a requirement/rule/standard that the NCAA imposes...

if the rule is broken or standard not upheld, they can and have brought sanctions..

demonstrating "institutional control" is a standard that i'm ok with despite it being open ended and semantical in nature....

we aren't talking about just Calipari-levels of lack of control here.. we are talking beyond baylor basketball levels in some respects...

Calipari never faced jail time either, but HIS schools he left behind paid

[lakerboy]

I always knew joe pa was a fraud. I should have shot him when I was at one of there games in 2003.

[manny24]

after what he was told, if joe pa had gone directly into those showers with the switch and cut sandusky's throat from ear to ear they would be dipping his statue in gold today.

maybe even coaching this season...saturday furloughs!

[hopkin]

No, does not matter. Anyone who has kids will understand.