Has there been a better hitter than Miguel Cabrera?

[SamDiamond]

Ted Williams averages over his career....

.344 Average--37 HR---130 RBI---127 Runs--OPS 1.116

Albert Pujols averages over his career...

.323 Average--39 HR---122 RBI--119 Runs---OPS 1.015

Miguel Cabrera

.320 Average--35 HR---122 RBI--104 Runs---OPS .960


And Ted Williams missed 3 years in the prime of his career to fight in WW2.

[v0dka]

http://www.replacementlevelpodcast.com/2013/05/01/is-miguel-cabrera-the-best-right-handed-hitter-of-his-generation/

So what does all this mean? Miguel Cabrera is not the best right-handed hitter of all time or of his generation but that doesn’t mean he isn’t great. He is. He is without a doubt on a Hall of Fame pace. He has the chance to surpass the career accomplishments of nearly everyone on this rather impressive list as he is still performing at his peak and likely has several great seasons ahead of him.However, looking the best right-handed hitters of his generation (through the age of 30) it’s nearly impossible to legitimately rank him ahead of Pujols or Thomas. A handful of others put up comparable numbers as well. That doesn’t diminish Cabrera’s accomplishments, he is among the best hitters of his generation, few can make that claim.
Not everyone or everything is the best thing ever. Miguel Cabrera doesn’t have to be the best hitter ever to still be awesome and fun to watch. Let’s just appreciate him for what he is.

[Inspirited]

i just have a hard time believing anybody with his stats are real these days

[TheMoneyShot]

[Smoke]

When he retires he will be known as one of the greatest ever who never cheated the game with roids

[TheMoneyShot]

How are we so sure Miggy never did roids Smoke?

[billysink]

How are we so sure Miggy never did roids Smoke?

Shit with all that he drinks his liver would have quit years ago. No secret around town he likes his pops.

[Smoke]

How are we so sure Miggy never did roids Smoke?

Will all the testing they do now he would have been caught by now.

[SamDiamond]

I think Cabrera's off-season is more like Mickey Mantle's than Barry Bonds.

[InTheDrink]

Will all the testing they do now he would have been caught by now.

[Smoke]

Whats so funny drinker

[InTheDrink]

My smoker is so naive

Sorta reminds me how smoker falls for the "just the tip" routine every time

[Smoke]

My smoker is so naive

Sorta reminds me how smoker falls for the "just the tip" routine every time

They test drinker. Just like you get tested daily for STD's

[Deuce]

Cabrera's last 162 games: .351 avg, 47 HRs, 152 RBIs, 45 doubles, 221 hits, 122 runs. Goodnight.

[InTheDrink]

They test drinker. Just like you get tested daily for STD's

Smoker just like miggy I know how to beat the tests

Smoker after I pound your butthole do you really think I'm clean???

[InTheDrink]

Cabrera's last 162 games: .351 avg, 47 HRs, 152 RBIs, 45 doubles, 221 hits, 122 runs. Goodnight.

Sounds like a mediocre stretch for Barry bonds in the early 2000's

[Smoke]

Smoker just like miggy I know how to beat the tests

Smoker after I pound your butthole do you really think I'm clean???

drinker im the monkey. spread your cheeks like the last 15 times. Im goin in

[Smoke]

Sounds like a mediocre stretch for Barry bonds in the early 2000's

Bonds was juiced. Miggy not

[GimpedMaster]

Ted Williams averages over his career....

.344 Average--37 HR---130 RBI---127 Runs--OPS 1.116

Albert Pujols averages over his career...

.323 Average--39 HR---122 RBI--119 Runs---OPS 1.015

Miguel Cabrera

.320 Average--35 HR---122 RBI--104 Runs---OPS .960


And Ted Williams missed 3 years in the prime of his career to fight in WW2.

Exactly, Ted Williams doesn't edge Pujols by a great deal even though he played in an era where pitchers were far inferior to what they are today. There were no 'four pitch' pitchers back in the 40's, there were no advanced metrics, zone scouting reports to capitalize on hitter weaknesses like today.

Pujols and Miggy have done what they've done in spite of the best technology in the world trying to game-plan against them. Ted Williams would have some Joe Schmoe opposing him on the mound who would just get told 'go get 3 by ole Teddy' and that was his scouting report.

No comparison.

If Ted Williams played in todays era he would have Ichiro/Tony Gwynn type numbers at best, possibly a high average but he would lose most of his power numbers trying to compensate for pitchers that actually have a repetiore and can focus on his weaknesses.

[HOT WINGS]

Exactly, Ted Williams doesn't edge Pujols by a great deal even though he played in an era where pitchers were far inferior to what they are today. There were no 'four pitch' pitchers back in the 40's, there were no advanced metrics, zone scouting reports to capitalize on hitter weaknesses like today.

Pujols and Miggy have done what they've done in spite of the best technology in the world trying to game-plan against them. Ted Williams would have some Joe Schmoe opposing him on the mound who would just get told 'go get 3 by ole Teddy' and that was his scouting report.

No comparison.

If Ted Williams played in todays era he would have Ichiro/Tony Gwynn type numbers at best, possibly a high average but he would lose most of his power numbers trying to compensate for pitchers that actually have a repetiore and can focus on his weaknesses.

Yes I agree it's impossible to compare players from different generations in any sport really. There's such a time gap all games evolve with time. When people look back at this generation of baseball (2000-2020 era) it's going to be Miggy and Pujols as best hitters of generation and maybe throw in Votto and couple others eventually. Bonds and A-rod will always be in conversation also but they will both always be tainted.

[ThaTopMoron]

Cabrera's last 162 games: .351 avg, 47 HRs, 152 RBIs, 45 doubles, 221 hits, 122 runs. Goodnight.

0-4 W/L in the Series

[Deuce]

0-4 W/L in the Series

Add a triple crown and MVP to his résumé. He can only carry his team so far.

[SamDiamond]

Exactly, Ted Williams doesn't edge Pujols by a great deal even though he played in an era where pitchers were far inferior to what they are today. There were no 'four pitch' pitchers back in the 40's, there were no advanced metrics, zone scouting reports to capitalize on hitter weaknesses like today.

Pujols and Miggy have done what they've done in spite of the best technology in the world trying to game-plan against them. Ted Williams would have some Joe Schmoe opposing him on the mound who would just get told 'go get 3 by ole Teddy' and that was his scouting report.

No comparison.

If Ted Williams played in todays era he would have Ichiro/Tony Gwynn type numbers at best, possibly a high average but he would lose most of his power numbers trying to compensate for pitchers that actually have a repetiore and can focus on his weaknesses.

That's a stretch.

Cabrera is playing at a time when Scott Kazmir is still able to get a starting job.

[GUMMO77]

I think Cabrera's off-season is more like Mickey Mantle's than Barry Bonds.

Sharp

[BuddyBear]

Cabrera is historically good offensively (i.e. wRC+ 200 is insane this year)....but unfortunately he is very mediocre to below average in most other facets of the game: speed, base running, arm strength, fielding, range....not even to mention his personal problems off the field (i.e. multiple drinking and driving violations). But since most fans do not care about anything other than offense, most people think he is the greatest player ever. Triple Crown is nice, but not as special as it has been made out to be. I think it was obvious that Trout was the best baseball player in the league by a wide margin last year but somehow the behind the times voters got it wrong. In fact, I thought there were a few National League players who had better years....but unfortunately baseball is so tied to tradition that it fails to see the full picture sometimes.

I think in terms of best players ever, I would rank Cabrera right now somewhere in the top 100, possibly top 75 or better depending how much you want to weight offense. To me, it still remains, Barry Bonds is by far the best player in the past 70 years and it is not even close. For a while, Pujols looked like he was going to assume that title but he has fizzled out. It's extremely hard to be an elite player for 10+ years in MLB.

But right now, 2013, almost everyone looks like a minor league player compared to Cabrera. It honestly astonishes me, just like last year, why the Tigers are not better than they are given their offensive weapons and probably having the best rotation in all of baseball.

[GimpedMaster]

That's a stretch.

Cabrera is playing at a time when Scott Kazmir is still able to get a starting job.

If Scott Kazmir of today got in a time machine and was sent back to the 40's... He wouldn't be the best pitcher in the league but he'd probably be a 15 game winner with his trick bag of angles and pitches hitters have never freaking seen before.

Again though, we really can't compare generation to generation because of things like this.

[You mad bro]

babe ruth ... joe d .. mantle .. williams .. gherig .. cobb .. all these guys say otherwise

[You mad bro]

the ballparks also back then were way bigger .. the mounds were higher .. the balls werent tightened so much like they are today

advantage hitters .. back then pitchers would throw double headers or every 3 days .. now a days the pitchers are rested throwing every 5 games .. 2 different eras of baseball that are hard to compare .. i mean back then these guys were working another job in the offseason while half these players are in their summer homes come winter time on vacation with their family or whatever .. (unless you are mickey mantle and just drink your life away anyway)

[InTheDrink]

Cabrera is historically good offensively (i.e. wRC+ 200 is insane this year)....but unfortunately he is very mediocre to below average in most other facets of the game: speed, base running, arm strength, fielding, range....not even to mention his personal problems off the field (i.e. multiple drinking and driving violations). But since most fans do not care about anything other than offense, most people think he is the greatest player ever. Triple Crown is nice, but not as special as it has been made out to be. I think it was obvious that Trout was the best baseball player in the league by a wide margin last year but somehow the behind the times voters got it wrong. In fact, I thought there were a few National League players who had better years....but unfortunately baseball is so tied to tradition that it fails to see the full picture sometimes.

I think in terms of best players ever, I would rank Cabrera right now somewhere in the top 100, possibly top 75 or better depending how much you want to weight offense. To me, it still remains, Barry Bonds is by far the best player in the past 70 years and it is not even close. For a while, Pujols looked like he was going to assume that title but he has fizzled out. It's extremely hard to be an elite player for 10+ years in MLB.

But right now, 2013, almost everyone looks like a minor league player compared to Cabrera. It honestly astonishes me, just like last year, why the Tigers are not better than they are given their offensive weapons and probably having the best rotation in all of baseball.

nice write up and all but maybe read the title of the thread

[InTheDrink]

Bonds was juiced. Miggy not

and youd have said manny wasnt either back from 2000-2008 right?

[No coincidences]

Cabrera is historically good offensively (i.e. wRC+ 200 is insane this year)....but unfortunately he is very mediocre to below average in most other facets of the game: speed, base running, arm strength, fielding, range....not even to mention his personal problems off the field (i.e. multiple drinking and driving violations). But since most fans do not care about anything other than offense, most people think he is the greatest player ever. Triple Crown is nice, but not as special as it has been made out to be. I think it was obvious that Trout was the best baseball player in the league by a wide margin last year but somehow the behind the times voters got it wrong. In fact, I thought there were a few National League players who had better years....but unfortunately baseball is so tied to tradition that it fails to see the full picture sometimes.

I think in terms of best players ever, I would rank Cabrera right now somewhere in the top 100, possibly top 75 or better depending how much you want to weight offense. To me, it still remains, Barry Bonds is by far the best player in the past 70 years and it is not even close. For a while, Pujols looked like he was going to assume that title but he has fizzled out. It's extremely hard to be an elite player for 10+ years in MLB.

But right now, 2013, almost everyone looks like a minor league player compared to Cabrera. It honestly astonishes me, just like last year, why the Tigers are not better than they are given their offensive weapons and probably having the best rotation in all of baseball.

This thread said "better hitter," not "better player."

[BuddyBear]

This thread said "better hitter," not "better player."

Who cares? Every other thread on this board deviates from the original title.

[greenhippo]

babe ruth ... joe d .. mantle .. williams .. gherig .. cobb .. all these guys say otherwise

Hornsby, Shoeless

[BuddyBear]

babe ruth ... joe d .. mantle .. williams .. gherig .. cobb .. all these guys say otherwise

With the exception of Mantle, all these guys played in a very different (i.e. much weaker) era of baseball. Cabrera would have been a .400 hitter basically in the era that Ruth and Gherig and Williams played in. I think Pujols is the best comparison you can make to Cabrera as a hitter.

[InTheDrink]

I think Pujols is the best comparison you can make to Cabrera as a hitter.

name dat hueye

1994	CLE	91	290	51	78	22	0	17	60	42	72	4	2	.269	.357	.521	.878	1.4
1995	CLE	137	484	85	149	26	1	31	107	75	112	6	6	.308	.402	.558	.960	2.6
1996	CLE	152	550	94	170	45	3	33	112	85	104	8	5	.309	.399	.582	.981	3.9
1997	CLE	150	561	99	184	40	0	26	88	79	115	2	3	.328	.415	.538	.953	4.3
1998	CLE	150	571	108	168	35	2	45	145	76	121	5	3	.294	.377	.599	.976	5.0
1999	CLE	147	522	131	174	34	3	44	165	96	131	2	4	.333	.442	.663	1.105	7.0
2000	CLE	118	439	92	154	34	2	38	122	86	117	1	1	.351	.457	.697	1.154	4.6
2001	BOS	142	529	93	162	33	2	41	125	81	147	0	1	.306	.405	.609	1.014	4.9
2002	BOS	120	436	84	152	31	0	33	107	73	85	0	0	.349	.450	.647	1.097	5.8
2003	BOS	154	569	117	185	36	1	37	104	97	94	3	1	.325	.427	.587	1.014	5.1

2003	FLA	87	314	39	84	21	3	12	62	25	84	0	2	.268	.325	.468	.793	0.5
2004	FLA	160	603	101	177	31	1	33	112	68	148	5	2	.294	.366	.512	.878	3.2
2005	FLA	158	613	106	198	43	2	33	116	64	125	1	0	.323	.385	.561	.946	4.9
2006	FLA	158	576	112	195	50	2	26	114	86	108	9	6	.339	.430	.568	.998	5.5
2007	FLA	157	588	91	188	38	2	34	119	79	127	2	1	.320	.401	.565	.966	3.0
2008	DET	160	616	85	180	36	2	37	127	56	126	1	0	.292	.349	.537	.886	2.3
2009	DET	160	611	96	198	34	0	34	103	68	107	6	2	.324	.396	.547	.943	4.7
2010	DET	150	548	111	180	45	1	38	126	89	95	3	3	.328	.420	.622	1.042	6.1
2011	DET	161	572	111	197	48	0	30	105	108	89	2	1	.344	.448	.586	1.034	7.3
2012	DET	161	622	109	205	40	0	44	139	66	98	4	1	.330	.393	.606	.999	6.9