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  • The Madcap
    SBR MVP
    • 07-03-10
    • 2808

    #36
    Originally posted by Sunde91
    So? You cannot name one season where PITT has not underachieved in tourney under Dixon.
    I've got to second this. Pitt has been choking in the tournament since I can remember.

    So I looked at the numbers:

    2010: #3 seed Pitt loses in 2nd round to #6 seed Xavier
    2009: #1 seed Pitt loses in elite eight to #3 seed Villanova
    2008: #4 seed Pitt loses in 2nd round to #5 seed Michigan State
    2007: #3 seed just slips past #11 seed VCU in overtime after blowing a 19pt lead before losing decisively
    to #2 seed UCLA in Sweet 16.
    2006: #5 seed Pitt loses in the second round to #13 seed Bradley
    2005: #8 seed Pitt loses in the first round to #9 seed Pacific

    That's 5 of 6 seasons losing as the better seed. And a couple of those are just outright embarrassing (Bradley/Pacific) and the Xavier loss last year isn't much better.

    Granted, upsets happen, but the point is, if you're the one always being upset and never doing any of the upsetting, it's signs of poor coaching in close games.
    No more of that talk, or I'll put the leeches on you.
    Comment
    • HoulihansTX
      BARRELED IN @ SBR!
      • 02-12-09
      • 30566

      #37
      LOL@ those examples.


      I think we should rename this thread FireJamieDixon.com.

      Then we should fire Bill Self for losing to Bucknell, Northern Iowa, and Bradley

      Coach K for losing to VCU

      Jay Wright for losing to George Mason, and St. Mary's

      Billy Donovan for losing to Manhattan

      Bo Ryan for losing to Cornell, and Davidson

      Pitino for losing to Butler last year, and Morehead St. recently

      Roy Williams for losing the NIT last year(LOLtastic), George Mason, and otehr choke jobs with Kansas(Especially that year they were loaded with Paul Pierce)

      Calhoun for losing to San Diego, and George Mason
      Comment
      • The Madcap
        SBR MVP
        • 07-03-10
        • 2808

        #38
        Originally posted by HoulihansTX
        LOL@ those examples.


        I think we should rename this thread FireJamieDixon.com.

        Then we should fire Bill Self for losing to Bucknell, Northern Iowa, and Bradley

        Coach K for losing to VCU

        Jay Wright for losing to George Mason, and St. Mary's

        Billy Donovan for losing to Manhattan

        Bo Ryan for losing to Cornell, and Davidson

        Pitino for losing to Butler last year, and Morehead St. recently

        Roy Williams for losing the NIT last year(LOLtastic), George Mason, and otehr choke jobs with Kansas(Especially that year they were loaded with Paul Pierce)

        Calhoun for losing to San Diego, and George Mason
        You're missing the point. COMPLETELY.

        Bill Self has won a national title.
        Coach K has won four.
        Billy Donovan has won two.
        Pitino has won one and been to the Final Four five times. (With three different teams)
        Roy Williams has won two.
        Calhoun has won two.

        Jamie Dixon has never even been to the Final Four once.

        And I'm not saying he's necessarily a bad coach, nor do I think he should be fired. But the point remains, his team has failed to get it done come tourney time, often choking in the clutch.

        Sure these other coaches have had teams get upset, but they've also had teams win it all. Sometimes when they weren't supposed to.

        As I stated in my last post, upsets happen, but when your team is the one always being upset, and never doing any of the upsetting, it's a sign that your team doesn't know how to get it done in pressure moments. And that's a sign of poor coaching.
        No more of that talk, or I'll put the leeches on you.
        Comment
        • hkssupra69
          SBR Sharp
          • 11-22-10
          • 272

          #39
          boeheim has won a national title as well so maybe his name shouldnt be brought up
          Comment
          • Cuse0323
            BARRELED IN @ SBR!
            • 12-09-09
            • 30169

            #40
            History repeats itself daily here, NoCoin shows he knows nothing about the game. Stick to worrying about what Pinny is juicing.
            Comment
            • EBDOG
              SBR Wise Guy
              • 09-30-08
              • 517

              #41
              Why did jaime dixon even put his guys on the line makes no sense to me yeah they could have got an offensive rebound but it would have been tough to get a shot off. Another game blown by fundamental coaching.
              Comment
              • EaglesPhan36
                SBR Aristocracy
                • 12-06-06
                • 71662

                #42
                Don't ever toss Boeheim into a conversation about Rick Barnes. Boeheim overachieved with this team. If you look at all the parts, they are not that good a team. Guy has a national title, that makes him better than Barnes when he wakes up every day.
                Comment
                • The Madcap
                  SBR MVP
                  • 07-03-10
                  • 2808

                  #43
                  Originally posted by EaglesPhan36
                  Don't ever toss Boeheim into a conversation about Rick Barnes. Boeheim overachieved with this team. If you look at all the parts, they are not that good a team. Guy has a national title, that makes him better than Barnes when he wakes up every day.
                  I totally agree. Syracuse has talent, but it is young and very inexperienced. NC State almost beat them in the Carrier Dome early on. When I saw that, I knew 'Cuse won't that good this year.

                  And let me tell you something about Rick Barnes: HE SUCKS. Some of my fellow NCSU alums want us to hire that fukker because he grew up around here and it's pissing the rest of us off major. He hasn't won dick. In 13 years at Texas he's never been to the Final Four once, despite having a slew of future NBA guys like TJ Ford, Kevin Durant, LaMarcus Aldridge, Daniel Gibson, Chris Mihm and Royal Ivey. And he had plenty of other college stars as well, like DJ Augustin, and Chris Owens.

                  Rick Barnes' coaching has underachieved his players' talent more than any coach in the history of college basketball if you ask me. And Jaime Dixon better start making moves or he's going to find himself catching up quick.
                  No more of that talk, or I'll put the leeches on you.
                  Comment
                  • No coincidences
                    SBR Aristocracy
                    • 01-18-10
                    • 76300

                    #44
                    Originally posted by hkssupra69
                    boeheim has won a national title as well so maybe his name shouldnt be brought up
                    Carmelo carried Boeheim the way Wade carried Crean to the FF. Crean parlayed that into the Indiana job and now he's garbage.

                    I'm not saying Boeheim isn't a good coach and he's better than Barnes and Dixon, but he's not among the absolute "elite" -- especially at tournament time -- given the number of March flameouts in his career.
                    Comment
                    • No coincidences
                      SBR Aristocracy
                      • 01-18-10
                      • 76300

                      #45
                      Throw Pitino in there as well. He's past his prime. Look at Louisville's recent recruiting classes. It's only going to get worse for them.
                      Comment
                      • TrapperDapper
                        SBR Wise Guy
                        • 08-20-10
                        • 502

                        #46
                        Originally posted by No coincidences
                        Carmelo carried Boeheim the way Wade carried Crean to the FF. Crean parlayed that into the Indiana job and now he's garbage.

                        I'm not saying Boeheim isn't a good coach and he's better than Barnes and Dixon, but he's not among the absolute "elite" -- especially at tournament time -- given the number of March flameouts in his career.
                        Let's give Crean some time though. Sampson ****** that program up.
                        Comment
                        • No coincidences
                          SBR Aristocracy
                          • 01-18-10
                          • 76300

                          #47
                          Syracuse has been past the Sweet 16 twice in the last 22 years.
                          Comment
                          • No coincidences
                            SBR Aristocracy
                            • 01-18-10
                            • 76300

                            #48
                            Originally posted by TrapperDapper
                            Let's give Crean some time though. Sampson ****** that program up.
                            Crean's had a decent amount of time and let's face it -- IU is showing zero progress.
                            Comment
                            • No coincidences
                              SBR Aristocracy
                              • 01-18-10
                              • 76300

                              #49
                              Originally posted by Cuse0323
                              History repeats itself daily here, NoCoin shows he knows nothing about the game. Stick to worrying about what Pinny is juicing.
                              I'm sorry that I offended you as a Cuse fan, but if you're satisfied with being past the Sweet 16 twice since 1989 given the amount of regular-season success they've had and all the talent that's gone through the Carrier Dome, you need to aim higher.
                              Comment
                              • HoulihansTX
                                BARRELED IN @ SBR!
                                • 02-12-09
                                • 30566

                                #50
                                Every coach sucks. Fire them all ,and just let the kids play Rucker park ball. AKA Rick Barnes' gameplan.
                                Comment
                                • TrapperDapper
                                  SBR Wise Guy
                                  • 08-20-10
                                  • 502

                                  #51
                                  Originally posted by No coincidences
                                  Crean's had a decent amount of time and let's face it -- IU is showing zero progress.
                                  He had time but he had crazy sanctions, and had a lot of kids transfer/ Eric Gordon go pro. They look like an Indiana team from twenty years ago. A bunch of six foot white kids who grew up playing on dirt courts.
                                  Comment
                                  • rochestertitans
                                    Restricted User
                                    • 12-14-09
                                    • 8149

                                    #52
                                    tx got screwed
                                    Comment
                                    • No coincidences
                                      SBR Aristocracy
                                      • 01-18-10
                                      • 76300

                                      #53
                                      Originally posted by HoulihansTX
                                      Every coach sucks. Fire them all ,and just let the kids play Rucker park ball. AKA Rick Barnes' gameplan.
                                      There's definitely an upper echelon of coaches. Then there are underrated ones and overrated ones.

                                      I just happen to think Boeheim, Barnes and Dixon are in the overrated camp, and Pitino has arrived there as well.
                                      Comment
                                      • drunkenbeaver
                                        SBR High Roller
                                        • 06-27-10
                                        • 215

                                        #54
                                        In the end, every team loses except the champion.

                                        I must say Pitt does go out early repeatedly.
                                        Comment
                                        • lyon804
                                          SBR Hall of Famer
                                          • 11-02-09
                                          • 6526

                                          #55
                                          Originally posted by No coincidences
                                          Carmelo carried Boeheim the way Wade carried Crean to the FF. Crean parlayed that into the Indiana job and now he's garbage.

                                          I'm not saying Boeheim isn't a good coach and he's better than Barnes and Dixon, but he's not among the absolute "elite" -- especially at tournament time -- given the number of March flameouts in his career.


                                          I agree about Boeheim. Without the one and done "Mello" season he would not have a championship or really come close at anytime. He is a "legend" though
                                          Comment
                                          • No coincidences
                                            SBR Aristocracy
                                            • 01-18-10
                                            • 76300

                                            #56
                                            Originally posted by lyon804
                                            I agree about Boeheim. Without the one and done "Mello" season he would not have a championship or really come close at anytime. He is a "legend" though
                                            Boeheim has had a lot of successful regular seasons during his tenure, which begs the question, why has he only been past the Sweet 16 twice since '89?

                                            These guys are all able to succeed during the regular season, but for whatever reason, they repeatedly don't get it done when it matters most.
                                            Comment
                                            • TPowell
                                              SBR Posting Legend
                                              • 02-21-08
                                              • 18842

                                              #57
                                              Boeheim wouldn't have a title if he didnt get to face Rick Barnes and Roy Williams back-to-back in the Final 4. Talk about a cakewalk
                                              Comment
                                              • No coincidences
                                                SBR Aristocracy
                                                • 01-18-10
                                                • 76300

                                                #58
                                                Originally posted by TPowell
                                                Boeheim wouldn't have a title if he didnt get to face Rick Barnes and Roy Williams back-to-back in the Final 4. Talk about a cakewalk
                                                I'd really love to put Roy Williams into this conversation, because I feel like he's done less with more over his career, pound for pound, than almost everyone. His teams are regularly soft and defense is optional. But he's done enough lately to be included in the elite group I suppose.
                                                Comment
                                                • The Madcap
                                                  SBR MVP
                                                  • 07-03-10
                                                  • 2808

                                                  #59
                                                  Originally posted by No coincidences
                                                  I'd really love to put Roy Williams into this conversation, because I feel like he's done less with more over his career, pound for pound, than almost everyone. His teams are regularly soft and defense is optional. But he's done enough lately to be included in the elite group I suppose.
                                                  Roy Williams is not a coach. He's more like a crew chief. A bad one. When the car is fast, and the driver is one of the best, he looks great. Just don't ask him what to do when he's struggling to break out of the pack during the race.


                                                  He wins because recruits fast athletic kids and let's them play in an up-tempo free style offense designed to outscore the other team. And talented kids love that idea. They think it will boost their NBA draft stock. And when he has a great point guard they are hard to beat. When he was just a good point guard, they always flame out in the tournament. Mainly because he doesn't know how to coach in the half court and has no conceptual understanding of defense.

                                                  You know Roy's a bad coach because every time his team loses and someone asks him what happened or what he could have done differently he always responds by saying "I don't know. I don't have any answers. I don't know what we should have done. If I did I would have done it." That really instills confidence doesn't it?
                                                  No more of that talk, or I'll put the leeches on you.
                                                  Comment
                                                  • The Madcap
                                                    SBR MVP
                                                    • 07-03-10
                                                    • 2808

                                                    #60
                                                    Originally posted by No coincidences
                                                    Boeheim has had a lot of successful regular seasons during his tenure, which begs the question, why has he only been past the Sweet 16 twice since '89?

                                                    These guys are all able to succeed during the regular season, but for whatever reason, they repeatedly don't get it done when it matters most.
                                                    I think it's because they always play that zone defense. All it takes is one team that can shoot or another that can get more physical. Sometimes you've just got to play man to man.
                                                    No more of that talk, or I'll put the leeches on you.
                                                    Comment
                                                    • No coincidences
                                                      SBR Aristocracy
                                                      • 01-18-10
                                                      • 76300

                                                      #61
                                                      Originally posted by The Madcap
                                                      Roy Williams is not a coach. He's more like a crew chief. A bad one. When the car is fast, and the driver is one of the best, he looks great. Just don't ask him what to do when he's struggling to break out of the pack during the race.


                                                      He wins because recruits fast athletic kids and let's them play in an up-tempo free style offense designed to outscore the other team. And talented kids love that idea. They think it will boost their NBA draft stock. And when he has a great point guard they are hard to beat. When he was just a good point guard, they always flame out in the tournament. Mainly because he doesn't know how to coach in the half court and has no conceptual understanding of defense.

                                                      You know Roy's a bad coach because every time his team loses and someone asks him what happened or what he could have done differently he always responds by saying "I don't know. I don't have any answers. I don't know what we should have done. If I did I would have done it." That really instills confidence doesn't it?
                                                      Good post.
                                                      Comment
                                                      • lyon804
                                                        SBR Hall of Famer
                                                        • 11-02-09
                                                        • 6526

                                                        #62
                                                        Originally posted by The Madcap
                                                        Roy Williams is not a coach. He's more like a crew chief. A bad one. When the car is fast, and the driver is one of the best, he looks great. Just don't ask him what to do when he's struggling to break out of the pack during the race.

                                                        I totally agree here. He is John Calipari WITH class and WITHOUT the "issues"

                                                        He wins because recruits fast athletic kids and let's them play in an up-tempo free style offense designed to outscore the other team. And talented kids love that idea. They think it will boost their NBA draft stock. And when he has a great point guard they are hard to beat. When he was just a good point guard, they always flame out in the tournament. Mainly because he doesn't know how to coach in the half court and has no conceptual understanding of defense.

                                                        You know Roy's a bad coach because every time his team loses and someone asks him what happened or what he could have done differently he always responds by saying "I don't know. I don't have any answers. I don't know what we should have done. If I did I would have done it." That really instills confidence doesn't it?
                                                        Originally posted by No coincidences
                                                        I'd really love to put Roy Williams into this conversation, because I feel like he's done less with more over his career, pound for pound, than almost everyone. His teams are regularly soft and defense is optional. But he's done enough lately to be included in the elite group I suppose.


                                                        Very good post. There are others like him that come to mind.


                                                        I even know one in college football...NICK SABAN. Most consider him a guru of coaching but he wins often over his career because he had more and better talent than the competetion. Put him in a game against another team with close or equal talent than he is NO Guru.
                                                        Comment
                                                        • EasyCover
                                                          SBR Wise Guy
                                                          • 02-01-11
                                                          • 621

                                                          #63
                                                          It doesnt matter about losing games to a team with a 9-21 record. It's how your playing now. See Butler,VCU and Florida State. And Valvano's NC State. The crappiest team to ever win an NCAA title.
                                                          Comment
                                                          • TPowell
                                                            SBR Posting Legend
                                                            • 02-21-08
                                                            • 18842

                                                            #64
                                                            I'll name some more like ole Roy

                                                            John Calipari (UK)
                                                            Lorenzo Romar (UW)
                                                            Coach K at Duke to a certain extent (nowhere near as bad as these guys though)
                                                            Rick Pitino (UL)
                                                            Rick Barnes (UT)
                                                            Comment
                                                            • Balco10
                                                              SBR Hall of Famer
                                                              • 09-11-10
                                                              • 5478

                                                              #65
                                                              Pitino has lost his edge!
                                                              Comment
                                                              • BrigadierPudding
                                                                SBR Wise Guy
                                                                • 11-07-09
                                                                • 617

                                                                #66
                                                                Originally posted by TPowell
                                                                Boeheim wouldn't have a title if he didnt get to face Rick Barnes and Roy Williams back-to-back in the Final 4. Talk about a cakewalk
                                                                Exactly. It's inexplicable to this day that Williams didn't win the title with that Kansas team. That roster was stacked.

                                                                A lot of these name coaches are just recruiters and don't have a clue how to coach and make adjustments in game. They get beat by teams that have coaches that actually know how to formulate a gameplan, make adjustments and teach their players. Guys like Roy, Pitino, Calipari, Barnes... they just roll out the ball and let their McDonalds All American athletes play.
                                                                Comment
                                                                • TPowell
                                                                  SBR Posting Legend
                                                                  • 02-21-08
                                                                  • 18842

                                                                  #67
                                                                  Melo and Warrick were great talents but like you said, Collison and Heinrich were awesome. Graves and Simien were solid underneath and Simien went on to become a first team All American. Unreal how good that team was
                                                                  Comment
                                                                  • HoulihansTX
                                                                    BARRELED IN @ SBR!
                                                                    • 02-12-09
                                                                    • 30566

                                                                    #68
                                                                    Originally posted by lyon804
                                                                    Very good post. There are others like him that come to mind. I even know one in college football...NICK SABAN. Most consider him a guru of coaching but he wins often over his career because he had more and better talent than the competetion. Put him in a game against another team with close or equal talent than he is NO Guru.
                                                                    Nick Saban consistently won @ Michigan St., and beat Michigan on occasion. This was when Michigan was a perennial Top 5 team. Saban can coach.

                                                                    The guy in college who is more of a recruiter than coach is Mack Brown. He is basically Boheim on the football field. Struck lighting in a bottle with Vince Young. B4, and after that National Championship. He always has the top talent in Texas, and doesnt really know what to do with it.
                                                                    Comment
                                                                    • No coincidences
                                                                      SBR Aristocracy
                                                                      • 01-18-10
                                                                      • 76300

                                                                      #69
                                                                      Originally posted by lyon804
                                                                      I even know one in college football...NICK SABAN. Most consider him a guru of coaching but he wins often over his career because he had more and better talent than the competetion. Put him in a game against another team with close or equal talent than he is NO Guru.

                                                                      YES.


                                                                      He blew more games at Michigan State than I can remember. I can recall a game around '97 or '98 when MSU was up like 10 with the ball kicking a field goal and there was only like 2 minutes left in regulation. Saban found a way to lose it.
                                                                      Comment
                                                                      • No coincidences
                                                                        SBR Aristocracy
                                                                        • 01-18-10
                                                                        • 76300

                                                                        #70
                                                                        Originally posted by HoulihansTX
                                                                        Nick Saban consistently won @ Michigan St., and beat Michigan on occasion. This was when Michigan was a perennial Top 5 team. Saban can coach.
                                                                        IIRC, Saban went about .500 every year at MSU and never won a bowl game (in fact, they were routed in nearly every bowl game he coached in). He only had a really solid year once and immediately left for LSU because of it.

                                                                        You are 110% right on Brown. He and Barnes are two peas in a pod -- literally.
                                                                        Comment
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