Alright, enough

[DaAce]

LeBron wont win till he has team mates who fear him. They partake as being clowns in the circus and advance the comedic value which has become their bench. Sure they'l admit its his team but how many team-mates do you imagine that he's approached violently (verbally) after a big loss or missed assignments. If youre too busy trying to be picture perfect, your greatest flaws will emerge.

[williams22]

They lost big in game 6- dont try and make this the same cause its not gonna work. Your cavs got blown out at home 2 times in a row in the same series. That is not acceptable and you know that. LA wasnt expected to make the finals that year. The cavs have the #1 record in basketball and high expectations. Lets not try and compare apples to oranges.

LA wasn't expected to make the finals after acquiring Gasol? Laughable.

[lyon804]

LeBron wont win till he has team mates who fear him. They partake as being clowns in the circus and advance the comedic value which has become their bench. Sure they'l admit its his team but how many team-mates do you imagine that he's approached violently (verbally) after a big loss or missed assignments. If youre too busy trying to be picture, your greatest flaws will emerge.

excellent post.

[lakerboy]

LA wasn't expected to make the finals after acquiring Gasol? Laughable.

Spurs were the favorites that year in the west when the playoffs started. Im not gonna get into an argument with you. You got blown out at home 2 times in a row. Go work on that.

[lyon804]

Spurs were the favorites that year in the west when the playoffs started. Im not gonna get into an argument with you. You got blown out at home 2 times in a row. Go work on that.

Willy. That's how an "older" guy talks shit.

[williams22]

Spurs were the favorites that year in the west when the playoffs started. Im not gonna get into an argument with you. You got blown out at home 2 times in a row. Go work on that.

Everyone expected the Lakers to make the finals. Then Kobe played like shit and they lost.
THE LIST OF KOBE NO-SHOWS

• Game 6 of the 2003 Spurs series: Lakers eliminated in a 32-point blowout (Kobe scores 20, commits seven turnovers).
• Game 3, Game 4 and Game 5 of the 2004 Finals: Kobe went 4-for-13, 8-for-25 and 7-for-21 as the Pistons finished off L.A.
• Game 7 of the 2006 Suns series: Lakers lose by 32, Kobe mysteriously stops shooting in the second half in a rarely seen Eff You To My Teammates performance.
• Game 4 of the 2008 Finals: Boston rallies back from 25 down to win in L.A. Kobe finishes 6-for-19.
• Game 6 of the 2008 Finals: Boston wins the title with a 39-point blowout, Kobe goes 7-for-22.



Just for you LB

[DaAce]

LA wasn't expected to make the finals after acquiring Gasol? Laughable.

Bynum just suffered an injury for the season, the Gasol move was desperation in February and Ariza was just smart GM'ing... 46 games into the season the Lakers where nowhere near favorites

[jgiun1]

wow, and Lebron will have more shitty playoff games in the 2 years than that whole list above ^

[lyon804]

Alot of heallthy discussion here. Damn, I love to gamble but wander how cool it would be if I was actually a fan of a team or player and could have a heated rivalry defending one's team or player..


For the record Willy... are you going to follow Lebron to NY or CHI??

[DaAce]

Everyone expected the Lakers to make the finals. Then Kobe played like shit and they lost.
THE LIST OF KOBE NO-SHOWS

• Game 6 of the 2003 Spurs series: Lakers eliminated in a 32-point blowout (Kobe scores 20, commits seven turnovers).
• Game 3, Game 4 and Game 5 of the 2004 Finals: Kobe went 4-for-13, 8-for-25 and 7-for-21 as the Pistons finished off L.A.
• Game 7 of the 2006 Suns series: Lakers lose by 32, Kobe mysteriously stops shooting in the second half in a rarely seen Eff You To My Teammates performance.
• Game 4 of the 2008 Finals: Boston rallies back from 25 down to win in L.A. Kobe finishes 6-for-19.
• Game 6 of the 2008 Finals: Boston wins the title with a 39-point blowout, Kobe goes 7-for-22.



Just for you LB

Were not debating bad games... those are inevitable... the effort is whats caused this commotion.

[Willie Bee]

However, I find it sickening how many of you seemed to be waiting for him to fail so you could jump all over him. I've never seen so many people be so excited that someone failed.

Williams, that's all some people have going for them. It's also the general mood of a lot of 'sports talk/sports media' outlets. Kicking someone or some team when they're down is a lot more exciting the vast majority of the time than elevating the winning team or individual. Listen to a Jim Rome show, for example, and calculate how much of the time is spent on the show putting a team or athlete down compared to talking about a team or athlete that is making positive strides.

I know plenty of people who call themselves Red Sox or Mets fans who get far more excited when the Yankees lose than when 'their team' wins.

I used to be guilty of the same behavior with regards to the Cowboys and Texas Longhorns. Also the Cubs, R-kansas Razorbacks, Tortilla Tech Red Raiders and several other teams. It embarrasses me now when I think about how I'd get all gumbied up about a team that lost. The problem was most of those teams -- Save the poor, poor Cubs -- have won most of the time. I finally figured out I was just making myself sick and wasting precious time in this life being a negative fan.

It bugs the bejesus out of me why other people haven't wised up as I did, but then, that's their call.

[DaAce]

Boston is running the same exact defense on the Lebron that they ran on Kobe in the finals. When Posey/Allen pressures him on the perimeter and within one dribble a second defender is there at all angles. It forces him to shoot jumpers and pass to his team-mates.

[Goat Milk]

Kobe also will always live in Shaq's shadow to some degree.

Shaq will always live in Kobe's shadow. Kobe carried him, Wade carried him, now he's clinging to Lebron. Shaq is the most dominant center of all time, but Kobe will go down as arguably the greatest player of all time if he gets 1-2 more rings.

-Lebron just needs to show everyone what he's made of these next two games. Adversity shapes character. If the Cavs lose this series, it won't be because of Lebron.

BTW, what a stupid comment about how he "lead" Kobe Bryant. All 12 Olympic players will tell you that Bryant was the non-vocal leader. These guys shit their pants when they saw an "old man" going through that daily workout regimen. Greatness is about dedication and killer instincts, not raw talent.

If you asked Tmac whats the difference between Kobe and any other player in the league, he'll tell you Kobe is ferocious on the court. He wants to rip your heart out, and keep bashin it until he destroys you.

[williams22]

Alot of heallthy discussion here. Damn, I love to gamble but wander how cool it would be if I was actually a fan of a team or player and could have a heated Rivalry defending one's team or player..


For the record Willy... are you going to follow Lebron to NY or CHI??

I'll answer those questions in the offseason

In all honesty, yes, of course I will. I've never seen a player more exciting to watch who has a more complete package than Lebron.

[jgiun1]

Shaq will always live in Kobe's shadow. Kobe carried him, Wade carried him, now he's clinging to Lebron. Shaq is the most dominant center of all time, but Kobe will go down as arguably the greatest player of all time if he gets 1-2 more rings.

-Lebron just needs to show everyone what he's made of these next two games. Adversity shapes character. If the Cavs lose this series, it won't be because of Lebron.

BTW, what a stupid comment about how he "lead" Kobe Bryant. All 12 Olympic players will tell you that Bryant was the non-vocal leader. These guys shit their pants when they saw an "old man" going through that daily workout regimen. Greatness is about dedication and killer instincts, not raw talent.

If you asked Tmac whats the difference between Kobe and any other player in the league, he'll tell you Kobe is ferocious on the court. He wants to rip your heart out, and keep bashin it until he destroys you.

real nice GoatMilk

[Goat Milk]

LeBron wont win till he has team mates who fear him.

wow that is a great statement.

[jgiun1]

I'll answer those questions in the offseason

In all honesty, yes, of course I will. I've never seen a player more exciting to watch who has a more complete package than Lebron.

I think cribbs from the Browns should be the "King"

[stefan084]

The difference is the fans have the vast majority of the past 7 years as evidence, the haters have a single game.

The reason this is getting so blown out of proportion (or perhaps not) is that if Cleveland is to lose this series it will provide for the highest likelihood of Lebron leaving of any possible scenario.

However, I've still never seen so many people salivate over watching someone fail. Kobe has had plenty of awful playoff games as well and never got such a reaction, yet he's a much less likable person. This is what perplexes me.

kobe always gives an effort, thats the difference

[big0mar]

Shaq will always live in Kobe's shadow. Kobe carried him, Wade carried him, now he's clinging to Lebron. Shaq is the most dominant center of all time, but Kobe will go down as arguably the greatest player of all time if he gets 1-2 more rings. -Lebron just needs to show everyone what he's made of these next two games. Adversity shapes character. If the Cavs lose this series, it won't be because of Lebron. BTW, what a stupid comment about how he "lead" Kobe Bryant. All 12 Olympic players will tell you that Bryant was the non-vocal leader. These guys shit their pants when they saw an "old man" going through that daily workout regimen. Greatness is about dedication and killer instincts, not raw talent. If you asked Tmac whats the difference between Kobe and any other player in the league, he'll tell you Kobe is ferocious on the court. He wants to rip your heart out, and keep bashin it until he destroys you.

But that isn't the only way, or even the best way to be successful. Being ferocious doesn't mean you are necessarily a winner, it just means youre ferocious.

Thats really one of the things that pisses me off the most, is that people expect Lebron to have the same personality as Jordan. He is his own man, which is a lot more refreshing than him being a Jordan-clone.

[williams22]

kobe always gives an effort, thats the difference

Um, I'll give you a chance to take this back. Kobe has outright quit on his team on at least 2 occasions.

[lyon804]

Williams, that's all some people have going for them. It's also the general mood of a lot of 'sports talk/sports media' outlets. Kicking someone or some team when they're down is a lot more exciting the vast majority of the time than elevating the winning team or individual. Listen to a Jim Rome show, for example, and calculate how much of the time is spent on the show putting a team or athlete down compared to talking about a team or athlete that is making positive strides.

I know plenty of people who call themselves Red Sox or Mets fans who get far more excited when the Yankees lose than when 'their team' wins.

I used to be guilty of the same behavior with regards to the Cowboys and Texas Longhorns. Also the Cubs, R-kansas Razorbacks, Tortilla Tech Red Raiders and several other teams. It embarrasses me now when I think about how I'd get all gumbied up about a team that lost. The problem was most of those teams -- Save the poor, poor Cubs -- have won most of the time. I finally figured out I was just making myself sick and wasting precious time in this life being a negative fan.

It bugs the bejesus out of me why other people haven't wised up as I did, but then, that's their call.

What you are saying here makes perfect sense but the example here is different. We are talking about an individual player than has gained rock star status and HOF status that hasn't won a championship. When I see the media and the younger generation worship somebody that has not earned it yet it is going to be funny to see them fail.


Nobody here is not going to admit he is a wonderful player but the worshipping of him is nuts and there is no end in sight. When the Cavs are good it is all Lebron, but when they stink many talk about he has no help.. Please. it don't work that way.


I would like to see him win a couple of championships before I personally "annoint" him is the greates ever, or "The King" Or "The Chosen One" Or before I too become " A WITNESS'

[DaAce]

He "quit" with this team right? or he made it a point to bring in help during a game where he did everything he could the 1st half to still get blown out

Luke Walton, Brian Cook, Shammond Williams, Smush Parker, Kwame Brown, Chris Mihm, Mo Evans, Aaron Mckie, Rookie Bynum, Rookie Turiaf

[big0mar]

What you are saying here makes perfect sense but the example here is different. We are talking about an individual player than has gained rock star status and HOF status that hasn't won a championship. When I see the media and the younger generation worship somebody that has not earned it yet it is going to be funny to see them fail. Nobody here is not going to admit he is a wonderful player but the worshipping of him is nuts and there is no end in sight. When the Cavs are good it is all Lebron, but when they stink many talk about he has no help.. Please. it don't work that way. I would like to see him win a couple of championships before I personally "annoint" him is the greates ever, or "The King" Or "The Chosen One" Or before I too become " A WITNESS'

So you're upset he gets a lot of attention? Who gives a shit?

The worshiping of all athletes is ridiculous. What sort of man wears another man's jersey?

The biggest issue I have with your stance though, is that you're saying his team has to do something for him to earn individual praise. That doesn't make sense.

[Goat Milk]

Um, I'll give you a chance to take this back. Kobe has outright quit on his team on at least 2 occasions.

When he had Luke Walton, Smush Parker, and Kwame Brown he quit in that Suns game (because Phil complained about Kobe taking too many shots- so Kobe doesn't shoot and look what happens. Kobe proves points. He is a stubborn champion. If he doesn't take 25+ shots per game with that squad, they fail to win more than 20 games on the season.

Kobe hasn't quit when he has a championship caliber squad. He brings it. Lebron hasn't quit either. We will see what he is made of in game 6. I know for a fact Wade would finish the celtics off right now and win the next two (if he had that squad). Remember what he did to Dallas after being down 2? Game 6 will show/not show Lebron's killer instincts.

[Snowball]

Can you imagine the blame or accolades if Bron heads to the Clippers, where he can pick his own coach and his own gm ?

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&s...l=&oq=&gs_rfai=

[lyon804]

So you're upset he gets a lot of attention? Who gives a shit?

The worshiping of all athletes is ridiculous. What sort of man wears another man's jersey?

The biggest issue I have with your stance though, is that you're saying his team has to do something for him to earn individual praise. That doesn't make sense.

Look bro...Did you ever play team sports at a very competetive level?? I am ssuming prob. not by your comments. Let me tell you something. When you are the guy your team is your team and it's your intangibles that make it a championship caliber team. Cleveland is full of capable winners. Cleveland is the deepest team in the NBA as evidenced by there best record in regular season. Lebron, is a great player but is currently absent the qualities of a true champion at this point in his career.

[big0mar]

When he had Luke Walton, Smush Parker, and Kwame Brown he quit in that Suns game (because Phil complained about Kobe taking too many shots- so Kobe doesn't shoot and look what happens. Kobe proves points. He is a stubborn champion. If he doesn't take 25+ shots per game with that squad, they fail to win more than 20 games on the season. Kobe hasn't quit when he has a championship caliber squad. He brings it. Lebron hasn't quit either. We will see what he is made of in game 6. I know for a fact Wade would finish the celtics off right now and win the next two (if he had that squad). Remember what he did to Dallas after being down 2? Game 6 will show/not show Lebron's killer instincts.

Wade had a much better team and a legitimate head coach when he did that?

Why didn't he finish off the Celtics this year?

[big0mar]

Look bro...Did you ever play team sports at a very competetive level?? I am ssuming prob. not by your comments. Let me tell you something. When you are the guy your team is your team and it's your intangibles that make it a championship caliber team. Cleveland is full of capable winners. Cleveland is the deepest team in the NBA as evidenced by there best record in regular season. Lebron, is a great player but is currently absent the qualities of a true champion at this point in his career.

I was all district 5A in football and basketball in the state of Florida in high school. I dont know if you consider that a very competitive level.

I'm not sure what qualities you're looking for? Maybe if you could be more specific.

And again, if you think Cleveland's team is so good, please tell me which of their players would start on either the Celtics or Lakers. I'll be patiently awaiting your answer.

[lakerboy]

Maybe Lebron is tired. He played alot of minutes when MO and Dwest were out. He played pg for lots of games. I think he is tired.

[lakerboy]

I was all district 5A in football and basketball in the state of Florida in high school. I dont know if you consider that a very competitive level.

I'm not sure what qualities you're looking for? Maybe if you could be more specific.

And again, if you think Cleveland's team is so good, please tell me which of their players would start on either the Celtics or Lakers. I'll be patiently awaiting your answer.

Which players on La would start on Boston ?

Just curious.

[big0mar]

Maybe Lebron is tired. He played alot of minutes when MO and Dwest were out. He played pg for lots of games. I think he is tired.

I think if any excuse is applicable, it would be his elbow, not fatigue.

Even last year when he was fatigued against ORL, he looked more active than he did last night.

[Goat Milk]

Wade had a much better team and a legitimate head coach when he did that?

Why didn't he finish off the Celtics this year?

Omar,

The Heat were a miserable team this year. How would Wade finish the Celts off? Wade had a much better coach the year he won. His team sucked. Who did he have? A washed up Mourning, Gary Payton who was like 40, Jason Williams who was way passed his prime, an old James Posey, a passed his prime shaq, etc.

Lebron has 2 all stars right now in their primes in Mo Williams and Jamison bro. Look at the Cavs bench. This Cavs team is much better than the Heat team that won it all in '06. Don't compare them.

[lakerboy]

I was all district 5A in football and basketball in the state of Florida in high school. I dont know if you consider that a very competitive level.

I'm not sure what qualities you're looking for? Maybe if you could be more specific.

And again, if you think Cleveland's team is so good, please tell me which of their players would start on either the Celtics or Lakers. I'll be patiently awaiting your answer.

Oh btw if the cavs have no good starters why are they maxed out for salary? I mean with so many shit players they shouldnt be maxed out should they?

[lyon804]

When he had Luke Walton, Smush Parker, and Kwame Brown he quit in that Suns game (because Phil complained about Kobe taking too many shots- so Kobe doesn't shoot and look what happens. Kobe proves points. He is a stubborn champion. If he doesn't take 25+ shots per game with that squad, they fail to win more than 20 games on the season.

Kobe hasn't quit when he has a championship caliber squad. He brings it. Lebron hasn't quit either. We will see what he is made of in game 6. I know for a fact Wade would finish the celtics off right now and win the next two (if he had that squad). Remember what he did to Dallas after being down 2? Game 6 will show/not show Lebron's killer instincts.

Bron-Bron is a excellent player but I think he is absent of those qualities. Lebron I have told many before he is not concerned with being a champion in the same regard Jordan, Bryant are/were. Lebron, is cool with winning but it does not drive him or consume him. Jordan/Bryant would have considered themselves failures had they not won titles. Lebron if never was to win a title will go down in history as one of the best ever and wealthiest athletes the world has seen and I think he is perfectly fine with that.


Now, I know Bron pays lip service to winning a championship but he ain't concerned. If he was concerned he would have developed a post game like Kobe/Jordan have. Who in the hell could defend Lebron in the Post?? He is too quick for bigs and to physical for guards.

[big0mar]

Which players on La would start on Boston ?

Just curious.

Gasol.